IRC Logs for #crux Wednesday, 2007-02-14

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stjepangood morning02:14
stjepanI'm writing XGL and Compiz ports02:22
Romsterregister a repo on the site while your at it if you are gonna be making more ports and would like to share them02:35
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stjepanI've got this in my Pkgfile: source=($name-$version.tar.gz)03:04
stjepanit says: =======> ERROR: Source file '/home/stjepan/Desktop/xgl-ports/compiz/compiz-0.3.6.tar.gz' not found (use option -d to download).03:04
stjepanshouldn't it be downloaded by default?? It does with other pkgfiles03:04
treachlol "Desktop"?03:05
tilmanno, it shouldn't03:06
stjepantreach, yeah, what's wrong with it? :)03:07
treachStuff fucking everything on the desktop.03:07
treachtilman: have you already forgotten? "Windows User Syndrome". :)03:09
Romsterstjepan, and also use prtverify to check them too.03:09
tilmannever heard of it03:09
tilmanright Romster, we're talking about WUS03:10
Romsteri remember treach said it yesterday03:10
Romsterstjepan, if you want to make pkgmk download without having to use the -d option then edit /etc/pkgmk.conf03:10
treachtilman: ok, longstanding joke, something that just bubbled up when I and koefz were messing around03:11
treachRomster: it's much much older than that, but I kind of like it, it's a bit like "WIMP". :)03:11
stjepantreach, it's been a long time I haven't been using windows... 2 years :)03:11
treachwell. old habits die hard they say.03:11
Romsterstjepan, no real need to use $name in the source=() array either03:12
Romsterheh true03:12
Romsteri'm getting out of some old styles03:12
tilmanlike not using $name in the source array?03:12
treachRomster: could you come up with some valid reason why *not* use $name in the array?03:12
treachIt's a generalization, and valid genralizations are good. Saves work.03:13
Romsterand the most anoying being having some$version.tar.bz2 and instead of using ${version%.*} in place of 2.503:13
Romsterwhen version is 2.5.7 etc.03:14
Romsterwhats up with crux 2.3 branch they got locals enabled in gcc now?03:15
stjepanomg I have checkouted xserver and Mesa 1000000 times today03:15
Romsteris that a fault or a design change03:15
treach"checked out"03:15
RomsterCO :)03:15
treachNative engrish speaker, apparently. :D03:16
Romsteri'm hungery raiding the fridge03:18
treachyou're a lost cause.03:18
stjepanowww my dear computer... it's dying... building gimp, xgl and compiz at the same time :D03:20
tilmanhaahhahaha, "checkouted"03:20
tilmani thought romster said that03:20
tilmannow it's not that funny anymore :/03:21
treachwell, you can revel in the humerous aspects of "hungery" instead.03:21
tilmanindeed :D03:22
Romsterheh picking on my bad spelling...03:25
Romsterstjepan, man nice03:25
Romsterand renice03:25
treachRomster: no, picking on poor english in general.03:25
Romster20:30:29 up 18 days,  1:04,  2 users,  load average: 2.51, 3.36, 3.3303:26
treachdon't think everything has to do with you personally.03:26
Romsterkinda loaded here atm too.03:26
prologicthat's nothing03:26
stjepan100% CPU here :)03:26
prologicwait till you start seeing 15's :)03:27
Romsteri've not got that high b403:30
Romsteri've had 5 b403:30
* stjepan has finally built compiz03:31
treach"An Adventurer is You!"03:36
stjepanI have absolutely no luck building xgl03:39
stjepanChecking that the source files exist for mesa module ...03:39
stjepan   error:   /home/stjepan/Desktop/xgl-ports/xgl/work/src/Mesa-6.5/src/mesa/main/bitset.h not found03:39
stjepanconfigure: error: Failed to link Mesa source tree.  Please specify a proper path to Mesa sources, or disable GLX.03:39
pitillostjepan, I think you are trying to do a hard job without the necesary knowledge....03:41
stjepanpitillo, I don't think so03:41
pitillowell I hope you can do it then.03:42
Romsterstjepan, look in the xorg package it uses mesa sources...03:42
Romsterit'll give you an idea how it works, configure for XGL may use the same ./configure option too03:42
Romstereasy to see03:42
Romster./configure help03:43
stjepanI already have the necessary configure options03:43
stjepanI have tried with mesa cvs and mesa 6.5 and it always complains03:44
stjepanRomster, I use --with-mesa-source=$SRC/Mesa-6.503:46
Romsterfind the readme or install file and read it on the pre-requistetes03:52
Romsteron what version of mesa it needs03:52
stjepanno README03:53
stjepangit clone git:// doesn't work03:53
stjepanso I use the old cvs version03:54
stjepanthat freedesktop server is getting on my nerves03:55
stjepanI'll try with mesa 6.403:58
Romsterhrmm dosn't the source of xgl have any info of what mesa it requires..04:01
stjepanno, it just wants mesa cvs04:01
stjepanthat's all it says04:01
Romsteruseally a INSTALL or README file is in the source04:01
stjepanand it fails to configure with mesa cvs04:01
stjepanthere is no INSTALL nor README04:01
Romsterthat could be totally unstable..04:01
Romsterand not build...04:02
Romsterso lateist devalopemnt another words...04:02
Romstermakes it harder to find then unless google can help04:03
nipuLoops, traceroute is broken with glibc 2.504:03
stjepanRomster, and what's going on with freedesktop server?04:03
treachHey Romster what's up with the buget of french guyana?04:04
Romsterprerequisites: [WWW]Mesa 6.504:06
stjepanRomster, from where did you get this?04:07
stjepanRomster, and it doesn't configure even if I use Mesa 6.504:08
prologicguys just go look at the gentoo sources or debian unstable04:10
prologicand be done with it :)04:10
prologicthere's probably a patch already :)04:11
Romsteri looked didn't find much on arch, gento is a stack of forums, looks to me xgl hsn't been touched since 200204:13
nipuLany particular reason for choosing xgl/compiz over aiglx/beryl?04:15
Romstertreach, what are you on about the french republic for? :/04:16
treachlol. sarcasm, which apparently didn't hit the right person.04:16
stjepannipuL, of course04:17
stjepanxgl is faster than aiglx04:17
Romstertreach, oviously not :|04:18
stjepancompiz is faster and stabler (also read as: better) than beryl04:18
Romsterand less maintianed :/04:18
nipuLberyl on nvidia is plenty fast for me, and stable04:18
nipuLcompiz also comes with a butt load of gnome dependencies04:19
pitilloon ati x600 and i945 too (running gnome)04:19
stjepanRomster, wrong04:19
stjepannipuL, false04:20
stjepancompiz does NOT require gnome04:20
stjepanberyl is one big bloated community-maintained hacky copy of compiz with lots of shiny useless features04:21
stjepanI choose usability04:21
treach*sigh* less options != more useable.04:22
treachonly idiots and gnome developers subscribe to that notion.04:22
Romsterhrmm well good luck porting it to a package04:22
Romstermore user comunity should mean less bugs..04:22
stjepanthat is not true04:23
stjepanI know beryl and compiz very well04:23
stjepanberyl focuses on eye-candy and many features... this results in bloat04:23
stjepanit's very unorganized, just look at beryl-settings04:23
stjepanit's slower and often unstable compared to compiz04:24
stjepanusable features come from compiz and beryl guys just immediately copy them04:24
stjepancompiz is developed by David Reveman, a Novell's employee04:24
treachdo you know what that sounds like? Talking points.04:24
nipuLeek, novell04:24
nipuLevil! eeevil!04:25
* Romster wonders if its safe to use crux-2.3 now, i've built a new tool chain.04:25
stjepanthere's a big war between beryl and compiz and I'm on the compiz side04:25
nipuLi've been using the 2.3 branch for quite some time04:25
nipuL64bit no less04:26
treachhow silly. taking sides, war. *gah*.04:26
Romsterstill on 32but but i don't see any reason to stay on 2.2 anymore04:26
Romsteri could build a older tool chain if i have some anoying ports.04:26
nipuLmore testers = less bugs04:26
Romsterand have it along side the new toolchain04:26
RomsternipuL, i totally agree on that one04:27
treachnipuL: I doubt novell is evil, just slow and dimwitted.04:28
treachthey got pwned.04:28
* stjepan is finally building XGL!! Thanks, gentoo ;)04:28
prologictold ya gentoo would help :)04:28
prologicbut noooo noone listened to me ;/04:28
stjepansource=( java-swing.patch compalloc.patch)   :)04:29
nipuLoh my04:29
prologicoh my stars04:30
pitillowhat about using vbles and put a general sf url... to let the user use his prefered mirror?04:30
prologicstjepan, you're an idiot :)04:30
stjepanprologic, why? :)04:30
prologicnice work nipuL04:30
prologichehe nothing04:30
prologiconly heaps of docs and howto's out there :)04:30
prologicincluding one for crux :)04:30
stjepanprologic, what's wrong?04:30
prologicwhy the hell would you want a 3d desktop anyway ?04:31
stjepanpitillo, instead of ?04:31
prologicit's not like your screen is interactive or anything04:31
stjepanprologic, it's useful04:31
Romstersed -i -e 's|||' Pkgfile04:31
prologicor has any dept!04:31
treachstjepan: you think too little for your self, asks too many questions and rely too much on other people to think for you.04:31
stjepantreach, eh?04:31
treachI think that's what prologic is trying to say.04:31
stjepanprologic, it's useful04:32
treachour .au friends doesn't talk that much, so they shorten things down.04:32
prologicnice one treach04:32
prologicI can't keep up with you guys (or obvous reasons) :)04:32
Romsteris what pitillo is getting at along with the dl.sourceforge.net04:33
stjepanRomster, nx04:33
prologicneways night guys04:33
prologichappy curxing04:34
pitilloprologic, goodnight04:34
treachprologic: tried feeding irssi into some screen reader? Might sound a bit like some spaniard commenting a fotball match though.. :P04:34
prologicyeah that's the problem04:34
prologicwhich is why I don't use any04:35
prologicthe technology is pitiful :/04:35
prologicshame really04:35
treachI guessed so.04:35
treachgood night then.04:35
stjepanxgl is not useless crap, it's useful04:35
stjepanmy gnome is 100 times faster with it... XGL accelerates drawing of my desktop04:37
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nipuLi'm using twm at the moment :)04:37
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jiribhi everybody04:43
jiribhas anybody seen apparmor working on crux?04:43
mike_kI doubt it's free like beer04:53
jiribi know... but i haven't find any doc how to install it on non-suse distro :)04:53
jiribyeah, there are some slackware packages, but anyway it's a little chaotic04:54
nipuLjust looking at the archlinux port for libstdc++ any reason crux relies on prebuilt libraries rather than building them from source?04:56
mike_kjirib: yeah, only suse related docs found so far05:00
jiribif i do some port, where can i send it for testing and comment?05:00
pitilloyou can make your own repo and share it. Can be talked here if there is someone interested in it.05:01
mike_kor on the mailing list05:01
pitillomike_k, true05:01
jiribis there any script which can find for me via ldd which ports can be deps or which deps should be ported?05:03
jiribsuch as... ldd `which someapp` - > libxy - ( someport); libzz ( non ported)05:03
nipuLnot sure, but it would be trivial to write one05:04
jiribi know05:04
nipuLif an official one exists, it's most likely in prtutils05:04
mike_kbut it's not in scripts.git05:07
mike_kanyone remember a place to find johannes' script 'finddeps'?05:08
nipuLsweet zombie jesus! doesn't anyone use the crux website05:09
nipuLi've lost count of how many times i've linked to it in the last hour05:09
mike_koh, prt-utils is (somehow) not installed on this box o_005:12
jiribfinddeps works just for installed port05:14
jiribi thought a script to find out deps for non-ported app05:14
Romstermike_k, lol05:14
Romsterjirib, if it fials to build your missing a dep :)05:15
nipuLfinddeps is good for finding automagical depenencies05:15
Romsterjirib, i've looked into that and the best solution i've came with is using a chroot with only core installed then install each port it depends ont hen make ports if they arn't already aviable.05:15
nipuLand refactoring for xorg05:16
jiribis a way to install port from binary packages and if it is not avaiblable to falldown for source port intallation?05:17
jiriblike FETCH_PACKAGES=Yes on OpenBSD when you are building a port05:17
nipuLcrux is source based05:17
jiribi know crux's ports are much simpler05:17
Romsterif the package is already built prt-get will just reinstall it.05:17
nipuLi'm not aware of any package repositories05:18
jiribpkg-get... prt-get dont look for packages if i know05:18
Romsterjirib, maybe safe-build is what your looking for but i haven't done much work on the chroot idea for testing ports in.05:18
Romsteri'll probbly move to using KVM for that soon.05:18
Romsterprt-get depinst05:18
Romsterdependency insall05:19
Romsterman prt-get05:19
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jiribRomster: yeah, but it wont try to use packages05:19
jiribRomster: maybe i'm wrong05:19
Romsterjirib,  just what are you trying to acomplish?05:20
Romsterhi Romster05:20
Romstererr Romeo-05:20
jiribRomster: yeah it is not very useful :)05:20
Romstertab completion sucks..05:21
treachnot as much as having to type funky nicks.05:22
Romsterjirib, its a manual process to depinst each dependency if you use a chroot or do it on a working system, then name that dependency in the Pkgfile, i use the safe-build script todo things in a chroot, to find dependencys that are installed on my system but not listed in the Pkgfile.05:23
Romstertreach, yeah i hate the nicks that start with | etc [05:24
jiribis there any interest for ipv6 to be built in base?05:26
jiribsuch as hack net-tools etc?05:26
guaqualast time i did ipv6 with crux it was a breeze to get working05:26
Romsteri tend to enable it for future proofing05:27
jiribyeah but it is not in default installation... it should be to make more pressure on using it05:28
jiribas 2.3 will use iproute2, it would be nice05:29
Romster2.2 uses iproute2 now.05:30
Romsterits just in opt and not in core :)05:30
jiribi was talkin about core and default settings05:31
mike_kbtw, anyone with ipssec/racoon experience?05:32
mike_kwith a good rc.template it could be shipped in opt...05:33
jiribisn't isakmpd better solution?05:34
mike_kthere are(was) plenty of implementations, ipsec-tools with racoon inside seems to be the default for netbsd/linux-2.605:35
jiribi hope isakmpd for linux would get some simplifications from openbsd ipsec efforts05:37
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jjpkHaha, someone took the ubuntu advice a step further.06:48
jjpkPeace & protection is/was a script for mIRC. :D06:49
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rehabdolloo, gcc 4.1.207:05
onestepI saw it in archlinux's beta iso, but it was built from svn snapshot afair :)07:19
Romsterthis is odd kde depends on imlib and there is only imlib2...07:28
treachkde doesn't depend on it afaik. but some of it's apps has some funny deps iirc.07:29
Romsterseems i got both installed yet imlib 1.9.15-1 isn't in the ports db anymore, wonder if its safe to kill imlib and just use imlib2...07:29
treachwell, you could try.. what do you have to lose except some time with the compiler? :>07:31
Romsterlooking at the twinkle port and its missing another dependency too, also found ktorrent out of date 2.1 is out now. hmmz07:31
Romsterconsidering imlib isn't in the ports db anywhere, i guess its safe to remove that one and do a revdep07:31
Romsterheh true07:31
Romsterspent all day redoing a tool chain.07:32
Romsterwhats another few more hours :P07:32
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j^2hey all08:48
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Romsterhi j^209:01
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spn|workjaeger, imo my ati port and the gl-select modification are finished, can you take a look please?09:54
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jaegernot at the moment, but I'll save the link10:02
spn|workIm very interesting on gl-select with ati support10:04
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thrice`spn|work: that shouldn't have /usr/X11R6 stuff, or is that only for xorg 6.9.x ?10:35
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stjepanhi jaeger11:36
stjepanmy xgl ports are finished11:37
stjepanonly two packages are needed to build: compiz and xgl11:37
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spn|workthrice`, Im using 6.9.x and it's works fine for me, please change values and test it if you want11:57
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stjepanhi from xgl and compiz :)12:09
jjpktilman: hahaha12:09
jjpkQuiet, you might actually invoke that persona non grata back :|12:10
jjpkBesides, ulughbegh was .tr, not .hr :D12:10
tilmani thought maybe he moved12:11
stjepanwho's ulugbegh?12:11
tilman#crux hero12:11
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jjpkxgl = stable? hmm12:13
jjpkI still would not use it because it is unnecessary.12:14
jjpkUnless of course my desktop requires ultra leet pimping.12:14
teKI figured it out today (Silicon Image S-ATA controller) .. one has to enable the S-ATA support, the IDE support and the SCSI Subsys+disc support... I missed the support in the IDE drivers section12:18
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stjepanhi again...12:19
stjepanAlt key doesn't work in X :(12:26
RedShiftmaybe your computer doesn't like your keyboard's ALT key12:27
RedShiftthis has happened before12:27
RedShiftthe only solution is buy another keyboard12:28
teK /nick tek12:28
stjepansetxkbmap -layout us -model pc10412:29
stjepanCouldn't interpret _XKB_RULES_NAMES property12:29
stjepanUse defaults: rules - 'xorg' model - 'pc101' layout - 'us'12:29
stjepanError loading new keyboard description12:29
jjpkUsually setxkbmap us is enough.12:30
jjpkIf that is what you are after.12:30
stjepanweird, works now.... setxkbmap -layout us -model pc10412:31
thrice`teK: yes ?12:41
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rehabdollahw.. php 4.4.513:41
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RedShiftuugh php414:39
RedShiftphp5 ftw14:39
rehabdollis the upgrade painless?14:40
RedShiftdepends, what are you upgrading?14:40
RedShiftyour own applications ?14:41
rehabdollill get flooded by angry users :)14:41
rehabdolldunno what they run exactly14:42
RedShiftnormally it's shouldn't give any problems14:43
RedShiftit's just in really really special cases that php code developped on the 4 platform fails or gives different results14:43
rehabdollah, good to know14:44
rehabdolli havent really looked into it14:44
rehabdolllamp is boring :)14:44
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tilmanningo: happy valentine's day!15:13
ningotilman: <3, thanks sweethart15:14
onestepcute love :)15:14
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drijenanyone about?17:00
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prologic$ dot17:34
prologicError: invalid api in config: usershape17:34
prologicdot: input.c:317: dotneato_args_initialize: Assertion `v' failed.17:34
prologicAnyone get that when using graphviz's dot tool ?17:34
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rehabdollgcc 4.1.2 will make its way to 2.3, right?17:43
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Romsterthis is intersting ppl camplain to me not using the proper project names for the port name, and what do i find in ports/opt :/ if they really want me to use the project names for all the ports then i'd expect everyone to abide by that, not just me..20:33
rehabdollwhat ports are we talking about?20:45
Romsteroh awhile ago i forgot who someone went off at me for having speek as libspeex, i noticed gmp is named libgmp in opt repo, when its project name is just gmp, i'm sure there are other examples that don't use the project name for the port name.20:48
Romstererr speex labeled as libspeex20:49
bd2Romster, btw, whole xorg/ repo abusing the rule ;-)21:13
Romsteryeah i hadn't looked :)21:15
bd2as for xorg itself, I do understand why it's not following rules. probably with pkgutils attributes, when there will be "repo" attribute, tilman will rename them ;-)21:15
Romsteri much prefer consistant port names than the project names, like all librarys prefixed with lib.21:15
bd2because otherwise it's pretty hard, for example, to remove whole xorg packages21:15
Romsteryeah that too.21:16
Romsteri renamed libspeex to speex again but i got other ports i've renamed like qc-cam i named it as module-usb-quickcam is this also wrong todo?21:17
Romsterwhich would you prefer :)21:17
bd2qc-cam is original name?21:17
bd2I'd prefer it  ;-)21:18
Romsteris project name actually.21:18
Romster:/ typical..21:18
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bd2Romster, just imagine if I've bought quickcam, and google it "quickcam linux". I will find qc-cam project, and will try /var/ports/contrib_old/qc-<tab><tab>21:20
Romstergrep -r qc-caom /usr/ports/contrib/*/Pkgfile :/21:21
Romsterbut its a bit long winded...21:22
Romsterthe ports database used to give descriptions but not anymore on the site..21:22
Romsterprt-get dsearch quickcam, would work21:22
bd2so debianish... :-/21:22
Romsterbeing a module you'd start with module-<connection>-<device> :/21:23
Romsteri used to use debian heh21:23
Romstermaybe a whole repo of project names including oens that don't use a prefix of lib, so ya have to really look to see that they are indeed librarys might hake some happy.21:24
Romsterits realyl hard to compromise when each person has there own opinions.21:26
Romsterargh where is libro i can not find it anywhere and google isn't being helpful21:33
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Romsternevermind found the blasted lib :/21:41
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