IRC Logs for #crux Wednesday, 2006-07-05

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sexy-mansome boss at work says redhat enterprise allows upgrades00:14
sexy-mandistro that compile are problematik00:14
sexy-manwow crux has many chatters00:15
sexy-manmore than arch00:15
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sexy-manno one here?00:30
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sexy-maneveryone throwing firecrackers00:30
predatorfreaksexy-man: No, sorry, I'm balancing my own work.00:31
predatorfreakTo sum this up.00:31
predatorfreakRed Hat Enterprise allows distro upgrades through ISO's.00:32
predatorfreakAfter installation.00:32
predatorfreakCRUX becomes mostly versionless.00:32
predatorfreakand you just need to read release notes and shit.00:32
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sexy-manoh no00:39
sexy-manI have peronally upgraded redaht ent 3 to 4 ES00:39
sexy-manand it is "no longer supportde"00:39
sexy-manaccording to redhat themselves00:39
sexy-manI though upgrading was matter of c compiler, kernel, and then packages00:39
sexy-mandoes seem that reedhat is goofy00:39
sexy-manwhat u wrkin on pred00:40
sexy-man<---we are about to stick our dicks in the jboss socket because redaht supports them00:40
predatorfreaksexy-man: Nothing much, a ton of crap mostly.00:41
predatorfreakHobby projects.00:41
predatorfreakand not really.00:41
predatorfreakUpgrading is more little packages to me.00:41
predatorfreakand then big upgrades are GCC, kernel and shit.00:41
predatorfreakFor the most part Red Hat Enterprise is, as far as I know, focused on being a Linux workstation/desktop environment that's well supported.00:42
predatorfreakand basically they just patch shit and bump revisions.00:42
predatorfreakThen release a new version.00:42
predatorfreakand upgrade all the software.00:42
sexy-manthey said reformat your bx with 400:43
predatorfreakCrazy nuts.00:43
sexy-manthe 3 to 4 upgrade fucked up ome java crap00:43
predatorfreakI say don't buy Linux :P00:43
sexy-manseems java is kinda a bear for linux00:43
sexy-manI do too00:43
sexy-manbut boss wants suport in case we sget stuck00:44
sexy-manIm like ever hear of an online forum00:44
sexy-manhe came from disney00:44
sexy-man"prodution kinda guy"00:44
predatorfreakWell, my Gentoo server is production quality.00:44
predatorfreakNever has any downtime, really.00:44
sexy-manbut he knows more than me so hes the top banana00:44
predatorfreakand if I had problems.00:44
predatorfreakI'm better than a helpdesk ;)00:44
predatorfreakI know more UNIX than some support jocky, I guarantee that :)00:45
sexy-mangentoo or crux?00:45
sexy-manhe he00:45
sexy-manIm sure00:45
predatorfreaksexy-man: Gentoo on my server, CRUX on my desktop.00:45
sexy-manI learned mroe installing arch linux00:45
sexy-manwhy not crux on server?00:45
sexy-manI ask why a lot00:46
predatorfreakGentoo because I wanted something that didn't require me to manage half of my own package repository to tune it to my needs.00:46
sexy-manhalf who?00:46
predatorfreaksexy-man: Don't be sorry! Not asking questions is how you become a Windows user.00:46
predatorfreaksexy-man: Half of a package repository.00:46
predatorfreakSomething that would handle all my custom needs.00:46
sexy-manwhy need to manage packae repository?00:46
sexy-mandoesnt crux have ports etc.00:47
predatorfreaksexy-man: Some packages aren't built to my tastes and ports aren't Gentoo ebuilds.00:47
predatorfreakThere isn't such a thing as USE="-cock" :)00:47
predatorfreakYou have to tweak the files.00:47
predatorfreakCRUX is more hobbyist.00:49
predatorfreakGentoo is more "professional".00:49
predatorfreakIn my opinion, anyway.00:49
sexy-manthat sucks00:49
predatorfreaksexy-man: I'm a hobbyist, but I like my server to be a fairly production-like environment.00:50
predatorfreakWith some decent doesn't-easily-die stuff.00:50
predatorfreakor doesn't-require-me-to-devote-ten-hours-to-it stuff.00:50
predatorfreakSince I really like to spend three days once and forget it.00:51
predatorfreakThen just update it about once a month :)00:51
sexy-manim kinda scared to upgrade rehat boxes since sometimes they overwite config files00:52
sexy-manI fucking hate that00:52
sexy-manit has n excludes00:52
sexy-manbut then there might be sister packages00:52
sexy-manare crux packages up to date?00:53
predatorfreakGentoo handles that BEAUTIFULLY.00:53
sexy-manisnt gentoo atke liek 40 hours to install?00:53
predatorfreaksexy-man: Depending on the box.00:53
sexy-mandoes it support modern drives liek sata00:53
predatorfreakA decently fast system isn't more than a few hours even with a full system rebuild.00:53
sexy-manredaht also uses something called LVM00:53
predatorfreakAt least for a bootable system.00:53
sexy-manwhihc im not sure how important it iz00:54
predatorfreakBoth CRUX and Gentoo support both.00:54
predatorfreakAs far as I know.00:54
predatorfreaksexy-man: Plus a stage3 installation will get it up and running in a day.00:54
sexy-manso do you know NIS and tcpip netowrking adn SAN stff?00:54
predatorfreakEven after you install everything.00:54
sexy-manarch linux installs in liek 15min00:54
sexy-manits inda cool00:54
predatorfreakI don't do any NIS stuff, I know some crap with networking.00:54
sexy-manbut doesnt even come with rsync jsut command line00:55
predatorfreakand haven't heard of SAN.00:55
sexy-manI had to tinker to get X going00:55
prologicpredatorfreak, I don't share your view :)00:55
prologicI have crux running on multiple servers00:55
prologicall production00:55
sexy-manpro does it do fine under stress?00:55
predatorfreakprologic: I still think CRUX is more hobbyist.00:55
predatorfreakIt requires far more hand maintaince.00:55
prologicmore flexible perhaps00:55
predatorfreakThen again.00:55
sexy-manhand amtin?00:55
predatorfreakI'm VERY specific on my shit.00:55
sexy-manlie what00:55
sexy-manapache modues?00:55
predatorfreaksexy-man: I'd have to patch qmail to deal with my environment.00:55
sexy-manor something00:56
predatorfreakI have to send shit through my ISP.00:56
sexy-manqmail is awesome i heard00:56
predatorfreakIt is.00:56
sexy-manwhy patch00:56
predatorfreakSmashes my old sendmail installation.00:56
sexy-manits supposed to be secure as hell00:56
predatorfreaksexy-man: I have to forward stuff through my ISP, who require SMTP-AUTH.00:56
sexy-manby dan b eh00:56
predatorfreakHence qmail must support SMTP-AUTH.00:56
sexy-manwhats that00:56
predatorfreakPlus I prefer SSL and such.00:57
sexy-manidentity check for MTA00:57
predatorfreaksexy-man: No, makes people login in before they can unrestrictedly send mail.00:57
predatorfreakand with the qmail setup I'm using.00:57
predatorfreakThey have to do starttls first.00:57
predatorfreakNo plain text passwords, folks!00:57
sexy-mani kinda suck at ssh00:57
sexy-manI log in but its all i can do to intall a thawete cert on apache00:58
sexy-manI love rsync00:58
predatorfreakIt handles my ports collection.00:58
predatorfreakprologic: My main thing is laziness though.00:59
sexy-manIn face I have a knotty problem maybe uve solved before: say I have 30 boxes with vetitas backup client, adn i need to add a new backup server to the cient config text file and then restart the client; how do I script that if connection is ssh?00:59
predatorfreakI can't be arsed to maintain a decent ports tree for my server.00:59
sexy-manwhat with ports with custom packages u made?00:59
predatorfreakI don't use it daily and it mostly sits there in a non-production environment.00:59
sexy-manIdont get the problem if crux has ports00:59
predatorfreakI prefer it to run and run well.00:59
predatorfreakWithout me spending time manually hacking shit.01:00
predatorfreaksexy-man: CRUX ports isn't Gentoo portage.01:00
predatorfreakor even FreeBSD ports for that matter.01:00
sexy-manooh you mean some programs missing?01:00
predatorfreakIt's more along the lines of Arch PKGBUILDS.01:00
sexy-manoh its binaries?01:00
prologicmorlenxus, you a contrib maintainer ? (If so, can you tag your sphinx2 port?)01:00
sexy-man686 binaries not soruce?01:00
predatorfreakApplication's aren't as tunable on how you build shit.01:01
predatorfreakAt least not without editing the Pkgfile.01:01
sexy-manwoa so you are a good unix hacker01:01
predatorfreakIt's like Arch ABS, basically.01:01
sexy-manif your all super customizing things01:01
sexy-manwhy so much customization?01:01
predatorfreaksexy-man: I wouldn't say hacker, I just mess with shit.01:01
predatorfreakI'm a good UNIX hobbyist really :P01:01
sexy-manI dunno Im a linux admin and I get stuck studying I get bored01:01
sexy-manbut I touch some relatively advanced stuff at work so I kow all these pieces01:02
predatorfreaksexy-man: Gotta have things in a way I love to use.01:02
sexy-manI have few books I should read01:02
predatorfreakand that doesn't constitute KDE or GNOME :)01:02
sexy-manredhat kinda pisses me01:02
sexy-manfluxbox is decent01:02
predatorfreakCRUX I love on my desktop.01:02
predatorfreakBecause I can tweak it to infinity.01:02
predatorfreakEverything is at my finger tips.01:02
sexy-manI cant find the button to miniize all windows tho01:02
predatorfreakI use Gentoo on my server beause I'm a lazy bastard.01:03
sexy-manso gentoo is not jsut for hardheaded unix devils01:03
sexy-manwhat x wm do you use?01:03
predatorfreakWith PyPanel.01:03
predatorfreakOpenbox feels good to me.01:04
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TARANtheWANDERRdoes it have window bar for multiple open windows?01:55
TARANtheWANDERRadn an icon to minimize all?01:55
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pitillono way with tls and amsn...03:47
Hanpitillo, use bitlbee03:58
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RyoSi agree with han.. bitlbee is perfect03:59
RyoSbut han, bitlbee doesnt have webcam support which bugs me.. sometimes a webcam can be cool too03:59
RyoSs&m weirdo04:02
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rxiRyoS: so your the guy on camwhores.com04:03
* co|work spanks RyoS 04:03
RyoSnot exactly :D04:03
RyoSuh :o04:03
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pitillothis is personal now... I try to make it working (in my computer works and don?t now why it isn?t finding the tls module when it starts with newer deps versions)04:11
pitillotouchung the source of amsn can be jumped the tls module check... but don?t now if information is encripted04:11
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ningoBei mir geht die Tendenz immer mehr zu Debian bzw. Ubuntu, für Gentoo04:17
ningosorry, wrong channel :)04:17
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lutin_triste!dico dépression04:24
jesuslemalindépression n.fém.04:24
jesuslemalin(abaissement, physique ou moral)04:24
jesuslemalin* dépression d'un terrain; dépression04:24
jesuslemalincreusée par un cours d'eau04:24
jesuslemalin* une dépression (atmosphérique) amène des pluies04:24
jesuslemalin* dépression physique (fatigue), morale04:24
jesuslemalin* soigner une dépression, une crise de04:24
jesuslemalindéprimer v.04:24
jesuslemalin(surtout au sens moral)04:24
jesuslemalin* les mauvaises nouvelles avaient dépriimé toute la famille04:24
jesuslemalin* des gens que la crise avait déprimés et affollés04:24
jesuslemalinle p.p.prend le genre et le04:24
jesuslemalinnombre de la pers.qui est déprimée,04:24
jesuslemalinsi celle-ci le précède04:24
jesuslemalindéprime n.fém.04:24
jesuslemalin(FAM.: dépression morale)04:24
jesuslemalin* il est en pleine déprime; combattre04:25
jesuslemalinla déprime04:25
jesuslemalindéprimant,ante adj.04:25
jesuslemalin* une situation déprimante (décourageante)04:25
jesuslemalindépressif,ive adj.04:25
jesuslemalin(porté au découragement)04:25
jesuslemalin* caractère dépressif; jeunesse dépressive04:25
jesuslemalindépressionnaire adj.04:25
jesuslemalin(en météo)04:25
jesuslemalin* zone dépressionnaire sur l'Océan04:25
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RyoSone of the cool guys :D04:26
mike_kjdolan: time to kick one's ass04:26
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nipuLgrr, when is coming back online already :[04:57
rxiwhen the earth stops spining05:01
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Husiohmm... on crux.2.2 iso there iso no default kernel?05:56
bd2you have to compile kernel by yourself. source tarball exists on iso05:57
prologicumm there is05:59
prologicyou can just copy the iso's kernel05:59
prologicI always do cause I'm lazy (I compile it later)06:00
mike_k(undocumented obvious feature)06:00
bd2do not work with exotic hardware. plus, I doubt that audio modules compiled in06:02
Husiowow... even polish packages in repo ^^06:03
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jdolanwhy do we have a foreign langauge bot here?06:31
jdolanclearly he was not built with --disable-nls and therefore is not fit for #crux :)06:32
ningothis whole i18n-crap that comes with GNU is fortunately disabled on crux06:59
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prologicbd2, I never said anything about the iso's kernel being suffice :)07:16
prologicbut good to get a system up and running quickly07:16
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pehwhy isent squirrel-mail in the ports tree?07:29
rxibecause no one uses it?07:30
pehno one at all?07:31
rxii guess not07:31
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rxibloody canandians07:32
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pehi cant find a webmail interface what so ever in the ports07:33
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jaegersounds like a good reason to port one07:34
mike_kpeh: it is easy to use squirrelmail (even without the port)07:34
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pehmike_k: i dont know how many times i tried to get postfix work with couire and squirrelmail :)07:35
pehit was a long time since i last tried now07:36
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jaegerI use squirrelmail with uw-imap, haven't tried with courier07:37
mike_ksendmail+dovecot+squirrelmail+quota-tools+clamav+mimedefang here07:39
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Husiothere's no crux forum ?08:45
rehabdollmailinglist & irc-channel08:47
ningoZOMG, I wan't!!! s/gentoo/crux/08:48
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* aon wants bbs.archlinux.org08:52
ningoah, go away08:53
Husioin repository list, I found 4 links to fluxbox packages. And 1 is different. How can I check which package is correct ?09:01
mike_kuse opt version if unsure09:03
mike_kor contrib if no opt there09:04
mike_kand better read man prt-get09:04
sepenmake[2]: *** [hello_world] Error 109:09
sepenmake[2]: Leaving directory `/usr/ports/contrib/freealut/work/src/freealut-1.1.0/examples'09:09
sepenthere are an error on freeglut (contrib) port09:09
aongood that you provide the most important information for solving the problem09:10
aon"gee, i wonder what the error code is?"09:10
aonand that's free_a_lut09:11
jdolan_bitchy in here today.09:16
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jdolan_keep it up - the less users to support the better ;)09:16
rehabdolldoh, ken lay is dead :(09:19
rehabdollnow he cant get ass-raped in prison09:19
pitilloRyoS, I hope you can use amsn, my sister can use it :) tcl, tk, tls and amsn (and like I said you yesterday, take a look to footprints to see what kind of shit add them to your system)09:21
jdolan_can i just get something off of my chest?09:22
rehabdolltake a deep breath09:23
rehabdolland release slowly through your nose09:23
jaegerdon't mozilla angry :)09:23
jdolan_it _used_ to just be a stupid "lock" file you'd have to kill, now, apparently, after i've already flattened a guys .mozilla/firefox and .thunderbird, i've read that you need to remove BOTH "lock" and ".parentlock"09:24
jdolan_here's a brilliant fucking idea.. DONT LOCK IT.09:24
rxiopera ftw!!!! *runs of laughing*09:24
jdolan_what the hell could mess up your profile?  and if that happens, who gives a flying fuck?  holy hell.09:24
jdolan_suffer a power failure, and the average user has just lost their profile.  real smart.09:25
jdolan_run the battery in your laptop dead..09:25
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prologicHas anyone noticed a strange bug in Opera9 ? Making spaces appear 8 characters wide in zoomed mode (ctrl + Num_PLUS) ?09:35
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RyoSpitillo: let me check09:40
RyoSwill build from your ports09:40
ssimonjaeger: have a look into your mails :) sent a reply.09:42
jaegerssimon: only occurs with RenderAccel disabled?09:43
jaegerI always use RenderAccel, perhaps that's why I don't see it09:44
ssimonno, if it's enabled.09:44
jaegerhrmm... dunno, then09:44
ssimonsame here ;)09:44
jaegerYour email says "If i set RenderAccel to true, it's fixed"09:49
jaegerso the problem occurs when it's disabled, right?09:49
Husiodamn... crux has really nice manuals09:49
RyoSpitillo: great!09:50
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ssimonjaeger: umm, i mean disabled :)09:51
j^2hey all09:51
jaegerssimon: ok09:52
jaegerheyo, j^209:52
* j^2 tips hat09:53
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pitilloRyoS, :)09:54
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jaegerssimon: I haven't got my laptop at work today, I'll have a look at it this evening when I get home09:54
RyoSpitillo: was it just the --with-tcl ./configure option?09:55
ssimonjaeger: okay, maybe it could be fixed with some font rendering options, dunno.09:56
pitilloRyoS, was a little path to tk's Pkgfile too09:57
pitillos/path/patch :)09:57
RyoSah alright09:57
RyoSnice :)09:57
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Husiothere's no ready-to-use packages for crux? only ports like in gentoo ?11:02
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Husioo, pkg-get, where can I found some info about it? the link fromhandboot doesn't work11:18
Husioand no manual also :/11:18
ningouse prt-get instead11:22
Husiobut I don't whant to compile stuff11:23
ningoin this case, crux isn't for you11:24
Husioso it's like gentoo ?11:25
pitilloHusio, CRUX is a lightweight, i686-optimized Linux distribution targeted at experienced Linux users11:25
ningotry archlinux, it's somewhat of a fork of crux but uses binaries instead11:25
HusioI'm using archlinux11:25
ningowhere's the problem?11:25
Husiono idea11:25
Husioso crux is like gentoo ?11:26
ningono, it isn't like gentoo11:26
ningoit's like crux11:27
Husiobut the porf stuff - it's similar11:27
pitilloHusio, at you have a lot of info11:28
ningoyes, both are inspired by the FreeBSD ports11:28
Husioyea, I've read all the info from there11:28
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Husiorobil ktos theme do phpBB ? trudne to to ?11:45
tilman[x] yes, [x] no, [x] maybe11:46
Falcon|tilman: can you update the mirror list?11:47
Husiosorry, not here11:48
tilmanFalcon|: shoot11:48
Falcon|tilman: -> and ->
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Falcon|tilman: thx11:52
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jdolan_jaeger, plans to add desktop menu items for firefox/thunderbird?12:11
jdolan_openoffice could also use one.12:11
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jaegerjdolan_: I haven't planned to add them to the firefox/thunderbird ports yet, no. my openoffice port already has them13:28
jaegerI use them, myself, but I haven't put them in the port because people are serious weenies about the extra disk space :)13:29
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jaegerjdolan_: I spent the entire weekend and monday in Chicopee/Northampton13:31
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jdolan_jaeger, that's cool!  you should have called me :)14:29
jdolan_i was actually in central mass, only about an hour from there.14:30
jaegerjdolan_: I would have if I'd had any real free time =/ didn't even get to go to boston14:30
jaegerI did get to go kayaking at littleville lake, though14:30
jdolan_nice =)  kelly and i went canoeing with my sister and her boyfriend.14:31
jaegerok, off to install a red hat enterprise server14:33
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ningoyou're such a lamer RyoS14:54
ningocool. that one is new to me14:58
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koefzrehabdoll, hahah.14:59
RyoSsorry ningo :(15:09
ningounexcusable as it is, I will show mercy this time and not punish you15:11
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thrice`Han: trivial fluxbox update to rc2 :-)18:45
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Hanah, cheers20:11
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predatorfreak <-- Good read.20:18
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percent20has anyone had any problems compiling with gcc4?  I have tried compiling a couple of programs and apparently it finds a bug with gcc.21:00
percent20i am trying to recreate it so ic an post the problem.21:01
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jaegerpercent20: please do, more info the better21:16
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jdolan_hm, i can't get nvidia working (?)22:03
jdolan_screen was going black, machine was locking.22:03
jdolan_now i dont have DRI.22:04
jdolan_should i be using gl-select or nv-helper?22:04
jaegeruse gl-select, it deprecates nvhelper22:07
percent20ok finally got the error
jaegernot too useful, that one22:08
jdolan_okay.. hm.  it's not working.  i ran nvhelper first when i immediately installed the port.22:09
jaegerpercent20: follow the URL in the error message and send them a bug report, I guess22:10
jaegerjdolan: you can set it back to x11 manually if you want to start over... just have to correct the symlinks that gl-select or nvhelper set22:10
percent20k just wanted to check if you all had seen it before22:10
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jdolan_thanks jaeger, all set.22:28
jaegergood deal22:28
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