IRC Logs for #crux-devel Wednesday, 2013-11-13

jaegerwhat do you mean by false step?03:13
jaegerI doubt I'll have any use for it myself but don't object to its being available03:14
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frinnsthorrorStruck: yeah i guess i sort of fucked you over suggesting you should apply to opt :/08:29
frinnstjust ask for contrib access, saying "systemd" might scare the shit out of people :)08:29
teK_I think we have a filter for that word on our contrib ML08:30
frinnstiirc you wanted libtxc_dxtn ?08:33
teK_not me08:33
frinnstno, horror08:34
juegood morning08:36
jueI don't think that it is a good idea to have ports in contrib that, if installed without further knowlege and experience, breaks the whole system08:38
frinnstyeah thats a good point. maybe a new "repo-of-darkness" repo?08:39
teK_I vote for 'ARCH angel of death' repo08:40
juewell, why not just a repo registered in our portdb?08:40
teK_yes; called arch angel of death :o08:41
teK_but why does systemd break everything?08:41
juewhatever horrorStruck likes ;)08:42
teK_it replaces packages from core, yeah..08:42
teK_let's see what/if the port looks like?08:42
juebut you will see that a lot of user-action is required to get it work :)08:44
teK_I can imagine that.08:45
juehorrorStruck: at all I don't get it why you doesn't go the usual way: 1) register a repo in our portdb 2) ask for contrib access etc. etc.08:47
juebtw, the wpa_supplicant/dbus issue is still open:08:52
jueshould we add dbus to our ISO just because wpa_supplicant depends on it?08:53
jue(I tend to revert the commit and build wpa_supplicant without dbus support ;)08:55
teK_what's the gain of dbus support?09:03
teK_i.e. what does not work without it?09:03
juethat was the reason to add it09:05
teK_that's a rather thin way of arguing09:05
teK_a more standard way (DBUS calls)09:06
teK_the problem is that we would need to ports because there will be no support for dbus even it is installed, right?09:07
jueas a side note: the firefox build _disables_ dbus explicitly09:10
juesame for cups and all the printer stuff09:11
teK_so we're a bit inconsistend there09:15
teK_the bigger problem still is that there is no way for users to  have a dbus-enabled wpa_supplicant without repackaing it09:18
Amnesiame gusta09:35
Amnesiadbus etc should be shunned09:35
frinnstjue: probably because i said he didnt need to (we were both drunk i think) :)09:45
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jaegerIf you want to script wpa_supplicant instead of relying on its normal functionality I guess you need dbus. I don't have a personal preference because I have dbus installed anyway for other stuff14:29
frinnstI have dbus installed too, but no wpa_supplicant14:30
frinnstwifi is for suckers!14:30
Amnesiasepen: me gusta15:12
frinnstnice.... eyes?15:19
jueok, thanks to all answers wrt wpa/dbus16:20
jueTBH, I don't like the idea to ship dbus with our ISO ;)16:20
jueat least not if only wpa_supplicant depends on it16:25
jueany objections if I remove dbus support again?16:34
juejaeger: we talked about it some times ago, would you mind to update iso.git, please?16:40
sepenjue: I don't see a reason to keep dbus in our iso16:53
sepeniirc all dependent ports are out of the iso too16:54
jueyep, that's my thought as well17:07
jaegerjue: Sure. I had posted a diff I wanted to apply to iso.git for review but I don't know that anyone had time. I'll go ahead and update it tonight if I can, we can always revert or change if needed. I *think* it's solid, though, worked in my tests and reproduced the release ISO properly17:08
jueand _if_ we ship dbus with our ISO, it's most likely installed on most (all) systems and we should build every other opt-port like cups, firefox etc. against it17:09
juejaeger: many thanks :)17:09
jaegerno problem, sorry for the delay17:10
juesepen: teK_ was right as he said: "so we're a bit inconsistend there"17:13
jaegerNo strong feelings on dbus from me. I use it so I don't mind if it's installed, but I don't mind installing it myself if needed.17:14
jaegerI use it indirectly, I should say, via other software17:14
jueif we agree that general dbus support is a good thing for CRUX, I don't mind too and would change my other ports that are able to use dbus to use it, but I don't like the current reason (dbus support in wpa_supplicant to make kde users happy)17:19
sepensorry was on phone17:19
sepenwell I have installed dbus due to thunar17:20
sepenindirectly as you said17:21
sepenjue: yeah, networkmanager is not a reason jue17:21
jaegerI have it installed for MATE stuff, which most crux users probably don't.17:22
sepenas thunar is neither a reason17:22
jaegerwhoever requested that change will be annoyed by the revert, though =/17:23
jueok, I see that someone has to make a decision: I'll remove the support for now and reopen the ticket17:24
sepen+1 jue17:24
sepenI'll add some comments, since xfce is also affected in the same way as kde is17:24
sepencan't be the possibility to have a separate wpa_supplicant-dbus port?17:25
juesure, why not? That's probably the best solution for now :)17:26
juenot nice, but working ;)17:26
sepenif this solution follows our package guidelines ... why not?17:27
jueok, great17:28
sepenanyway I don't understand why some software can depend only on runtime17:28
juewill do it tomorrow, going to dinner now17:29
sepenlater jue17:29
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horrorStruckthanks for the different inputs guys, i'm just trying to find a way to give back what i'm given :) just too bad the real serious contribution i could bring is most hated :P21:23
horrorStruckWRT dbus issue, FWIW (read: simple user's standpoint) i don't think wpa_supplicant-dbus is a good idea. so far, CRUX ports do not use optional deps, it's always up to the user to bring in additional features/deps. start with wpa_supplicant-dbus and be prepared to have 10 versions of each port with each configure flags possible combinations.21:28

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