IRC Logs for #crux Monday, 2006-11-13

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aonHan: how about changing the e-mail address format in your contrib ports?01:18
HanWhy? It's my email, unobfusticated and all. What's wrong with that?01:19
aonnothing, i guess, although the guidelines say differently01:21
mike_kis there a requirement that Pkgfile: $name = port_directory_name?01:52
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mike_kas prtverify does not like that... $name must much dirname03:27
mike_k  gives all ports as result. Searching 'lab_' gives all ports containing 'lab'. Is it ok?03:57
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aonscreen is both in opt and contrib06:51
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Hanaon, check the comments in the contrib version07:33
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treachjaeger: btw, gaim hit beta5 (!) the 10th08:03
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AstonV12anybody can suggest a nice minimalist window manager?08:10
jaegerwhat degree of minimalism are you after?08:10
RyoSevilwm, pekwm..08:11
AstonV12let's start with very minimalist08:11
jaegerotherwise, there are plenty available: ion3, ratpoison, windowlab08:12
RyoSpekwm ._. /me <3 it08:12
AstonV12wow...I should check for all of them!08:13
aoncwm too08:13
AstonV12and...what about beryl? I mean..what kind of wm is it?08:13
jaegerit's a compositor, like compiz08:13
treachwmaker is also nice, and ofc fvwm once you get it right... which might be something of a Project (TM)... :P08:13
jaegermeant for the eye-candy crowd08:13
AstonV12you would suggest it or still quite unstable for a not very expert user like me?08:14
jaegerI would not suggest it at all unless you want to play with Xgl/AIGLX08:15
AstonV12ok...I'll not try it, already had lot of problems with aiglx08:15
treachif you're "not very expert" stick with the old mature stuff.08:16
AstonV12and what about blackbox?I mean..compared to the ones you suggested me (ewm,ion3,evilwm,pekwm,windowlab...)08:16
AstonV12yes...better to use old mature stuff or i'll certainly get in trouble!08:17
treachwhy not give it a try?08:17
treachif it doesn't work, there are probably at least another 100 you could try.08:17
treachs /work/work out for you/08:18
AstonV12anyway....I'll have a look for all the ones you suggested and than I'll see...08:19
AstonV12thank a lot anyway!08:20
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j^2hey all08:53
Romsterhi j^208:56
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* deus_ex plays armagetronad.09:23
* deus_ex sux09:23
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deus_exwtf, audacious is using more cpu than FF atm.weird...09:31
aonmy audacious just crashed09:31
treach"autroucius media player".09:32
deus_exaon: Mine is still ok, but eats  cpu cycles as crazy.09:32
RyoSworks fine here09:32
RyoSbtw anyone checked out the latest svn? it should have mlayer support09:33
deus_extreach: Yes, we know, you hate it :)09:33
treachNo I don't. I was just not quite happy with the current version.09:33
deus_exRyoS: It always works fine *somewhere*.09:33
treachno, Romster has no problems, that's proof that there is nothing wrong with it.09:34
deus_exSo it must be PEBKAC than...09:34
treachdeus_ex: btw, how much cpu are you talking about?09:35
deus_ex20-26 percent, according to htop09:36
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treachI assume you're not running it on a 486.. :P09:36
deus_exIt jumps up and  down.09:36
treachI'd say that's way too much, probably time to kill it. :-)09:37
deus_exNo, celeron2@2ghz09:37
treachit's using ~0.3% here (barton 2500)09:37
deus_exWow.with vbr mp3, it uses ~20%, but now I'm playing cbr track, it's down to
treachhm, can't repat there here.09:40
treachblah blah.. "that here"09:41
deus_exYeah, yeah :)09:41
treachvbr mp3 0.3-0.7% here09:41
deus_exHm.I'll play vbr track again.09:42
* deus_ex does09:43
deus_exSame thing happens.09:44
deus_exTime to kill it.09:44
treach"It's a good day to die".09:44
deus_exNah, doesn't help, still the same.09:45
jaegerI haven't used audacious much yet but I find it amusing my audacious install can't play anything09:46
deus_exMaybe the track is somehow b0rken.09:46
RyoSjaeger: you need the plugins09:46
jaegerRyoS: yeah, I'm building them now09:46
RyoScheck out my port (i always wanted to say that)09:46
jaegerjust find it funny that there's nothing by default :)09:46
jaegeryours is the one I'm using09:46
deus_exjaeger: Did you got my mail with scorched3d diff?09:48
aonaudacious just hangs every time i change the song09:48
jaegerdeus_ex: yes, and it's updated09:48
aonah, that was because of the plugin :)09:49
deus_exjaeger: Ok, I havent run ports -u today.09:49
aonand back to xmms i go09:49
deus_exaudacious ftw09:50
aonxmms does the same thing09:50
aoncmus seems to work09:51
treachxmms does the samething but brings cruft09:52
deus_exlast fm client won't work here(looks for sound devices, and just hangs).09:52
jaegerRyoS: looks to me like audacious-plugins is missing taglib as a dep09:52
RyoSlet me check09:52
treachjaeger: I've got a port that works.. ;-)09:52
jaegerno big deal, already building RyoS'09:53
aondeus_ex: yeah, it's off already09:54
RyoSjaeger: you are right, i add this asap09:54
aonguess i shouldn't mess with gui players at all :)09:54
* treach wonders if anyone except himself uses his repo, despite his heavy disclaimers..09:55
jaegerI don't, though I'd be willing to if there were something in it I needed :)09:55
* deus_ex steals^Wuses ports from portdb09:57
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pitillotreach, wich one is yours?09:59
treachpitillo: it's not listed, but some of them has been refered to by other people here.09:59
treachmy gphoto2 port for instance.09:59
pitillotreach, ummm can you give me a link to take a look?10:00
deus_extreach: Will you join contrib?10:01
treachand NO. I won't join anything..10:01
treachI'm simply not able to keep things up to snuff as well as I'd like to.10:01
pitillo(only a opinion... if you had tons of stuff, is quite difficult to do that, but if you start with some of them, it can be easy to make good updates of them) more people doing little things instead of less people doing tons of things...10:04
treachpitillo: I'm not really well, for a start. and then there is the time issue, the hackishness, and the identity issues. better just leave things as they are.10:06
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deus_extreach: I hope you get well soon, man.10:11
Romsteri guess if anyone wants to they can take trenches ports and do them up/maintain them and throw them in contrib.10:13
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treachdeus_ex: thanks, I'm hopefully working on it. :-)10:14
treach"trenches" indeed. FTR, I'm not buried yet.10:15
deus_exjdolan: Do you have any mixes on ?10:18
deus_exI dug up some pretty awesome mixes there.10:19
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pitillotreach, sorry, don´t know that. I hope you´ll be better soon.10:20
deus_ex700 bucks for video card...that's just insane,  imho10:22
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treachdeus_ex: just wait for the powerbill. :P10:23
deus_extreach: Heh.And it has 5 star rating, no less.10:24
treachafk food10:24
pitillodeus_ex, have you got a link to some mix?10:25
Romstervideo cards should throttle its memory and gpu when its not being used for anything more than everyday stuff, only to use full gpu when doing full graphics.10:27
deus_expitillo: Check out
deus_exI can recommend this:
pitillodeus_ex, I tried it and advanced search too (didn´t work) to look by name.10:30
deus_expitillo: Advanced search is b0rken for some time now, try simple search, by genre.10:31
pitillodeus_ex, I thought to search by your name. :) downloading it. I will listen it this afternoon. :)10:32
deus_expitillo: I don't have any mixes of my own, I'm only a consumer :)10:34
deus_exSorry for the confusion.10:34
* deus_ex makes noise, not music.10:35
pitillodeus_ex, don´t understand it, sorry. :)10:40
* deus_ex is puzzled10:42
deus_expitillo: Just listen to the mix, ok ? :)10:43
pitillodeus_ex, sure. This afternoon I will listen it. :)10:43
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deus_expitillo: Just play it and pump up the volume.Tribal techno is *good*.10:47
Romstercool i should download soem mixes to listen to :P10:48
Romsterdeus_ex, i just ignore things that don't make scence, the sentance that is :)10:49
Romsteri got about 40GB of music here to listen too aswell and radio streams10:49
pitillodeus_ex, sure you listen jdolan mixes... very good imo.10:49
jaegeraudacious' 'jump to file' function doesn't work well10:49
treachany special provocation needed?10:51***/How.To.Seducing.Women.With.Your.Home.Computer.rar10:51
RyoSjaeger: <- would this be an usable startup file for a port?10:51
deus_exI've got to d/l this :)10:51
RyoSsorry for highlight, it was actually meant for all10:52
treachmmh. my main complaint about audacious is that it really doesn't work well with fvwm. :-/10:52
deus_expitillo: Thanks for reminding me to check out jdolan's mixes.10:52
jaegerRyoS: what does it accomplish? not familiar with audtty10:53
RyoSaudtty is an ncurses client for audacious10:54
RyoSstarting it headless will just start the core without gui10:54
deus_exjaeger: What's the problem?.10:54
RyoSaudtty then connects to the core and you have a nice ncurses gui :)10:54
jaegerdeus_ex: the problem with what?10:54
jaegerRyoS: ah. well, seems ok to me10:54
deus_exaudacious 'jump to file'10:55
RyoSgreat :)10:55
jaegerdoh... still some texture problems with the 96xx nvidia drivers10:55
treachwelcome to the joys of using an "alternative" os. :/10:56
jaegerdeus_ex: oh, the fact that it doesn't search properly10:56
deus_exdefine 'properly'.10:58
deus_exiirc, it works same as in winamp, so if winamp is b0rken, so is this ;)10:59
jaegeran example: I have a 2-disc set of Infected Mushroom - Converting Vegetarians ripped - the album name exists in all the id3 tags as well as the filenames but if I try to jump and type in "converting" (case doesn't seem to matter) the search window is completely blank11:00
jaegerah, no, I'm wrong, it *is* case-sensitive11:00
jaegerwhich winamp isn't11:01
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Romsterjaeger, damn11:02
jaegermight have to feedback that, heh11:03
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jaegeror just send in a patch, I guess11:03
deus_exjaeger: When I search for either 'dj' or 'DJ', it finds same tracks.11:04
deus_exSame for 'incubus' vs 'Incubus'.11:06
jaegerawesome, taking a screenshot killed audacaious :)11:06
aoncmus seems to be still running :)11:06
deus_exbtw, 'Converting Vegetarians' <----great title11:07
aonthe album isn't really bad either iirc11:07
deus_exaon: that's psy trance?11:08
aonsomething like that, yeah11:08
treachjaeger: Something seems to be amiss with your setup..11:09
treachmaybe it doesn't like gnomes. ;-)11:09
deus_exaon: I prefer trance/techno/d'n'b myself, but I'll check it out.11:09
jaegeror XFS11:09
aondon't worry, at least one person i know claims that the newer albums aren't psytrance at all :)11:10
deus_exjaeger: weird11:11
jaegerwhat filesystem do you use?11:11
jaegerI'll test it on ext311:12
deus_exaon: Ok :)11:12
jaegernope, same results for me on ext311:14
Romsterbtw what was that ultimate fs we wouldn't see on linux again, was gonna show a friend i can't fidn the wikipedia page.11:15
RyoSanyone wants to try my audtty port? :)11:16
deus_exRomster: reiserfs4?11:17
aoni think we already have seen it on linux11:17
deus_exBut we will not see it again, since main dev is in jail?11:18
Romsterdeus_ex, no it was like sun microsystems or something striped tree like FS that never fragamented etc. that didn't have a open licence11:18
Romsterand it had features like LVM2 has11:19
Romsterdunno about that deus_ex11:19
Romsteras its opensource reiser could be taken over by anyone..11:19
aonand it still doesn't stop existing even if the dev is in jail11:19
deus_exaon: it never was in vanilla kernel, iirc, so it doesn't really count, imho11:19
Romsteror everyone will use the last stable version till he gets back to it11:19
Romsterjaeger, hmm that wasn't it but i did look at that one in my search.11:22
Romstersomeone mentained it here along time ago, not sure if it'l be on the archive as the log bot wasn't on then?11:22
tilmanmentioned or maintained?11:22
Romsterand i didn't log it :/11:22
tilmanare you taking bets? ;)11:23
Romsterheh no11:24
Romsteri just wanna find the damn thing again to show a friend..11:24
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Romsteri should of bookmarked it, soemone I think it was here said it wasn't licenced to be aviable for linux to use. but the FS had alot of features i wanted to show a friend. not unless it was in #linuxhelp i might be confusing myself.11:29
tilmanwhat are you looking for?11:30
aonsome fs that seems like zfs but isn't it and isn't available on linux11:32
Romstera filesystem that i read about it was either here or in #linuxhelp i so can't remember it had features like LVM etc, it wasn't open licensed which is a shame, i can't for the life of me find it on google or wikipedia..11:33
treachsounds pretty much like zfs to me.11:33
tilmanyeah, it probably is11:33
Romsterhad a restricive licence that would make porting it to linux a copyright violation, but i'm trying to find the site so i can show a friend about it.11:34
treachmaybe it's just the glue that made the name and the object disconnect?11:34
Romsteri looked and its got a FUSE project in the works :/11:34
treachzfs is under CCDL11:34
Romsterdunno if that was it?11:34
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tilman"bad licensing" is another argument for it being zfs11:34
tilmanDTrace would be fun to have in linux11:35
treachwell, they've got to protect whatever interesting stuff they come up with.11:35
tilmanbut because of cddl evilness, they may not include it :'(11:35
treachCan't say I blame them.11:35
Romsteri'll keep looking around when i'm bored but i'm still shure zfs wasn't it but i could be on a wild goose hunt :/11:35
treachThey really need any incentitive they can find to get peple to use solaris imo..11:35
tilmansome days ago i saw that nvidia provides binary drivers for solaris11:36
tilmanmade my jaw drop a bit11:36
tilmanWouldn't have expected that at all11:36
treacha lot of workstations around the world runs solaris.. and nivia sells workstation class graphics cards..11:37
treachso if they want into the industrial CAD business they pretty much have to provide the drivers. :)11:38
tilmani thought industrial CAD was all windows these days11:39
tilmanheh, i finally got this weird ass Gouranga spam, too11:40
treachnever underestimate the inertia in the industrial world. :-)11:40
tilmanat the company i work at, most of our customers still run windows 98...11:41
tilmanpower supplier companies11:42
treachthat's bad. The companies I've been at usually at least uses NT4.11:42
RedShift2ugh windows 9811:44
RedShift2now that is one bad piece of software11:44
tilmanit's especially fun cause microsoft doesn't support it anymore11:44
treachNT4 isn't brilliant, but at least it doesn't crash if you give the computer an odd look.11:44
RedShift2I have some customers too that run win98, I'm really pushing to get them to upgrade11:44
tilmanthe latest .net framework crap doesn't work on nt4 either ;)11:44
RedShift2I'm not supporting win98 anymore, otherwise I'd lose all my hair11:44
treachwho cares about .NET, really?11:44 is nice11:45
tilmantreach: the industry11:45
treachA bunch of hot air from what I've seen in actual use, and a few tv commercials..11:45
RedShift2I had hoped it would stop that wild growth of non-conforming windows programs11:45 is nice though11:46
RedShift2I would recommend it to every windows dev11:46
tilmanit makes me want to cut myself every now and then11:46
tilmanactually quite often11:46
treachas oposed to java, which makes you want to do.. what? ;)11:47
RedShift2didn't they opensource java?11:47
tilmanthey plan to afaik11:47
treachsupposedly they did11:47
* tilman doesn't like the term 'open source'11:47
deus_expitillo: Some more music I stumbled upon :
Romsteryeah i thoguht anything serious was windows, other than servers being linux.11:48
tilmanjava under gpl v211:48
tilmanomg omg omg omg11:48
tilmanO M G11:48
tilmanjdolan: omg omg!11:48
deus_ex"Java is Free and the Flat Earth Society is recruiting"11:48
tilmannow java is a whole lot nicer than it was yesterday11:49
ningoall of a sudden11:49
ningoI suddenly liek javs <311:49
treachyou mean as oposed to .NET, which was nicer yesterday? ;-)11:49
ningoI will frenzy-code in java now11:49
tilmanc# is a cheap copy of java11:50
treachtilman: I was just kidding. :-)11:50
tilmanof course i knew that!11:50
tilmanjust watned to play along11:50
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treachinteresting though. Poor miguel, redundant again.. >:-)11:51
tilmanmaybe he'll switch horses now :D11:51
treachI doubt that. He's always been a sucker for MS-tech.11:51
treachafik, yes. IIRC he even applied for jobs at ms, more than once.11:52
treachI think it fell on the "green card" issue or something.11:53
treachDon't ask for sources, it's a long time since I read about it, just a vauge recollection.11:53
tilmannp, i don't care about miguel and/or gnome all that much11:54
treachneither do I, but you are free to compare the old gmc with win95 ;-)11:54
tilmanit's been 5 years since i ran gmc11:55
tilmanwas it better or worse than windows 95's explorer?11:55
treachlet's make it 6. At least! :D11:55
tilman5 years and 4 months maybe!11:55
treachbetter/worse wasn't my point, I just meant they feel very similar, at least imo.11:56
treachalso, bonobo etc was heavily inspired by MS OLE iirc.11:56
tilmani thought about that when you mentioned 'ms tech' before11:57
treachI bet it's all out there in some mail archive I can't be bothered to find. :-)11:57
tilmangotta admit, OLE/radioactive x isn't all that bad11:57
* tilman hides11:57
treachfrom who's point of view? ;-)11:58
treachs /'//11:58
tilmanit works reasonably well11:59
tilmanbeing able to write some stuff in c++, and some boring gui stuff in visual basic *can* be pretty neat12:00
tilmani'll shut up now before someone gets weird ideas about me12:00
Romstertilman, too late... j/k dude :P~12:04
treachaon: yay, looks like that famous productivity everyone using gnome seem to boast about. ;-)12:05
treachbtw, cmus is quite nice, but it would probably gain on using sqlite or something.12:06
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tilmanmaybe someone should write an ncurses frontend to xmms212:07
RyoSwhy xmms2? ;o12:07
treachwhy not12:07
aontreach: dunno, i usually have quite a short playlist12:08
RyoSthere is one for audacious :>12:09
treachaon: heh, I usually operate in the library view. :P12:09
aontilman: x2cp/nxmms2?12:10
aonme too12:10
tilmani think all of the current ncurses clients are unmaintained12:11
treachnot sure how you define a "short" playlist, but mine is 138h or something. :D12:12
tilmanRyoS: xmms2 has a pretty neat media library12:12
tilmanand soon it will have a pretty neat way to define playlists on speed ("collections")12:12
RyoStilman: ok, agreed on that12:13
aontreach: mine's currently one album :)12:14
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tilmanmaybe x2cp/nxmms2 are actually maintained12:16
tilmani was thinking of two others12:16
aonthey don't seem very featureful, though12:18
tilmanyeah, i meant  XMMS2Curse and xmms2curses :D12:20
rehabdollpretty cool pitillo.. gestures rock12:29
treach <- how to get creative with a wm..12:34
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rehabdollnice fonts12:35
pitillonice clock :D12:47
treachlooks pretty cool, imo, but it makes me feel woefully incompetent. :P12:48
treachalso, it makes me question how much sparetime that guy has. :D12:50
pitilloand shade method is a bit simply, how can make diferences between 2 shaded windows?... like the r/l shade, but without info about the window is quite difficult, imo. Can be interesting to dev the side shade with the top bar, and not only make top shades in other wm.12:51
treachdon't shade multipel windows on the same viritual desk, maybe. :)12:52
thrice`doesn't that defeat the purpose of shade?  :)12:55
treachof course it does. That's why I said maybe. :P12:56
pitilloor differents shades (ff top shade, other app r/l shade...)12:56
treachwell, I use the titlebar to get info about what happens in the window while it's shaded, so I'd keep it. :-)12:57
treach(for instance cmus puts info about what's currently playing, etc.)12:58
deus_exBased on threads on nvnews forum, nvidia 9629 is badly b0rken(lirc, glxinfo, various games/apps, monitor etc. problems/issues).I can't wait to try it :)12:59
* treach thanks $DIETY for his old trusty radeon 9000.13:00
treachdoes everything I want/need, and no broken proprietary drivers to deal with.13:01
deus_exwhat is 'gimmick'?13:03
treachspecial useless feature.13:04
rehabdolli heard that matrox had some "opensource" drivers out with one of their boards.. but that it was not really free13:04
tilmancheap stuff to attract the masses13:04
tilmanrehabdoll: want me to elaborate on that? ;)13:04
deus_ex(apart from being codename for arch linux 0.7.2)13:05
rehabdollfeel free to :)13:06
treachdeus_ex: something like having a firewire connector on your mb when you have no such devices.13:06
tilmanxfree86's mga driver needs a proprietary "hal" module to be able to use "advanced" features like mergedfb ("twinview" in nvidia land) and dual head13:07
tilmanmaybe that's what you mean13:07
tilmannot sure about parhelia13:07
rehabdollbut then a standard EULA..13:07
tilmanyeah, they added non-free stuff there13:07
Romsterffs something is up with my isp or the ML13:08
Romster<>: connect to[]: Connection13:08
Romster    timed out13:08
RomsterReporting-MTA: dns; sv11.per.eftel.com13:09
RomsterDiagnostic-Code: X-Postfix; connect to[]:13:09
Romster    Connection timed out13:09
Romsterlike how can that be so and i jsut now got the bounced e-mails13:10
deus_extreach: So, archlinux-0.7.2 a.k.a 'gimmick' = 'cheap stuff to attract the masses, full of special useless features'? ;)13:11
treachundefined reference to `XRenderFindStandardFormat, XListPixmapFormats, XFree, XCreatePixmap hmm...13:12
treachdeus_ex: apparently.13:12
deus_exThat sounds like Win0ws Vista...13:12
treachtilman: do you know where those functions are supposed to be found?13:12
tilmanXFree is very basic stuff (
tilmanso it seems something's really strange there13:13
treachthey all ara as far as I can find out..13:13
tilmanwhat port/package?13:13
treachit's my own slightly modded firefox.13:14
treachbut it's not much different.13:14
treachbesideds, it used to build..13:14
tilmanare you on x11r7 or x11r6?13:14
tilmancan you post the diff to firefox?13:15
tilmanboth source code and pkgfile13:15
treachthere isn't much to it. I added a few configure options, and that's it.13:16
tilmancan you post the compiler output then?13:17
tilmanthe line that results in the error13:17
treachit's what I posted above plus collect2: ld returned 1 exit status13:18
treachmake[3]: *** [] Error 113:18
tilmani need the gcc call13:18
tilmanor, check that it includes "-lX11"13:18
treachlooking for it.. :P13:18
treachit appears to be related to cairo.13:19
tilmanblame it on the cairo13:19
treachI feel like it, but is it reasonable?13:20
tilmanfirefox builds without your modifications?13:20
treachI'm just about to try again with the cairo stuff commented. but it did build in the past, *with* the cairo stuff..13:21
treachit feels like cairo changed, except that it's refering to fairly basic x stuff, if I get things right.13:21
tilmanmaybe it only links to `pkg-config --libs cairo`13:23
tilmanit should probably link to `pkg-config --libs cairo cairo-xlib`13:23
tilmanthat's just a wild guess though13:24
treachhmm. apparently someone has enabled -fvisibility=hidden in the firefox build..13:24
tilmanmaybe it's automatically done on gcc413:24
tilmanwould make sense!13:24
tilman(if the code is prepared for it)13:24
treachthat's a pretty big if though. :P13:24
tilmanif you send me the diffs, i'll take a look13:26
treachI'll try without the cairo stuff first, it'll take a while.13:27
treachbut I haven't been hacking on firefox, it's just a few more switches for configure.13:27
tilmani see13:28
treach(that I thought made sense.)13:28
treachhmm, firefox picks up sqlite3 if you've got it, or does it ship with that build in as well? o_O13:29
tilmancool, that openbox bug struck again13:30
tilmanit's been a long time!13:30
treachah, must feel like meeting an old friend again then.13:31
tilmantreach: hum, you aren't building firefox 2, are you? afaik the sqlite stuff is to come with firefox 313:31
treachone that constantly wants to borrow money..13:31
treachI'm building ff213:31
tilmancool, ff2 restored my session13:32
Romstertreach, look up on the output and see if its missing a library something.so13:32
Romsteri had missing libs before :/13:32
RyoSis contrib-old unmaintained?13:32
treachRomster: If I'm missing libs, why did it build the first time?13:32
treachwhen ff2 had been out for a week or two?13:32
treachtilman: yeah, that's one of the good things about it. there are a few annoyances as well, so I guess it evens out.13:33
Romstertreach, then your not missing libs unless it now needs an aditional lib for a extra option?13:35
Romsterfx2 i was told was the geek name for firefox, as ff is for final fantasy.13:36
RomsterRyoS, yes afaik13:36
Romstertreach, what extra configure options btw?13:38
Romstercare to paste them so i can mess around myself13:38
treach--enable-system-cairo  --enable-svg-renderer=cairo , I think those are the ones which cause problems. Too early to tell for sure yet.13:42
Romsterah yeah svg is sweet i should try them out.13:43
tilmanoh crap13:46
tilmanjust deleted stuff by accident13:46
tilmancrap crap crap13:46
aonwe should have Recycle Bin13:48
tilmanyeah ;)13:48
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Romsterprologic does have that trash port, but i've not touched it it looks too dangerious.13:50
mike_kRomster: but we can not see prologic himself (13:51
prologicit's not dangerous at all13:52
prologicvery usefull - saved my ass a number of times13:52
Romsteri mean the port not james himself lol13:53
prologicit works great - highly recommended13:54
Romsterlol i've got hes attention.13:54
Romsteri read the readme file highly dangerious if not setup right :P13:55
Romsteri think tilman needs it more than me :P13:55
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prologicyes but obviosuly I've set it up right :)13:59
prologicor I'd not have made a port of it13:59
prologicI only say that because in testing and creating the right set of config files, I did screw up something major :)14:00
Romsterand lost half your filesystem with it?14:01
prologicyeap :)14:01
treachthat's reassuring.14:02
treachit might save your butt if you get configure it right, otherwise it'll trash your system. "No thanks".14:03
prologicI just tinkered with the config file a bit too much14:04
prologicthe author's defaults work fine14:04
treachI guess it's one way to stay with a "small elite community" ;D14:05
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treachbtw, it appears the cairo related stuff indeed *was* the culprit, it built fine this time.14:13
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* deus_ex is seriously considering buying radeon video card14:26
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* ningo is seriously considering shooting himself into the head 14:28
tilmangot a gun?14:28
* deus_ex hands ningo a shotgun14:28
deus_exShotgun is  traditional weapon of self destruction :)14:29
ningowell, you're an expert I see14:29
ningothose are usually rare to find14:30
ningolife expectancy is quite short...14:30
deus_exHemingway, that guy from Nirvana...14:30
tilmankurt cobain was murdered buy his wife14:32
tilmaneverybody knows!14:32
deus_exningo: far from being an expert on the subject, but it is logical:you can't miss, and you get the job done.14:32
treachtilman: sure it wasn't IRS?14:32
deus_extilman: she naged him, so he killed himself?14:32
tilmansorry, IRS rings a bell, but i don't know which one14:32
mike_kHan: are you going to import your p5-* ports to contrib?14:33
Hanports -u contrib14:33
deus_exIRS = Irish dRunken Slayers?14:34
deus_ex(lame, I know)14:35
tilmaninternal revenue service?14:35
ningointernational rude service?14:35
ningoas found in trains, hotels, etc...14:35
treachtilman: yeah. the guys who nailed al capone. :P14:35
tilman# IRS is a song by the band Guns N' Roses that may be included on the forthcoming Chinese Democracy LP14:36
mike_kHan: oh, was playing with git/gitweb, didn't notice that. thanks. (btw, pushing to git in the same time is like a russian rullete)14:36
ningothere's a chinese democracy lp?14:36
deus_ex'forthcoming' for what, 10 years now?14:36
tilman"maybe eventually forthcoming (HAHAHAHA)"14:37
Hanmike_k, indeed, I had to push after every add.14:38
Hanwell now I know for the next time ;-)14:39
mike_kHan: I decided to make three commits in one push - and your push broke my tree =(14:39
Hansorry :-}14:40
Handoes that help?14:41
Han% grep + /usr/ports/contrib/.git/remotes/origin14:41
HanPull: +refs/heads/master:refs/heads/origin14:41
HanPull: +refs/heads/2.2:refs/heads/2.214:41
mike_ktried that somewhen, that time the sequence was different. Than jue's mail, tilman's reply, ContribHowTo modification relaxed me.14:42
tilmanit won't help if you have conflicts though14:43
tilmanthen you _will_ need to merge14:43
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tilmantreach: if you patch mozilla/layout/build/ to force inclusion of "-lX11 -lXrender" it might work14:46
mike_kHan: you've hide a huge commit in "abiword: initial release" =P  thats why I didn't notice p5-*14:47
Hanindeed, that's what I noticed as well.14:47
HanDoes anyone want to take over my abiword port? It's a bitch to maintain for me. especially since I never use abiword.14:48
mike_ktilman: I pulled/pushed, made a few commits (while han made another push), tried to pull - got "...does not fast forward". What were the supposed steps than?14:49
Hanmike_k, so it's better to remove the + chars and use git fetch, git rebase origin, git push origin14:50
treachtilman: ok, interesting, I'll put it on my list. :-)14:50
HanI just lost my changes after git pull origin14:50
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tilmantreach: let me look for the proper fix ;p14:50
treachbetter worry about git ;-)14:51
tilmanmike_k: tbh, i'm not sure14:52
HanI don't quite understand your remark treach14:52
treachHan: that can depend on your ignorelist. :-)14:52
treachs can/might14:52
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mike_kHan: removed them ('+') long time ago; fetch, rebase resulted in your commit being lost in my tree. this all is just too tricky or I am too old.14:54
tilmanthere is a problem in the contrib repo on crux.nu14:54
Han;a=shortlog;h=2.2 is nice to bookmark as well14:54
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tilmanbetter hold off on committing to your local contrib clone14:54
tilmanand i'm delighted to say that han cannot read this14:54
Hanmike_k, I just did a git pull origin and it's fine.14:55
Hanerrr s/opt/contrib/ in the previous url14:57
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mike_kHan: I am not quite shure if ports in contrib might duplicate (even with security holes removed) core/opt ones. not only screen being in such state...15:01
tilmani thought about that, too15:01
Hanthe screen one is not really important, though I am pretty upset that jue removed the root-p patch from tar!15:02
tilmangood that you filed a bug15:03
Hanoh wait. it's still there, but they removed the comments :-\15:06
tilmanand it wasn't jue either15:06
tilmanmaybe i did it just to piss you off15:06
* treach watches tilmans performance behind the mirror glass. :D15:08
Romsterhan rpm2targz is already in core :)15:08
HanOh right, I only checked with files in opt =)15:08
sepenhi! I re-write my findexternaldeps: $ svn co svn:// .15:09
Hanfor i in *; [ -d /usr/ports/core/$i ] && echo $i15:09
sepenIm trying to write a tool for find external deps that aren't on core,opt or contrib repos, the aim is doing a tool for check contrib ports candidates15:10
mike_ktilman:  can you close bugs # 115, 100, 92?15:11
tilmanlet me have a look15:11
HanRomster, but my version is much better. :P15:11
mike_ksepen: if it's only based on Pkfiles, footprints, etc analysys - there already exist one. prtverify.15:13
sepenmike_k, look at diffs->>> $ prtverify /usr/ports/sepen/blender15:15
sepen$ /usr/ports/sepen/blender/15:15
sepenExternal deps for blender are:  libjpeg,ode,openal,fmod,smpeg,ftgl,scons,openexr15:15
sepenprtverify returns my blender port OK, xD15:15
mike_ksorry, no svn installed atm (15:16
prologicI think my script does a similar job15:17
sepenbrowse at
HanRomster, I removed the duplicate ports, except for pkgutils, ports and rpm2targz since I thing they really add something. and they were in the old contrib as well.15:19
sepenprologic, nice! but had you obtain some estrange experience with '# Depends on:' and '# Depends:' lines?15:20
sepennot all ports have the same dep header15:20
prologicsepen, not sure how much my script differs from yours15:21
prologicbut mine just tries to find out what libs and essentially what ports a binrary depends on15:21
mike_ksepen: seems "prtverify -m missing-deps -c ../core -c ../opt -c ../contrib blender"  does the job15:21
prologicusefull to correctly fill in the "Depends On"15:22
sepenmmm mike_k thanks15:22
sepenprologic, try my bash script if you want, works fine15:22
prologicI think as mike_k said, yours just does what prtverify can do already :)15:23
sepenyes, prtverify really is nice!15:23
Romsterhan then shouldn't you inform and send the patch for core? for altering, or do so if you have core access. (which i assume you don't or you would of altered it already, in core)15:24
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sepenmike_k, prtverify -m missing-deps -c /usr/ports/core -c /usr/ports/opt -c /usr/ports/contrib /usr/ports/sepen/blender15:25
HanNot everybody prefers my version of pkgutils.15:25
tilmanprologic: do you plan to import your 'icecast' port to contrib?15:26
Romsterrpm2targz i'm talking about15:26
prologictilman, I plan to import them all :)15:26
prologicall that were marked as .sync in the old contrib :)15:27
tilmanfix the deps please15:27
prologicjust going through and fixing up flaws that prtverify has picked up15:27
prologicwhy did I not get an email ?15:27
prologicflyspary does send out emails right ?15:27
mike_kprologic: if it's assigned, I assume15:28
tilmanmaybe because you don't have a flyspray account?15:28
prologicno I do15:28
Romsteryou'd want to pre or post fix your version so it's not the same name as pkgutils, but maybe pkgutils-saferoot or something?15:28
prologicI just thought I'd have gotten an email about it if it's a bug with my port15:28
prologicbut maybe you're right - it's prolly not assigned to me15:28
tilmannot in the 'crux' flyspray project probably15:28
tilmanflyspray + contrib = mess right now15:28
prologicwell I do have a flyspary account15:29
prologicbut yeah I can see it not working too well atm15:29
mike_ktilman: how do I assign bug to someone? is it possible now?15:29
tilmanprologic: let me know when you committed the fixed version of icecast please15:29
tilmanmike_k: you probably don't have sufficient rights15:30
tilmanafaik the plan is to set up a new flyspray environment for contrib some how15:30
mike_ktilman: this way fluspray is not a very handy thing to submit contrib bugs =(15:30
prologicno tasks assigned to me15:30
prologicwonderfull :)15:30
tilmanmike_k: we. are. working. on. it.15:31
prologiccan't we just integrate flyspary/contrib somehow ?15:31
mike_kok, ok, that is a good news.15:31
prologicjust needs to be assigned to the maintainer for the port in question15:31
tilmanwe know15:31
* mike_k hides (for all night)15:32
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Romstersepen, prt-get deptree, also shows missing deps, (not found in ports tree)15:40
sepenRomster, yes but if you have this installed also15:42
Romsterits in core :)15:42
sepenprtverify runs perfectly xD15:43
Romsteri got a little bash script that can read all the metatags and vars out of Pkgfiles I'm gonna use that to generate my own html page sometime.15:43
Romsterthat lists description, and other things that i think the current setup on is lacking,15:44
Romsterand yeah i'm using prt-verify15:44
sepenRomster, Im using portspage for doing that with html's15:44
Romsterone anoying bug in prt-verify it won't run in a directory with the Pkgfile, only if i cd .. then run it with the directory name..15:45
Romstersepen, i'm using that atm, but i'm not happy with it.15:45
Romsteri'd like to list a category, and description and add a search capability for files again, that got removed off crux.nu15:47
Romsteri used to use that alot...15:47
sepenwhere is located?15:47
Romstersepen, eh?15:50
Romsterprt-get fsearch works if you have all the repos but that a pain, and it dosn't do selective searches in said paths afaik.15:50
Romsteroh yay long compile only to find i'm missing a dependency :/15:50
* Romster lists it and then trys again.15:50
treachmaybe should have kind of read the docs before?15:51
j^2has anyone ever heard that ethernet cables "shouldn't" be less then 3ft?16:04
j^2IEEE standard or something?16:05
prologicoh never heard that16:05
Romsterno wonder i can't run prt-verify in the same dir as the Pkgfile....16:05
Romsterlike ya jsut make a port and to prt-verify ya have to cd .. then prt-verify foo16:05
jaegerI've made crossover cables shorter than that before... but never used a straight-through that short16:05
Romsterfor i in `ls`; do < what the for i in *; do works jsut fine or use $(ls --no-color) note $() is the same as `` (backticks but is easier to read)16:05
prologicbut I can verify I've used cat5 cables <10cm16:05
Romsteri hadn't looked into prt-verify that much but i might hack at it soemtime, it still misses some junk files, i have noticed.16:06
Romstertreach, i had read the docs but i also tryed to do what i think it should do.16:06
prologicI've used a 5cm straight-through16:06
j^2yeah same here, my manager just said that he "thought" it was a ieee standard never to have it shorter then 3ft16:06
prologicmight be standard  but doesn't stop you from doing it I guess16:07
Romsteri never knew of a short limit, only 10 meters of stranded and 90 meters of solid core is the limit, 100Meters total16:07
Romster3ft nearly a meter :/16:07
j^2hmm ok16:07
j^2thanks guys ;)16:07
prologicnah you can go further than 100m :)16:08
treachI think that's the standard for thinnet16:08
prologicI've strung over 400ms of Cat516:08
treach(shouldn't be shorter than 3ft.)16:08
Romstermayeb its got todo with the cable impedence? but that dosn't matter on length, i'd say thats a bogus claim16:08
Romsterwtf, with no repeaters in 100M sections?16:08
treachhello, earth calling.16:08
treachit's for *thinnet* afaik.16:08
Romsteroh ok no less than 1 meter then :/16:09
aoni think there can be problems with some equipment because the Rx voltage is too high16:10
deus_exjaeger: would it be possible to put openal svn snapshot tarball somewhere on, I don't know,, and use that to build the port?16:10
jaegerI suppose it would, having problems with the svn?16:10
Romsterwell what i got was out of the siliconchip electronics magazine i get so if i'm wrong thats wrong too, ont he max distance, hteres no miniumn afaik, i guess 1Meter is the shortist?16:10
deus_exYes, it takes a long time atm ;(16:11
Romsterover 1 meter of cable the loss would be negeltable16:11
treachmeh, there are all kinds of rules wrt repeaters and segments and what not, which I should know..16:11
treachbut I don't. :-(16:11
aonif you just mess in cabinets it doesn't matter that much16:12
aonuse whatever is available :)16:12
aonif that doesn't work, switch16:12
Romsteri only learn stuff that i have to sue alot :)16:12
Romsteraon, do it the right way(tm) the first time and save having to redo it later if its not right :)16:13
aonby not following standards you secure your own employment :)16:13
treachaon: anyway, it bugs me that I don't remember, but it's related to what I said about not being well earlier this evening. :-(16:13
* Romster shakes my head16:13
aoni've never "officially" heard of that16:14
aonhm, i think i have some book on the subject16:14
Romsterif i didn't follow standareds with electronics i could create some very dangerious siturations :/16:14
Romsterin the lest case it won't work right16:14
Romsterno safety issues with lan cable but in electronics in general.16:14
Romsterthats why there are standereds16:15
aonyeah, but we aren't discussing electronics in general, i think :)16:15
Romsterfor reliability, safety, and compatability16:15
treachsame with networks, but just the same as you sometimes find someone has replaced a fuse with a nail, sometimes you finde flagrant breach of the standards in this field as well.16:15
Romsterreliabality fals on lan cable standareds16:16
treachshouldn't happen, but it does, because of neclect, incompetens or just plain "it's gotta work - yesterday, and screw all else".16:16
Romsterwell using a nail is jsut asking for trouble and possability of a fire16:16
treachbut it works.16:17
treachif all goes well.16:17
Romsterthose types shouldn't be allowed near anything then :)16:17
treachsame applies to a number of things in networking.16:17
Romsterthats the keyword 'if all goes well'16:17
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treachthat's why there *is* a standard.16:17
deus_exSo many to choose from...16:18
treachif it doesn't go as planned, you can get errors that are terribly hard to nail down. it's bad enough as it is.16:18
treachdeus_ex: it's a well known fact that in the US you have to have at least two standards, whatever the situation. ;-)16:19
aonfwiw, i didn't find anything on shortness limitations16:19
Romsteri've seen some bad things and fireworks etc from stupid things people have done :/ or protentl shock hazards.16:19
Romstertreach, totally agree16:19
Romsteri'm off for a shower i gotta go out soon16:19
Romsteraon, neather have i16:20
treachaon: did you look for tp or thinnet?16:20
aonehm, tp :)16:20
aonif by tp you mean twisted pair16:20
treachI can't remember anything wrt tp, but I'd say no less that 1/2 m16:21
treachactually, cutting cables is an entire sience.. I'm surprised it works as well as it does.16:22
aonof course16:23
treachcut it wrong and you get no signal, or you get massive bounces that might cause serious damage.16:23
aonreturn loss will be too small if the cable is too short16:23
aonsince there's a minimum limit for that16:23
treachit has more with the wave-form to do than the actual resistance of the cable iirc.16:24
aonsame thing with elfext16:26
treachie, cut the cable in a node, and you get no signal, and so on. (All IIRC, it's been more than 10 years since I had anything with that to do.)16:26
aonsurely far-end crosstalk at least is affected?16:28
treachwell, I'm talking in a general sense.16:28
treachhappily the effects are too low in this setting for it to cause any major accidents.16:30
aonyep, i'm still talking about the minimum length and why it would be set :)16:30
treachI remember a story my teacher back then told me about a guy who misadjusted an antenna on the radio buss he was responsible for. :P16:31
aoni'm not quite getting what you exactly mean by cutting cables16:31
treachit's related. it's the same phenomena that makes really short cables less suitable.16:33
treachat least from what I've been taught a very, very long time ago.16:34
aondo you mean the cutting that's done before a connector is attached?16:34
Romstermassive bounces, your talking about reflections swr16:35
aoni agree that it's unbelievable how often it works :)16:35
Romstersignal wave refelection16:35
aonstanding wave ratio :p16:36
Romsterand cable impedence and the length of an antenna cable for a wavelength which is 1 / (speed of light * Hz) = distance for one cycle16:36
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Romsterah thats it, i was trying to recall it from my mind16:37
Romsterhaven't touched cbs etc for zonkes16:37
Romsterrefelections upset the impedence which can blow up rf power stages16:37
aonbut in ethernet it isn't about unmatched load16:37
Romsternope rf power is so low, miliwatts or less16:38
Romsterbut refelectiosn count remember the old 52ohm lan networks had matching resistors on each end :)16:39
treachRomster: right, I couldn't think of the right term.16:39
aonyeah, and it's usually caused because faulty connectors16:39
treachthat guy I mentioned before? He burned that buss to cinders. :P16:40
Romsterwithout the matched line, the reflections garble up the data, and make it hard to pick what its state is, so its preaty much corupted data.16:40
Romsterhow the?16:40
treachRomster: he misadjusted the antenna.16:40
Romsterstarted a fire in the buss?16:40
treachhe had a pretty serious radio transmitter.16:40
aonand those tend to heat if your SWR is somewhere around 10 :)16:41
treachbasically he was operating a mobile radio station.16:41
treachthere was *nothing* tangible left of neither the buss nor his career. :P16:42
treachRomster: please find a blackboard somewhere, and then write "reflections" a hundred times on it.16:45
treach"The reason for minimum lenght, is to get the required number of twists."16:45
treachI had totally forgotten about that, but definitely rings a bell.16:46
treacha whole set actually.16:46
Romstermust of been some serious rf power it was using and not tuned right16:47
Romstermust of.16:47
Romsterthey should be SWR tested16:47
Romster10 is insane16:47
Romster1:1 is optium 2:1 is average but anymore is jsut bad for high power16:47
Romstertrained in fitting antennas?16:47
Romsteror some noob16:47
Romsteri'll give him a job working on 415 volts 3 phase :P that should fix him hehe.16:47
Romsterthen again he'll probbly survive and burn the place down knowing my luck16:47
treachalso it has to do with propagation time.16:47
treachall the reasons I learned are in that thread above.16:48
aonRomster: 2 is pretty much the maximum16:49
aontreach: yeah, that explanation seems reasonable :)16:49
treachthey are all reasonable, and true, it's just a matter of to which degree they matter.16:50
treachI guess impedance mismatch isn't such a problem with data cableing. :-)16:51
aonyeah :)16:51
Romsterlol my spelling really anoyes you, dosn't it16:51
Romsterthe cable is tightly twisted, and dosn't really matter i guess a few cm would even be enougth.16:52
Romsterprobbly todo with the power level designed for 100meters of cable, but i'm sure lan cards can adjust that for best snr ratio16:52
Romstererr signal/noise ratio16:52
Romsteryeah time delay, wave length maybe minium length is a few waveforms, i think lan cards work arond 350MHz for 100mbit not sure for gigabit lan.16:52
* RedShift2 zzz16:52
treachexciting discussion, obviously. :P16:53
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Romstercome to think of it i have not seen premade cables shorter than 1 meter, but wasn't aware on any short length16:54
aoni think the ones we had @ the place i worked in the summer were 3ft (yes, feet, hrrr.)16:55
treachsure it wasn't a yard? ;P16:55
aonno, i think the package said 3ft :)16:56
Romsteri'll have a search later, i gotta go out now.16:57
treachprologic: check it all you want, think I care?16:57
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aontreach: wrong person16:58
prologicempty list :)16:58
aonah, different channel16:58
aonanyway, i haven't yet seen anybody making cables by hand in anywhere besides school, so perhaps the shortness problems aren't often encountered :)17:00
treachRomster: btw, it's not as much your spelling that annoys me, as the lack of it. We all have our weaknesses I guess.17:07
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prologicI'm guessing the new contrib isn't being used yet ?17:18
prologicthe decentralizsed/git one17:18
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