IRC Logs for #crux-devel Saturday, 2007-08-25

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clbUpdate from opt: 25 Aug 09:28 - lftp: updated to 3.5.13. || 25 Aug 09:29 - wine: updated to 0.9.4404:43
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tilmanwow, the new wine release even made it to /.'s front page06:06
tilmano_O06:06
aon:-O06:08
tilmanbtw06:08
tilmanwe're at a draw wrt the dash-for-sh thing at crux-devel06:08
tilmanmy +1 vs juergen's -106:09
tilmanso comment!1106:09
aonmy mail setup is quite ungood at the moment06:09
aonso i won't06:09
tilman:D06:09
aonbut i'm -1ish06:09
tilmandamn06:09
aonbut +1 for making the scripts posix06:10
aonand possibly pkgmk too06:10
tilmani think i'll branch off opt and core for 2.4 later today06:11
aonand pkgfiles, perhaps all at once at some branching point or something06:11
aonalthough contrib could be a bit tedious to get converted06:11
tilmanyeah06:11
aondoes /. mention the military connection the CRUX wine updates have currently? ;)06:15
tilmanrsync: opendir "/crux-2.3/contrib/zsync" (in ports) failed: No such file or directory (2)06:15
tilmanwtf06:15
tilmani thought the current script fixed that problem06:15
tilmanaon: no idea, didn't read the article :D06:15
aon"If you use Wine on CRUX you're promoting hate and violence!"06:16
aondamn it's slow to compile stuff on the 466MHz celeron06:23
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jjpktilman: I think I have found some information as to why mplayer -vo xv/sdl locks up my laptop. AIGLX14:45
tilmanjjpk: mmh, i don't have aiglx enabled here. maybe we're not seeing the same issue14:50
jjpkI hope that is the answer to the problem.14:52
jjpkI am getting paranoid about when data corruption will happen.14:52
treachjjpk: what happens if you turn it off? Note that you have to do that explicitly, if you didn't already know that.14:57
jjpkI just noticed it in the logs, and it was on by default according to xorg.conf's manual page.14:58
treachyeah, I was a bit surprised by that as well.14:58
treachtilman: Not sure if you ment that, but you have to *disable* it if you don't want it. :)14:58
jjpkSomething is terribly wrong when you are watching any video with mplayer and using -vo xv or sdl.14:59
treachwhat chip?14:59
jjpkintel 855gm on the laptop.15:00
tilmanyeah, i explicitly disabled it15:00
treachmmh, intergrated stuff.15:01
jjpkYeah, unfortunately. :p15:01
treach*integrated*15:01
tilmanjjpk: are you using exa or xaa there?15:01
tilmanon the laptop15:01
tilmanif the answer is 'dunno' or 'default', you're using xaa15:01
tilman:D15:01
jjpkxorg logs tell me its xaa.15:02
tilmanB[B[B[B[B[B[B[B[B[Bmmh15:02
tilmanshould be okay15:02
treach?15:03
jjpkI have no intention of running a beryl or whatever those 3d effect desktops are called.15:03
treachthat doesn't look ok at all. :D15:03
tilmanwhat the hell was that15:03
jjpka stuck key maybe?15:03
treachsome escape squence by the look of it.15:04
tilmanjjpk: exa isn't only for 3d eyecandy15:04
treachcolors maybe, of some sort.15:04
tilmanexa can accelerate xrender better15:04
tilmaneverything uses xrender these days15:04
tilmanso exa can in theory give you a faster desktop15:04
tilman:D15:04
treachjjpk: maybe time to do things in the good old-fashioned way. :p15:05
jjpkhaha15:05
tilmananyway15:06
tilmanreport it on bugs.freedesktop.org15:06
tilmani say that all the time, but i think treach never does it15:06
tilman:>15:06
treachman xorg.conf && man i810, vim /etc/X11/xorg.conf and get cracking. :P15:06
treachI did! But it was just a dup anyway.15:07
tilmanoh, nice15:07
tilmanremember the bug id?15:07
jjpkI will give it a try.15:07
treachthe exa problem I had with EXA that is.15:07
tilmanor do you mind digging it up?15:07
treachfdohhsdgl15:08
treachI should probably go to sleep and stop typing nonsense. :/15:08
aonoh my god, it actually worked!15:09
jjpkwhat worked?15:10
aon/dev/raid0a   19.7G    602M   18.1G     3%    /15:10
jjpkah the raid.15:10
aonye15:10
treachis that a raid115:10
treach?15:10
aonyes15:10
jjpk\o/15:10
treachaha15:10
treachthat explains it15:10
aonyep15:10
treachsyncing it up takes an eternity15:10
aonwonder why it can't show a progress bar since raidctl supports that15:11
treach/dev/md2              148G   62G   86G  42% /home15:11
aoni thought it froze15:11
tilmantreach: i guess i was thinking of your radeon lockup15:11
tilmani think that was xv related too15:11
treachtilman: ah, ok. I guess it was something else at work there as well.15:12
treachit happened even when I hadn't been using anything related to XV.15:12
treachaon: ^ "can you spell W A I T I N G"? :p15:13
tilmantreach: did you have a patch for making the rc scripts sh compliant?15:14
treachI had, but I think I've lost it. Maybe prologic has it somewhere.15:14
treachHe wrote the bulk of it, I just fixed a few minor things he had missed.15:15
treachbtw, I've had sh linked to dash for a couple of days, no problems detected so far.15:23
treachBut, then I'm not really using much proprietary stuff.15:23
tilmanso the patches were bogus and not needed? :D15:24
treachno..15:24
treachthe rc scripts call bash.15:24
treachor are we possibly talking about different things again..?15:24
tilmanno clue15:24
tilmani'm weird today15:24
treachheh, welcome to the club. :P15:25
aontreach, yes, i can :)15:25
treachI thought it would never finish. :/15:25
aonmine has two 160GB disks15:25
aonthat was just the first partition, the rest weren't formatted yet15:25
treachah.15:26
tilmantreach: what's the status of rakt on your desktop?15:26
treachstill broken. :/15:26
treachAnd I'm still clueless.15:26
tilmani tried to steal epdfview's "page ___ of 100" control some days ago btw15:26
tilmanbut gtk's ui manager stuff didn't make integrating it easy15:26
treachI think I've rebuilt *everything* it depends on, with more conservative settings. No deal.15:27
tilman:x15:27
treachWhich doesn't surprise me, btw, since it works on the laptop, without extra caution.15:27
treachI also tried to run it as new user, still no workie.15:27
treachSo it's not something in my $HOME that screws stuff up.15:28
jjpkDisabling aiglx did do something good, mplayer -vo xv has not crashed anything, but -vo sdl has.15:37
treachwell, as long as xv works..15:38
treachnot sure why you'd want to use sdl15:38
jjpkI used it for testing.15:39
treachAh, ok.15:39
jjpkI was under the impression that sdl could use hw acceleration, xv does seem a lot smoother.15:39
jjpkNow to test, see if aiglx was the main culprit15:41
treach"Banzai!" :p15:41
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jjpkIt would have crashed by now. o_o15:45
aonø_ø15:47
treachbtw, you've got to love antons concerns about bloat.. dash is 68kB ;D15:48
aonhehe15:48
aoni think we should migrate to the heirloom shell15:49
aonhttp://heirloom.sourceforge.net/sh.html15:49
jjpkzomg bloat15:52
aonhaving two shells seems a  bit icky to me15:53
jaegerlet's use a php shell, it'll be awesome15:53
aonlet's use php as the shell15:53
jaegerif you're a bash user you already have 2 shells since tcsh is installed by default15:54
jaegerthough I suppose it can be removed :)15:54
aonyeah, i don't have it :)15:54
treachaon: Icky, how so? Do you use a sledge hammer when you need a hammer?15:54
jaegeror the other way around, tcsh user with bash installed15:54
treachjaeger: do you know why tcsh keeps getting shipped around?15:55
jaegerno idea, I've never used it15:55
aontreach, more like "do you throw all the rest of your toolchest away when you need a single screwdriver"15:55
aonbash seems quite posix-compliant15:55
treachI don't think anyone outside of *BSD still use it.15:55
treachaon: not quite.15:55
aonthe only issue i can think of is memory footprint15:55
aonand even i don't consider it a problem15:56
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treachaon: if you run a lot of scripts..15:56
aonthat and invocation time15:56
treachexactly15:56
aoni get easily annoyed about stuff15:56
aonbut i haven't yet got annoyed about bash taking too long to start15:57
treachI think I read some place over at ubuntu that it cut the time needed for the updating process with more than half.15:57
aonthat should be benchmarked15:57
treachwe are not ubuntu ofc-15:57
treachaon: there's a huge ass thread someplace over at their forum with lots of numbers.15:57
treachlots of people whining too, since they can't be arsed to link sh to bash in stead of dash themselves, too.15:58
aoni see15:59
aoni mean it should be benchmarked on crux :)15:59
treachI'm pretty sure it wouldn't make that much of a difference.15:59
treachbut it would be a pretty effective obstacle to re-introducing bashisms.16:00
aonyes16:01
treachbottom line, as I said in the mail, it's debateable.16:01
aonyeah, stuff like that tends to be16:02
treacheither way, I have no say, so I was merely raising the question. I'll leave the debating, flaming and number polishing to those who do.16:05
aonsame :)16:05
aonhttp://www.bash.org/?33945816:05
tilmano_O16:06
treach;D16:09
jjpkA low hit. :D16:18
jjpkWhat an outcry! 3 shells if you are a zsh user if the rc scripts are moved away from bashims.16:23
jjpkThe amount of hd space is not a constraint in this case.16:24
treachyeah, I was about to reply that I knew, and since the experience nearly killed me I had given up on the whole thing.16:24
treachbut I ultimately decided that I've got more dignity than taking him seriously.16:25
treachHe's one of those "special" people, forcing him to interact with reality would probably be cruel.16:26
jjpkI think jue has a good point about removing bashisms in the rc scripts. My question is would they work with bash?16:32
jjpkThen just give users the option to symlink /bin/sh to their "minimal" shell of choice.16:32
aonwould the scripts without bashisms work with bash?16:33
aonyeah, they most likely would16:33
aonthe array stuff can get a bit tricky, though..16:33
jjpkI am not a shell expert, but that was the kicker.16:34
jjpkThe easy solution for the moment would be to keep it as it is, then offer a bashism-free rc for those that want it.16:39
jjpktreach: hitting with reality check, this might get interesting16:49
treachugh.16:49
treachfasten your seatbelts.16:49
* jjpk gets a glass of whiskey.16:49
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