IRC Logs for #crux Thursday, 2007-01-04

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nipuLre: jaegers question04:28
nipuLappears they are in the kernel headers, perhaps some trimming is in order04:28
nipuLi'm guessing kernel-headers-2.6.18.tar.gz was generated from make headers_install04:31
nipuLnope, the kernel headers dont conflict with alsa-lib. guess it's not a problem then04:34
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brointhemixis the "gnome" repo actively maintained?05:23
treachNo. Jaeger just uses it as bait to flush out the gnomeheads.05:24
brointhemixtreach: so, is it or not? ;)05:25
treachof course it is.05:25
brointhemixthank you :)05:25
brointhemixhow are you people in the brand new 2007? ;)05:28
brointhemixi guess i asked the wrong question... ;)05:32
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brointhemixRomster: ?05:54
Romster<brointhemix> i guess i asked the wrong question... ;) < ask us in a few months :)05:55
Romsterhumerious gnome joke was funny.05:55
brointhemixoh :)05:56
brointhemixyou know, they say that the first impression is the most important one ;)05:56
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Romsterbrointhemix, true06:51
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RyoSis there any app that can control applications use of bandwith?08:03
deus_extrickle, wondershaper(?)08:08
RyoSdeus_ex: thanks i guess trickle looks nice08:11
* deus_ex wishes everyone plenty of bandwith this year :)08:15
RyoSah tickle and wondershaper use QoS? is that right?08:17
RyoSi just want to adjust up and down on the fly08:17
RyoSisnt there something like that?08:18
RyoSi used once netlimiter on windows08:18
Romeowhat i does wrong here?
RyoSMake sure you have the DocBook DTD installed and ensure that....08:20
RyoSthat was a quote08:20
jaegerRomeo: I would guess the post-install script for docbook-xml-dtd didn't get run08:20
RyoSand s/does/do08:20
jaegeryou can run it after the port is installed, have a look at /usr/ports/opt/docbook-xml-dtd/post-install08:20
deus_exI'm not sure 'plenty' is right term here, but you'll figure it out :)08:22
jaegerit's a shell script, just run it08:22
Romeoi do that08:23
RomeoMd5sum mismatch found08:24
RyoSgo download it elsewhere or verify that the packge is alright and has not been modified by some third party cool hacker08:30
RyoSand override that md5 sum check08:30
RyoSit works for me08:31
RyoS=======> Building '/usr/ports/gnome/libsoup/libsoup#2.2.96-1.pkg.tar.gz' succeeded.08:34
Romeonot here08:34
jaegeryou're using different repos08:35
jaegerlithium vs. gnome08:35
Romeolet me see08:36
Romeoyou'r right08:36
RyoSjaeger: ah saw it, well, however, he wnats to install gonme, its documentated on crux.nu08:36
Romeoyep jaeger i coment lithium and works08:37
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RyoSback to my question: anyone knows a app that can control bandwith usage on the fly? like the one i posted a screenshot from08:42
deus_exgoogle might know....08:43
jaegerxchat 2.8 looks nice so far08:44
deus_ex2.8? when that happened?08:45
jaegerjan 308:45
deus_exxchat-2.6.8 here08:46
jaegerthe port is still 2.6, I'm running 2.8 to see if it has any problems08:47
* guaqua wonders what people see in xchat08:48
jaegerirc :)08:48
RyoSguaqua: ;)08:48
treach"I see stupid people" :>08:49
RyoSthats treach how we love him :P always in for a flame war :p08:49
* guaqua <3 irssi08:49
treachuh? flame war?08:49
treachRyoS: that shouldn't start any thing, unless any truely stupid people are present..08:50
guaquatreach: don't ever underestimate the stupidity of the people you run into in the internet08:51
Romeothat's true08:52
treachtrue, true. But hey, you can't please everyone. :)08:52
guaqua3w-9xxx: scsi0: WARNING: (0x06:0x000C): Character ioctl (0x108) timed out, resetting card.08:53
guaqua3w-9xxx: scsi0: ERROR: (0x06:0x001F): Microcontroller not ready during reset sequence.08:53
guaquals: vmlinuz: Input/output error08:53
guaquals: /boot: Input/output error08:53
guaquathe fs might be dead08:54
treachExciting. :)08:54
guaquahw raid controller and all sort of lvm stuff08:54
guaquahotplug sata08:54
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j^2hey all10:03
tilmanyo j^210:04
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Romeohow can i fix this?10:37
Romeo-- Packages where install failed10:38
Romeoprt-get depinst --install-scripts gnome10:38
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jjpklost terminal night.11:05
tilmani think Romeo is installing ubuntu right now11:06
jjpkoh right, changing your distribution is always the right solution ;)11:07
guaquai believe for him it might be the right solution11:08
jjpkcrux is not about automation, it is about knowing what you are doing :)11:09
jjpkI think that person has been here earlier.11:10
jjpkLaziness rules.11:12
jjpkAnother set of people who have not read mailinglist rules...11:17
jjpkThe rules should be changed to DO_NOT_README, since they are never read :D11:17
brointhemixn00buntu woild be nice if not for the packaged kernel11:23
brointhemixsame with archlinux11:23
jjpkThose two options would suit the ML noisemaker more ;)11:27
jjpkAlthough I have to admit there is no lack of courage.11:27
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guaquabrointhemix: i don't think compiling your kernel in the traditional way is a problem in ubuntu11:46
guaquayou just have to avoid updating lilo and kernel11:46
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jaegeryou can even update both if you add your entry outside the automagic kernels list11:47
guaquaoh, there's even that. never had the need to do it so...11:47
jjpkI just love these people. So so difficult following simple guidelines11:50
brointhemixguagua: hmm... that's a solution11:51
brointhemixgood we have CRUX :)11:52
brointhemixall the best features in a single distro :)11:52
jjpkI think Han said it best, crux gives you full control, AND a clean base to start off from.11:53
brointhemixbtw, would it be extremely diffucult to implement pkgutils, prt-get and stuff into a Linux From Scratch handbuilt distro?11:53
guaquai don't think so11:54
brointhemixjjpk: i totally agreee on that11:54
jjpkWhy would it? If it compiles, then you are good to go :)11:54
tilmanprobably not that much point to it though11:54
jjpkTrue, but the point is that it is possible.11:55
brointhemixyea, why make an LFS + pkgutils and prt-get if you can install CRUX? ;)11:55
tilmanjjpk: sure11:55
jjpkRecently someone said they had installed pkgutils on an ubuntu install, or something like that.11:56
guaquawell one might try implementing crux package management, but use upstart instead etc11:56
brointhemixjjpk: yea? wow :)11:56
brointhemixwere those people also allergic to Debian? ;)11:57
jjpkI have no idea.11:57
brointhemixntw, i just downloaded ubuntu 6.10 liveCD :P12:00
brointhemixbtw = btw12:00
brointhemixntw = btw12:00
* jaeger is currently running ubuntu12:00
treachor, another old favourite x=x :-/12:01
brointhemixjaeger: what's your box's CPU and RAM?12:01
treachtoo hot and too much. ;)12:02
brointhemixthat's very precise ;)12:03
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guaquakubuntu 6.10 here12:06
treachgood old crux 2.2 here. I guess that puts me in the minority. :)12:07
guaquawith duron 650 & super hot nvidia riva 8mb and 384mb ram :)12:07
brointhemixheh :)12:07
guaquai'll switch my desktop to crux when i can compile kdelibs in less than 12 hours12:07
jjpktreach: make that two crux 2.2 users12:07
brointhemixi'm currently building gnome on my Cel 2,4G with FX 5200 and 512M12:07
brointhemixand i'm running CRUX: current :)12:08
treachwhat's that? 2.3 pre-alpha?12:08
jjpkAlthough I did once say that I preferred a timed release schedule on the ML, maybe a snapshot system should be in place instead.12:08
koefzports -u && prt-get sysupgrade12:09
brointhemixno, that's: "i've 'ports -u' + 'prt-get sysup' yesterday" ;)12:09
brointhemixkoefz: yea :D12:09
treachgood point. Of curse, I guess that reduces the number of "2.2" systems down quite a bit..!12:09
guaquabtw, anyone recently built kde?12:10
guaquaand how long did it take?12:10
jjpkThe last time I tried it on my desktop (amd 2400+/512m ram), qt + kdelib + kdebase, probably about 2.5 - 3 hours12:12
guaquanot bad12:12
guaquamy duron takes a whole lot longer :<12:12
treachsounds a bit optimistic imo..12:13
treachI used to do it on this system, and it usually took all evening. :-/12:13
treach(amd 2500, 1GB)12:14
brointhemixguaqua: build the packages on a better box and ftp them to your Duron 60012:14
* jdolan mumbles something about pkgsync12:15
brointhemixjdolan: is there anyone who hosts packages?12:15
treachpah, we might just as well switch to debian then ;)12:15
brointhemixtreach: good point12:15
guaquabrointhemix: my main box is a duron 1600 with 1 gig of ram, but it's slow as well12:17
brointhemixguaqua: start building and go to work/school then ;)12:18
guaquayeah. i might switch to crux, but we'll see12:19
jdolandistcc and pkgsync is the fastest/easiest way to maintain multiple systems12:19
treachyou should know better than using absolutes. ;)12:20
jdolandistcc and pkgsync is a fast and easy way to maintain multiple systems12:21
jdolan(but really, i spent a lot of time and effort on the subject and found no better alternative)12:21
guaquahmm...anyone built a compile grid yet? :)12:22
brointhemixwhat in the name of God is a compile grid?12:22
guaquadistcc, vpn tunnels and some ospf magic?12:22
jdolani had 12 athlon 2600xp's running distcc on CRUX.12:22
treachThere are always corner cases. If you think about it, diskless terminals are probably both faster and easier to keep synced and updated, once you've got it all set up.12:23
jdolanbuilt gnome in much less than 2 hours.12:23
jdolantreach, but not practical on crux.12:23
jdolanthere's a lot to that setup that we do not provide out of the box.12:23
jdolanpkgsync is setup in just a few minutes, particularly if you already have nfs in place.12:24
treachmaybe. I've never tried. Not sure what you'd be missing though..12:24
treachnfs, nis, tftp.. anything else you'd need?12:24
jdolantry it :)12:25
brointhemixtreach: you'll also need twisted pair cables and NICs ;)12:25
jdolan(i ventured down that path briefly and came running back, that's when i decided to write pkgsync)12:25
treachbrointhemix: obviously, plus a powerplant or something..12:26
brointhemixtreach: :)12:26
treachjdolan: I know terminals are a pain to set up, but iirc nipuL got it up and running.12:26
treach(I made an attempt many years ago with slack, got stuck on some nfs issue I think.)12:27
jdolani had the crux install and 'barebones' system config down to a science at my old office.12:28
jdolani could bring a box from a brand new hard drive to a full crux/gnome node with nfs /home in about 15-20 minutes.12:28
treachIIR I got the kernel loading at the client, but I think I was too much of a newbie back then to get it to mount the rootfs properly.12:28
jdolani had a directory with an that would copy a usable kernel, fstab, rc.conf, and install a few packages precompiled in that directory atop a freshly completed crux `setup`12:29
jdolanso i'd complete `setup`, scp that directory over my modprobing the nic driver off the crux iso, run install, reboot, run pkgsync, done.12:30
treachwell, if you're 1337 and already have a working setup, I guess you could add a new terminal in < 1 minute. ;)12:31
jdolandd /dev/hda1?12:31
treachno, just copy a few files and use some script to edit them appropriately.12:32
treachIf you've got homogenous hardware basically it's the MAC adress/hostname that differs.. Might be a bit more to it though.12:34
jdolanyea, the install routine i had did that.  you'd export HOSTNAME before running it, and it would sed up /etc/rc.conf and /etc/hosts12:34
treachI don't quite remember, it's been like 6 years since I looked at it.12:34
jdolanthe IP, if you're on a static LAN.12:34
treachplus adding the hostname, MAC adress to your dhcp-server config.12:35
jdolanthat was one thing that got annoying.  my old boss wouldn't let me purchase all our machines at once, and so naturally identical hardware was not always available.12:35
jdolanwhich meant maintaining several kernel images.12:35
treachonly if you've got hetrogenus hardware.12:36
jdolandifferent ide chipsets, no way around that one on crux.12:36
jdolanyou're running different kernels.12:36
treachweeell.. ;)12:37
treachobviously idechipsets are less of a problem on a *diskless* terminal but of course you have a point. As I said, I'm assuming you don't have wildy different clients.12:39
treachbesides, having different kernels isn't much of a problem, since you specify to each client at boot time which kernel they should use.12:40
jdolani was talking about how with my setup it was annoying to maintain multiple kernels.12:45
jdolandiskless sounded awesome in theory but as i remember was going to be very difficult.12:46
treachok, I thought you were trying to shoot holes in the diskless theory. :-)12:46
treachotoh, there is always ltsp if making it happen on your own is too hard.12:48
jdolani think that was part of my objection, back when i evaluated it.12:48
jdolani looked at ltsp and a few other canned solutions, and was disatisfied because they were not crux.12:49
treachbesides, it feels a bit like cheating :P12:49
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jaegerbrointhemix: dual-core intel em64t 3.0, 2G RAM13:05
guaquacheating :)13:11
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rx5hi crux people14:22
rx5nice day for developing14:23
jaegerheyo, rx514:24
j^2i seriously didnt know this existed...14:26
rx5jaeger nice to meet you14:26
aonj^2: why not?14:27
j^2i dunno, it just never dawned on me14:27
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jjpkQuickie development ;)14:41
treachagile development maybe?14:42
jjpkThis is almost going into fancy new marketing jargon :D14:44
jjpkGood thing I'm not majoring in marketing :p14:49
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nipuLjaeger: did you commit the xchat upgrade 3 times or a bug in the the commit hooks?16:27
nipuLlooks like a bug16:27
nipuLnow that i look closer there are lots of duplicate commit notifications16:28
jaegerit's from the merge, I think16:29
jaegerI actually committed it to 2.3 and then 2.2, then someone merged 2.216:29
nipuLsurely that would explain 2 notifications, not 316:31
jaegerthe merge creates them again16:33
jaegerat least, I think that's where they come from16:34
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blizzcan anyone help me with a simple choice - which wlan pci card should i get for smooth linux compatibility?17:27
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blizzi think it should come with a atheros/prism chip then17:29
guaquablizz: atheros is not smooth, but you can get it working17:32
blizzhow about broadcom?17:33
guaquano idea. the chip that has native support in vanilla kernel is probably the smoothest'17:33
blizzim getting a buffalo router which im going to flash to run dd-wrt. i thought about getting bufallo pci cards, too, but they have broadcom chipsets17:33
blizzchecking that17:33
guaquaanyway, atheros chip with madwifi driver has pretty good support nowadays in terms of capabilities17:34
guaquabut you have to compile the module against the kernel every time so it takes some extra effort17:34
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