IRC Logs for #crux Thursday, 2006-05-11

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hermitrxi: on the dmtf web site01:10
hermituh01:10
hermitrxi: barely_female1401:10
hermitthat clip owns01:10
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rxihermit: wtf?02:40
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maropitillo: http://borkware.net/~mark/screenshot-thunar.png03:26
maroor was it sepen? :)03:26
tilmanyour stupid fileserver still doesn't serve png as image/png03:27
tilmanthat makes monkey tilman sad03:27
maroone sec03:27
maronow?03:28
treachnope03:28
maroLength: 203,664 (199K) [image/png]03:29
marois that wget doing magic?03:29
treachit worked now. (third attempt)03:29
maroprobably your browser's caching03:30
treachmaybe.03:30
tilmanfixed now :))03:30
marocool :)03:30
maroI'll open a bug about it, it's our default mathopd config03:30
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marois there a list of very common mime types somewhere?03:35
tilmanlighttpd.conf03:35
marothanks :)03:35
tilmanat the bottom03:35
tilmanwell.03:35
tilmanit contains lots of crap03:35
tilmanwho cares about .t and .tr03:35
tilman._o03:35
maroyeah, I used to use it03:35
marolighttpd that is03:36
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pitillomaro, me too, thanks :)03:51
pitillonice, but I thougth you were using xgl, are you using it?03:53
maropitillo: I am when I'm in gnome03:53
marohttp://borkware.net/~mark/crux/cubed-tux.png03:54
pitillomaro, I cant see a quality image by vnc. I asked because didnt see the tranparents windows :) but with the cube... I see the xgl effect03:55
* treach fails to see the point with vnc. :P03:56
maro:)03:57
maropitillo: the first shot was xfce03:57
marojust gnomified the panel layout03:58
pitillomaro, :O It seems gnome.. I thought it was gnome.03:58
treach"gnomified" as in using the gnome stuff with xfce, or as in themeing?03:58
marothe cube thing is gnome, but not the first one03:58
marotreach: just as in moving the applets around03:59
* pitillo saving bandwitch :D03:59
treachok, I guess they changed the look of the panel then.03:59
marohmm?03:59
treachIMO the old xfce panel was really ugly looking.04:00
maroI also resized it and added an additional one04:00
maroit still has the cde-like layout by default04:00
rxipekwm + fbpanel ftw04:00
treachcool. :-)04:00
treachpitillo: saving bandwith compared to what?04:00
treach*width*04:01
pitillotreach, I?ll take a shot of the older panel of xfce.. seems nice to me with a black theme04:01
treachI never liked xfce enough to try theming to my liking.04:02
pitillotreach, saving my bandwidth :)... I prefer velocity than quality04:02
marooh, I also use tango icons04:02
marothey still have the ugly rodent theme by default :(04:02
pitillo(ummmm dont know so much about nx)04:03
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treachpitillo: I don't think you got that right. I meant "compared to what alternative technology, that you consider more wastefull with bandwidth."04:03
treachmaro: just be happy it doesn't look like xfce 3x anymore. :)04:04
maroI am, I am... :)04:04
pitillotreach, well I dont know how many alternatives I have and I dont know so much about nx too. And for me is more confortable to use vnc because I dont need to read about another alternatives04:06
pitilloworking with vnc and 256 colors I get all I need :). I?ll try to read about another alternatives04:08
treachif you are using windows rdp is pretty good. and with X on linux I've always had pretty good luck with ssh -X -Y -C.04:08
treachof course, if you are on a modem, things might look a bit different, but then again, vnc over modem is no joy imo..04:09
pitillotreach, Im in windows at work,connected by vnc to home. I?ll take a look to rdp too. 16Kb of upload at home, sufficient bandwidth, imo.04:19
treachok. rdp is used when your server is windows.04:19
treachI've never used ssh tunneling X apps on 16Kb, but with enough encryption it might work.04:21
treachdoh.. multitasking isn't my strong point.. *COMPRESSION* I mean, not encryption, dammit.04:24
rxianyone tried matchbox recently?\04:38
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pitillowell, Im using a tunnel ssh to conect with vnc, by this way I got encription with vnc but lost a bit of bandwidth too. I think this is the best solution by now, but continue reading to see if there is another way. :)04:57
treachsure, just forward your x apps.04:57
treach(and get an X server for your windows system)04:58
pitillowell, but Im working in windows... is that posible? I tried putty and there is no way to get it working04:58
treachmoment..04:58
treachpitillo: this one has worked pretty well for me, when I've had the need for it. http://www.pexus.com/Documents/release.htm04:59
treachjust start it, connect with ssh and make *sure* X accepts to forward your apps, then just start them from the prompt.05:00
rxicould i use qemu to emulate x86 so i can run opera?05:03
treachno.05:03
treachbochs might help though.05:03
vektoriNo?05:03
treachvektori: afaik anyway..05:04
rxihas to be able to run on hppa05:04
vektoriWhy not?05:04
treachvektori: Iafaik qemu isn't a hardware emulator.05:05
vektoriIt's primarily a hardware emulator.05:05
tilmanof course it is05:05
vektoriKQEMU, the virtualizer is just an afterthought.05:05
tilmanhttp://qemu.org/status.html05:05
treachoh, ok. I always thought it was more like vmware than bochs..05:05
tilmanno hppa in host cpu though05:05
tilmanso you cannot emulate x86 on hppa ;)05:06
rxidamn :(05:06
rxii dont wanna use firefox *crys*05:06
pitillotreach, well, it seems a nice alternative but I cant see my desktop. With vnc Im working directly with my desktop. But sure I?ll try it. Thanks for the info :)05:06
treachpitillo: depends on what you are after, your apps or your desktop?05:06
treachbesides, there is really nothing that stops you from running the entire desktop-session that way if you want to iirc, but IMO that's a bit excessive.05:07
treachrxi: maybe you should try dillo then. :P05:08
treachat least it's not firefox ;-)05:09
rxithat just uses mozilla doesnt it?05:09
treachhehe, no.05:09
maronope, but forget about css etc.05:09
rxiits a toss up between dillo and firefox :)05:10
treach:-)05:10
pitillotreach, this is the point... well, Im running my desktop to use some apps and the most important, see the router?s logs. By this way I can see all with less quality(256colors) but runs well. I think that is a nice alternative in front of vnc if the number of apps were less. (irc+im+mail for example)05:10
treachthere is nothing that stops you from running several apps this way.....05:11
treachapp1 &05:12
treachapp2 &05:12
treachetc.05:12
treachbut of course, use whatever you feel comfortable with. :-)05:12
pitillotreach, true... but... another point is that I should?t start a session, because the apps grown by 2. In my session and in the connection.05:14
treach?05:14
treachsorry I can't make sense of that.05:14
pitillotreach, yes, but its nice to talk with other people about. Another opinions always can get a bit of knowledge.05:15
treachsure.05:15
pitillotreach, sorry, my english level is too poor. I refer that if I start the session at home I start all apps and if I connect from work fowarding X apps I need to run another time them. The solution is, not to start the session at home to save cpu and mem, and launch all apps by the forward app05:17
treachah... I see.05:17
treachYou should use console apps, then you could use screen ;-)05:18
pitillojajaaajaja terminal apps.. but only one by connection :D05:20
treachnono.. screen can run a lots of apps.. :-)05:21
treachyikes. I'm getting "infected".05:21
treachbah, I'd better get back to battling with samba.. :-(05:22
rxilol05:24
treach"lol"? Schadenfreude is the one and only true joy, apparently.05:26
rxiif i knew what that was i might agree05:28
pitillo:? need to read more about screen, dont understand how launching a terminal app  can be in another screen. Learning all days... :D05:28
treachscreen is really cool.05:29
vektoriI couldn't live without screen. It's probably the first thing I install when setting up a system. :)05:31
rxiive never used it05:31
vektori:O05:31
rxiive used minicom plenty05:32
vektoriThat's like saying you've never eaten an apple but you still play golf.05:33
rxilol05:33
rxiim just reading the screen page on gnu.org05:33
rxicall me dumb but i dont see the diff between screen and xterm05:38
tilmanhit "ctrl-a c" in screen05:38
tilmanwow, a new terminal opens05:38
tilmanxterm = 1 terminal05:38
tilmanscreen = n terminals05:38
tilmanthat's why it's called a "terminal multiplexer"05:38
tilman;)05:38
rxilol .. just type xterm and get a new term?05:39
treachhit c-a d and detatch from your session..?05:39
vektorirxi: Oh, and open a new ssh connection when you want to two things simultaneously?05:39
tilmanare you drunk?05:39
rxiright .... /me goes over here now05:39
treachrxi: and login type "xterm -r" and get all your stuff up again as they were? ;-)05:40
vektoriHehe.05:40
vektorirxi: http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2004/3/9/16838/1493505:40
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rximan i should have just kept my mouth shut .. its like gentoo fanboy club in here :P05:41
vektoriYou hurt my feelings. :(05:41
treachnot really, but comparing screen to xterm is *really*, *really* ignorant..05:42
rxitreach: hence why i said "20:38 < rxi> call me dumb..."05:42
treachwell, I guess we did. :-)05:42
rxiwell ill emerge screen and see what happens05:45
vektoriDidn't you give up on Gentoo?05:46
rxiyeah i did but i gave up one netbsd when the iso wouldnt boot05:46
vektoriHehe.05:46
vektoriIt's hard to argue with that.05:46
rxiim not sure if it even works with my cpu05:46
vektoriIf NetBSD doesn't work, I don't think anything will. :P05:47
rxilol .. freebsd and openbsd will but meh05:47
rxidont like openbsd and freebsd actually doesnt support it looking at their website05:48
rxigentoo is like windows .. the only reason im using it cos its the only feasible choice05:48
rxithey both shit me equally05:49
pitillowell, nice the  "terminal multiplexer" term. I?ll go to read. It sounds like what vektori said, it seems a lot usefull. I need more time :D05:50
vektori:)05:50
rxiie: i install screen and it says: Some dangerous key bindings have been removed or changed....05:51
rxii think id prefer it use mrxvt or a tabbed terminal. i dont really have any need to remote screen either05:56
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rxii found a use for screen .. when your compiling more than 6 things at once and you dont have x :)07:22
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Jeffjohnsonhowdy07:47
Jeffjohnsonhow can I create an initrd image under CRUX? I don't find a mkinitrd port or something like that07:47
HanCreate a custom kernel and compile all driver into the kernel and you won't need an initrd07:50
HanThe only module I have is nvidia07:51
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rxilo jaeger07:53
jaegerheyo07:53
JeffjohnsonHan: i have a special purpose :) I want a installation that runs on the most machines07:54
Jeffjohnsonis there no "easy"  way to create an initrd image?07:55
treachcopy the one on jaegers updated 2.1 iso?07:56
jaegermkinitrd is pretty easy... just not too featureful07:56
Hanmake your own port07:58
Jeffjohnsonjaeger: where i can find an mkinitrd crux port?07:58
jaegerthere isn't one, as far as I know07:58
Jeffjohnsonhmm ok, thank you07:58
jaegerfor future reference, if someone has published a port, you can find it here: http://crux.nu/portdb/07:59
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scriptdevilis crux doing well??08:09
scriptdevilIt is falling in the dirstrowatch table08:09
scriptdevilany problems08:09
vektoriOh my god! Something must be done!08:09
treachCrux is dying, distrowatch confirms it.08:09
treachwe are doomed.08:09
Hanheh08:09
rxihaha08:10
scriptdevili am an arch user wanting to take up crux08:10
rxirofl08:10
Handon't08:10
scriptdevilbecause of ports08:10
scriptdevilwhy not08:10
scriptdevilJukka Heino> u r not doomes08:11
scriptdevil*doomed*08:11
vektorio_O08:11
treachah.. but vektori that's encouraging isn't it?08:11
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vektoriYeah. :P08:12
treachit'd be worse if you were told you *are* doomed. :P08:12
vektoriHehe.08:12
scriptdevilwell i am not encouraged then bye08:13
vektoriBye.08:13
treachbye! happy journey.08:13
treachbah, that one was easy..08:14
rxitreach: he;s still here :P08:14
scriptdevilarch is good, being based on crux i thought crux was better08:14
scriptdevili dont mind backstabs08:14
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scriptdevil:)08:14
cptnhey there08:14
scriptdevilholla08:15
treachscriptdevil: "better" always depends on what you are looking for.08:15
rxihey cptn08:15
treachheya cptn, long time no C. ;-)08:15
Hancptn++08:15
scriptdevili want a solid base i can build on and compile software unless i want dont want to08:15
treachlol08:15
Hanscriptdevil, then crux is not for you08:16
treachwell, if you don't want to compile stuff crux isn't for you.08:16
scriptdevili want the libs installed in the default places08:16
scriptdevilI want to compile08:16
treachyou can get away with binaries for firefox, ooo but for the rest...08:16
scriptdevili will use ports for jdk etc which is not open08:16
treachoh, well, opera is binaries too.08:16
scriptdevili compiled firefox on LFS08:16
* scriptdevil is talking about closed source stuff like jre08:17
treachyou don't need crux for jre/jdk.08:17
scriptdevilwhich i cant compile08:17
scriptdevili will compile everything in source tarball08:18
treachimpressive.08:18
rxilol08:18
scriptdevili want ports for the closed stuff like jre, can u get me a tarball dor jre by the way08:18
scriptdevilu cant08:18
scriptdevilso i need ports for that08:19
treachno. but a selfextracting binary isn't that difficult..08:19
scriptdevilAlso i used bsd for a long time08:19
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treachphew..08:19
rxigood riddence to bad rubbish08:19
treach"this isn't the distro you are looking for..."08:19
rxii dont know i understood what he was really after08:19
treachI'm not sure he knew that either.08:20
rxihehe sounded like it08:20
rehabdoll#crux is somehow short for "newbie friendly"08:22
treachwell, there *are* limits.08:23
rxisome plese bold and under and change the fold size of "experienced" to 7 on the website:)08:23
rehabdoll:)08:23
treach<h1>experienced</h1>08:24
rxicptn: how did you go with that guy about crux/sparc08:24
treachrxi: actually in some cases I think even <blink> could have it's use.. :P08:25
rxihaha08:25
cptnrxi: I actually answered him before contacting you... he basically asked whether I would look at the error message, and I agreed08:25
marothe "crux isn't for you" attitude is what I love most about crux :)08:25
treachexactly.08:25
cptnrxi: haven't heard from him though08:25
rxiahh08:25
maropretty much every other distro has been spoiled because they want to satishfy everybody08:26
treachNobody in their right mind should accuse us of envangilicism.08:26
rehabdollby the way, im curious if there is a specific reason why bash 3.1 is not in core08:28
rehabdolland dont hold back if anyone thinks its a stupid question, just let me have it08:28
rehabdolli get turned on by irc-abuse08:29
treachbash is evil and considered legacy. It's being phased out by better shells. ;)08:29
treach(sorry, I just got pissed of wrt debian attitude towards mp3.)08:30
rxior so treach and a few unamed people think :)08:30
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rehabdoll:)08:30
treachrxi: no, but I think I'll include the <sarcasm></sarcasm> tags the next time..08:31
jjpkzomg! crux is dying because the ratings are falling on distrowatch. What will become of this?!?! :D :D08:31
jjpkThat made my day.08:31
treachwe'll add another similarity with *BSD then I guess.08:32
jjpkRatings are overrated.08:32
rxiits a good thing for us if our rating drops08:32
treach"Crux, successfully dying since 1999" or something.08:32
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rxihey its prologic08:34
jjpkAh the joys of endless reincarnation and painful death.08:34
treachjjpk: I guess we should thank eugenia for not picking us as her darling. ;-)08:34
prologicyes yes08:34
prologicI'm back finally :)08:34
prologicthough I think my isp have fucked up my /29 route :/08:34
jjpkhaha, I doubt it would have happened. CRUX is no one's bitch.08:34
jjpkPR-wise.08:34
treachI wouldn't call it a bitch in any sense..08:35
treachthere are other, much better candidates.08:35
marorehabdoll: there are some issues with the unpatched version, patches are available now though08:36
jdolanyou guys are mean.08:49
jdolan=P08:49
rxii thouhght you liked it when we play rough :P08:49
jdolanhaha..08:51
jdolanwell, "hi, i'd like to try CRUX"08:51
jdolan"dont, get lost, n00b"08:51
jdolanlol.. ah fuck it.08:51
jdolanhi everyone, btw.08:52
jjpkhi.08:52
rxihehe hey jay08:52
jjpkJust the daily dose of elitism.08:53
treachI liked how he was about to compile everything. In a tar file. :-)08:53
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treachprobably more of a linguistic screw-up than a declaration of actual intent. But.. :D08:54
treachjjpk: btw, if you think it was elitistic, do you volonteer to do the handholding these people would need for quite some time? ;-)08:56
jjpkOf course not. ;)08:56
rxii try to laugh and make things worse08:57
treachjjpk: then it's not elitism, it's pragmatism. :-)08:57
jjpkIf you say so. :p09:02
treachI guess it's depends on your view, but IMO it's better to tell people they are in too deep, than that they get a frustrating experience and blame the distro.09:06
rxiyeah09:07
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marotreach: it's even better to tell them that they suck and that they should fuck off09:14
marojdolan-style :)09:15
treachwhy? abuse sucks just as much as newbies in over their head..09:15
jdolanhah.. that guy wasn't a newbie, he was just an asshole.09:19
jdolan(what was his name?09:19
cptnRonny, probably :-)09:20
jdolanyep!09:20
maro:)09:20
jdolan;)09:20
jjpk:D :D09:20
treach:D09:20
jjpkRonny ftw.09:20
treachomg, no way..09:20
treachronny ftl...09:20
treachgth, even.09:20
jdolanhe actually emailed me a valid suggestion for the jre/jdk ports =/09:20
marojdolan: you were too proud to apply, right?09:21
maroeverything else would be bad maintainership09:21
jdolanhah, i actually intend to make his adjustment.. just have been a bit busy, he only sent it last week.09:22
maro:)09:22
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prologicI see Ronny is still entertaining us :)10:03
jjpkHe hasn't said much on the ml for a while again10:04
jjpkAt least a month.10:04
treach-= THIS MESSAGE NOT LOGGED =-10:05
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prologicyou're funny treach :)10:06
kensaihi guys10:06
prologichi kensai10:06
kensaihey guys udev gives some invalid kernel arguments errors when booting and says that the invalid kernel arguments are in line 38 39 and 40, this is since the upgrade to udev 09110:12
jaegermake sure you've merged rejected files in /var/lib/pkg/rejected, if any10:14
maroyou probably want to use rejmerge to do it10:15
marois this crack? -> http://www.securityfocus.com/columnists/40210:16
treachjaeger: I get some funky udev stuff here as well wrt fuse. I haven't made any notes of the exact error, yet, but everything is merged though.10:17
treachanyone else seen that?10:17
jaegertreach: I've seen that, it's probably due to the new strictness with regards to assignment vs. comparison operators10:17
treachok.10:17
jaegerKERNEL="fuse", NAME="%k", MODE="0666"10:17
jaegerKERNEL=="fuse", NAME="%k", MODE="0666" <--- right10:18
treachyeah.10:18
* jaeger pokes vektori10:18
kensaithx very much guys10:19
kensaithat was the problem I think. let me reboot10:19
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treachhm, any pointers to how you use wildcards in arguments to shellscripts?10:24
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PuGzhey guys, i dont mean to spam here at all, but i need to get the word out about this. I am doing a marketing unit at uni and need people to do an online survey about energy drinks. it only takes 3 minutes (and i use the power of linux, apache, mysql, php and drupal to do it). you can access it here: http://kite.homelinux.net/10:39
bd2lol10:39
PuGzsorry10:39
PuGz:)10:39
teK /amsg sry 4 amsg10:40
teK:o10:40
treach"the survey will also have a special question about fitting punishment for off topic marketing..10:41
PuGzahhh!10:42
PuGzhehe10:42
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cptnPuGz: there's a little type in the third age range10:49
cptnshould probably be 26-35, but it's 36-3510:49
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j^2hey all11:04
jjpkhey.11:05
PuGzcptn: thanks for that - i have fixed it now, and you obviously WON'T need to do the survey again.11:08
PuGzhaha11:08
PuGzi gotta run11:08
PuGzthanks cptn11:08
PuGzcya11:08
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cihi11:46
jjpkhi.11:47
aonhi11:48
will[werk]hi12:00
copworkhihi12:07
predatorfreakMars.12:12
predatorfreakSorry, had to break up all the hi :)12:13
aon:(12:13
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vektorijaeger: Fixed fuse, thanks for the heads up.13:48
jaegernp :)13:49
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danmhi14:52
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sepenI wish I have also the openal port in my repo15:09
sepenjejejej15:09
sepen# Description: open15:10
sepen# URL:         http://openal.org15:10
sepenopen???15:11
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sepenmay be, the description can be changed by the info show at webpage...15:21
pitillomay be15:26
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prologicQ: 2.1 -> 2.2: pkgadd -u everything on the cd, run the setup-helper script ?22:27
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sepenboot from cd and then start setup script with upgrade option22:32
sepenthis upgrade to 2.2 for you22:33
prologicyeh can't boot from cd though22:41
prologicsome of my machines, a. don't have cdroms, b. have no keyboard/monitor22:41
sepenmmm22:43
sepenyou can use the script if you give to them the mount point and where are located .pkg*22:44
sepenI never has installed crux over the net22:45
sepensorry prologic I can't help you x|22:46
prologicnps22:46
sepencptn, are you here?22:47
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