IRC Logs for #circuits Wednesday, 2014-07-09

pdurbinprologic: congrats!01:08
prologicoh yes thank you01:19
prologicwant you to have a quiz at this01:19
c45yHello World!01:24
prologichi c45y :)01:26
prologicalready have lunch plans sorry01:33
prologicbut we should have lunch in the next few days01:33
prologicmy last day here is 21st01:33
c45yoh what?01:33
prologicwell my contract originally was not getting renewed01:36
prologicthen last min they renewed it for 6 weeks01:36
prologicbut obviously in that time I had to look for other jobs just in case, etc01:36
prologicburnt through rec leave, etc01:36
c45yYea I did the same dance01:37
prologicanyway I have been offered a permanent (non fixed-term) role at another company for the same pay and similar work (web application development)01:37
c45yput in a request for leave and went overseas for 2 weeks01:37
c45yoh sweet01:37
prologicso in effect GU has lost me01:37
prologicalmost because of beurcracy really01:37
c45yYea its so shitty01:37
prologicit is really01:37
c45yconstantly waiting to see if you get renewed or not01:37
c45ynot fun01:37
prologicit creates disloyalty and detestment01:37
prologicnot fun at all01:37
prologicso back to corporate for me for a while01:38
prologicprobably at least for the next 5 years01:38
prologicand NodeJS of al things01:38
prologicnah it’ll be fine01:39
prologicNodeJS is actually quite like circuits in many ways01:39
prologici.e: event-driven et all01:39
c45yI like the idea of it01:40
prologicnah javascript is okay01:41
prologicit’s not perfect - no language is01:41
prologicbut it’s better than say umm oh I dunno01:41
prologicPHP :)01:41
c45yle sigh01:42
c45ywriting so much php of late01:42
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pdurbinprologic: I tried from android last night but it wouldn't accept text input. couldn't type "help"12:37
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prologicpdurbin, ahh really? hmm13:45
prologicI'll have to try that myself13:45
prologicin any case just toying with the concept of building web uis cli-style with appropriate web apis of sorts13:46
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prologicpdurbin, is it?13:55
prologicI still after all these years still don't feel as though we're doing this "right"13:55
prologicI can code tools, libraires, cli apps and apis of all kinds13:55
prologicbut UI sucks "insert some adjective here"13:56
prologicperhaps the realization is that building systems to interact with humans is "HARD"13:57
pdurbinyeah, it's hard13:58
prologichow can we make it easier?13:58
pdurbinwell, in my copious spare time I'm trying to read this book my friend wrote: http://www.visualusabilitybook.com13:58
prologiclearned anything so far?14:00
pdurbinshe emphasizes the importance of consistency14:01
pdurbin"the foundation of great application visual design: consistency, hierarchy, and personality"14:02
prologicwith what I'm trying to toy with and build at work (last few days before I start my new job)14:04
prologicI've been thinking...14:04
prologicwhy can't web apps and their uis mirror that of simple CLI apps14:04
prologicso basically there are two aspects here14:15
prologicobviously we both know what a horrible ui design looks like when we see it14:15
prologicwe are familiar with many best practices, etc14:15
prologicbut web app uis (at least) are tedious, hard to get right14:16
prologiceven with the consistency of bootstrap for example14:16
prologicI remember back in the ol desktop days with the likes of Java swing and Delphi14:16
prologicyou slapped together standard components and wrote event handlers for them14:16
prologicit was all quick and easy :)14:16
prologicI just came across this14:21
prologiclean, mean and nice14:21
pdurbinit's the whole point of docker is that it's a nicer cli interface to a bunch of not so nice cli interfaces? it's not like all cli interfaces are nice :)14:34
prologicno that is true too14:34
prologicwhat I sometimes wish is that I could just write useable functionlaity14:35
prologiceven write it as cli-style app14:35
prologicand then magically turn that into a consistent nice web ui14:35
prologicbut maybe that's too trivial14:35
prologicit's not like cli-apps are complex14:36
prologicat least not ones that follow the nice unix philosophy14:36
pdurbin`find` is complex14:40
prologiccould you imagine having all those options on a web ui14:57
pdurbinnope. I'm struggling enough with how should look14:59
prologicwell I have to say15:05
prologicI'm glad I"m not the only dev who feels this way15:05
prologicit's frustrating as all hell15:05
prologicpurecss and bootstrap are great15:05
prologicbut they're missing one impoartnt thing15:06
pdurbinonly one?15:08
prologicsimplicity :)20:45
prologiclike the simplicity of Python20:45
prologictake twitter bootstrap for example20:46
prologicor any web css/html framework with or without js20:46
prologicyou have forms, buttons, grids, layouts, popups, navbars, etc, etc20:46
prologicthen on top of that20:46
prologiceach has at least half a dozen or more different versions of each20:46
prologicnot to mention at least (with bootstrap) 3 different ways to use the grid system20:47
prologicit's insane20:47
prologicfollowing? :)20:47
pdurbinI guess. My experience with Bootstrap so far has been pretty positive though. And it seems to have enough simplicity. I think "I want a label"... and I get a label :)21:01
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prologicoh yeah no don't get me wrong21:13
prologicbootstrap is great21:13
prologicI'm just being a whining sook21:13
prologicbecause of the tedious nature of desgining uis21:13
prologicand getting it looking right21:13
prologicI'm no ui/ux developer21:13
prologicpurely backend/api/cli21:13
prologicsystem orchestration, automation, ai21:13
prologicall that jazz :)21:13
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pdurbinyeah. me too22:14
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prologicpdurbin: so you have lots of experience with bootstrap and developing web uis?23:03
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pdurbinhardly :)23:23
prologicare you familiar with any best practices at least?23:23
pdurbinI know what I hate23:24
prologicwhat I want to find is stuff like23:24
prologichorizontal navbars are used for ...23:24
prologicvertical side-base navbars are used for …23:24
prologicalways do blah and blah23:25
prologicyou know23:25
prologicconsistency :)23:25
prologicI’m thinking of taking my little prototype that I demoed yesterday that doesn’t really do all that much23:25
prologicand split the cli part out into /cli23:25
prologicso it’s nice and separate but still using the cli command events23:25
prologicand try to generate as much of a bootstrap webui as I can from python code structures23:26
prologice.g: why can’t portions of a webui be driven by cli-style argparse options and arguments and docstrings?23:26
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pdurbinisn't that just url hacking?23:49
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prologicpdurbin: how do you mean?23:59

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