IRC Logs for #crux Monday, 2007-09-03

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pitillogood morning00:27
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blerdwould i be wrong in saying crux supports reiser4 ?04:22
rawit would be wrong saying linux can't be patched against reiser404:26
blerdyea..i suppose not like windows would be looking into reiser4....umm04:29
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rxiis there any reason why /etc/ports/ couldnt be moved to a location in /usr/ports/ ?05:03
blerdbut why would you wanna move it ?05:06
blerd /etc -> config files and /etc/ports are config files..^_^05:06
rxito simplify central ports management05:07
SiFuh /usr/ports/etc  with a   ln -s /usr/ports/etc /etc/ports   ?05:25
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mike_krxi: FYI: http://crux.nu/bugs/index.php?do=details&task_id=136&histring=ports something similar were discussed06:15
tilmanrxi: strange idea ;)06:17
rxihmm .. i think something like /usr/ports/_files would be more logical06:17
rxitilman: hehe to sarcasm or not to sarcasm06:18
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rxitilman: you can see the reason tho cant you?06:25
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wil_lowHello 2 all07:22
wil_lowcannot install Crux 2.307:23
wil_lowcan someone help07:24
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RedShiftlol07:45
RedShifthello 2 all07:45
RedShiftmy girlfriend won't have sex with me07:46
RedShiftcan someone help07:46
jjpk#crux is such a tremendously user oriented place. ;)08:07
jjpk...but the damned crystal ball is still out of comission.08:08
jjpkrxi: why would you move ports drivers from /etc/ports/ to /usr/ports/? /etc/ports/ are config files.08:09
jjpkI doubt it would really simplify anything. All you would do is mash everything together in the same place.08:11
rxihuh?08:11
rxiive got a /usr/ports/_files/ where all the drivers and such go08:12
rxithen i mount the /usr/port08:13
rxis08:13
rxiwhich is an nfs export on te fileserver08:13
rxiworks fine for me08:14
rxiand its not like you have to configure the httpup files so that argument isnt really valid08:14
jjpkThere would be no need to touch anything except on the fileserver since any other crux machine gets the ports tree via nfs.08:15
rxiyeah but it still needs to look at the /etc/ports to know what to update when ou do a ports -u08:17
rxi*shrugs* it works for me so whether you guys implement it or doesnt really work me08:20
jjpkIt shouldn't matter if you have the fileserver act as the ports tree for every pc on the network.08:21
jjpkJust update on the fs and whoever is using nfs for /usr/ports gets them automagically.08:22
rxi*sighs and walks off*08:22
jjpkIt just does not seem logical to me to have the /etc/ports/ files under /usr/ports.08:23
jjpkBesides, you'd only need to use them IF the fileserver was down for some reason.08:23
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jjpkPatience has a high premium today. :D08:24
jjpkrxi: I probably misunderstood something you said, but if it works for you, use it.08:27
jjpkGood thing crux is certainly not stopping you from configuring to your heart's desire. :D08:27
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mike_kjjpk: to be honest, other distribution do not stop you either, they just make it very painful08:50
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bjohanis there anyway to have (when using twinview) a monitor that is displaying 1280x1024 and have a tv cloning that?12:50
jaegercheck the nvidia driver readme, the settings you need should be detailed in the twinview section12:50
bjohanjaeger, thanks12:52
tilmancan a tv do a resolution that's so high?12:52
tilmanhum hum12:53
tilmani bet it doesn't work12:53
bjohantilman, that is what i was wondering, if the driver can just scale down the image12:53
jaegertilman: some can12:54
jaegerbjohan: I'm not sure the driver can scale down like that... I used to just switch my res down when I hooked up to the old TV12:55
tilmanjaeger: i for one welcome our newly fandangled super tvs12:55
jaeger:)12:55
jaegermy old TV would do a sorta crappy 800x600... my new TC does 1920x1080 without breaking a sweat12:55
bjohani inherited mine from my late grandmother, so its not really state of the art :)12:56
jaegers/TC/TV/12:56
jaegerbjohan: I wouldn't be surprised if you had to stick with 800x600 =/12:56
tilmani could give a technical explanation why it won't work12:57
tilmanbut i'm not sure whether it applies to nvidia's hardware12:57
tilman;)12:57
bjohanjaeger, it does 1024x768 at the moment, and it is above the "native" resolution of the tv12:57
jaegerah12:58
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highlyjhihello, im new to crux and i am having a problem updaing pgkutils to 5.30.0. when i ran "pkgmk -d -u" in spit out a load of errors...the first one is " 'archive_read_new' was not declared in this scope"13:14
highlyjhimy current version is 5.2213:14
tilmaninstall core/libarchive13:15
tilmanthat will fix it13:15
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highlyjhiah, thank you very much! so im going to assume this is a new dependency since i already had pkgutils installed?13:18
tilmanyep13:21
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predatorfreakWell, I encountered a serious bug with sysklogd 1.5.14:29
predatorfreakklogd no longer forks to the background, for whatever reason.14:29
predatorfreakand causes the system to hang on boot.14:29
predatorfreakI had to boot into a livecd and modify my init scripts to do klogd & disown14:29
treachahhhh, so that's what happened..14:29
treachI didn't have time to investigate, just noticed something suddenly went very wrong..14:30
predatorfreaktreach: All that should be needed in the official init scripts is klogd & disown14:30
treachk. btw, if you wait long enough the system starts anyway.14:30
treachyou don't *have* to use a livecd.14:31
predatorfreaktreach: Waiting for an eternity for the dang thing to fork isn't my cup of tea.14:31
predatorfreakIt's quicker to boot into a liveCD and fix the init scripts ;)14:31
treachofc.14:32
tilmanerrm14:32
treachI just have a problem with absolutes. ;)14:32
predatorfreakOf course, it's be better for the dang thing to not-be-broken in the first place.14:32
tilmanwhy don't i see that problem?14:32
treachtilman: you're lucky?14:32
treachor we are unlucky?14:32
predatorfreaktilman: Did you reboot your system after upgrading to 1.5? :)14:32
tilmanpredatorfreak-- for assuming i'm an idiot14:32
tilmani just booted the laptop to test it ;)14:33
predatorfreaktilman-- for doing predatorfreak--14:33
treach@karma predatorfreak14:33
clbtreach: predatorfreak has neutral karma.14:33
predatorfreak@karme treach14:33
predatorfreakerr.14:33
tilmanpredatorfreak: don't mess with the karma thing14:33
treachah. apparently you've done something good previously. :)14:33
predatorfreakI'd help if I could spell :(14:33
predatorfreak@karma treach14:34
clbpredatorfreak: Karma for "treach" has been increased 1 time and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 1.14:34
predatorfreakawww.14:34
tilmanpredatorfreak-- to restore the universe's balance14:34
treach\o/14:34
predatorfreak@karma predatorfreak14:34
clbpredatorfreak: predatorfreak has neutral karma.14:34
predatorfreakHehehe14:34
treachheh14:34
predatorfreakThe bot loves me!14:34
tilmanokay, the universe obviously doesn't want you to have negative karma14:35
tilmani shall obey the universe's wishes14:35
tilmancould it be that my laptop is so insanely fast that i just don't notice the problem?14:35
predatorfreakI doubt that ;)14:35
predatorfreaktreach: What processor do you have?14:36
predatorfreakI'm wondering if maybe it's specific to dual core processors or something.14:36
predatorfreakSince I've got an Athlon X2 :\14:36
treachathlon xp 2500 @70014:36
tilmani've got a dual core thingie too14:36
predatorfreakMaybe it just H8's AMD?14:36
predatorfreakor maybe it's just magical appears-for-us-but-not-you.14:36
* treach is stuck in the stoneage. :(14:37
tilmanpredatorfreak: did you see the sysklogd diff to confirm your no-forking theory or is it a wild, uninformed guess? :D14:37
predatorfreaktilman: Well, it sits for an eternity.14:37
predatorfreakBut according to treach it EVENTUALLY forks.14:37
tilmansounds stupid14:37
treachahem.. "Long time". ;D14:37
predatorfreaktreach: Same thing for me :P14:37
tilmanrather sounds like 1.5 needs a longer time to do the pre-fork tasks14:38
tilman;)14:38
tilmanbut.14:38
treachlike, 20 min or so.14:38
tilmanpredatorfreak: wanna bring it up on any of the lists?14:38
tilmanit's almost late here and i'm busy watching house right now14:38
tilman;)14:38
tilmanpredatorfreak: thanks for the openssl catch btw, i'll test it soonish14:39
predatorfreaktilman: I suppose.14:39
predatorfreaktilman: Your welcome.14:39
predatorfreakI just happened to do a total system rebuild last night with gcc 4.214:39
treachhaha14:39
predatorfreakand found that everything using svn caused illegal instructions ;)14:39
predatorfreakWoah! Mark Rosenstand is deserting CRUX for Fedora o.O14:40
tilmanold news, i think(?)14:41
predatorfreaktilman: News to me.14:41
tilman;)14:41
treachhe will be sorely missed.14:41
predatorfreakand it brought up my "ARE YOU INSANE?" responses.14:41
treach:>14:41
predatorfreaktreach: We lost him to FEDORA, I mean, how is that possible? O.O14:42
treachwell, that's obvious, right?14:42
tilmanmy money would have been on sourcemage14:42
tilmanit's also source based, and they have cool role names14:42
treachFedora rocks.14:43
treachIf you like to be a guinea-pig.14:43
treachAnd have gnomes on your brain.14:44
predatorfreaktreach: I like to keep guinea pigs.14:44
predatorfreakNot be one ;)14:44
* predatorfreak fixes up rc and attaches to e-mail.14:44
treachwell, I'll stick to keeping cats.14:44
tilmanHAHA14:45
tilmanfrom the changelog:14:45
tilman+   - Improved daemonise routine in klogd to stabilise startup14:45
treachhaha14:45
treach;D14:45
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jjpkInteresting turn of events.14:47
predatorfreaktilman: Beautiful! it's stabilised....... to 20 minutes!14:47
jjpkarch -> crux -> fedora.14:47
predatorfreakand e-mail sent.14:47
treachjjpk: IOW, he was improving, but slipped back into madness.14:47
predatorfreaktreach: Arch isn't total madness, but Fedora sure as hell is.14:48
treachof course.14:48
jjpk*shocked*14:48
treachhaven't you heard that (what do you call it, relapses?) when you get ill again with the same thing as you've had before, you frequently get worse than the first time?14:49
predatorfreakLooking at a diff between sysklogd 1.4.1 and 1.5.14:52
predatorfreakIt adds a nice "sleep(300)" in there.14:52
jjpkI have heard of that possible effect. Pure and simple, it was a big WTF.14:52
predatorfreakSo maybe it's slipping at hitting that instead of doing the proper thing?14:52
jjpkSo far my laptop is working fine with sysklogd 1.5.14:52
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jjpkNothing unusual happened today when I booted.14:53
predatorfreakjjpk: Processor?14:53
predatorfreakI'm beginning to think it might be a bug-on-AMD processors.14:53
tilmanpredatorfreak: want to test a patch?14:53
tilmanhttp://cvs.infodrom.org/sysklogd/klogd.c.diff?r1=1.22;r2=1.2314:53
predatorfreakSince some systems work fine and others don't.14:53
tilmanthis is the stabilise-system-boot (sic) diff14:54
tilmanif you could patch -R this one and see if it helps..?14:54
tilmantreach: or you14:54
treachtilman: out of the question, sorry. :P14:54
tilmanpredatorfreak: i'd say it's pretty damn unlikely that this is cpu specific :D14:54
jjpkpredatorfreak: pentium-m on the laptop.14:54
predatorfreaktilman: Well both me and treach have AMD CPUs.14:55
jjpkThe other machine is working fine as well.14:55
jjpkIt has an amd 2400+.14:55
* predatorfreak shelves that ideaer.14:55
tilmanare you sure it's *20* minutes?14:56
tilman+ sleep(300); exit(1);14:56
treachtilman: no, I might be exaggerating a bit, but it was at least 10 I think.14:56
tilmanif it's 50 minutes, that would be it14:56
tilmaner, 514:56
predatorfreakmmk.14:57
predatorfreakRestarting.14:57
jjpkpredatorfreak: where exactly did the boot hang?14:57
predatorfreaktilman: Let's see if this works.14:57
tilmanpredatorfreak: thanks!14:57
predatorfreakjjpk: when starting klogd.14:57
tilmanpredatorfreak++14:57
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treach@karma predatorfreak14:57
clbtreach: Karma for "predatorfreak" has been increased 1 time and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 1.14:57
tilmanof course, if this fixes it, we're hitting that "something major went wrong" case14:58
tilmanwhich is a bit worrying ;)14:58
treachyeah.14:58
tilmantreach: so i can bump him, but not decrease it? how lame is that14:58
treachI think you can't go negative anymore.14:58
jjpkThere will nevar be negativity, arr.14:59
treach@karma jjpk14:59
clbtreach: Karma for "jjpk" has been increased 1 time and decreased 1 time for a total karma of 0.14:59
treachjjpk--14:59
jjpkw00t, plus minus of nothing \o/14:59
treach@karma jjpk14:59
clbtreach: Karma for "jjpk" has been increased 1 time and decreased 2 times for a total karma of -1.14:59
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treachhaha14:59
treachjjpk++14:59
predatorfreaktilman: klogd just doesn't start now.14:59
jjpk@karma jjpk14:59
clbjjpk: Karma for "jjpk" has been increased 2 times and decreased 2 times for a total karma of 0.14:59
predatorfreak@karma predatorfreak14:59
clbpredatorfreak: Karma for "predatorfreak" has been increased 1 time and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 1.14:59
predatorfreak:315:00
predatorfreakIt never counts my decreased karma!15:00
treachdid you bribe clb?15:00
jjpkweird. clb must have it in for you.15:00
treach@bribe clb15:00
predatorfreak@I'll give you money15:00
tilmanmaybe your nick is too long15:00
jjpkragazza nostra.15:00
predatorfreakAwww.15:00
tilmanpredatorfreak: also, lame.15:01
tilmanpredatorfreak: you didn't mess up the reverse patching, did you? ;D15:01
predatorfreakNope.15:01
predatorfreakI had to remove the first hunk.15:02
predatorfreakBut aside from that, same patch.15:02
predatorfreakAlthough.15:02
predatorfreakThis time it didn't hang :P15:02
RedShiftmotherfscking ubuntu folks15:02
tilmanheh15:02
RedShiftsome guy wants support for "kubuntu feisty"15:02
RedShifthow am I supposed to know what release "kubuntu feisty" is15:02
RedShiftuse the goddamn version number :X15:02
predatorfreakFeisty Fawn I think?15:02
predatorfreakand pfft.15:02
predatorfreakVersion numbers are for old folks!15:03
predatorfreakIn fact.15:03
treachwrong channeL?15:03
predatorfreakCRUX 2.4 should now be CRUX Fancy Flying Pants15:03
treach"Fancy Flying Socks"15:03
RedShift"Don't panic"15:03
predatorfreakRedShift: Taken by Arch :P15:03
jjpk"fancy flying failure"15:04
RedShiftpredatorfreak: yes, that's the humour of it... ;-)15:04
treachjjpk: you're missing the point. ;>15:04
RedShiftthe guy that made up "Don't panic" was probably high15:04
RedShifthow do you come up with that kind of lame name15:04
predatorfreakHuh.15:04
treachhe was actually drunk15:05
tilmandouglas adams reference15:05
tilmaneasy15:05
predatorfreaktilman: klogd just segfaults now :)15:05
predatorfreakThat explains it.15:05
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tilmanpredatorfreak: i think there's other chunks of code that are related to the daemonization15:05
jjpkNo wonder I missed that obscurity.15:05
jjpkNot familiar with douglas adams' works.15:05
treachpredatorfreak: the foreword in the book explains about how he thought up the whole thing.15:05
treach"Obscurity"?15:06
treachpff15:06
treachGeek standard issue, I'd say. :D15:06
predatorfreaktilman: Even weirder.15:06
tilmanjesus motherfucker, yes15:06
tilmanjjpk: go read the hitchhiker's guide to the universe15:06
predatorfreak1.5 klogd when executed with -c 4 -d -n seg faults instantly.15:06
predatorfreakWITHOUT the patch.15:06
treach"galaxy"15:06
tilmanshit15:07
tilmanoh the shame15:07
treach:)15:07
predatorfreakSo, klogd is MASSIVELY borken.15:07
tilmantreach: that's only because i was talking about the universe and balance and that karma crap15:07
treachheh15:07
jjpktilman: that would be little compared to my shameful disrespect of standards :D15:07
RedShiftgoddammed15:07
predatorfreaktreach: What compiler version are you running?15:08
treachnone atm.15:08
predatorfreako.O15:08
RedShiftanother post in a linux support newsgroup: "When using felamimail the sent emails don't end up in the sent items folder"15:08
RedShiftDID YOU EVEN BOTHER TO LOOK AT IT YOURSELF?15:08
treachI had to do some testing, so I'm currently on OpenSUSE.15:08
RedShiftffs15:08
* treach takes cover.15:08
tilmanyeah, you better do15:08
* tilman gets the sticks and the stones ;)15:08
treachow15:08
jjpkThere goes the village agitator. :p15:09
* predatorfreak gets shotgun.15:09
predatorfreakWE GOT US A TRAITOR!15:09
jjpkKeep it up, now to watch the lynch mob.15:09
tilmanhhahahaha, their code says:15:09
tilman  auto int fl;15:09
treachhey. I still have crux on my lappy..15:09
tilmano_O15:09
tilmanhow old is this crap?15:09
RedShifttreach: OpenSUSE?15:10
jjpktreach: besides, it is good to know thy enemy(ies). ;)15:10
RedShiftwhy opensuse15:10
treachRedShift: why not?15:10
RedShifttreach: that's avoiding the question :p15:10
predatorfreaktilman: Okay, 1.4.1 works perfectly.15:10
predatorfreak1.5 is segfault city.15:10
treachit's a solid - some might say massive - dist, with a pretty good kde setup.15:11
tilmanis it safe to run more than one instance of sysklogd at one time?15:11
RedShifttreach: it's a behemoth15:11
treachnot really15:11
predatorfreaktilman: klogd isn't running beyond when I start it.15:11
predatorfreakSo that's not the problem ;)15:11
treachRedShift: it's not nearly as bad as it has been.15:11
predatorfreakThe thing segfaulted on boot and I haven't been able to get it to run without reverting to 1.4.1, so, I've got only one instance running.15:12
RedShifttreach: anything that uses RPM as its package manager is blacklisted by myself15:12
treachyour loss.15:12
tilmanpredatorfreak: i'll look into this shit more closely tomorrow15:12
RedShifttreach: or my win? :o15:12
treachit's a damned sigth better than kubuntu imo.15:12
predatorfreakWell for now I'll stick with klogd 1.4.115:12
treachAnd I'll rather die than use gnome.. so.15:13
jjpkpredatorfreak: have you by chance used aggressive optimization?15:13
predatorfreakjjpk: -march=k8 -O2 -fomit-frame-pointer -pipe is REAL aggressive ;)15:13
treachyeah, sometimes15:13
RedShiftpredatorfreak: what does the -fomit-frame-pointer do15:13
RedShiftI see that alot15:13
treachsome apps doesn't like that you throw away the framepointer.15:13
predatorfreakIt just frees up one register.15:14
predatorfreaktreach: Some apps refuse to build without it.15:14
treachpredatorfreak: see above.15:14
predatorfreake.g. ffmpeg/mplayer.15:14
predatorfreakand I've yet to encounter ANY app that breaks with it.15:14
treachpredatorfreak: yes, and some other, like wmaker builds, but crashes.15:14
RedShifthow exactly does that help performance?15:14
tilmandoes firefox work with -fomit-frame-pointer these days?15:14
treachyes15:14
tilmanRedShift: more registers for other stuff = good15:14
jjpktilman: no clue about that since I use the binary release. :p15:15
treachtilman: that was for you.15:15
tilmanah15:15
predatorfreakBesides.15:16
predatorfreak-march=i686 -O2 -pipe causes the same problem with 1.5.15:16
tilmanjjpk: so 1.5 works nicely for you?15:16
tilmanpredatorfreak: maybe we need to blame gcc 4.2?15:16
predatorfreaktilman: Maybe.15:16
jjpktilman: yeah, business as usual.15:16
predatorfreakBut is yours built with gcc 4.2? :\15:16
tilmanwhy does that fool use k&r in newly written code?15:17
predatorfreaktilman: Because legacy coding is cool :P15:17
treachhe's an *old* fool maybe? :p15:17
predatorfreakTo be honest, I'm thinking about just porting syslog-ng.15:17
predatorfreakand being done with it.15:17
jjpkWell, finding a replacement could be one solution.15:17
jjpkSysklogd strikes me as very conservative.15:18
predatorfreakjjpk: Yeah, it's nice.15:18
jaegerI'd like syslog-ng better anyway15:18
treachjjpk: strictly, no.15:18
predatorfreakBut if it doesn't run.15:18
predatorfreakIt's annoying.15:18
tilmanwe need a short-term solution for 2.3 anyway15:18
treachit's a workaround, not a solution. ;)15:18
predatorfreaktilman: True.15:18
tilmanfeel free to suggest syslog-ng for 2.4 though15:18
tilmanor 2.5 ;)15:18
predatorfreaktilman: I'll get on with porting it.15:18
predatorfreakand hacking away the sysklogd bits in the init scripts.15:19
jjpkNothing says old school like 2001 march to 2007 july before a new release is made. ;)15:19
predatorfreakLooks like I need to port eventlog and syslog-ng :(15:22
predatorfreakThere goes my lazy-time.15:22
jjpkThat tends to happen you you tweak your systems.15:29
jjpkSome people don't have that need and will settle for something more automated.15:29
treach*shrug* either you mess with your system because you broke something, or you mess with it because someone else is braindead.15:31
predatorfreakirk syslog-ng needs glib2.15:31
treachjjpk: like suse, for instance. Today I found out that you can't just pop in a cd as a normal user and have it automounted etc.15:32
treachsome stupid "security policy" getting in the way.15:32
RedShifttreach: heh... sounds like windows vista15:32
predatorfreakTo be honest, I think syslog-ng in opt would be fine, but syslog-ng in core wouldn't.15:32
treachnow, how hard would that have been to catch..15:32
predatorfreakSince glib would need to be moved to core for one port.15:33
jjpk"this is a classified function, you do not have the security clearing to continue" lol15:33
tilmanpredatorfreak: yeah, that would a suck a bit15:33
predatorfreaktilman: syslog-ng also needs logrotate for logrotation <_<15:33
treachjjpk: it's a two word fix in a dbus config file..15:33
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treachbut good luck to aunt tillie getting that fixed.15:34
predatorfreaktilman: I hereby retract syslog-ng as viable for core.15:34
treachpredatorfreak: sure it doesn't need rh to work, when all is said and done? :p15:35
predatorfreaktreach: Pretty much :P15:35
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jjpktreach: suse must be patronizing the user. :D15:35
predatorfreakAssuming metalog isn't too depend heavy that might be viable though.15:35
predatorfreak... well it needs libpcre.15:35
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treachjjpk: not really, but it's a completely retarded mistake15:35
predatorfreakBut aside from that.15:35
predatorfreakIt seems fine :\15:36
jjpktreach: agreed.15:36
jjpkMistakes happen, but damn.15:36
treachsomeone should get slapped for it.15:36
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predatorfreakYeah metalog is definitely viable :315:37
treachfirst you make a dist that is pretty much perfect for newbies, and then you make stupid configuration decisions that makes it unsable.15:37
treach"unusable"15:38
underdog5004when I boot crux, after the bios screen, it just shows a black screen with a _ in the top left corner. I'm running crux 2.3 in Virtualbox. I installed with the method used in http://crux.nu/Main/Handbook2-3. When I boot from the CD and do CRUX root=/dev/hda1, it boots nicely, leading me to think it's a lilo problem. Any ideas?15:39
treachfix your lilo.conf?15:39
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underdog5004h/o, let me paste it...I'm more used to grub, so I may have it done wrong.15:39
treachahem.15:40
treachdon't paste it here.15:40
treachuse the pastebin15:40
underdog5004yeah, I know.15:40
treachhowever, if you prefer grub, it's on the iso, as well as in the ports15:40
RedShiftunderdog5004: why not use grub?15:40
treachk, I wish everyone did.15:41
underdog5004oh, I didn't realize it was on the iso!15:41
treach:)15:41
underdog5004in the guide, it made grub out to be some hacky patched up thing15:41
thrice`almost all grub packages are that way ;)15:41
tilmani guess that's mostly so you don't sue us inn case it doesn't work15:41
underdog5004lol15:41
underdog5004h/o, copying15:41
tilmansue/yell/scream/raise hell :)15:41
treachtilman: isn't that what you're here to deal with? like "+b" ;)15:42
thrice`where does it say maro is going to fedora?15:42
tilmani'm here for bad jokes and swearing15:42
treach"You have problems, GTH!" ;D15:43
underdog5004http://pastebin.org/168115:43
Jason5876boot=/dev/hda, not boot=/dev/hda115:44
underdog5004h/o, just looked at the lilo.conf man page...I think I see the problem15:44
underdog5004yeah, that's it, ha ha15:44
underdog5004sorry to waste your time15:44
predatorfreakI'm going to need a VERY tweaked metalog setup...15:44
underdog5004thank you for your time!15:45
marohuh?15:45
marogoing to fedora?15:45
predatorfreakirk this thing isn't viable either.15:45
predatorfreakBloody thing only dumps logs into directories <_<15:46
treachhaha, new resurrection method; suggest the subject is switching to fedora. :P15:47
* predatorfreak sticks with sysklogd.15:48
underdog5004do I need to have an initrd specified in the lilo.conf?15:48
predatorfreakNo.15:48
underdog5004ok, thanks15:48
predatorfreakOnly if your kernel is built to use one.15:48
underdog5004is that common?15:48
treachdepends on what you mean15:49
predatorfreakOnly if you use a binary distro ;)15:49
treachfor crux, probably not.15:49
underdog5004I just compiled the kernel with the stock .config, I just wanted to get everything up, get familiar, then start tweaking...15:49
predatorfreakUhh.15:50
predatorfreakWhat exactly is a stock .config on CRUX?15:50
treacher, you should probably make sure that config works with your system first.15:50
treachthere is no "stock" config, afaik.15:50
underdog5004oh15:50
underdog5004I figured there would be no problems with the basic .config supplied, as I'm running in a VM...15:50
highlyjhihey, i've attempted to install thunderbird from opt but it get this error:15:51
highlyjhi------15:51
highlyjhi./../util/nsUCConstructors.h:42: internal compiler error: Segmentation fault15:51
highlyjhiPlease submit a full bug report,15:51
highlyjhiwith preprocessed source if appropriate.15:51
highlyjhiSee <URL:http://gcc.gnu.org/bugs.html> for instructions.15:51
highlyjhimake[5]: *** [nsCP852ToUnicode.o] Error 115:51
highlyjhimake[5]: Leaving directory `/usr/ports/opt/thunderbird/work/src/mozilla/intl/uconv/ucvibm'15:51
highlyjhimake[4]: *** [libs] Error 215:51
treachstop.15:51
highlyjhimake[4]: Leaving directory `/usr/ports/opt/thunderbird/work/src/mozilla/intl/uconv'15:51
highlyjhimake[3]: *** [libs] Error 215:51
highlyjhimake[3]: Leaving directory `/usr/ports/opt/thunderbird/work/src/mozilla/intl'15:51
highlyjhimake[2]: *** [tier_9] Error 215:51
highlyjhimake[2]: Leaving directory `/usr/ports/opt/thunderbird/work/src/mozilla'15:51
treachSTOP!15:51
highlyjhimake[1]: *** [default] Error 215:51
highlyjhimake[1]: Leaving directory `/usr/ports/opt/thunderbird/work/src/mozilla'15:51
highlyjhimake: *** [build] Error 215:51
treachPASTEBIN YOU IDIOT15:51
predatorfreakJesus Christ man.15:51
* underdog5004 sighs15:51
predatorfreaktreach: SECONDED!15:51
predatorfreakhighlyjhi: anyway.15:51
predatorfreakYour compiler failed.15:51
predatorfreakand died.15:52
predatorfreakMake sure it's not built with ricery CFLAGS.15:52
* underdog5004 reinstalls and _looks_ at menuconfig this time15:52
treachunderdog5004: stop15:52
treachyou don't need to reinstall15:53
treachjust boot up on the cd again and chroot, then fix your config15:53
predatorfreakoh and.15:53
predatorfreakdon't forget to rerun lilo ;)15:53
treachright. :)15:54
tilmanunderdog5004: you can use the cd's kernel config as the basis15:54
tilmanit's got *lot* of stuff you won't need thoug15:54
highlyjhisorry about the paste ... i sent it as one big message ... i didn't know line breaks sent a new message every time ... care to explain what pastebin is? anyways, predatorfreak, what do you mean by ricery CFLAGS?15:54
treachpastebin, see topic15:54
tilmanricery cflags are cflags that aren't safe15:55
treachricey as in riced out cars.15:55
tilmansafe cflags -> http://gentoo-wiki.com/Safe_Cflags15:55
predatorfreakor alternative safe CFLAGS on CRUX.15:55
predatorfreak-march=i686 -O2 -pipe :P15:55
underdog5004tilman, that's what I had before...15:55
underdog5004treach, lol, ok15:55
tilmanunderdog5004: heh, i missed your problem description in the noise15:56
treachhighlyjhi: chances are that you have bad ram.15:56
underdog5004tilman, np...fixing now15:56
underdog5004I'm booting from the cd and doing CRUX root=/dev/hda1 to get into my installation15:56
treachhighlyjhi: maybe you should try running memtest15:56
tilmanhighlyjhi: how much ram do you have?15:56
highlyjhii have a gig15:56
tilmanokay, i have seen g++ dieing with scary errors when it just ran out of memory15:57
tilmanbut a gig should suffice15:57
highlyjhii would hope so! and thanks. im little confused about having bad CFLAGS b/c everything is stock.15:58
underdog5004YES!!!15:59
underdog5004I forgot to run lilo after I changed /etc/lilo.conf15:59
predatorfreakhighlyjhi: A lot of people fuck up their compilers by trying to build with with -O3 -march=OMGOPTIMZED -fomit-frame-pointer -ffast-math -OMGOPTIMIZED (more or less :P)15:59
treachhighlyjhi: as I said, I think you should run memtest15:59
underdog5004The system is coming up. Please wait15:59
underdog5004thanks everyone!15:59
treachnp15:59
tilmanunderdog5004: that's why i like grub15:59
tilmanyou cannot b0rk the system because you forgot to re-program the MBR15:59
predatorfreaktilman: GRUB users unite!15:59
underdog5004me too...seems nice and easy compared to lilo15:59
tilman:)15:59
mxqtilman: where can i find cd kernel .config?16:00
tilmanhighlyjhi: btw, you probably shouldn't irc/run pidgin(?) as root16:00
underdog5004haha, X is up and...oh, no...wait a sec...16:01
tilmanmxq: /crux/kernel/linux-*.config16:01
highlyjhiyea...im working on getting an account all set up...im still new to linux and haven't gotten that far yet16:02
mxqof course, that was stupid question16:02
predatorfreak... Aww crap I just realised I forgot to add -msse3 when I rebuilt my system.16:02
treachsave yourself the trouble with thunderbird, just get mutt instead. :P16:02
predatorfreakAh well.16:02
predatorfreakI guess GCC can deal with only using SSE2.16:02
treachat least it builds a lot faster. :D16:03
predatorfreakor if you like fancy GUIs.16:03
predatorfreakclaws-mail.16:03
tilmansylpheed is such a pita16:03
treachplain sylpheed worked well enough when I used it.16:03
predatorfreakIt works just as well as thunderbird, is less bloated and has better features :316:03
tilmani hated it16:03
predatorfreakPlain sylpheed is too dang featureless :(16:03
treachlike, what are you missing?16:04
predatorfreakPlus it took hacks to make it work with non-SMIME encrypted e-mails.16:04
predatorfreaktreach: Mainly the hacky GPG handlaring, lack of spell check and other features I commonly use.16:05
highlyjhiwell...i am open to suggestions16:05
highlyjhii'll try them out16:05
predatorfreakhighlyjhi: Only use mutt if you like terminals, A LOT :P16:05
treachheh, I'd say anything that doesn't make you chew on 35MB source code is an improvement.16:05
tilmanif he's new to linux, he probably won't like it a lot ;)16:05
predatorfreaktreach: I agree :)16:05
tilmanneed sleep16:05
underdog5004when I upgrade my kernel, will I have to rebuild everything on my system?16:06
tilmannighty16:06
treachnigthy16:06
tilmanunderdog5004: haha, no16:06
predatorfreaktilman: Night.16:06
predatorfreakunderdog5004: If it worked like that.16:06
underdog5004ok, cause I think that was a concern for me with gentoo16:06
predatorfreakEvery couple days I'd be rebuilding my entire system.16:06
underdog5004lol16:06
treachhaha16:06
predatorfreakI go through kernels on an almost daily basis :)16:07
underdog5004why?16:07
predatorfreakunderdog5004: I mess around with patches.16:07
underdog5004ah16:07
underdog5004I just tried the -ck patch...didn't seem to help too much16:07
treachbig ass "recompile everything" parties are usually just triggered by glibc updates.16:07
predatorfreakI've been using stuff from -ck forever now.16:08
predatorfreakand it always feels pretty good here.16:08
predatorfreakbetter than mainline, that's for sure.16:08
predatorfreakEspecially under heavy load.16:08
* treach uses Hz 100, noticks, and no preemption16:08
RedShiftno preemption?16:09
treachno.16:09
predatorfreakCurrent mainline bogs down to a stand-still with a couple of compiles running and a video playing.16:09
underdog5004How can I get the X11R7 ports with rsync?16:09
RedShiftmy philosophic tought about preemption is that every kernel should have one16:09
treachunderdog5004: get the xorg ports.16:09
RedShifthave it, I mean16:09
predatorfreaktreach: preempt actually helps on desktop systems.16:09
underdog5004I'm used to apt-get...the equivalent is...pkgadd?16:09
underdog5004or at least, pkg*?16:09
RedShiftunderdog5004: RTFM16:09
treachand actually, I don't care that much about interactivity.16:09
predatorfreakand I've been using dynticks + preempt + 1000 HZ forever now.16:10
underdog5004RedShift, alrighty16:10
predatorfreaktreach: Well, you love terminals, not fancy GUIs :P16:10
predatorfreakWhen you love fancy GUIs, interactivity is real nice.16:10
treachpredatorfreak: 1000Hz gains you nothing, except a whole bunch of contextswitches for no good.16:10
treachpredatorfreak: yeah. :D16:10
predatorfreaktreach: Not really, 1000Hz is SUPPOSEDLY better for multimedia.16:11
predatorfreakThen again.16:11
treacheven though I'm having something of a mental vacation right now..16:11
predatorfreakI'd need to test that.16:11
RedShiftI wonder if there are any benchmarks to prove that 100Hz <-> 1000 Hz16:11
treachwell16:11
predatorfreakRedShift: There aren't.16:11
RedShift1000 Hz should be better for multi tasking16:11
predatorfreakand I bet real world difference in encoding or something.16:11
predatorfreakWould be like 0.5FPS.16:11
RedShiftbut 100 Hz is better for single application throughput16:11
predatorfreak100HZ triggers less interrupts without dynticks though.16:12
treachpredatorfreak: you'll notice a difference no question about it. but I think 1kHz is overdoing it, quite a lot.16:12
predatorfreakLeading to better battery life.16:12
treachyeah16:12
RedShiftwhat's the kernel default these days, 250 Hz?16:12
predatorfreakThen again.16:12
treachRedShift: I think so.16:12
predatorfreakI suggest folks just use like 250 or whatever the 300something one is.16:12
predatorfreakand dynticks.16:12
predatorfreakIt'll probably equal about the same battery life.16:13
RedShiftI wonder at what rate the windows kernel tick16:13
RedShifts16:13
treach100 iirc16:13
predatorfreakWhoops I stand corrected.16:13
predatorfreakMy kernel build is 300Hz tick rate16:13
treachheh, sounds a lot saner.16:13
treach:D16:13
predatorfreakI bet I only trigger like 100 interrupts per sec on this system though.16:14
predatorfreakand most of those are probably bloody dbus.16:14
predatorfreakPOS tick monster.16:14
treachmmh. DE's ftl16:15
predatorfreaktreach: I'm not using a DE.16:15
treachoh.16:15
predatorfreakBut I'm kinda stuck with dbus for certain apps using it or HAL.16:15
treachok.16:15
RedShiftaren't there some patches for a tickless kernel?16:15
predatorfreakWhy they can't just use fucking normal libraries I do not know.16:15
treachpatches?16:15
predatorfreakRedShift: It's mainline.16:15
predatorfreakwith .21 I think.16:15
treachyeah16:15
predatorfreakand it's TECHNICALLY not tick-less.16:16
predatorfreakSince the tick rate still governs the maximum ticks it can do.16:16
treachbtw, if you're using a radeon card on a laptop, I seriously suggest you stay out of X if you can.16:16
highlyjhiso i pkgmk'd claws-mail and i got about two dozen footprint mismatch's16:16
treachhighlyjhi: read the faq16:17
highlyjhiok thank16:17
highlyjhiyou16:17
treachnp16:17
RedShiftpredatorfreak: what's the advantages over a tick kernel?16:17
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predatorfreakRedShift: Better battery life on laptops, less power draw period on desktops.16:17
predatorfreakBecause it triggers less interrupts.16:17
treachit wastes less time doing nothing16:17
predatorfreakand lets the CPU idle longer.16:17
RedShiftso that's it?16:17
underdog5004I may be a little thick, but stick with me here. What is the point of having to write all the .conf files yourself? Why not just have relatively safe values added, and then have the option of changing them later?16:18
RedShiftno better performance?16:18
predatorfreakRedShift: It adds up.16:18
predatorfreakI've seen like 20-30 minutes of battery life from it.16:18
predatorfreakRedShift: It's not about performance, it's about battery life.16:18
RedShiftah16:18
* RedShift wants more performance ^_^16:18
RedShiftI don't care about power16:18
treachunderdog5004: because what's sane ofr someone might be insane for someone else.16:18
thrice`underdog5004: there are.  for example, /etc/fstab is define well, but everything is commented16:18
RedShiftI want POWERRRRR16:18
predatorfreakeven on a desktop it's nice for drawing less power.16:18
treachs/ofr/for16:18
predatorfreakLowering your energy bill is good :)16:18
RedShiftI mean, PERFORRRRRMANCE16:18
predatorfreakRedShift: Go back to #gentoo.16:19
treachhaha16:19
treachpredatorfreak: you beat me to it. :P16:19
predatorfreaktreach: :)16:19
RedShiftpredatorfreak: /me doesn't care about the energy bill, in fact, they should build some more nuclear power plants16:19
underdog5004ok, that makes sense.16:19
RedShiftpredatorfreak: I'm talking about sane ways to increase performance :P16:19
predatorfreakRedShift: Obviously you don't pay for it then ;)16:19
RedShiftpredatorfreak: yes I pay for it16:19
RedShiftalot16:19
RedShift20 euro/amp :-(16:20
predatorfreakA couple more bucks in my pocket every month is a good thing.16:20
treachpredatorfreak: also he doesn't pay for getting rid of the heat, presumeably.16:20
treachand I guess he carries hearing protection16:20
predatorfreakHehe.16:20
RedShifttreach: and I also pay for that...16:20
predatorfreaktreach: Quieter and cooler systems is a nice side-effects of a tickless system with cpufreq enabled :)16:20
predatorfreakside-effect*16:21
treachwell, cheap hearing protection usually makes it hard to use a keyboard at the same time.16:21
treachpredatorfreak: yeah I know.16:21
treachthat's why I'm running this box at 700MHz.16:21
treachI hate the fans.16:21
predatorfreakAlthough newer processors are even better :)16:21
treachI know, saving up for an upgrade. :)16:22
predatorfreaka decent 65nm processor at like 1GHz for normal stuff can run REALLY cool.16:22
RedShifttreach: you don't have to hate fans... temperature controlled fans :-)16:22
treachyes I have.16:22
treachwhat do you think I have?16:23
RedShifttreach: some 6000 RPM monster?16:23
predatorfreakRedShift: Fans can still be loud.16:23
treachIf I didn't have temperature controlled fans, what would be the point in downclocking..=16:23
treachs =/?/16:23
RedShiftyou know, the ones that make you go deaf after a while? ^_^16:23
rehabdollmy harddrives are whats driving me mad, not my fans16:23
predatorfreakPlus I doubt treach can buy a heatsink for his CPU anymore.16:23
treachthey don't have to make you deaf.16:23
RedShiftI even have some 8000 RPM 6 CM fans here16:23
underdog5004you know, this venture with crux has made me realize something: I don't want to be a poweruser. I don't want to recompile my kernel with the latest patches, or do package dependency by hand. I don't want to edit 50+ config files to get my computer working the way I like. I want stuff to just work, and to allow to get into an environment where I'm comfy, and then I'll go back and reconfigure and tweak stuff. Thanks, everyo16:23
underdog5004ne, for your help...I may be back, but it's unlikely.16:23
treachthey just get tireing after a while16:24
treachunderdog5004: sure.16:24
rehabdoll800rpm 120mm ftw16:24
treacheveryone to their own.16:24
RedShiftunderdog5004: maybe give www.archlinux.org a try16:24
* RedShift ducks16:24
rehabdoll:p16:24
underdog5004ok16:24
predatorfreakunderdog5004: Go back to #ubuntu :P16:24
predatorfreakand redshift is messing with you.16:24
predatorfreakif CRUX isn't for you.16:24
predatorfreakArch isn't either.16:24
RedShiftno I'm not16:24
predatorfreakIt's just CRUX with worse package maintainers and binaries.16:25
mxqwhy in arch you dont need to compile jkernel16:25
RedShiftpredatorfreak: arch may be more balanced for him16:25
predatorfreakmxq: Sure you don't.16:25
predatorfreakBut you still need to edit config files.16:25
predatorfreakand make shit work.16:25
RedShiftpredatorfreak: it's not crux, but it does have some pretty bad package maintainers :-(16:25
underdog5004nah, I don't care. I've got kubuntu where I like it...it runs fast enough for me...I don't know...16:25
RedShiftunderdog5004: give archlinux a try please :p16:26
predatorfreakIt doesn't just come out of the freaking box perfectly tuned.16:26
predatorfreakIt's not bloody Ubuntu.16:26
RedShiftunderdog5004: ignore what the others are saying, just give it a try16:26
predatorfreakIt's a binary CRUX.16:26
treachunderdog5004: if you're happy with kubuntu, I suggest you stick with it.16:26
predatorfreakRedShift: Stop pushing your favourite distro.16:26
underdog5004it all comes down to personal choice, imho16:26
treachyeah16:26
predatorfreakotherwise I'll just be like "RedShift, try CRUX" :P16:26
RedShiftpredatorfreak: I'm not pushing anything, I'm just saying he should give it a try16:26
underdog5004have a good day, everyone16:26
treachsame16:26
predatorfreakunderdog5004: Bye.16:27
predatorfreakRedShift: You're pushing Arch.16:27
treachin #crux...16:27
predatorfreakTrying Arch when he doesn't like CRUX is pointless.16:27
treachhe should be flayed. :p16:27
predatorfreakIt's going to be the exact same experience, only with binaries :P16:27
RedShiftpredatorfreak: how do you know... he hasn't tried it16:27
predatorfreakRedShift: ... Because I have?16:27
predatorfreakand I know what Arch is like.16:27
predatorfreakIt's basically CRUX with moron package maintainers, binaries and excessive complexity abound.16:28
treachit's light in the automagic departement as well.16:28
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RedShiftpredatorfreak: there are still some major differences, and maybe underdog5004 will appreciate those16:28
predatorfreakRedShift: Yeah.16:28
mxqim willing to try CRUX but setting the kernel is killing me16:28
predatorfreakReplace prt-get with pacman.16:28
RedShiftpredatorfreak: why don't you just let him try it16:28
treachmxq: only the first time.16:28
predatorfreakRedShift: ... Read what he said.16:28
predatorfreakHe doesn't want a distro that requires tons of hand configing.16:29
treachmxq: then you save that .config file.16:29
predatorfreakThat's practically the definition of Arch.16:29
RedShiftpredatorfreak: yeah so... arch doesn't require tons of hand configing16:29
predatorfreak.....16:29
thrice`yeah, you only have to figure the kernel out once, then you're set :)16:29
predatorfreakRedShift: What do you use, GNOME?16:29
RedShiftpredatorfreak: KDE16:29
predatorfreakYeah, that explains a bit.16:29
treachoh? where's YAST for arch?16:30
predatorfreakA lot of shit is wrapped in KDE.16:30
RedShiftI've used gnome for a very long time16:30
predatorfreakBut initial setup in Arch is just like setting up CRUX or Slackware.16:30
predatorfreakIt's a lot of vim :)16:30
RedShiftuntill it made me puke and pull out my hair on stupid things16:30
thrice`oh yeah, treach is on opensuse :<16:30
treachthrice`: only for the moment.16:30
RedShiftI tried out KDE one day "oh what the hell" and never looked back16:30
treachthrice`: please don't give up on me yet. :D16:31
predatorfreakRedShift: I've tried GNOME, KDE and XFCE.16:31
predatorfreakand I said.16:31
predatorfreak"Fuck this shit"16:31
predatorfreakevery time.16:31
thrice`treach: don't need to - rpm will do the job :)16:31
treachhaha16:31
RedShiftpredatorfreak: tried xfce too, still uses GTK, gtk sucks :-)16:31
treachwe'll see about that.16:31
predatorfreakRedShift: QT3 sucks as much as GTK.16:31
predatorfreakIt's only QT4 that actually delivers something RESEMBLING a sane toolkit on Linux.16:32
marowhy does gtk suck?16:32
predatorfreakand well FLTK2, but no one uses FLTK2.16:32
RedShiftpredatorfreak: well obviously you haven't compared gtk to qt then16:32
treachmaro: ask tilman :>16:32
RedShiftmaro: tons of reasons16:32
predatorfreakRedShift: I doubt you've done a code-comparison either.16:32
RedShiftpredatorfreak: hey, QT is pretty clean in its code16:32
RedShiftand so is KDE16:32
predatorfreakThe fact is QT3 is just as horribly giant, buggy and slow in places.16:32
treachpredatorfreak: ahem..16:33
predatorfreakRedShift: I supposed QT3 is so clean that they don't need a bloody UI wrapper?16:33
treachqt isn't that big, actually.16:33
RedShiftpredatorfreak: still better than GTK... which is slow *everywhere*16:33
predatorfreakKDE requires a bloody wrapper for shit that GTK does natively.16:33
predatorfreakand to be honest, both seem about comparable in speed to me.16:33
predatorfreakUnless you use one of those fancy ass cairo GTK engines.16:34
predatorfreakWhere glitz slows them down to a fucking crawl at 1GHz <_<16:34
predatorfreakAnyway, enough flame fest.16:34
thrice`lol16:34
predatorfreakMy flame thrower is out of gasoline.16:34
treachpredatorfreak: if gtk does things natively that qt apps needs wrappers for, why is it that generally speaking gtk apps needs a ton of libs, when qt apps usually doesn't?16:35
RedShiftnice one treach16:35
predatorfreaktreach: It depends on what the lib is for.16:35
treachof course.16:35
RedShiftbut treach, I have to disagree with you there. Alot of QT apps require KDE libs16:35
treachwell.16:36
predatorfreakand 99% of QT apps require the base kdelibs.16:36
treachyou're putting the horse before the cart, or something16:36
predatorfreakand those provide well... just about everything that most GTK apps would need to do.16:36
RedShiftkioslaves are great16:36
predatorfreakQT as a plain toolkit has very few apps.16:36
RedShiftgnome may have gnomevfs, but it still can't beat kioslave16:36
predatorfreakQT wrapped through KDE has a ton of apps.16:36
predatorfreakRedShift: I don't need either.16:37
RedShiftpredatorfreak: well I do16:37
predatorfreakI just use a dang terminal for file management.16:37
RedShiftediting files over ftp, ssh, etc... is just way to cool to give up16:37
predatorfreakGood ol' rm, chmod, mv, scp, cp, etc.16:37
predatorfreakRedShift: ssh -l predatorfreak server16:37
predatorfreakvim shit16:37
treachpredatorfreak: it's about workflow16:37
RedShiftpredatorfreak: I'd like to see you do that with ftp16:38
predatorfreakRedShift: I don't use FTP.16:38
predatorfreakThe glory of having your own server.16:38
predatorfreakYou don't NEED to work via FTP.16:38
treachyou can just "open file" in kate or something, and do the same, no matter where the file is.16:38
RedShifttreach: exactly... loving it :D16:38
predatorfreaktreach: sshfs, if I really needed that.16:38
predatorfreakand I don't.16:38
RedShiftpredatorfreak: well, then I must tell you the glory of having your own serverS16:39
predatorfreakI don't fuck around on my server enough for it to matter.16:39
treachpredatorfreak: I know, that's  why I said it's about workflow.16:39
RedShift*my own16:39
treachpredatorfreak: I don't need it either, but I still think it's nifty as hell16:39
RedShiftand so begins the discussion on genital size16:39
predatorfreakRedShift: My balls are bigger than yours.16:39
treachand gnome is just 10 years behind with that stuff.16:39
predatorfreaktreach: GNOME is crap and I know it.16:40
predatorfreakI can't bring myself to use the dang thing or ANY of its apps.16:40
predatorfreakAt least KDE has one good app, k3b.16:40
RedShifttreach: what annoyed me the most about gnome was the keyboardability... it doesn't exist in the gnome world16:40
treachhehe, I didn't say you loved it.16:40
treach^ for predatorfreak16:40
predatorfreakI mean, I could USE KDE, but, I prefer my openbox setup.16:40
predatorfreakand apps NOT bound to GNOME/KDE.16:41
predatorfreakSadly, there's no decent CD burning app that's not bound to either.16:41
predatorfreakSince Graveman is total shit now.16:41
jaegercdrecord, woo16:41
predatorfreakBugs galore.16:41
treachwhat? You mean wodim isn't good enough?16:41
predatorfreakjaeger: Too lazy :P16:41
predatorfreaktreach: A billion wrapper scripts to automate stuff isn't fun.16:41
predatorfreakRedShift: Why did you just CTCP VERSION me?16:42
treachhehe16:42
RedShiftpredatorfreak: just checking out16:42
RedShiftI had guy once complaining the shit out of windows16:42
* treach ponders ctcp:ing predatorfreak just for the hell of it16:42
RedShifthe was running mirc...16:42
predatorfreaktreach: I do have one script though, a custom-brewed cd copying script.16:42
predatorfreakor audio-cd-burning script.16:43
predatorfreakDepending on how it's used.16:43
treachRedShift: maybe he ran it in wine. :P16:43
RedShifttreach: no he didn't :p16:43
predatorfreakWhich is going to "securely" extract a CD.16:43
predatorfreakand then burn it.16:43
predatorfreakBecause I dislike k3b's audio CD copying.16:43
predatorfreakIt's produced coasters for me <_<16:43
predatorfreakPlus, it's also convenient as hell to do cd music/Band/Album; burnaudiocd *.ogg16:44
predatorfreakand reproduce an album without having to grab the original.16:44
predatorfreak...16:44
predatorfreakRedShift: If you keep that up.16:44
predatorfreakI'm going to ignore CTCP from you.16:45
treachooh.16:45
RedShiftpredatorfreak: I'm shaking16:45
RedShiftno really16:45
treachthat sounds scary16:45
RedShiftI'm shaking16:45
treach:)16:45
RedShiftit's cold in here :-)16:45
predatorfreakAw shit.16:45
predatorfreakI forgot how to use CTCP.16:45
predatorfreakand sent CTCP predatorfreak to version.16:45
predatorfreakOops.16:45
* onestep is away: Gone away for now.16:46
RedShiftlol16:46
*** onestep is now known as one|away16:46
treachlol16:46
RedShiftSysinfo for 'polaris.local': Linux 2.6.22-ck running KDE 3.5.7, CPU: AMD Sempron 3300+ at 1999 MHz (4002 bogomips), HD: 11/23GB, RAM: 965/1011MB, 82 proc's, 15.6h up16:46
predatorfreakAw, RedShift isn't responding to my CTCP :(16:46
RedShiftpredatorfreak: what do you want to know?16:47
one|awayRedShift: Konversation?.. :)16:47
one|awaySysinfo for 'onestep-box': Linux 2.6.21-ARCH running KDE 3.5.7, CPU: AMD Athlon 64 3200+ at 2009 MHz (4021 bogomips), HD: 122/127GB, RAM: 703/1003MB, 95 proc's, 1.14h up16:47
RedShiftone|away: jup16:47
predatorfreakRedShift: You just answered it :P16:47
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predatorfreakhttp://kerneltrap.org/Linux/Discussing_the_Really_Fair_Scheduler16:48
predatorfreakAhh the CPU scheduler.16:48
predatorfreakThe kernel version of "vi versus emacs"16:48
one|awayRedShift: what to you think about CFS?16:48
one|awayI see you use SD... :)16:48
RedShiftone|away: CFS, SD?16:48
predatorfreakone|away: I use CFS here, it runs fine, better than mainline, feels fine.16:48
RedShiftI'm not following16:48
one|awayhehe, predatorfreak was first :)16:48
one|awaypredatorfreak: okay. I heard that it will be included in 2.6.23?..16:49
predatorfreakone|away: I rape kernels for fun, so, I know what each is ;)16:49
predatorfreakLinux predatorbox 2.6.22-dark5 #3 SMP PREEMPT Mon Aug 27 09:01:00 EDT 2007 i686 athlon-4 i386 GNU/Linux16:49
predatorfreakone|away: Yeah, CFS is due for .2316:49
treachLinux thing 2.6.18.8-0.5-default #1 SMP Fri Jun 22 12:17:53 UTC 2007 i686 athlon i386 GNU/Linux16:49
treach\o/16:49
predatorfreaktreach: JESUS CHRIST MAN!16:49
RedShiftLinux polaris.local 2.6.22-ck #1 SMP PREEMPT Fri Aug 10 18:34:41 IST 2007 i686 AMD Sempron(tm) Processor 3300+ AuthenticAMD GNU/Linux16:50
RedShiftI have the longest16:50
RedShiftI win16:50
RedShift:P16:50
one|away:)16:50
predatorfreakRedShift: This is not a penis size comparison.16:50
one|awaylet's compare our pings to localhost.localdomain?.. ;)16:50
RedShiftpredatorfreak: no, it's a uname -a size comparison16:50
predatorfreakRedShift: Same thing!16:50
predatorfreakThat's e-penis!16:50
RedShift64 bytes from localhost.local (127.0.0.1): icmp_seq=1 ttl=64 time=0.023 ms16:50
one|away64 bytes from localhost.localdomain (127.0.0.1): icmp_seq=2 ttl=64 time=0.029 ms16:51
one|away:(16:51
predatorfreakaw your box can do nothing faster!16:51
RedShiftok bogomips now16:51
RedShiftshould I use this PC or one of my dual core xeons? :-)16:52
* RedShift ducks16:52
predatorfreak4626.1816:52
predatorfreakeven though bogomips don't mean shit.16:52
* one|away gonna patch kernel to multiply bogomips by 1000...16:52
treachbogomips        : 3083.2516:52
RedShiftpredatorfreak: ya, that's why they are called BOGOmips16:52
one|awayyou can see my current bogomips above ^__^16:52
treachwheee. :P16:52
predatorfreaktreach: My bogo-penis is bigger than yours :P16:53
one|awayhehe16:53
RedShiftSystem Bogomips8781.1116:53
RedShiftproof? http://lcpbak.opengate.be/phpsysinfo/16:53
RedShift^_^16:53
predatorfreakRedShift: On what?16:53
predatorfreakA giant penis machine?16:53
RedShiftpredatorfreak: dual core machine... phpsysinfo counts both processors together16:53
predatorfreakoh.16:54
RedShiftso technically it's cheating ^_^16:54
predatorfreak(standard_in) 1: parse error16:54
treachpredatorfreak: are you running it on an essentially 6 years old computer clocked at 700MHz? =)16:54
predatorfreakBlarg BC.16:54
predatorfreak9252.3616:54
predatorfreakRedShift: There.16:54
predatorfreakCounting my dual-core-cheats.16:54
predatorfreakSTILL THE LARGEST BOGO-PENIS IN TOWN!16:55
RedShiftok storage capacity now16:55
one|awaybe aware of predatorfreak's bogopenis!16:55
predatorfreaktreach: Nope, but I think I could donate to the "Treach needs a new CPU" fundation.16:55
RedShiftwho has 15k rpm disks?16:55
predatorfreakNASA?16:55
RedShiftpredatorfreak: probably16:55
treachpredatorfreak: don't bother, a new cpu is cheap.16:56
predatorfreaktreach: How about the "Treach needs a new system" fund? :P16:56
predatorfreak-fundation +foundation16:56
treachI'd be fine with something in the sub $150 range16:56
predatorfreaktreach: For a whole system? o.O16:56
treachfor the cpu, that is ;)16:57
* RedShift zzz16:57
predatorfreakRedShift: Sleep in #archlinux!16:57
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predatorfreakor offline.16:57
treachheh16:57
predatorfreaktreach: Well now we need someone else to pimp Arch.16:58
treachdid some estimations, looks like I only need to find like $500 in lose change someplace to get something quite decent.16:58
predatorfreaktreach: 300 in loose change would get you a monstar compared to an Athlon at 700MHz :P16:59
treachof course, but I need a new chassie as well.16:59
predatorfreaktreach: Get some quiet fans too :)17:00
predatorfreakThat way you don't need to downclock.17:00
treachyeah, but well, you know they do that automatically anyway.17:01
predatorfreaktreach: quiet fans or downclocking? :P17:02
treachdownclocking.17:02
predatorfreakSure, but only with cpufreq.17:02
treachno, cool'n quiet doesn't rely on that iirc.17:03
treachbut even if it does, so what?17:03
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predatorfreakJesus Christ!17:18
predatorfreakxscreensaver makes X crash!17:18
treachwell, that *should* spare the screen, right?17:18
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predatorfreaktreach: I guess.17:19
mxqJesus wont help you17:20
mxqhe is not in this room17:20
treach@seen jesus17:20
clbtreach: I have not seen jesus.17:20
treachright.17:20
treach#crux, the channel god forgot.17:20
predatorfreak@seen god17:21
clbpredatorfreak: I have not seen god.17:21
predatorfreak@seen raptorjesus17:21
clbpredatorfreak: I have not seen raptorjesus.17:21
predatorfreak:O17:21
predatorfreakWell wish me luck, let's see if this fixes it.17:21
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predatorfreakJust needed gl-select xorg; gl-select nvidia XD17:23
treachah, more nvidia related joy, iow17:23
predatorfreaktreach: don't make me give you a day in the pen with the NVIDIA monster :]17:24
treachohh, new rc of ion3.. everyone hurry. :D17:25
treachpredatorfreak: good luck, I'm not touching nvidia with a 10' pole17:25
* predatorfreak forces treach into the pen.17:26
treachmaybe if that "noveau" project goes anywhere.17:26
predatorfreaktreach: If you're REALLY lucky, I hear it can do glxgears :P17:27
treachyeah, so far.17:27
treachthey haven't been at it for very long though, so it seems they are making decent progress so far.17:28
predatorfreaktreach: Supposedly 2D acceleration already beats the nv driver.17:28
predatorfreakBut that's probably because 2D acceleration has been documented in the nv driver forever :P17:29
treachmmh.17:29
* rehabdoll slaps predatorfreak 17:32
* treach gets popcorn17:32
treachcatfight! :D17:32
predatorfreakrehabdoll: Either you're a women and asking for sex.17:32
predatorfreakYou're a women and I just touched your ass.17:33
predatorfreakor a man with the same two choices.17:33
predatorfreakEither way, YOU DIEZ!17:33
* predatorfreak pulls out a machine gun.17:33
* predatorfreak blows rehabdoll away.17:33
predatorfreakrehabdoll: Also, no need for a two channel slap.17:34
mxqanyone knows some good guide about configuring kernel?17:36
predatorfreakmxq: make menuconfig and 2 billion hours of reading.17:37
treachor use common sense, where it applies17:37
treachie, don't chose k8 as march if you have a pentium-m cpu.17:38
treach:)17:38
mxqif i have sempron?17:38
treachthat should be k717:38
treachdepending a bit on how old it is, I guess.17:39
treachwhat kind of sempron is it?17:39
mxqok thx, i'll try tomorrow play with configuration once more17:39
treachok.17:39
predatorfreaktreach: k7 or k8.17:39
mxq32 bit17:39
predatorfreakDepending on the revision.17:39
treachyes, as I said.17:39
treachdepending on age.17:39
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predatorfreakI think it's like G stepping or something that they become k8's.17:40
predatorfreakI know mine is a k7 variant.17:40
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mxq2500+ is k7?17:41
predatorfreakmxq: If it supports SSE3 it's a k8 variant.17:42
treachI gues so17:42
predatorfreakIf not, it's likely a k7 variant.17:42
treachmxq: since it's socket A, I think it's a k717:42
rehabdollthere were a 2400+ k7 atleast17:42
predatorfreakmxq: Check if it supports 64-bit.17:43
predatorfreakIf not, it's a k7 variant.17:43
treachpredatorfreak: think a bit.17:43
treachhow many 64 bit cpus do you know that uses socket A?17:43
predatorfreaktreach: Where did he say it was Socket A?17:44
treachhe said it was a 2400+17:44
predatorfreakSempron's come in Socket AM2 variants.17:44
treachbut not as 2400+17:44
treachup to 3300 is socket A17:45
predatorfreakahh yeah I see.17:45
predatorfreaktreach: Sorry, didn't know that.17:45
predatorfreakI don't keep up on all the different model names.17:45
treachwell, neither do I. :P17:45
treachbtw, there are sub 3300 64bit models, but none of those are 240017:46
treachso I'd say it's a k717:47
predatorfreaktreach: Mine's a 3100+ that's k7 variant.17:47
predatorfreakand I think the lowest the 64bit models go is like 3200+.17:48
treach2600, afaict17:49
treach2500, I mean.17:50
treach90nm palermo based semprons17:50
treachsocket 75417:50
predatorfreakWhy can't AMD just call them Flying Pants Processor Number 2 or something more memorable :(17:51
treachmmh, Xenon 456 makes so much more sense17:52
treachor "pentium D 12317:52
treach"17:52
treachtbh, at least the performance rating number tells you *something*, which is more than intels numberscheme does.17:54
predatorfreaktreach: Hey, I never said Intel were much better.17:54
mxqit supports 64 bit i have it about two years and i didnt know that17:54
treachmxq: congrats. :)17:54
* treach suggests mxq to file it under "nice surprises"17:55
mxqSocket 754 ??17:56
treachsounds reasonable17:56
treacholdest socket that supports 64 bit17:56
* mxq feels surprised17:57
one|awaybye! ;)18:01
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treachmxq: btw http://gentoo-wiki.com/Safe_Cflags#Sempron.2FSempron64_.28AMD.2918:04
treachcompare it to the output of cat /proc/cpuinfo18:04
mxqtreach: thanks18:06
treachnp18:06
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highlyjhiwhen creating an account to use instead of root, is putting that user into the wheel and users group be the best thing to do?22:28
blerdyep..22:30
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blerduseradd -m -G users,wheel,audio -s /bin/bash jesus22:30
blerdpasswd jesus22:30
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* blerd cah didnt even see he left..22:31
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highlyjhiim back...the problem is that when i add my user to the wheel group and then login as that user and open mousepad it gives me a warning "your are using the root count blah blah blah"22:32
highlyjhiso im assuming i did something wrong22:33
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