IRC Logs for #crux-devel Friday, 2009-01-16

pitill0let's see if I am able to make tig working here with jue's tip01:09
pitill0seems to work here, but not at home... I will take a look to see where is my error there01:23
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pitill0good morning jue02:40
* jue wonders why Romster has adopted imagemagic and not namenlos02:49
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juenamenlos: what happens with imagemagic?03:48
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namenlosjue: looks like romster will keep it04:32
namenlosjue: looks like he is afraid, that those ports get outdated.04:35
namenlosjue: i will talk back to you later04:40
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juenamenlos: IIRC unrar was another port you want?07:23
jueI'm not going to accept Romsters behaviour :(07:25
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juehello cptn07:31
cptnjue: just saw #41807:32
cptnwho was the contrib secretary again?07:33
jueyou've seen the 20k pre-install script as well?07:33
cptnwas it sepen?07:33
cptnmaybe contrib could assign someone to double check romster's work07:33
jueIIRC it was viper07:33
Rotwangthere is none iirc07:33
juewell, to be honest I'm in the mood to cancel his crux account :(07:34
cptnI understand...07:36
cptnyeah, it looks like that thread didn't have any result07:36
cptnwhen we asked for an administrative contact07:36
cptnRotwang: is there any communication among contrib maintainers regarding overall quality?07:38
cptnor does everyone just do his own thing?07:38
cptnjust wondering, as I'm kinda out of the loop right now07:38
pitill0I think everyone has his own way, may be paying more attention to contrib ports to see if there are errors. I think there isn't a centraliced communication "channel" (reports at FS, by irc, may be emails, ...)07:43
mike_keveryone is on his own. only occasional per-port private email exchanges, I guess07:43
cptnI see07:43
pitill0and hey btw cptn :)07:43
cptnnamenlos: yes, please bring it back to opt07:44
cptnmike_k, pitill0:07:47
cptncan you please have a look at that?07:47
cptnit's a >600 line pre-install script07:48
jueas I said ~ 20k07:48
mike_kyeah, weird.07:48
cptnit's just very clear that he hasn't understood the goals of crux07:49
cptnand I think he's hurting us more and more07:49
aonomg @ that script07:49
pitill0I saw jue's FS ticket yesterday and overviewed the script, quite big. I think Romster is mixing some things, between his ideas and CRUX.07:50
cptnpitill0: seriously07:50
cptnwe've asked him many times to fix smaller things07:50
cptnover and over again07:50
cptnand then he goes ahead and commits something like this?07:51
cptncan't be an oversight really07:51
pitill0I see things easy. Starting at the point of using bz/bz2 files and finishing in simplicity. That port breaks both in CRUX.07:52
cptnlet me ask him in #hvlinux07:54
pitill0I think jue told both in the ticket and must be reviewed by the maintainer. That must be thought, if you work in a comunity, folow the comunity, if not, you are working in your own way.07:54
pitill0I talked with him this morning and discussed some of his ideas (lzma, incremental patches for sources, ...) and I think isn't a bad idea, but this doesn't mean those ideas are good for CRUX (I don't know if I explain that)07:55
pitill0if you have an idea which is wrong for the comunity, take your own way, you are free. But all must be discussed in a comunity and the majority must take the decision07:56
cptnwell, one of his goals is "more features"07:56
pitill0that's how I understand a comunity (may be depends in if CRUX can be understood like that, and it can be wrong from my point of view)07:57
pitill0I must leave (finishing work and starting weeked) I will read from home in around 2h, sorry.07:57
cptnpitill0: sure, no worries08:00
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mike_kwhile I am certainly against such scripts, it is important to get Danny's point. I hope on a bloodless resolution.08:03
cptnwell, he thinks it's better than downloading 8.5 MB all the time08:04
cptnsince it's updated so often08:04
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mike_ksomeone with dialup-like connection may just update less frequently08:06
Rotwangomg, nice pre-install ;]08:14
cptnwell, it appears Romster is doing the right thing for the user08:15
cptnand he has to remove these things because the devs don't like it08:15
cptnhe still thinks he's right08:15
juedid you expect something else?08:16
cptnwell, frankly I'm just disappointed08:16
namenlosso i guess, the question, who takes imagemagic is already settled.08:26
tilmanpitill0: i thought about using incremental patches for opt/gtk as well. the tarball is pretty large these days08:26
tilmanfwiw, libarchive 2.6 does support lzma archives08:27
tilmanbut: adding lzma support to core/libarchive isn't possible without doing a new crux release (we'd have to add core/lzma i believe)08:27
tilmanalso: the lzma guy is working on a new lzma library which will be incompatible to the current format08:27
juenamenlos: IMO you08:27
tilmansee tukaani.org08:27
tilmanlzma is nice and all, but it's just not ready for prime time IMO08:28
namenloscptn: the only thing i am concerned about this xdelta stuff is, that it doesn't play well with oldfiles(1)08:28
tilmannamenlos: sorry for not replying to your git driver mails last week :((08:28
namenlosjue: romster already took it to contrib08:28
cptnnamenlos: yeah, same here (regarding git)08:28
juewell, it's still in opt and waiting for an update08:29
namenlostilman, cptn: np . this we i plan to do the thing with removing non needed commits from the tree.08:29
juecptn, tilman: objections?08:33
cptnnot from me08:33
tilmani don't object to anything ;D08:33
tilmanromster also imported jdk/jre into contrib, btw08:33
tilmanalthough opt/firefox-java-plugin still needs it08:33
cptnsomeone didn't do his homework08:34
tilmani didn't tell him yet because i was afraid of starting another flamewar08:34
cptnand just wanted to add another port to his collection08:34
jaeger600 line pre-install? yeesh08:45
pitill0well, I think isn't a bad idea to use incremental sources, romster's point was disk space. I told him about time too, but like I said, I think these days, BW and space aren't a problem, and with CRUX, there are many ways to act (diy). I think CRUX give freedom to the user keeping simple the distro. If you think it can be better, isn't hard to make a little own core repo and setup your systems with it (last solution if the comunity isn'08:54
juenamenlos: please go for it, the port is currently broken08:56
tilmanpitill0: i agree wrt disk space :D08:56
pitill0and like we are free to use it, join the comunity, all people must understand that and think about. CRUX is perfect to do whatever people want.08:56
namenlosjue: i won't hijack a port08:56
jueyou don't, I think it's the other way around08:57
cptnwell, if you want to maintain it, and do it in opt, then that's better for our users08:57
cptnso if you are interested to maintain the port, let Romster know that you do so in opt08:57
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cptnand mention that it's just in the interest of the user, and to enable opt ports to depend on imagemagick08:57
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cptnit's fair to tell a maintainer if you take a port into opt08:58
cptnbut it's not a question08:58
juecptn: he did that already, his name was in the list behind the port too08:58
pitill0tilman: these days is quite hard to think about disk space (networks, HD, so many cards, ...) but may be I am missing (or not thinking in a single case)08:58
namenlosi will talk to him (i am not planning to piss him off). i primary wanted to maintain it, because i use it every day and so it is some kind of tested...08:58
cptnsure, sounds like you have just as much reason to do so as he has08:59
cptnand you have commit access to opt08:59
cptnif tetex wasn't meant to go away (the port), I might maintain lyx in opt09:00
* namenlos is writing the mail09:00
namenlosi was using tetex when i worked at the university. i like it a lot. but atm i got no clue, how to maintain it.09:00
namenlosmaybe  should have a look at it09:01
cptnwell, tetex is not maintained upstream anymore09:01
tilmanthe problem is: tetex is unmaintained by upstream09:01
tilmanwe'd probably switch to texlive instead09:01
tilmanwhich is an insane amount of work afaict :)09:01
cptnso maybe we should stick to tetex for the time being? ;-)09:01
tilmansounds good :D09:02
namenlosisn#t the tetex live stuff a whole iso?09:05
tilmanyes, but you can download individual packages too i think09:05
namenlostilman: if i got some space time i will have a look09:07
tilmanfeel free to yell for help09:07
tilmani might be motivated to work on this if i'm not alone :D09:08
namenlosyou got some initial changes?09:08
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tilmannamenlos: nope09:12
namenlostilman: ok, i will tell you about my progress (if at all).09:13
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namenloshow do you say: hey, i want to hijack/take over your port in a nice way?09:50
Rotwanggimme imagemagick, SUCKA!!09:51
RotwangB.A. Barackus style09:51
Rotwangthe A-Team09:52
tilmannamenlos: BA from the a-team09:52
namenlosah, k.09:52
tilmannamenlos: "i'd like to maintain $port in opt. since it was in opt before, please consider removing it from contrib"09:53
tilmansomething like that09:53
namenlostilman: thx09:55
juenamenlos: TBH, i don't understand your objections. The situation was as follows: we have a list with orphaned opt ports, you and Romster are interested to adopt some ports, you both are listed there, Romster has stolen the ports without any notice10:05
namenlosjue: he was there first, because i was hesitating10:07
juewell, and do we distribute ports with a first-come-first-take principle10:09
jueI think no10:09
namenlosi won't start a fight10:10
jueyes, I know10:10
namenlosimho only if some messes up there would be the right to take away a port from someone10:11
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juenamenlos: don't want to offend you in any way10:12
namenlosjue: no worries, you aren't at all10:12
namenloshehe, if you search on google for pictures for "alone" you get "emo" as related search :D10:13
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cptnrandom thing:10:26
cptnsomeone mentioned once that there's an alternative URL for sourceforge downloads10:26
cptnwhich is supposed to work better10:27
cptndid anyone does anyone remember?10:27
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cptns/did anyone//10:28
cptnmaybe it was prdownloads...10:46
jaegerI think it was, yeah, but I've not had any better luck there10:48
Rotwang193.1.193.66 works pretty well for me10:49
aonsame here10:49
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cptnI was hoping that they did something on their side to improve things though...11:04
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namenlosi think the thing with imagemagick will take a while...16:18
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