IRC Logs for #crux Monday, 2006-10-16

prologicnothing fancy :)00:00
xsachai havd amd64 3000+, only 512mb ram00:00
xsachamy uncle was telling me years ago he'd use a flash drive to boot off and it would boot much faster00:00
xsachawhat time saving do you think that would give?00:00
prologicI'm considering doing that00:00
prologicmy hard disk cacked itself a couple of months ago00:01
prologicI don't know how flash compares to ide drives atm00:01
xsachahe was saying 15 second boot into windows i think00:01
xsachai'm going to look it up00:01
rehabdolli have a cf-ide adapter00:02
rehabdollcould never get it to run in DMA mode though, low quality crap00:02
prologichehe00:03
prologicanything < 60s boot-time for windows is good00:03
xsachaoh yeah every time it boots up it tells gives me this long messages about dma being disabled and how it's going to make fsck run very slow00:03
prologicbloody machines at uni take 4mins to boot00:03
prologicthen 3mins to login00:03
prologicand they call themselves P4 Dells00:03
xsachayeah school/uni computers always seem to take forever to login00:03
xsachasoem elaborate scripts running in background00:03
prologicif you find any stats performance or specs on flash drives lemme know00:04
xsachaok00:04
prologicI'd be interested in getting a flash drive and an ide adapter00:04
rehabdollthere shouldnt be any problems getting a cf to run in dma, most cards are spec:ed for udma33 atleast00:04
rehabdolland you can get a 4gig cf with 16.2/21mb read/write for about ~$10000:05
xsachai think i removed dma support from kernel to get smaller image lol and now it takes a while at boot because i dont have it enabled00:05
rehabdolllol00:05
prologiclol00:06
prologicyou idiot :)00:06
prologicyou kinda need dma :)00:06
prologicsorta "fake speed" for hard disks :)00:07
xsachauniversities should really invest in some flash drives to boot their library computers. they must reboot more than any other computer and would have greatest time saving00:07
rehabdollnah, its not that fast00:07
rehabdolla modern harddrive is faster and will last longer00:07
xsacha:O what kind of harddrive?00:08
rehabdollyou can only rewrite a flash-device so many times00:08
xsachayeah 100,000 or something00:08
xsachabut it's only reading when it boots isn't it?00:08
prologicrewrite or write ?00:08
prologicxsacha, yeah I'd install your system so that nothing gets written back to the flash00:09
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xsachayep that's how i had my boot hard drive working before00:09
xsachaso that 100,000 write limit wouldn't apply unless it means read as well00:09
prologicyeah is it a 100,000 write limit or rewrite limit ?00:10
prologicby rewrite I mean a complete 100% write of the flash00:10
rehabdollrewrite00:10
prologicone would imagine it could handle > 100,000 writes though ?00:10
rehabdolltotal, yes00:10
prologicthe individual cells can prolly only handle 100,000 writes :)00:11
prologicpity00:11
xsachabut if you only write to it every time you update kernel it should be fine for a few years at least ;)00:11
prologicindeed00:11
prologicand keep /tmp and /var in memory00:11
prologicand maybe write out /var at shutdown00:11
prologicshouldn't be too hard to do that00:11
prologickeep /home on a usb stick :)00:12
prologicset pkgmk src/work dirs to /tmp00:12
rehabdollbut the harddrives really the bottleneck during boot?00:12
prologicsure is00:12
rehabdollone would think better startup scripts would speed up a lot more00:13
prologicnot really00:13
prologicthink about it00:13
prologicthere's some startup scripts which do a find . ... rm -rf etc in /tmp at boot-time00:13
rehabdollsince 90% (figure i pulled out of my ass) of the time is wasted waiting on other stuff to complete00:13
prologictry doing that in memory sometime :) or having /tmp as a ramfs00:13
prologicmuch faster boottime :)00:13
xsachalive cd00:14
prologicheh00:14
prologiclive cds are slow00:14
rehabdollhttp://www-128.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-boot.html?ca=dgr-lnxw04BootFaster00:14
prologiccd read times are slower :/00:14
* prologic checks his supplier for flash and adapters00:15
xsachaThis article will not explain all the different phases, since we are only interested in the phases after the kernel has loaded.00:15
xsachawell after the kernel..00:15
prologicwell crux is already simple enough and boots quite quickly as it is00:16
prologicthe only 2 things you can really do is further optimize the startup scripts00:16
prologicand use a faster medium00:16
prologicI would for instnace remove the find /tmp ... bit and just load /tmp as a tmpfs00:16
prologichmm 4G CF $126 AUD00:18
prologic2G CF $66 AUD00:18
xsachaSamsung 32GB00:18
rehabdollhmm, 4gig might be a bit more than $100.. i forgot that the US $ is about as valuable as pesos these days :)00:19
prologichmm00:19
prologicI might be able to get my desktop in under 2G00:19
prologicjust :)00:19
prologicsitting at 2.69G atm00:20
xsachahttp://www.codinghorror.com/blog/images/vista-readyboost.png00:20
rehabdollthe kernel sources are over 300mb00:20
prologicyeah00:20
prologicyou'd have to compile then remove the sources00:20
xsachacompile and then copy to flash drive00:21
prologic*nods*00:21
prologicie: have the sources on your /home (usb stick)00:21
prologicunfortunately my /home is 9.3G :)00:21
prologicwon't fit on my 2G usb stick00:21
* prologic checks size of openoffice00:22
prologiconly way I could do this is by removing cruft :)00:22
prologicopenoffice -> another 300MB00:22
xsachawhy you need /home on there :P00:23
xsachahttp://www.reghardware.co.uk/2006/03/21/samsung_unveils_ssd/00:23
xsachause that flash drive for /home00:23
xsachaFor example, the Seagate Momentus 5400 PSD includes 256 megabytes of flash RAM. This feature is called ReadyDrive, and it's even better than ReadyBoost. Unlike a USB flash drive, the flash RAM on a hard drive can be read before the system is booted, and thus can be used to speed up boot and resume times, too.00:24
prologic$ pkginfo -i | awk '{print $1}' | pkgsize | awk '$6>4096{print $0}00:25
rehabdollgonna time my boot :)00:25
prologichehe00:26
prologicI will be too soon00:26
prologicgonna see if the latest ati driver has fixed this bug00:26
rehabdoll21.6 seconds :)00:27
prologichow do I sort numerically via the 6th column ?00:27
prologiclargest first00:27
xsachaGeil David 100 256MB does 28.8MB/s mm00:27
xsachafor boot00:27
prologichttp://www.twinmos.com/flash/images/test_cfc_140x_01.gif00:31
prologichttp://www.twinmos.com/flash/flash_p_cfc_140x.htm00:32
xsachafast random read00:33
prologicdo ext3/xfs/reiser need defragging, are there any such tools ?00:34
xsachaext3 has a problem :P00:36
xsachayou have to convert back to ext2 and use e2defrag00:36
xsachano way to defrag ext3 that i know of, other than going back to ext2.. but yeah it needs defragging00:36
xsachaxfs_fsr to defrag xfs00:37
prologicahh k nice00:38
prologicgodo thing I use xfs huh :)00:38
xsachai dont think you really need to defrag on ext3 and reiser as much though00:38
xsachaor else surely there'd be tools for doing it ;)00:38
prologicfair enough00:39
prologichmm I think if I got rid of lyx/tetex/openoffice/wine00:39
prologicI'd be sweet :)00:39
prologicgood 1/2G there00:40
xsachabut one of the features coming into ext4 is meant to be 'extents' that means it sets aside room after the file so you won't need to defrag00:40
prologicahh nice00:40
xsachaeach file will be in its own spot00:40
prologicspeaking of performance though I think there is slight benefit in using a high performance fs like xfs00:41
prologicI've sorta compared it to using ext300:41
xsachayeah bad ting with xfs is you can never shrink it though :S00:46
xsachaso choose a conservative size :P00:48
prologicyeah00:49
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xsachaWhile version 2.16 continues to enhance GNOME with useful features, makes it easier to use, and removes rough edges, it also takes the first steps into the advancing age of eye candy: windows that wobble, vanish, fade, shrink, or explode -- such effects are possible due to ongoing advancements of graphics hardware.01:44
xsachagnome getting eye candy? :O :P01:44
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xsachaA telephone number, an idea, a meeting with friends -- your life is an endless flow of small pieces of information. Keeping track of it all can be difficult and frustrating but GNOME 2.16 makes it easy with a powerful new note-taking application called Tomboy01:50
xsachaomg, could they think of a worse name01:50
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Hanopenoffice-2.0.4 update released. :-)02:58
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sepenhi04:50
sepengood changes at portdb04:50
sepennow I need to change my cruxer script04:52
HanHmm the duplicates doesn't take .sync ports in account.05:48
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liwchathi07:58
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RyoShey, i want to use usbnet and give an usb port an ip, but it doesnt work at all for me08:20
RyoSbo:psi# ifconfig usb0 10.0.0.108:21
RyoSSIOCSIFADDR: No such device08:21
RyoSusb0: unknown interface: No such device08:21
RyoSany suggestions why it might not work?08:21
xsachathe /dev/usb0 doesnt exist?08:22
RyoSnope08:22
xsachayour usb is supported, you have driver installed?08:22
RyoSusb is supported08:22
xsachamodprobe usbnet ?08:22
RyoSworks08:22
xsachals /dev ? maybe it isnt called usb008:23
RyoSi have nothing with *usb* in /dev08:23
xsachamaybe a hotplug issue?08:24
RyoSdunno.. a friend just tried with ubuntu generic kernel and says it works08:24
xsachahotplugging enabled? it generates hotplug event when you stick it in08:24
RyoSyes08:25
xsachashould get a message like this: "usb0: register usbnet usb-00:02.0-1.3, Belkin, eTEK, or compatible, c2:91:27:cb:d7:29"08:26
xsachain syslogs08:26
RyoSmh...08:26
xsachaapparently if you see hotplug event it should be working08:35
RyoSmh i am looking at it08:42
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RyoSaccording to an tutorial i have everything setup fine for usbnet08:49
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j^2hey all09:02
aonhi j^209:02
j^2hey does anyone of yall have a Macbook Pro?09:04
_paranoid_nope, I do have a mac mini in the office tough...09:04
j^2ah ok thanks!09:10
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jaakkophello.09:28
deus_exjdolan: Wassup?09:28
deus_exjaakkop: Hello.09:29
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blizzhm, how can i create an iso with a 4.4G file?09:44
blizzmkisofs says it's "too large for defined data type"09:45
blizzi used growisofs to create&burn it, but it seems like mkisofs doesn't like the big file09:45
blizzi got cdrkit installed09:47
jdolan_hi guys09:47
blizzhey09:47
jdolan_hah, i'm a retard.  i sent a mail to crux-devel from my work account (awaiting moderator approval now)09:48
jdolan_jaeger or sip should get a chuckle out of that.  i don't have the mailman passwds.09:48
jdolan_jizzbot, tell jdolan_ you sux!!09:49
rxi_lol09:49
rxi_is that a script?09:50
jdolan_jizzbot?  he's a supybot09:55
jizzbotjdolan_: Error: "he's" is not a valid command.09:55
jdolan_jizzbot, q2 jdolan.dyndns.org09:55
jizzbotjdolan_: Qmass.net Resurrection DM, jdab, 0/16, 0ms09:55
jdolan_i wrote a qstat plugin for him to ping quake2 and quake3 servers, and parse their responses 8)09:55
rxi_hehe09:55
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blizzcan anyone try wether udftools compile?10:08
jdolan_wow.  hans reiser hacked up his wife, huh?10:28
rxi_yeah10:28
j^2crazy eh?10:28
jdolan_fucked up..10:28
jdolan_i wonder if she was fscking someone else.10:29
jdolan_;D10:29
j^2dont mess with a germans wife ;)10:29
rxi_lol10:29
rxi_jdolan: well he was fscking around too :P10:29
jdolan_oh?  is there a whole soap opera to this?10:29
j^2yep10:29
rxi_lol .. i meant fscking lieterally10:29
j^2lol10:29
rxi_not fucking10:29
jdolan_haha10:31
copworkwhazzat ?10:34
xsachafilesystem check10:34
rxi_just another bad joke .. im suprised treach wasnt in on it too :P10:35
jdolan_http://www.lugod.org/photos/2002.07.15/5.jpg10:35
jdolan_yea, he looks like a wife killer.10:36
copworkhehe, naw .. i know what fscking is :P10:37
rxi_she was probably secretly running a box with xfs10:37
xsachatreason10:37
blizzlol10:38
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rxi_@seen hanswife10:42
clbrxi_: I have not seen hanswife.10:42
jizzbotrxi_: I have not seen hanswife.10:42
xsacha@seen Nina Reiser10:44
clbxsacha: (seen [<channel>] <nick>) -- Returns the last time <nick> was seen and what <nick> was last seen saying. <channel> is only necessary if the message isn't sent on the channel itself.10:44
jizzbotxsacha: (seen [<channel>] <nick>) -- Returns the last time <nick> was seen and what <nick> was last seen saying. <channel> is only necessary if the message isn't sent on the channel itself.10:44
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xsacha@seen Ninaisdead10:45
clbxsacha: I have not seen Ninaisdead.10:45
jizzbotxsacha: I have not seen Ninaisdead.10:45
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Hanxsacha, tasteless.10:58
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rxiHan: your wife isnt nina too is it? :P11:00
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thrice`hrm...if I have a gnome_before and gnome_after (done with prt-get depends gnome > file), is there any easy way to remove everything that gnome installed and go back to a base system ?11:56
j^2bet that's a lot of work :(11:56
jjpkSuppose the easiest way is just to remove the majority by hand, but j^2 is right.11:57
thrice`yeah, I can't find a way to manipulate diff into a nice list11:58
thrice`i suppose everything in /usr/ports/gnome would be a start11:59
jjpkIs it just me, or does gnome seem way overblown in complexity? o_O12:05
thrice`yeah, a little bit I suppose12:07
HanDepends on what you want.12:08
* Han prefers discussing food when it comes to flavour.12:08
thrice`you mean for my removal ?12:09
thrice`oh, heh12:09
thrice`I suppose I shall go through one by one12:09
thrice`thanks anyways :)12:09
jjpkGood luck :]12:10
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deus_exnp:DJ Tiesto-Love comes again.12:31
deus_exI hope ;)12:32
deus_ex(that love will come again, that is)12:33
* deus_ex would settle for night of hot sex, too12:34
_paranoid_try amsterdam12:34
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deus_ex_paranoid_: Why Amsterdam?Good weed?12:35
_paranoid_and legalized prostitution :P12:36
_paranoid_I have to say, after wandering about the red light district for a few hours, I was sorely tempted12:36
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deus_exOh.Slovenia is much closer for that :)12:36
_paranoid_heh12:36
deus_exotoh, visa is required for both, so ....12:37
deus_exTough call :)12:38
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deus_ex_paranoid_: So, was temptation too great for you?Do tell :)12:39
* deus_ex suggests that next Cruxcon be in Amsterdam12:40
deus_exj/k12:40
jjpkdeus_ex: haha, I think that would derail the entire project :p12:40
_paranoid_deus_ex: I have a girlfriend and I don't have to pay her, so no ;)12:41
jjpkSomeone might come up with the suggestion to merge or sell everything to redhat for instance :D12:41
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deus_exjjpk: :)12:42
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deus_ex_paranoid_: Sissy :)12:42
tilmano_O12:43
_paranoid_deus_ex: humm, I'd just rather not risk something going wrong and infecting my girlfriend with something that'd be difficult to explain ;)12:43
deus_ex_paranoid_: Or surprise her.'where have you learned *that* ?'12:45
_paranoid_deus_ex: I'd rather not :)12:46
deus_ex:)12:46
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j^2fraking libgd15:36
RedShiftwhat's wrong with it?15:42
the-ruedigerwhich ftp software is good? Of course it should support sftp and have a good security-history (and it would be nice if it would be small and fast)15:52
the-ruedigerany recommendations?15:52
jaakkopgui or cli?15:53
the-ruedigeroh, i mean ftp-server software. Sorry15:55
RedShiftthe-ruediger: pureftpd15:55
jaakkopvsftpd?15:56
the-ruedigerpureftpd seems to be nice15:58
RedShiftit OOOOOoooOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOWNZ15:59
RedShift(trying to find that cs clip)15:59
RedShiftgot it16:03
RedShifthttp://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7016350539467020463&q=everybody+runs+with+a+knife16:03
_paranoid_RedShift: "Wha-what?! Everyone knows you run faster with a knife dude?"16:16
RedShiftindeed :-D16:16
_paranoid_purepwnage.com ;)16:17
RedShiftI vaguely remember that quote from the movie16:17
RedShiftthere are more eps??16:17
RedShiftlol nice16:17
_paranoid_1116:17
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RedShiftjust found something to do, brb :p16:17
_paranoid_12th out the end of this month :)16:17
nullpointerhello16:18
_paranoid_hihi16:18
j^2hey nullpointer16:22
nullpointerhey j^216:23
nullpointerwhat's up?16:23
j^2i'm still _always_ around :16:23
j^2-P16:23
j^2:P16:23
nullpointer:D good16:23
j^2working on my nagios server16:23
j^2how you doing?16:24
nullpointerkinda fine16:28
j^2aww just kinda?16:29
nullpointeryep16:30
nullpointergot some problems16:31
nullpointernot uge problems, ordinary problems! :)16:31
j^2gotta love working with computers!16:31
nullpointerhehehe16:31
nullpointeru? any power5 or power6 for a test-run?16:32
j^2actually.... alas no i only have g4s now, i got laid off from ibm16:33
nullpointerreally? where are you working now?16:33
j^2www.imagemicro.com16:33
nullpointer:(16:33
j^2their new net admin/soon-to-be IT manager16:33
nullpointergood luck then16:34
j^2thank you!16:35
RedShiftj^2: what are your expriences with nagios?16:40
j^2RedShift, have you ever used it before?16:40
RedShiftno16:40
RedShiftI've looked at the screenshots and it looks a bit bloated/overkill16:41
j^2ah well as a complete newbie, it's combersome hard and confusing16:41
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j^2it's taken me since....02? 03? to get it down to the point where i'm happy and it's "useful" to me16:41
RedShiftbut as an advanced user, does it give you that "devine" feeling when working with it?16:41
j^2very much so16:42
j^2and it's impressive to look at16:42
j^2plus, higher ups like to look at it, so they can see stats on the network16:42
j^2it's just generally impressive to use/work/setup16:42
RedShiftadded it to my todo list16:43
RedShiftfor managing one server it's totally overkill by the looks of it16:44
RedShiftbut when you have 20 servers, tracking incidents would be nice16:44
j^2yep, only one server? you should really split it up16:45
j^2you never want a monolithic server16:45
j^2i've seen that the hardway sooooo many times16:45
nullpointerI've heard that openNMS is really good either16:46
RedShiftany screenshots?16:46
nullpointernope... it's in my todo list16:47
nullpointerbut i never tried it...16:47
Auge^hi. is there a tool which shows (on desktop, in terminal...) the recent version of a software? i want to check for things like openoffice, kernel... :)16:48
j^2openNMS was pretty cool, but that too me seemed even more so overkill, plus i've been paid in the past to play with nagios :P16:48
nullpointer:)16:49
RedShiftAuge^: ports -d16:49
nullpointerthat's a good reason to stay with that! :D16:49
nullpointeri miss the old portdb :-(16:50
Auge^RedShift: i don't want to see my ports-tree, i want to see the latest version available in web...16:50
RedShiftnullpointer: on the website?16:50
nullpointerRedShift, yes16:50
RedShiftyeah me too16:50
RedShiftI commented on it yesterday I believe in this channel16:50
nullpointeri was not here16:55
nullpointeri show up very rarely here... heheh must come more frequently16:56
RedShiftwell I hope you show up very rarely in my life16:56
RedShiftbecause I just hate you16:56
RedShiftyou always strike me at the most unsuspecting moments16:57
nullpointerhahahaha16:57
nullpointeri'm the nullpointer of C not the one that shows up in java16:57
nullpointer:-P16:57
RedShifttwo and a half men season 316:58
RedShiftalmost ready :-D16:58
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sepennym, ??17:47
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sepennym, change source from xerces-c port > http://www.apache.org/dist/xml/xerces-c/xerces-c-src_2_6_0.tar.gz >> to >> http://www.apache.org/dist/xml/xerces-c/source/xerces-c-src_2_7_0.tar.gz17:48
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HanSince there is a local root exploit in the nvidia drivers I recommend everyone upgrades to the latest beta-driver.18:41
Hanports -u && prt-get update nvidia xorg-nvidia && reboot18:42
Hanor something like that18:42
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cirkithttp://crux.nu/portdb/repo/contrib/ and http://crux.nu/portdb/repo/opt/ keep returning 40419:29
cirkitI know there are some rsync mirrors to use but how would I add those to /etc/ports/contrib.httpup and opt.httpup ?19:29
cirkitnevermind, I think I figured it out, thanx.19:34
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cirkitYou can't use rsync to update ports?19:45
jdolanmaybe with some fiddling.20:05
jdolancat /etc/ports/drivers/rsync or whatever20:05
cirkithmm20:08
cirkithttpup is in /etc/ports/drivers/ , no rsync20:08
cirkitits just a driver script20:08
cirkityeah20:15
cirkitlooks like /core and /opt are messed up20:15
cirkitand the only option to use them is thru rsync20:15
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predatorfreakhttp://kerneltrap.org/node/7228 <-- Great.21:09
predatorfreakNVIDIA: We're giving root to random people.21:09
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nipuLi particularly like how a sufficuently long input field in your browser can dos your machine23:05
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