IRC Logs for #crux-devel Saturday, 2019-02-02

jaegerok, hoping to finally get some time this weekend to do PAM stuff, does anyone object to me adding PAM to core in 3.5 and rebuilding openssh/shadow/sudo for it?00:39
jaegerwell, modifying those00:39
jaegeroh, and xscreensaver00:40
ryuojaeger: why not? it allows administrators to do more.00:40
ryuoallows more control over logins.00:40
jaegerYeah, and I don't think anyone is against it, but until now it's been in a separate repo, so just want to make sure00:41
pedjaqt-5.12.1 is out, and, afaict, still no sane way to disable qdoc build, so it still depends on clang. ffs01:01
pedjatbh, I just skimmed thru the changelog and bug reports, maybe it got merged and I just haven't found it01:02
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frinnstjaeger: I'm all for it03:24
juejaeger: no objections12:15
juejaeger: btw, what's your opinion wrt glic 2.29?12:15
juefrinnst: and your's as well, of course12:16
ryuojue: glibc upgrades usually introduces regressions, which require patching. when i worked for Frugalware, i always prefered to delay them for a few months to see what major distributions ended up patching, particularly ARCH.14:25
ryuoi always had a more conservative approach to critical components.14:26
jueryuo: thanks for your comment, that's my thought as well; and we, mainly frinnst, has put a lot of work in 3.5 already14:31
juebut we will see what the colleagues have to say :)14:32
ryuosame reason i always delayed major GCC upgrade until their 2nd or 3rd patch level.14:32
jaegerI tend to agree with the comments already made15:55
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frinnstYeah if we want to get 3.5 out the door soon'ish lets stay with the current version16:41
frinnstmy only peeve with the current 3.5 plans are the bootloaders during install. I'd like to have a separate menu for it but I think im not in majority here?16:42
frinnstif so I'll leave it16:42
ryuofrinnst: why does crux still offer lilo anyway? that thing is rather fickle.16:46
ryuogrub2 and syslinux are generally better.16:47
frinnstquick and easy16:49
frinnstI always use it for VMs16:49
ryuoI see.16:49
jaegerfrinnst: I have no objections to a boot loader menu18:43
jaegerno strong feeling, really. In general I feel like any 'advanced linux user' should know how to select their own bootloader but we do get people who don't now and then18:44
ryuoif i was in charge, i'd just throw out lilo already and bring in the more advanced ones people generally use these days.18:46
ryuoit would be somewhat nice if you had an auxiliary core group for software that isn't always necessary, such as bootloaders.18:56
ryuoso people can more readily pick what they want to use.18:56
jaegerlike opt? :D19:00
jueryuo: the idea is to move lilo to opt have all bootloader there19:00
ryuoOh. I see.19:01
jaegerA menu during setup would corral those together for the user to select, though19:02
jaegerI assume that's why frinnst wants it19:02
frinnstjaeger: true but If i chose to just install core (like i always do) I would expect a bootloader to be installed with it21:53
frinnstI dont know any distribution that doesnt install a bootloader when you install the minimum defaults. unless its for arm or some other special stuff21:54
ryuoi see nothing wrong with not installing one if they don't request one.21:54
ryuonot all targets require a bootloader.21:54
ryuoE.g., containers.21:55
frinnstwell having to chose "opt" to include a bootloader is less than obvious in my eyes.21:56
frinnstor cherry-pick packages to be installed21:56
frinnstbut alright. we could do it like this for 3.5 and see what the result is21:57
ryuoOr, at least include an explaination of it in the docs or the menu prompt.21:57
ryuojaeger: to be fair, when i first tried CRUX, i knew nothing about these bootloaders. i got through using the handbook.21:58
ryuoso, if you change it, perhaps mention the change in the handbook or the menu.21:59
pedjaisn't bootloader by definition a core system package? you can't go far without one :)22:02
ryuopedja: yes/no. it depends on the core environment.22:02
ryuopedja: by that logic, CRUX should have official kernel packages in core, yet doesn't.22:03
frinnstWhat I imagine is the regular setup program. You select what repo you install and if you want to cherry-pick. then another menu where you select the bootloader with a list22:03
pedjaryuo, what's with this obsession of your to make kernel a package :)22:05
ryuofrinnst: did crux get around to upgrading sysvinit to the newer upstream releases?22:05
ryuopedja: lol22:05
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jaegerSure, a bootloader is required for most installation methods, but which one is up to the user23:40

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