IRC Logs for #crux Thursday, 2007-05-17

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RoomsterGNOME 2.16.x for FIrefox... :(00:36
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pitillogood morning01:26
vektoriRoomster, that's gotta be the craziest plugin _ever_.02:45
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sepenmorning all02:58
pitillomorning sepen03:26
sepenpfffff, how many emails did you receive at crux ML from 'arnuld'??04:23
sepenheheheh04:23
pitilloless than tomorrow xD04:25
sepeneach day, more and more04:32
pitilloxD04:42
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tilmancool, someone put Pkgfile in contrib/06:21
tilmanis it so hard to check the output of "git status"?06:22
sepentilman, maybe it's my problem06:26
sepenIm going to take a look06:26
sepensorry inconveniences06:26
tilmansepen: yes, it was you :P06:26
sepen1 minute06:27
sependone06:28
jjpkSomething tells me the distro dancing days are not quite over :]06:30
tilmansepen: ok06:30
tilmanjjpk: maybe there's a logical explanation for all this ;)06:30
sepenthere was an error copying from my personal repository06:31
tilmansepen: do you run 'git status' before you commit and push? if not, you should :)06:31
sepenyeah! it's a best practice, also when you are using whatever control system tool06:32
jjpktilman: I would not be so sure ;)06:32
tilmanhehe06:33
sepentilman, did you have your clock.sh script near?06:44
tilmani cannot remember such a script06:45
tilmanmaybe you're confusing me with someone else :)06:45
sepenaahahha06:45
sepenyes06:45
sepenwith treach06:45
sepenpfff I've a bad day06:46
tilmanit's a public holiday in germany06:47
tilman\o/06:47
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rehabdollin sweden also07:14
rehabdollhttp://pics.obra.se/sve-vs-nor.jpg07:15
rehabdolloops, wrong window07:16
rxilol you swedes like burning your own flag?07:17
tilman"you swedes" - yeah, every single swede is doing it07:17
jjpkLooks like another marginal group of pissed off radicals with too much time at their disposal.07:18
rehabdollyeah07:19
rehabdollbut the national day in sweden just became a national holiday.. we dont really celebrate it07:19
rehabdollbut the contrast to norways celebration of may 17th is quite strong :)07:19
tilmanrehabdoll: is it sweden's nation day today?07:20
tilmanguess that's just too unlikely07:20
tilmanbut it would be funny :D07:20
rehabdollno, norways07:22
rehabdolli actually dont know on which date we celebrate our national day :D07:23
rehabdollbut i know when norway does.. go figure07:23
tilmanheh07:24
tilmanjune 6th07:24
rxithats the day before the queens birthday here in aus07:26
mike_kvektori: don't you mind if I'll add an updated thing like this http://paste.lisp.org/display/41338 to the public wiki? These steps were checked during 2.3 install process07:34
vektoriMmh, it's better to ask someone who is on the development team. :)07:36
jjpkThe public wiki is what the name suggests, open for the public :p07:37
jjpkIt's just tips anyways.07:37
tilmanwhat is makecommand?07:38
mike_kI guess, you was the original author... thats a copyright question afterall07:39
jjpkIt's a prt-get.conf option.07:39
tilmanmeh, i can't read07:39
jjpk:p07:39
tilmanmike_k: i'd use '$' for the prompt character07:39
tilman# looks like a comment07:39
tilman:)07:39
tilmanmike_k: s/juka/jukka/ :D07:40
mike_ktilman: yep, but maybe after wikifying it'll look better07:40
tilmanmike_k: oh, okay07:40
mike_kI found that in google's cache of another man's page in translated and untranslated version... another username was used07:42
tilmani don't think copyright is an issue, btw :P07:43
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mike_knot an issue, but I just cant modify something (with or without specifying an original author) without asking07:47
tilman:)07:48
rehabdolljune sixth, cheers tilman07:50
rehabdolli'll make a note of it :D07:50
tilmanheh07:50
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jjpk"shit, wrong channel. quit quit quit!1111"08:30
jaegerclose one08:31
jjpk:p08:31
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pitilloummmm, the spam came with him at ML? (I noticed it last week... but today 2 by now)08:44
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tilmanso.08:54
tilmanwhat the hell is wrong with autotools?08:54
tilmanwe don't have 'automake-1.10' we only have 'automake'08:54
tilmanstill autotools generate files that refer to automake-1.1008:55
tilmanbraindead.08:55
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rawpkgtools is missing the libarchive dependency09:22
rawand xorg doesn't work out of the box, it somehow complains about aiglx: no dri blafasel09:23
raw. o O ( I don't want aiglx, damnit! )09:23
rawand the kernel segfaults09:24
raweverytime I boot it until I remove xorg ( I don't know why this is the case! Completeley insane! )09:24
rawso apart from xorg and linux not working, that's about it :]09:25
jaegervery odd09:25
jkrEverything works fine here :)09:25
rawjaeger: where's that aiglx even coming from?09:26
rawnote: this is what the cd's installs09:26
jaegerI would guess the x server tries to enable aiglx by default09:26
rawsomething is seriously wrong with i810/intel09:26
rawhe's complaining about missing module i915 as well09:27
rawbut what's even more strange are the kernel segfaults, I deinstalled the i810 driver, rebooted, and the kernel is entering init 2 with a segfault09:27
rawIt seems to be an acpi issue09:28
tilman grep Depends /usr/ports/core//pkgutils/Pkgfile09:28
rawtilman: on a freshly installed crux 2.3 he can't update the pkgutils because he's missing archive.h09:30
jaegerinstall libarchive09:31
rawjaeger: no shit, einstein ;)09:32
* jaeger shrugs09:33
tilmanraw: i915 is the dri module09:36
tilmanbut if it's not available, then x should just disable dri and aiglx09:36
rawtilman: in the kernel, I guess?09:37
rawI think I'll compile in acpi as module as well09:38
tilman"dri module" = mesa driver09:38
tilman"drm module" = kernel module :)09:38
tilmanraw: pkginfo -o i915_dri.so09:38
* raw notes09:38
tilmani don't know what the kernel module is called for intel09:39
rawI compiled in all intel modules possible ;(09:39
raws/(/)/09:39
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tilmanraw: you could try to get drm.git and use the latest intel drm module09:40
tilmanhttp://gitweb.freedesktop.org/?p=mesa/drm.git09:41
tilmanthe urls are noted there09:41
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tilmancool, i won 300k pounds10:00
jkrOn the weigh bridge?10:01
j^2w00t rejected over 700k spam messages since january!10:02
tilmanjkr: what? peugeot uk wants to give me that money, and a new car10:03
tilmanhooray, etc.10:04
jkrHehe, congrats10:05
tilmanthe email didn't even ask for my bank account ;)10:05
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sepenhi treach10:15
sependid you have your clock.sh near10:16
sepen?10:16
treachyeah.10:19
treachshould be at http://hem.bredband.net/clock.sh10:19
treachwoups.10:19
treachshould be at http://hem.bredband.net/treach/clock.sh10:19
sepencan I integrate on my personal subversion repo?10:23
treachsure.10:23
aon:)10:25
treachi'd think it's too trivial to copyright anyway. :D10:25
aonmy clock is 190sloc10:26
tilmanoh my10:30
tilmani wasted more than an hour to figure out why my crux package of libx11 produces a larger libx11.so10:30
tilman(than if i build it manually)10:30
rawtilman: thanks I will have a look at it next time I have the notion to experiment10:30
tilmanturns out i overlooked the following line in Pkgfile:10:31
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tilmanexport CFLAGS="-O0 -g"10:31
rawtilman: xmms2-scrobbler doesn't clean up it's lock file when started via the CLI, btw10:31
tilmanffs!10:31
tilmanraw: yah, lock file handling sucks nuts :(10:31
tilmanraw: it should work if you start it manually though10:31
rawtilman: nope, it works if I _don't_ start it manually but via startup.d10:33
rawweird, eh? ;)10:33
tilmanhow exactly do you reproduce that error?10:35
tilmanor better, how are you stopping/killing xmms2-scrobbler to reproduce it?10:36
tilmanmaybe i should just open the file with the EXCL bit10:42
jjpkarnuld's guessing game is in full swing again.10:44
tilmanO_EXCL is  broken  on NFS file systems; programs which rely on it for performing lock- ing tasks will contain a race condition.10:44
tilmanmaybe not10:44
tilmanhttp://www.fsf.org/resources/formats/playogg10:55
tilmanstupid people who cannot properly spell "ogg"10:55
tilman"Ogg" even10:55
tilman>:10:55
jjpktilman: time to write a bitching complaint :)11:00
tilmanWhat is OGG?11:01
tilmanOGG is a professional-grade media format. It's like MP3 but better—and it respects your freedom.11:01
tilmando they want to cater to granma?11:01
tilmanthey are mixing up container and codec11:01
tilman:(11:01
tilmankind of lame11:01
* tilman goes to look for his starcraft cd11:01
Romsterheh11:20
Romsterbroward war expansion :P11:20
tilmanbroward war? :D11:20
tilmananyway, i failed11:20
tilmancan't find the cd :'(11:20
treach"broodwars"..11:22
tilman-s11:23
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treachright11:23
Kep1Hi, anyone knows is there CRUX 2.X ISO with 2.4 series kernel ?11:24
tilmanno, there isn't11:24
treachwell, if you make one there will be.11:25
Kep1OK, thanks, I will do it myself. I've IBM Thinkpad 600X and11:27
Kep1it doesn't seem to work with any 2.6.X kernel.11:28
tilmanjust changing the kernel version in the makefile could do it11:28
tilman(and doing a full rebuild afterwards of course)11:28
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d0ze_sucksHey Guys11:31
Kep1Thanks, will do that.11:33
d0ze_sucksGuys, I have some probelm regarding CRUX.11:33
d0ze_sucksI mean problem in the installation thingy.11:33
tilman?11:34
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treach"Computer no workie, ehlp"11:34
d0ze_sucksWell, I was just wondering what should I edit in /etc/fstab.11:35
d0ze_sucksIsn't there an auotmoted procidure.11:35
d0ze_sucks?11:35
treachno11:35
jjpkIf you expect automation in crux, you probably should not be using it.11:35
d0ze_suckswell, allright, then can you plz tell me what to edit in /etc/fstab.11:36
treachand if you don't know what to edit in fstab that's a good indication jjpk is right.11:36
d0ze_sucksum, well, i know crux is for expert users. but my friend who is a linux guru told me to use crux. because it'll help me understand linux.11:37
treachyou'll need to find out how partition naming works in linux and then adjust your fstab accordingly11:37
d0ze_sucksso can u guys help me.11:37
jjpkRead the Introduction on crux.nu11:37
jjpk_understand_ it.11:38
treachSorry, we don't do spoonfeeding, but the basics isn't hard really.11:38
tilmanBASICS11:38
treachhehe11:38
d0ze_sucksso can u guys provide me with some links that'll help me clear my concepts.11:39
tilmanhttp://www.linuxvoodoo.com/resources/howtos/mounting/11:39
treachd0ze_sucks: just find some basic introduction docs for linux on for instance tldp.org, and you should be able to pull it off.11:39
tilmanselflinux.sf.net maybe11:39
d0ze_sucksOh, thanks guys.11:39
tilmannp, good luck11:39
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loupgaroublondd0ze_sucks, if you want 'expert' linux with lots of hand holding, why don't you try gentoo?11:40
d0ze_suckslol gentoo is too damn complicated.11:41
d0ze_sucksi have the iso.11:41
treachgentoo--11:41
treachan accident waiting to happen.11:41
tilmangentoo--11:41
RyoSgentoo--11:41
RyoS:O11:41
treach@karma gentoo11:41
clbtreach: Karma for "gentoo" has been increased 0 times and decreased 3 times for a total karma of -3.11:41
RyoSi just had to11:41
treach:p11:41
RyoSoh wee11:42
loupgaroublondthat's harsh :P11:42
RyoSRyoS--11:42
clbRyoS: Error: You're not allowed to adjust your own karma.11:42
RyoSsnap11:42
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jjpkIf gentoo is off for you, crux will be a pain in the ass without a doubt.11:43
treachwell, he's trying to learn.11:44
treachmaybe he'll learn something from a PITA? Question is, what lesson? ;D11:44
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jjpk:D11:48
jkrHehe, Ubuntu really sucks11:50
jkrNot just because it's a mainstream distro, but because it really technically sucks11:50
loupgaroublondno, sabayon really sucks, it makes ubuntu look good11:50
jkrYou can't use WPA and static IPs together :D11:50
treachI'd say that depends on what you compare to.11:50
jkrOnly WEP and static IPs - for WPA you have to setup a DHCP server somewhere11:51
treachI'd take ubuntu over windows any day. :-/11:51
jjpkjkr: bullshit, set the ip settings and run wpa_supplicant. done11:51
jkrjjpk: But that's not the Ubuntu way ;)11:51
jkrThat's how normal distributions would do it11:52
jkrIn Ubuntu you first have to prevent that stupid network manager from resetting your manually set connections11:52
jkrOtherwise it'll kill your wpa_supplicant settings and try to setup its own stupid settings11:52
jjpkOrthodox distribution mentalities+++++11:53
jkrThe nerolinux port is broken :(11:58
jkrprologic: Are you maintaining nerlinux?11:59
treachno, he just makes false claims in the Pkgfile.12:00
treachit's maintained by a mouse living under romsters fridge.12:00
jkrAnd the mouse doesn't care prologics false claims?12:01
treachapparently not.12:02
jkrWhat's the mouses mail address?12:04
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treachwho knows. He just pops up here and dumps a bunch of ports now and then. ;)12:04
jkrHehe12:05
treachJoking aside, I guess prologic is asleep, if you've got a problem mail him.12:05
jkrAh, he's australian, right?12:06
treachyes12:06
jkrI'll just send a patch then12:06
treachjaeger: btw, libexif is at 0.6.1412:06
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destructcd13:23
treach~%13:24
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Romstertreach, lol what the, why use nerolinux when there is k3b anyways?13:28
treachI don't know.. I don't use it.13:28
treachIn fact I use none of them.13:29
jjpkcdrkit ftw.13:29
Romstercdrkit directy?13:29
Romsterjjpk, stop reading my mind :P13:30
Romsteri use k3b with cdrkit :)13:30
treachk3b would be nice, if it didn't depend on kde.. :>13:30
Romsterheh maybe..13:31
jjpkI still fail to see why a gui is needed.13:31
Romsterlike mozilla will depend on gnome so it looks like..13:31
treachnothing wrong with kde, but I don't have the horsepowers for building it.13:31
Romsterlazyness. :/13:31
treachwell. there's nothing final yet afaik.13:32
tilmani think they won't really depend on gnome13:32
tilmanthat's just too insane13:32
Romsteri use it on this 1.4GHz box just fine.13:32
jjpks/y/i13:32
treachtilman: too bad that's no guarantee..13:32
Romsteryeah really tilman13:32
treachinsanity usually prevails for some reason. :(13:32
tilmanwe still have katze*!13:32
jjpkI think they probably will make it a required dependency.13:32
treachkazehakase. :p13:33
Romsterugh13:33
treach(I can spell it. :D )13:33
Romsterwhy can't they fix the existing bugs..13:33
Romsteri know of a few thats been in every verison.13:33
Romstertreach, copy pasting don't count :D13:33
treachI didn't.13:33
Romsteror you redid it som many times to memorise it13:34
treachtilman: well, then all we need is a port for gecko I guess. :P13:34
tilmanoui13:34
treachotherwise you'll have to build firefox anyway. :/13:34
Romsterlibgecko13:34
jjpkMozilla have a knack for creating bloat...13:35
treachI wonder if it's possible to split up firefox in multiple ports.. and what we would have to bribe jaeger with to do it. :P13:35
jjpkIf it does not happen, do it yourself ;)13:36
tilmanthere's opt/nss already13:36
treachI fear it's a bit over my head.13:36
tilmanno idea whether opt/firefox could use it though13:36
treachtilman: it's way out of date iirc.13:36
Romsternss got updated not that long ago...13:37
tilmanjjpk: i think it hurts that a lot of mozilla people are also windows people13:37
treachhm..13:37
tilmanjjpk: just a gut feeling though :D13:37
treach@seen predatorfreak13:37
clbtreach: predatorfreak was last seen in #crux 2 weeks, 1 day, 19 hours, 45 minutes, and 36 seconds ago: <predatorfreak> jdolan: No problem.13:37
Romsterwonder if there is a nice gtk based gecko engine browser about.13:37
treachhe's listed as maintainer for nss... in opt..?13:38
tilmanprobably a mix up13:38
tilmanmaintainer/packager13:38
treachI guess so.13:38
tilmandidn't even know predatorfreak was still around13:38
treachme neither13:38
jjpkSomething tells me predatorfreak does not even use crux these days, I just have a feeling.13:39
tilmanprobably because he never says anything13:39
jjpkThe last thing I remember was the argument about creating a standard framework for cvs/svn ports.13:40
jkrHe, that would be cool13:40
jjpktilman: I would think the windows user syndrome _does_ have some effect in the mozilla camp.13:40
rawtilman: terminating xmms2-scrobbler13:41
tilmanraw: ctrl-c resp sigint?13:41
rawtilman: you can also suspend it to background (&) and exit the CLI13:41
rawif you kill it now, lock remains. voila13:41
treachjjpk: the mozilla people pretty much only cares about windows, since that's where the mass of their users are.13:42
rawtilman: yep13:42
tilmansigint works perfectly for me :(13:42
treachjjpk: that's why I get the feeling we would be better off with dropping them. :/13:42
tilmanraw: openbsd?13:42
jjpktreach: the windows user infestation in mozilla, or what do you mean?13:43
treachno, I mean the attitude from the Mozilla people.13:43
jjpkIndeed, sure windows counts for much more than the unixlike os's, but you can't just throw a release and tell them to stuff it.13:44
rawtilman: yep13:44
treachwhy not? ;)13:44
treachYou treat me like a second rate, and I'll drop you in a heartbeat.13:45
jjpkSure they can do it, but the arrogance will eventually bite them in the ass.13:45
treachdefinitely.13:45
jjpkThis seems to happen too much when you establish yourself and become complacent.13:47
jjpkLet your guard down, you will pay for it if you have competition.13:47
tilmanraw: care to try a small snippet?13:47
tilmanraw: http://rafb.net/p/33GVIO26.html13:48
treachsure. the "you need us more than we need you" attitude will bite you big time when there are other ways.13:48
tilmanraw: does that print "stopped"? :)13:48
treachwhich is what MS is about to find out I guess..13:48
treachI wonder when SUN will discover it. :-)13:48
jjpk:D13:49
jjpkI think there are signs of change in MS, but they are in the infancy stages.13:50
jjpkTo me that says the leadership is not interested.13:50
treachI doubt they will ever change.13:50
jjpkIn that case, if they trip themselves up, it will not be pretty.13:50
treachindeed not, and I will cheer all the way to their grave. :)13:51
jkr:D13:51
rawtilman: ruby?13:52
jjpkI think it is unlikely they will dig their own grave, but I would be there cheering as well :D13:52
tilmanyes13:52
treachjjpk: they will, unless they change.13:52
jjpkThey still have to learn about managing change, I think they are doing a miserable failure in that regard.13:53
raw% ruby  test.rb13:53
rawstarted13:53
rawstopped13:53
jjpkIt is much easier coping with constant, but gradual change than immediate and significant changes.13:53
tilmanraw: now append a line saying "sleep 10", and abort the process before the timeout13:53
treachcommodity software is not profitable anymore. When you have to resort to lock-in and other ugly tricks to make money, you're in trouble.13:53
tilmanraw: to check how it reacts to sigint13:53
jjpkNothing lasts forever and the cracks are slowly emerging.13:53
treachindeed.13:54
jjpkEspecially with the European Commission pestering MS lately.13:54
raw% ruby test.rb13:54
rawstarted13:54
raw^Cstopped13:54
rawtest.rb:5:in `sleep': Interrupt from test.rb:513:54
rawYou can tune a file system, but you can't tune a fish (from most tunefs man pages)13:54
treachAt some point the competition will catch up enough to make people wonder, "hey, why am I paying through the nose for an office suite?"13:55
rawerr, the last line is bofh-excuses, actually ;)13:55
treachand if you don't have plan B you're dead.13:55
jjpkMS does not seem like they have one.13:55
treachI mean, what meaningfull addition has MS-Office seen the last 10 years..?13:55
jjpkMy impression of Ballmer is "my way or the highway"13:55
treachadditons*13:56
treachbha.13:56
jkrMS has other businesses beside the OS market where they can move13:56
treachand none of them are profitable..13:56
jjpkI think the other side is the US government and their economic policies.13:56
jjpkThey are too much pro big biz.13:56
treachthey make money on office and windows. everything else is losing money.13:57
jjpkThey are monolithic and that is the problem.13:57
treachno, not really.13:57
jjpkThey have tried to expand their revenue, but they have not had much success elsewhere.13:58
treachthe problem is that they can use their ill-gotten monopoly-money (no pun intended) to sponsor products losing money for years.13:58
treachthat way they can drive competitors out of a market without ever making money.13:59
treachat least not until the competitors are gone.13:59
treachthat's when you'll have to pay $400 for an beta stage OS.14:00
jjpkThat probably is not much of a challenge, they have a lot of resources to make anything happen.14:00
jjpkThe os reality has been like that for many years now.14:01
tvaalI'm actually more worried about what kind of corporation Google will eventually turn out as, let's heckle them.14:01
jjpkPricing has been stiff for the quality you receive.14:02
treachI'm not forced to deal with google. And they are not trying to force me to use their products.14:02
aonwell, w2003svr sbs is 400ish e OEM and the only reason to run it is better compatibility with windows than the competitors have14:03
treachI've never heard google say anything like "Hey, it's illegal to search the Internet with anything but google".14:03
tvaaltreach, true. But was that the case with MS from the start? (I don't really know).14:03
aontvaal: no14:03
aonalthough iirc there were some lawsuits on the DOS front14:03
treachyes.14:03
treachthey have pretty much always been assholes.14:04
treachbut IBM used to be worse. :)14:04
aonbut business didn't use M$ in the ancient days14:04
treachthat's why people mistook ms for good guys.14:04
tvaalI just think it's part of the economic ecosystem or something. Corporations swell and acquire and blob up. Then they lose speed and direction, and shareholders demand those damned profits. And then they do what they can to hold on.14:04
aoni wonder what the point in migrating AS/400 apps to windows is now that microsoft is dying too :)14:04
treachtvaal: google for caldera, dr-dos and windows 3.114:05
treachthat's typical MS modus operandi.14:05
aonhmm, has anyone actually seen the sources of win3.1 and dr-dos and knows that there actually are no compatibility issues?14:06
aonMS does some nasty hacks under the hood14:06
treachaon: since they got pwned in court I bet there's evidence.14:06
aonoh, k14:06
tvaaltreach, yeah. They are the truest of true assholes when it comes to dirty tricks. I'm not denying that.14:09
aona lot of software companies are, though14:09
treachwell, that's no excuse, is it?14:10
jjpkIt's a race between time and quality.14:10
tvaaltreach, I just think MS will self die sooner or later, or at least lose their stranglehold on everything today.14:10
jjpkMinimizing the time it takes to release something, cutting a few corners.14:10
tilmanlike selling windows 1.0 for $9914:10
tilmanCAN YOU BELIEVE IT14:10
aontreach: i'm not saying it is14:10
treachof course they will die, and that will be because they can't change.14:10
tvaaltreach, and peoples' praising of and increasing reliance of Google today might well backlash sooner or later.14:11
aonjust that perhaps more attention should be paid on the smaller assholes before they're goatse-sized14:11
treachtvaal: well, it's a whole lot easier to avoid google..14:11
treachgoogle doesn't come preinstalled on my computer.14:11
treachthere's no google tax.14:11
aonheh, where do you buy your computers from? :)14:11
aona lot of them come with ge, picasa and other unneeded crap nowadays14:12
treachI've never heard anyone say "people will pirate google if you don't preinstall it"14:12
aonand it's possible to buy computers without windows14:13
aonat least nowadays14:13
treachaon: I usually don't buy computers that way, but it did come preinstalled on my laptop.14:13
treachunavoidable. :(14:13
tvaalThere's nothing saying The Next Big Bully(tm) have to follow MS's path.14:13
aonisn't it possible to get a refund of the windows license?14:14
treachOf course not. Bit's a great deal harder to bully someone who can just simply avoid using you.14:14
treachaon: No.14:14
aonit isn't?14:14
aonisn't it in their own eula anymore?14:14
tvaalAll this talk about "online apps" and stuff might well shoot Google to the definite lead, and then they fsck something up, and close their formats and stuff, and then the rest of us are stuck again, because everyone else is using their word processor, etc.14:15
treachsome people have claimed success, but it's very very hard and tedious, and varies greatly from country to country.14:15
tvaalOf course it simplified, but you get the point.14:15
treachaon: I don't think you can succeed here with such a claim.14:15
aonoh14:16
treachthey just say your computer is sold "as a product" which includes windows.14:16
treachand since you bought "the product" you've no base for your claim.14:16
treachor something like that.14:16
aonhm14:18
jaegertreach: updated14:23
treach:)14:26
jaegerI wonder why I linked gaim against nss for so long when the configure output says gnutls is the preferred SSL method14:36
treachhehe, I wondered that as well. :P14:36
treachthat's why I got the gnutls port in the first place. :)14:37
jaegermaybe less deps, purely from a numbers point of view... but I honestly don't remember14:37
jaegerI have it linked against nss on this machine and against gnutls on my laptop, both seem to function as expected14:37
treachyeah.14:37
* tilman pushes the freetype bump14:37
treachno complaints then? ;)14:38
tilmandidn't hear any :>14:38
jaeger:)14:38
tilmanpros > cons14:38
tilmani think i'll also port those new redhat fonts14:38
tilmanliberation14:38
tilmanmaybe people who *still* use ms core fonts can switch finally14:38
treachhehe14:38
tilmanotoh, i think i should plug in my radeon and finish warcraft314:39
tilmanand play starcraft14:39
treachwell, some sites looks seriously shitty without them. :(14:39
tilmanand possibly more games14:39
tilman:D14:39
tilmantreach: which ones?14:39
treachwell, I haven't tried with those red hat fonts.14:39
tilmantreach: i've configured firefox to use vera for everything. it's good :)14:39
treachbut iirc the inq, is one of those.14:40
treach(just an example..)14:40
tilmankatze needs a throbber badly14:40
treach?14:40
tilmanyou mean theinquirer.net?14:40
treachthrobber? that sounds dirty..14:40
treachyeah.14:40
tilmanthe rotating "updating..." icon in the top right corner of firefox14:41
treachoh.14:41
treachok.14:41
tilmantheinquirer.net look awesome here14:42
tilmantreach: try to force vera in firefox :)14:42
treachcould be the register as well.14:42
tilmans/vera/yourfavouritefont/14:42
treachmmh, that could be a way. Never tought of forcing stuff.14:43
jaegerhrmm... wonder if I can run nagios on a php5-cgi and lighttpd host instead of mod_php/apache14:44
* jaeger will try it14:44
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aonnagios doesn't even use php iirc14:56
aonat least the versions i've been dealing with14:56
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tilmantreach: theregister looks vera'ish too ;)14:59
treachok.14:59
jaegeraon: it may not, I just asked because the port says it requires mod_php15:09
j^2jaeger: yep you can15:09
j^2i have15:09
jaegerI use php for other stuff anyway15:09
jaegerj^2: just got it setup and running, I haven't configured it yet15:09
j^2ah15:09
j^2it's just easier to copy paste the apache setup :P15:10
aonah15:10
aoni wonder why it does require php15:10
jaegerI just don't really want to use apache on this machine15:10
jaegerlighttpd is serving quite well so far15:10
j^2aon: i know you can have mysql on the back end too and i guess php is dynamic also15:11
aonuhm15:11
jaegeraon: it's possible the port author just included it erroneously15:11
aonj^2: are you running that configuration builder thing?15:11
j^2i'm not running nagios anymore, did a while ago though15:12
aonokay15:12
aoninteresting, have to grep it tomorrow15:13
aoni found AD-integrated logins quite hard to implement ;)15:13
j^2totally15:13
aonthat's more of an apache issue, though15:13
jaegerok, got my nagios install behind mod_auth, now I can play with it :)15:16
sepenrecently I ported php4, many people has their programs written in this branch15:29
sepenI think this is one of the inconveniences15:30
pitillonice, thank you for that comments. I will remove both dependencies from nagios port. Sorry for that mistake.15:46
tilmanmmh15:53
tilmanis "x11-fonts-" the right prefix for ports that ship ttf files?15:53
treachwithout thinking I'd say no.15:53
treachsince there's nothing x11 specific about a ttf.. I chose font-ttf but that's probably not right either..15:55
aoni'd name it just liberation-fonts15:59
aon(guess that's what you're doing)15:59
aoni find the x11-fonts-blah (or whatever prefix) model somewhat braindead16:00
aonsince other packages don't have genre prefixes either16:00
treachliberation-ttf-fonts maybe.16:00
jaegerdoesn't matter much to me, I'll change the corefonts and artwiz-aleczapka ports to match16:01
aontreach: yeah, perhaps16:01
aonthe tarball seems to be liberation-fonts-ttf16:02
treachheh, we're all wrong then. :)16:02
aondunno why the ttf has to go around there unless there are liberation bitmap fonts or something that would collide16:02
aons/go/be/16:03
treachit's nice to know what kind of font it is just by looking at the name IMO.16:03
treachthat way you can ignore fonts you know right away doesn't fit your purpose.16:04
aonwell, yeah16:04
aonttf-fonts seems better than fonts-ttf to me :)16:05
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treachhi, bye16:12
pitillo(updated but not tested, thank you a lot for these observations)16:13
tilmanhaving some prefix seems to make more sense than a suffix though16:26
tilmanttf-fonts-foo maybe?16:26
jaegerwhat about non-ttf like artwiz?16:27
* treach calls for a vote. :D16:27
tilmanfor the classic artwiz package, "x11-fonts-*" would actually be accurate16:28
treachor should we launch a sub-commitee to find out further details? :D16:28
tilmansince those are x core fonts16:28
tilmanbtw, i just realized that xorg-font-bitstream-vera is a misnomer16:28
jaegerhrmm, ok16:28
tilmanwell, i dunno16:28
jaegermaybe x-fonts-artwiz-aleczapka, ttf-fonts-corefonts or something16:29
tilmantreach: i just think a common scheme would be good16:29
treachagreed, just kidding.16:29
treachnot mocking.16:29
rehabdollx11-fonts-artwiz-latin116:29
treachttf-fonts-foo sounds reasonable to me.16:29
aonperhaps ttf-fonts and x11-fonts16:30
treachmatches pretty well with x11-fonts-blah16:30
treachaon: I see we're going to the same party. :P16:30
tilmandoh, i thought artwiz-aleczapka was ttf16:30
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jiribhi all17:25
jiribjaeger: i was just looking at your updated pidgin Pkgfile... and i'm courious how does --with-dynamic-prpls works :)17:28
jaegerin this case, it allows me to specify plugins I'd like NOT to build, like bonjour17:33
jiribwell... i have silc-toolkit installed and compiled pidgin with it automatically17:33
jiribbut how can i add silc plugin after i installed pidgin?17:34
jiribmaybe it's a question for silc devs :)17:34
jaegerit seems to try to build whether its prerequisites are available or not, in some cases.. but the aim was to disable dbus and howl support17:34
jaegerI have no idea there, I don't use silc17:34
jiribsilc rulez :P17:37
jiribsilcnet.org17:37
thrice`--with-silc-indcludes=DIR17:40
thrice`--with-silc-libs=DIR17:40
jiribi have pidgin with silc17:40
thrice`just not showing up ?17:41
jiribi was just courious about that option17:41
thrice`ooh, my fault :)17:41
jiribit's working17:41
jiribdo you use pam on crux?17:43
jiribso bittorrent is out, any other console client?17:49
jiribi haven't been successful with mldonkey as bittorrent client17:49
jaegerI like rtorrent now17:50
jkrrtorrent is great17:51
jiribok i'll try17:51
jiribbut have you tried mldonkey as bittorrent client?17:51
jkrNope17:52
jkrI don't like anything that matches /donkey|mule/i17:52
thrice`I think someone shoudl stick (lib,r)torrent in contrib17:52
jkrI only like monkey17:52
jiribhehe17:53
jkrI think there's a port in my repo17:53
jkrYup, there is one in nexscrp, if there's no port in contrib17:53
thrice`lots of people have rtorrent in their repos, I think17:55
jiribcan samba hide one directory from a share?17:55
jkrthrice`: I didn't find on when I made that port17:56
jiribhan has rtorrent port17:56
jiribi used utorrent under wine :)17:58
thrice`jkr: http://crux.nu/portdb/?q=rtorrent&a=search  :)17:58
jkrjirib: Be sure it's not-so-old version, some time ago rtorrent used to seg.fault a lot17:59
jkrthrice`: Hmm, I know there must have been a good reason for me to make an own port, but I don't remember :)17:59
jiribanyway... sometimes after sysup i got some problems with dependencies18:00
jiribwhat's the best way to ensure everything is OK? revdep shows always a lot of ports...18:01
thrice`jirib: such as?18:01
jiribi had problems with ports depending on python18:01
thrice`jirib: with the exception of mozilla stuff and binaries (openoffice, jre, etc.), revdep will show you stuff that needs to be rebuilt18:01
jkrjirib: That's because python sucks :D18:02
jjpkIf you upgraded 2.4 to 2.5, then you do have to reinstall whatever depends on python.18:05
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jkrOr you uninstall python and whatever depends on python ;)18:06
jiribok18:08
jiribi have prt-get lock xorg-xf86-video-i810 as it doesn't work18:08
jiribor have you tried that (if you have that intel card)18:09
jirib?18:09
jiribthe 2.x version18:09
tilmanjirib: make sure your bug is in fdo's bugzilla18:09
jiribfdo?18:10
tilmanfreedesktop.org18:11
jiribi don't know if it is bug, maybe i miss some libs18:11
jiribit changed that driver18:11
tilmanthe general idea is that xf86-video-intel 2 fixes a LOT of problems18:19
tilmanrather than incuding them18:19
jiribthanks for new mldonkey port!18:20
tilmanjirib: so i suggest that you investigate whether it is a real bug or a local set up problem18:20
tilmanand if it's a bug, make sure it's known to the developers :)18:20
jiribi've bee fighting with shitty tv-out on my old 855gm for weeks18:20
jiribi think it's impossible to get it working18:20
tilmani don't know about tv-out support18:21
jiribi read that some reduction for crt>cinch exists18:21
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prologicjkr, yes I maintain nerolinux19:06
prologicjkr, yes I was saleep19:06
jkrYou got the patch?19:09
jkrOh, and good morning19:09
prologicmorn'n19:09
prologicI shall check a bit later19:09
prologicgot work to do today19:09
jkrOnly the RPM URL and the version changed, so nothing big19:10
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thrice`eek, I someone developed an /opt/bin20:37
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