IRC Logs for #crux Thursday, 2007-10-11

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prologichttp://infobunker.com/our_facility.shtml03:56
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Raizenexcuse me, someone here who can help me?06:30
nipuLpossibly, just ask your question06:31
Raizenwhen I try to update my pkgutils via prt-get, the build fails. any ideas why?06:31
nipuLnot with out some sort of error report06:31
Raizenhrm06:31
nipuL"it's broken" doesn't tell me much06:31
Raizenhow can I relay the log?06:31
nipuLbut i'm guessing you probably need to install libarchive06:32
nipuLdo a prt-get depends pkgutils06:32
Raizenlibarchive?06:32
Raizenah06:32
nipuLit's a new depenency06:32
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nipuLnewish06:33
RaizenI managed to compile a good working 2.6.23 kernel :)06:33
Raizenyay06:33
RaizennipuL: it could help if prt-get had support for upgrades that have new dependencies06:34
Raizenwelp successful build06:34
Raizenthanks06:34
Raizenis there a prt-get command to clean up packages after they've been installed?06:35
Raizenmeaning the package file is removed..06:35
teKfind /usr/ports -type f -name '*\#' | xargs rm06:37
teK(untested)06:37
teKoh06:38
teKfind /usr/ports -type f -name '*\#*' | xargs rm06:38
Raizenor I could just remove the entire ports folder and update it fresh from ports next time I need to install/upgrade something06:38
teKyou could tell pkgmk via /etc/pkgmk.conf to DL the sources to /usr/ports/sources or so and do a rm /usr/ports/sources/* ..06:38
Raizenwill that effect built packages as well?06:39
Raizenlike Bash#.tar.gz06:39
Raizenor whatever you wish to call it06:39
Raizenman crux feels a lot like gentoo06:40
Raizenin terms of being source based06:40
rehabdollyou can specify where built packages end up06:40
Raizenah06:41
rehabdollPKGMK_PACKAGE_DIR=06:41
Raizenthat would make custom cleanup much easier06:41
Raizen:)06:41
nipuLRaizen: there have been plenty of source based distrobutions before gentoo06:41
RaizenI know06:41
Raizenjust saying source distros are a minority compared to binary06:41
nipuLcrux can be package based06:42
Raizenyea, but by default its source :)06:42
Raizenkinda wanted a good source distro anyway06:42
Raizenso I can make my processor work for once :P06:42
nipuLso put windows on it, that's good at wasting cycles :)06:44
Raizennah06:44
Raizennipul, where is the skeleton folder on this distro?06:45
Raizen I couldn't find the default files to go with my new user06:45
rehabdollcreate one06:46
rehabdoll/etc/skel06:46
Raizenoh? this distro has no default?06:46
Raizenhow unusual. my last distro did.06:46
RaizenI see.06:46
RaizenI had to manually create and assign my home directory :o06:47
Raizenbut eh06:47
Raizenbig deal06:47
Raizenhow do i tell ports to download the contributor port?06:47
rehabdollyou can use a script to add users06:47
rehabdollhttp://fredrik.obra.se/adduser06:48
Raizenah06:48
rehabdollstolen from slackware :)06:48
Raizenthats what I used on my old distro06:48
RaizenI had grown used to that -.-06:48
rehabdollrename /etc/ports/contrib.rsync.inactive to contrib.rsync06:49
Raizenah06:50
Raizenthanks06:50
RomsterRaizen, reading the crux handbook would be helpful, also add the prtdir to /etc/prt-get.conf06:57
Romsterthen do a ports -u; prt-get cache06:58
Raizenerr06:59
Raizenheh06:59
Raizensorry06:59
Raizen<_<06:59
Romsterthat's ok.06:59
Romsterjust is nice to have a read..06:59
Romsterelse everyone askes the same questions...06:59
RaizenI'd consider crux fairly large compared to most distros on freenode07:00
Raizenlike frugalware07:00
Romsterlarge in what way?07:01
Raizenlarge channel?07:01
Romsteri haven't used frugalware07:01
Romsterthis is about it maybe a few more on IRC07:01
Romsteralot of us idle and read back logs and chat at times.07:01
Raizenits a distro that uses the pacman package manager from arch07:01
Raizenis the work dir variable where the actual compiling occurs?07:03
thrice`to clean up ports, prtwash can be used from prt-utils07:03
Raizenokay...07:04
Raizenwhich does what? removes the leftover tar balls?07:04
Raizensource and binary?07:04
Raizen:o07:04
thrice`I think it removes source, packages, and perhaps patches07:04
rehabdollman prtwash tells all07:05
RaizenI've changed my source directory to /usr/ports/src, package to /usr/ports/pkg and work to /usr/ports/src/work07:05
Raizen:o07:05
thrice`ah07:05
rehabdollwork is probably redundant in most cases07:05
Raizenperhaps07:06
Raizenbut I decided to still define it07:06
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Romsteractually arch is based off crux07:07
RaizenI noticed07:07
Raizenbut it uses an entirely different package manager in terms of source code07:07
Raizenbut its structure design is the same really07:07
RomsterRaizen, all where source, packages and work (compiling directory) can be set in /etc/pkgmk.conf07:08
RomsterPKGMK_SOURCE_DIR="/usr/ports/distfiles"07:08
RomsterPKGMK_PACKAGE_DIR="/usr/ports/packages"07:08
RaizenI did something like that already07:09
Romsteris what i use, i stil eep compiling in the same directory makes it easier toedit if i have too.07:09
Romsterkeep*07:09
Raizeni bet prt-get was a godsend when it came out :)07:09
Raizenmanually dealing with dependencies is a pain07:10
Romsteri came to crux when it was version 2.107:10
RaizenI came to linux when I felt I had plateaued with what I could do with windows :p07:10
Romster2.4 is around the corner, prt-get was out way before crux 2.1 so i wouldn't know any diferent.07:11
Romsteryeah i'm a ex ms-dos win xp pro, i refused to goto vista and its DRM crap.07:11
Raizensadly07:11
Raizenwindows xp's drm is much better than windows vista07:11
Raizenin terms of how much less prevalent it is07:12
Romstervista is junk in my opinion sp1 might fix it i dunno it'll always be a memory hog and slow.07:12
Romsteryeah07:12
Raizenthats not why I hate vista07:12
RaizenI hate it because they've finally turned it into the TCPA type crap07:12
Romsteri'm keeping a eye on ReactOS, mainly for playing games on.07:12
Romsterunless wine beats it and can do everything then.07:13
Raizenwine is fairly impressive07:13
rehabdolli bought a wii instead :)07:13
Raizenas it stands now07:13
Romsteri agree07:13
Romsterrehabdoll, money well spent :P07:13
RaizenI'm guessing what reactos is going to do for hardware support is07:14
Raizenfind a way to provide an interface for binary windows drivers07:14
Raizenor something like that07:14
Romsteri did see another project that actaully recompiled binary files into linux by changing the calls, but i lost the site.07:14
Romsteranyways i much prefer linux programs.07:14
Raizenagreed07:14
RaizenI first tried linux many years ago07:15
RomsterRaizen, yeah for the msot part it'll be API ABI and all that compatable.07:15
Raizenbut only recently became truely serious about it07:15
Romsterit's come a long way since then.07:15
Raizenfirst distro for me was Mandrake 9.107:15
Romsterand i have too but didn't do everything i wanted.07:15
Romsterstill dosn't but it's improving.07:15
Romsterah mandrake 7.2 i think was my first.07:16
Raizeni think the main thing that turns newbies away from crux is manual kernel compilation07:16
RaizenI personally compiled the 2.6.23 for this installation07:16
Romstersome lice cd debian, core linux then here.07:16
Romsteri wasn't serious with linuix untill crux.07:17
Romsterah neat.07:17
Raizenwhat kernel you still using?07:17
Romsteri haven't switched yet but i've compiled it already.07:17
Raizen2.6.22?07:17
Raizenat least the kernel is the only thing you have to manually install :)07:17
Romster2.6.17.14 is my main one 2.6.22.6 i think is the most recent one, and it'l be 2.6.23 now.07:17
RaizenI wonder why they still develope the 2.4 kernel line...07:18
Romstergot a driver that won't work on a newer kernel...07:18
Raizenisn't that line like super obselete?07:18
nipuLnot really, 2.2 is still supported aswell07:18
Romsterno it's clased as stable red hat debian and aot of others use 2.407:18
nipuLplenty of enterprise systems out there running older kernels07:18
Raizenyea, but it hasnt been updated since 200407:19
Romster2.6 is preaty much called bleeding edge07:19
Raizeneven thought 2.6 is very stable07:19
nipuLmost of the time07:19
Raizenonly time I've had kernel panics is from misconfiguration or bad modules07:19
Raizenlike ones you manually compile outside the kernel source07:20
Raizenetc, madwifi07:20
Romsterthe distros that keep with 2.4 are mainly like enterprise i think.07:20
Raizeneventually 2.6 will become the new 2.407:20
Raizeni wonder when the kernels'll reach the 3.0 line :P07:20
nipuLi wonder when it will reach 500007:21
namenlosaccording to linus it wont.07:21
RaizenOh?07:21
Romsteri always keep a few versions and 2.6.17.14 is my tryed and fall back one if i stuff a later one up.07:21
Raizenis 2.6 the final numerical line?07:21
Romsterno idea..07:21
namenlosno, it seems, that the devs are satisfied with the development model in 2.607:21
namenlos2.6.17 was bad...07:21
Raizeni'm wondering if there'll be a 2.707:21
Raizenor 2.807:21
Raizen2.907:21
Raizenwho knows07:21
Romsternamenlos, 2.6.17.14 is very stable for me.07:22
Romstermaybe 2.6.17 itself was buggy.07:22
Raizenisn't it true that 2.4.x isn't getting any new feature updates, just security/bug fixes?07:22
Romsteror i haven't hit the bug on my system.07:22
namenlosRomster: might be, but i was dissapointed, because there where nearly twice a week a new release.07:22
RomsterRaizen, jsut security/bug fixes07:23
Raizenthought as much07:23
Romster2.6 is more of a snad box to test new ideas07:23
namenlosRaizen: afaik yes, and this guy also ports some drivers to 2.4.07:23
Romstersand*07:23
Raizenyou need 2.6.x line if you use newer hard ware07:23
Romsterah yes there is backwards porting too.07:24
Romsternamenlos, ah07:24
Raizenif I upgrade crux later, does it require a kernel rebuild?07:24
Raizenvia CD07:24
Raizeno_o07:24
Romsterah there is 2 ways but updating via cd is easier07:27
Romsterand yes you gotta rebuild the kernel to relink to the new glibc07:27
Raizenbut you can just take the previous kernels config right?07:28
Raizenand rebuild that way?07:28
Romsterya can do it by switching to the new 2.4 ports tree and then rebuilding the tool chain then the rest of core and other packages.07:28
Romsteryes same config07:28
Romsterif you use a newer kernel jsut do a make oldconfig07:28
Raizendo I have to rebuild the entire toolchain if I stick to 2.6?07:29
Romsterit'll ask a few questions of chnages and the rest will be as normal.07:29
Raizenor just during upgrades?07:29
Romsterit would be when crux 2.4 comes out07:29
Romsterunless you do the cd update from a crux 2.4 cd07:29
Raizenoh07:30
Raizenis that why gcc hasn't been updated yet?07:30
Raizenits only updated when crux is?07:30
Raizen4.1.2 is out of date I believe07:30
Raizen4.2.1 i think is latest07:30
Romsteryes gcc is part of the tool chain, the tool cahin only gets updated on a new crux release.07:30
Romster4.2.207:31
Raizenmy bad07:31
Romstercame out not long ago :)07:31
Romsterbtw for kernel updates take a look at ketchup, prt-get info ketchup07:31
Romsternice program to do paches and stuff for you.07:32
Raizeneh07:32
RaizenI got the kernel upgraded by wgetting the source instead of using the cd kernel source :D07:32
Raizenerr07:33
Romsterliek i can do ketchup 2.6 to update to current kernel then make oldconfig and do the rest as per normal.07:33
Romstercheats way to patch the kernel.07:33
Romstercan goto any kernel version ya want with it.07:33
Romsteryeah ketchup would do the dirty work for you.07:33
Raizenany idea when crux 2.4 will come out?07:33
Romsternot sure but it's not too far away.07:33
Raizenfew months?07:34
Raizenshrug07:34
Romsteryou could wet your feet and try it now if oyu spent time recompiling and knew how to do it all or wait.07:34
RaizenWhy bother?07:34
Romsterit'll be out when it's all tested.07:34
Raizengcc 4.1.2 will do until their ready07:34
Romsterwell soem like to hop on the new version early.07:35
Romsterhas new glibc and kernel headers too.07:35
Raizendoes prt-get have a way to rebuild your entire list of installed packages at once?07:35
Raizeno_o07:35
Romsterand some design changes.07:35
Raizenlike if you upgraded gcc and wanted to recompile your packages?07:35
Romsteryes07:35
Raizenupdate I assume?07:36
RaizenI noticed update can upgrade to the same version =p07:36
Raizenwelp tomorrow I can install the rest of my software07:37
Raizenzzz07:37
Raizensure helps having 800 kb/s speed07:37
Romster$ `prt-get update -fr --install-scripts pkginfo -i |awk '{ print $1 }' |xargs`07:37
Romstersomething like that is a brute force method.07:37
Romsterprt-get depinst <package>07:38
Raizenmaybe you could write a script for an entire system rebuild :P07:38
Romsteris the best way to install stuff.07:38
Romsterthat command would do the msot of it but the tool chain.07:38
RaizenI'd only do a rebuild when the toolchain gets upgraded07:38
Romsteri think thee is a better way todo it i sut threw that together now.07:39
Romsteryeah only time oh look at revdep quite handy tool07:39
Romstercheck for broken dependnecys.07:39
Raizenwouldnt you notice if a package failed to build? XD07:40
Romsterand after install and update use rejmerge.07:40
Romsterread it's man page first!07:40
Romsteryes but wen you update a package and something else depends on it you may not notice.07:40
Romsterthat's where revdep comes in.07:40
Romsterwill test all links with ldd07:40
Raizenoh like updating a package could break another packages dependency on it?07:41
Romsterand report a error if something is not relinked right, and jsut recompile that package that's broken to get it to relink to the new package.07:41
Romsteryes07:41
Romsterman revdep07:41
RaizenI see07:41
Raizennot installed07:42
Romsterif you don't have rvdep instaled you can find what package it's in with prt-get fsearch revdep07:42
Romsterrevdep*07:42
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Raizenanyway I better get some rest :o07:42
Romsterok have fun later ;)07:42
Raizenkernel took 4 hours to configure properly07:42
Raizen<_>07:42
Raizenlater07:42
Romsteryeah even then you could tweek it somewhat.07:42
Romsterlater.07:43
Romsternamenlos, was it you that was after avifile?07:43
Romsteror was that someone else in here. still gotta work on that i started working on patching it.07:44
namenlosRomster: no. which avi file?07:44
Romsteravifile in contrib07:44
Romsterwas either you or schniggie iirc07:45
namenlosi wasn't it.07:45
Romsterah would of been schniggie then.07:45
Romstertoo much on my mind this week.07:46
namenloshehe07:48
Romsterif case anyonr forgot the irc stats page http://clc.morpheus.net/irc/stats/07:51
Romsteranyone*07:51
Romsterman i should watch my typing alot more.07:52
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et-swehi where is pli08:00
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et-swehi jaeger08:01
jaegerhello08:01
et-swewhere is pli08:02
jaegerno idea. haven't seen him in quite a while08:02
Romstercomes and goes like the wind08:03
Romster@seen pli08:03
clbRomster: I have not seen pli.08:03
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sepenhey08:45
et-swehey08:46
sepenjejejej last night I found that http://www.armlinux.com/08:46
sepenseems that someone becomes root xDD08:46
et-sweDraculas castle is for sale08:51
tilmanet-swe: he's not active here anymore09:11
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et-swewhy, what happened09:16
tilmanhe just stepped back from crux development09:18
et-swewhat is he doing these days09:20
sepenwho?09:20
et-sweDo you know that , that draculas castle is for sale09:21
rehabdolland i've got a bridge for sale09:29
nipuLthere were some guys in australia that stole a bridge once09:30
rehabdollawesome09:30
j^2crazy aussies, stealing a bridge09:31
nipuLwhat can i say, we just love to steal stuff09:32
rehabdollwell its in your history :)09:33
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Raizenhey15:18
Raizencould someone give me some help setting up xorg? its complaining about a missing font path when I try to use the config nvidia-xconfig generates15:19
treachjust check the paths listed, if any, and make sure they are valid.15:20
drijenRaizen, did you chop up x?15:20
drijenneed to check the paths if you did15:20
Raizeni used prt-get depinst xorg15:20
Raizento install xorg15:21
treachdrijen: I think x chopped up him. :p15:21
drijenhehe15:21
Raizentook a good while to compile everything15:21
Raizenthen i tried using nvidia's xconfigure15:21
Raizenwhere do I normally find the xorg fonts?15:21
tilman /usr/lib/X11/fonts15:22
treachGenerally I find it easier to just use the file X creates and then edit it.15:22
* tilman <3 nvidia15:22
treach:s15:22
Raizeneventually I heard xorg won't need configuration15:22
tilmannot sure it's working with nvidia's drivers though15:22
Raizenif automatic is ever as good as a configuration file....15:23
treachI don't know anything about that. I've edited xorg.conf files for years, and I'll probably do it as long as they let me..15:23
Raizenfor some reason15:23
Raizennvidia generates an XF86CONFIG15:23
Raizenfile instead of xorg.conf15:23
treachhaha15:23
Raizenand xorg still uses it15:24
* Raizen faints.15:24
treachlegacy never dies15:24
treachI wonder if those nvidia drivers would even work with "current" xfree86..15:24
Raizenisn't xf86 the original window server and xorg is the port?15:24
treach"fork"15:24
Raizenerr15:24
Raizenfork15:24
Raizenyea15:24
tilmanxf86 went crazy15:24
Raizenlike this?15:24
Raizenshell-init: error retrieving current directory: getcwd: cannot access parent directories: No such file or directory15:25
Raizencat: /proc/sanity: No such file or directory15:25
Raizeneh?15:25
Raizenwhats getcwd?15:25
tilman;D15:25
treach"get current working directory"15:25
treachI guess15:25
tilmanerr, that wasn't a joke?15:25
tilman /proc/sanity ? o_O15:25
Raizenit is15:25
Raizenbut i'm wondering why it outputed that15:25
Raizenerror15:25
treachmount -t squish /dev/brain /mnt/brain15:26
Raizenheh15:26
* Raizen presses Esc and his computer jumps out the nearest window.15:26
RaizenO_o15:27
treachtry the sane way, "X -configure" and then use that file instead to see if you get something running.15:28
Raizeni hope one day linux'll be able to support any type of PC hardware it may encounter15:28
Raizeninstead of having to special pick hardware for proper support15:28
treachwell, it supports more hw than windows..15:28
RaizenI'm refering to stuff with 100% support in windows but nadda for linux15:29
treachwrong15:29
Raizenfor example wireless stuff15:29
RaizenX_X15:29
treachthere is no support in windows for these things15:29
Raizenxorg?15:29
Raizen:P15:29
treachit's the *manufacturers* that supports windows, not the other way around15:29
Raizenwelp15:30
Raizen<_<15:30
treachbrat15:30
Raizenlmao15:30
Raizenwhen i tried xorg's config15:30
Raizenit said nvidias kernel module could not be loaded15:31
Raizenwelp time to peak into it15:31
RaizenI know... I can try linking these 2 config files15:31
Raizenfill in the gaps that nvidias lacks15:31
RaizenI don't know why, but crux feels much faster than arch did when I used it15:32
Raizenprobably because I can customize the kernel15:32
Raizeno_o15:32
treachall you should need is to change the driver, from nv to nvidia15:32
treachand load the module, obviously, if you haven't already15:32
Raizenyou dont get it15:32
tilmanRaizen: maybe arch starts more daemons on boot?15:33
Raizenit autoselected nvidia not nv15:33
Raizenwhen i used autoconfig15:33
treachok, I haven't used nvidia for a long time now, so I'm not that familiar with it, I guess google knows better15:34
Raizenhrm15:34
Raizeni'll try my idea15:34
Raizenhrm15:37
Raizenthe config file is refrencing an RGB path15:37
Raizendo I need to install xorg-rgb?15:37
tilmanyes15:37
Raizenk15:37
Raizenthats wierd15:38
Raizenit says xorg-rgb is already installed but15:38
Raizenit has no listed directory15:38
Raizenwhere the rgb path is reference15:38
tilmanfix it then15:38
tilmanseems the nvidia config script sucks15:39
tilmanmy, i'm so surprised!15:39
Raizenwell15:39
Raizenthe 2 different config15:39
Raizenone referneces /usr/share/X11/rgb the other15:39
Raizen/usr/lib/X11/rgb15:40
treachlearn to use prt-get.15:40
RaizenI did use prt-get to install xorg15:40
Raizenhrm15:40
treachwell, it's not a one-trick pony you know15:40
treachfsearch is *very* usefull15:40
Raizenprt-get fsearch rgb displays nothing15:41
Raizenso15:41
Raizenthats wierd15:41
treach\*rgb\*15:41
Raizeno15:42
Raizenit finds15:42
Raizen/usr/bin/showrgb15:42
Raizen/usr/man/man1/showrgb.1x.gz15:42
Raizen/usr/share/X11/rgb.txt15:42
treachyou're looking for rbg.txt I think15:42
Raizenthen why is it trying to reference a directory...15:43
Raizenthat does not exist15:43
thrice`--install-scripts may have helped15:43
rehabdolli want xvideo support in radeonhd D;15:54
Raizeni'd like my if statement to be true, but you don't see me complaining. if(pigsfly) goto explode15:58
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tilmanerm16:05
tilmanwhat the hell16:05
Raizenwhat?16:05
tilmanpeople who send youtube links to their entire address book need to be unscubscribed!16:05
tilman;))16:05
Raizenyoutube... ick16:05
Raizenheh16:06
Raizentilman16:06
Raizen?16:06
Raizenwhy does xorg reference a rgb from its auto configure utility that doesn't exist?16:06
* Raizen boggles.16:06
tilmanpardon?16:07
RaizenI used X -configure and nvidia-xconfig16:07
Raizenand they both reference a RgbPath that does not exist16:07
tilmanmmh16:07
Raizenon the file system16:07
Raizeni do have xorg-rgb installed16:07
Raizenbut I noticed a lot of the usual directories are missing16:07
tilmani'll check that out tomorrow16:08
Raizenfor example, /etc/X11 did not exist after I installed16:08
Raizenxorg16:08
Raizenand it compiled16:08
Raizenall its dependencies16:08
Raizenprt-get depinst16:08
Raizen:o16:08
Raizeni didn't get an error16:08
Raizenbut i did think it was odd16:08
Raizenhrm16:08
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treachRaizen: this isn't ubuntu or some other pointy clicky dist, in case you haven't noticed.16:18
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treachpackage management installs stuff for you; configuring it is up to you.16:18
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RaizenI'm having issues with nvidia drivers in xorg :/ anyone here who could hear me out?16:49
treachdon't ask to ask. also, did you try google?16:51
treachbecause I'm careless I guess.16:52
treachhahaha16:52
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tilmando you run irssi?16:53
treachyes16:53
jaegerwhat issues?16:53
treachhorizontally split windows, and then I sometimes forget to change which one I have focus on.16:53
tilmantreach: do you make it put traffic from all channels into a single window? bitchx style16:53
tilmanaha16:53
Raizenuh16:54
Raizenokay i'm back16:54
Raizennvidia's glx module refuses to load properly now16:54
Raizenotherwise xorg is running great16:54
namenlosyou did gl-select?16:54
Raizenno...?16:55
Raizenoh16:55
Raizenmy bad16:55
treachalways read the readmes :/16:55
Raizenheh16:56
Raizentime to check log for any remaining errors16:56
namenlosok, its time for me. good night16:57
treachnighty16:57
Raizeneh?16:57
tilmannight16:57
Raizena warning?16:57
Raizensays it can't open the ACPI socket16:57
Raizendoes that mean xorg won't have ACPI features?16:57
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RaizenOpen ACPI failed (/var/run/acpid.socket) (No such file or directory)16:58
Raizenhrm16:58
Raizenmaybe its a software16:58
Raizenguess not16:59
Raizenprt-get found nothing16:59
treachgoogle -lucky acpid16:59
treach@google -lucky acpid16:59
clbtreach: http://acpid.sourceforge.net/16:59
Raizenwhy isn't it included in the prt-get ports?16:59
* Raizen boggles.16:59
jaegerit isn't required17:00
treachbecause it's not *necessary*17:00
RaizenOh.17:00
Raizenbut I need it if I want xorg to turn off my monitor, right?17:00
Raizenafter so much time of no use?17:01
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treachnot sure what it's for. I've never used it myself17:01
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Raizenaww, ports doesn't have my favorite window manage17:01
Raizen*manager17:01
treachmake your own then.17:02
treachor look in the portdb17:02
Raizensawfish :/17:02
predatorfreak.. people still use sawfish?17:02
treach<- dwm/fvwm17:03
Raizensawfish is still under developmenet17:03
predatorfreak<- Openbox17:03
Raizenicewm isn't even included O_O17:03
treachLook in the prtdb, will ya?17:03
predatorfreakRaizen: Sure, but it's really useless when not in GNOME or some other environment.17:03
Raizentreach: I would if I had a good WM :P17:04
Raizenno firefox right now17:04
treachthat's what you have elinks for. :P17:04
predatorfreakYou can really use firefox without a WM.17:04
RaizenI know17:04
predatorfreakjust put exec firefox into ~/.xinitrc ;)17:04
Raizenbut its not very useful without one17:04
predatorfreakSure it is.17:04
Raizenif the download box comes up17:05
Raizenyou can't close it or move it17:05
treachvimparator ftw. :P17:05
Raizendwm is great if you just want a WM to move stuff17:05
predatorfreakRaizen: I fixed that by making Firefox emulate Opera.17:05
predatorfreakand keeping everything in one damn window.17:05
Raizeno_O17:05
treachpredatorfreak: you should have a look at vimperator instead. ;)17:06
predatorfreakYou only need one window with tabs anyway.17:06
predatorfreaktreach: Sorry, I do not want to do17:06
treachheh, wimp. :P17:06
predatorfreakesc; :new tab17:06
Raizeni wonder what daemons I should run other than net, dhcp, and17:06
predatorfreaki17:07
Raizencrond17:07
predatorfreakLOLZURL!17:07
predatorfreakesc17:07
predatorfreaketc ;)17:07
treachpredatorfreak: sorry, but it works with ^T as well17:07
Raizenanyone know what portmap's daemon does?17:07
Raizen>_<17:07
predatorfreaktreach: Then it's not true vim! :P17:07
Raizenit was included with the core install17:07
predatorfreakRaizen: Maps ports, i dunno?17:07
treachwell, it works with the vim way too17:07
treachuseful if you're using nfs.17:08
treachotherwise, not much17:08
RaizenI don't use nfs17:08
predatorfreakRemove nfs shit and it.17:08
RaizenI disabled nfs support in my kernel17:08
Raizenonly included samba support17:08
predatorfreakSave some disk space for more important things.17:08
treach...17:08
Raizenwhat?17:08
predatorfreakLike world domination plans.17:08
treachsave some space... that's probably *the* worst possible reason to leave nfs out.17:09
treachit's tiny.17:09
treach"I don't use it" or "security" would be much, much better reasons..17:10
predatorfreaktreach: He doesn't use it.17:10
predatorfreakSo, by removing it.17:10
Raizentreach: unless your dealing with a really low RAM arch17:10
predatorfreakHe saves space too ;)17:10
Raizenlike PS2 linux17:10
* Raizen faints17:10
predatorfreakThus, win-win.17:10
Raizenfor that you'd want to make your kernel as light as possible17:10
treachpredatorfreak: I think the amount of space saved is with in the margin of error..17:10
Raizensince you have only 32 MB of ram17:10
predatorfreaktreach: Even if it's only like 1MB of disk space, that's still space saved though.17:11
predatorfreakSo there's nothing WRONG with getting rid of nfs because you don't need it and want some extra space.17:11
treachno, I never said that.17:11
Raizenis the 2.6 kernel much more bloated in terms of RAM usage than the 2.4 kernel?17:12
treachI'm just saying *that* is not a good reason17:12
predatorfreaktreach: I agree, space ALONE isn't a good reason.17:12
predatorfreakBut if it's not doing anything.17:12
treach"I don't want to keep track of a package I don't use, and keep it up to date would be more valid17:12
treachfor instance17:12
predatorfreakYou still save some disk space.17:12
predatorfreaktreach: All he said was "I don't use nfs"17:13
RaizenI simply like to keep useless packages off my system17:13
predatorfreakand I said to remove it.17:13
predatorfreakand save some space.17:13
Raizenas much as possible17:13
Raizenpart of the reason I hated windows17:13
predatorfreaktreach: I don't see how I'm saying that is the soul reason to remove it?17:13
treachpredatorfreak: yeah, sure, I'm just teasing. Pet project; Make people give sound and logical reasons for their actions.17:14
treach;=17:14
treach;)17:14
treachshouldn't that be "sole" btw?17:14
predatorfreaktreach: Not all of us have the advantage of superior non-American educations :P17:14
treachtrue.17:14
predatorfreakPlus, we all make typos XD17:15
Raizenis there any advantage of making all the kernel stuff modules instead of built-in?17:15
rehabdollwhats wrong with nfs?17:15
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predatorfreakrehabdoll: Nothing.17:15
predatorfreakrehabdoll: But if you don't need it, you don't need it ;)17:15
treachit's a bit complicated, and have potentially catastropic security issues.17:15
rehabdollah, didnt really follow your discussion17:15
treachotherwise it's fine. ;)17:16
predatorfreakRaizen: You reduce the initial kernel image size17:16
RaizenI see17:16
treachno, there's no gain in going modular17:16
RaizenI wouldn't disable loadable module support17:16
Raizenif you plan to use binary drivers17:16
Raizenerr17:16
Raizenmodules17:16
treachindeed17:16
predatorfreakOf course, often times modules wind up being huger than the modules alone would be.17:16
predatorfreakerrr17:16
predatorfreakKERNEL ALONE17:17
predatorfreakDamn brain17:17
Raizencat: /proc/sanity: No such file or directory17:17
predatorfreakRaizen: Oh hi, you must be new here.17:17
predatorfreakI'm predatorfreak, I eat people.17:17
Raizenheh17:17
treachmount -t squishy /dev/brain /mnt/cranium17:17
* Raizen presses the panic button.17:17
* predatorfreak eats /dev/brain :317:18
treachIOW, predatorfreak gets the leftovers after I and tilman are done. ;)17:18
Raizenmy kernels size is about17:19
predatorfreaktreach: You bastards always steal my kills :(17:19
Raizen17 MBs17:19
Raizeni think17:19
Raizencompared to archs kernel17:19
Raizenthis is much lighter17:19
treacheh?17:19
treachwtf?17:19
treachthat's freaking huge17:19
RaizenI disabled support for all ethernet/audio hardware I didn't use17:19
Raizenhrm17:19
Raizenwell17:19
predatorfreak1.2 + 21 :P17:19
predatorfreakSo 22.2MB.17:19
predatorfreakIncluding modules.17:19
treachah17:19
RaizenI don't actually know how to check it on17:19
Raizencommand line...17:20
Raizenit says17:20
predatorfreakdu -sh /boot/KERNELIMAGE17:20
treach/boot/vmlinuz-2.6.22.9-0.4-default17:20
predatorfreakdu -sh /lib/`uname-r`/17:20
treachoops17:20
Raizen1736632'17:20
Raizennext to my kernels image17:20
predatorfreakthen add the numbers together.17:20
Raizeni wonder what that means17:20
predatorfreakRaizen: Make sure to add the -h :P17:20
treachRaizen: -h is a lot nicer.17:20
RaizenLMAO17:21
Raizenmy kernel is only 1.7 MB!17:21
predatorfreakRaizen: FAT KERNELZ!17:21
Raizenimage17:21
predatorfreakMines only 1.2MB :P17:21
predatorfreakRaizen: du -h /lib/`uname -r`/ :)17:21
treachmake a lot more sense than 1717:21
Raizenyea17:22
rehabdoll1.4+9.4 D;17:23
Raizenthis makes me want to get PS2 linux for some fun :)17:23
Raizensee what I can do with a limited amount of resources17:23
Raizen200 mhz and 32 MB of ram17:23
predatorfreakI have WAY too many modules :(17:24
Raizenmy only modules are my sound O_o17:24
treachI used to have a 166 with 32 MB running17:24
RaizenI compiled most of my stuff directly into the kernel17:24
treachPretty much everything worked ok, except mozilla, and openoffice. :P17:24
predatorfreakMine are sound, nvidia, assorted codepages, usb, firewire, etc.17:25
predatorfreakBasically anything not critical to boot.17:25
Raizenif I wanted to bridge my atheros device to my ethernet device, what option do I need to enable in the kernel?17:25
treach@google -lucky linux bridging wireless17:26
clbtreach: http://linux-net.osdl.org/index.php/Bridge17:26
treachsee.17:26
treachdon't underestimate google17:26
Raizen@google -lucky Linus Torvalds17:26
clbRaizen: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linus_Torvalds17:26
Raizenlol17:27
treachplease.17:27
predatorfreak@google -lucky treach17:27
clbpredatorfreak: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treach17:27
predatorfreakHuh.17:27
treachrofl17:27
predatorfreaktreach: I didn't know you were a rapper...17:27
treachme neither17:27
Raizen@google -lucky predatorfreak17:27
clbRaizen: http://www.last.fm/user/predatorfreak/17:27
predatorfreakApparently the internet cares more about my music taste than my shell scripts :(17:28
predatorfreakLOL THAT'S HILARIOUS.17:28
treachhaha17:28
predatorfreakBeethoven brings up a DIE HARD soundtrack album cover17:28
Raizen@google -lucky Selrach17:28
clbRaizen: http://eqbeastiary.allakhazam.com/search.shtml?id=498117:28
Raizeno_O17:28
Raizenlol17:28
treachdudes. how about harassing clb in private?17:29
Raizen<_<17:29
Raizentime to install firefox17:30
Raizendoes prt-get keep logs somewhere?17:31
treachyes, if you tell it to17:31
treachsee the manpage17:31
Raizenthat'd be useful if you wanted to log what you've installed17:31
Raizenetc17:31
treachthat's what you have listinst for, isn't it...?17:31
Raizen...17:32
Raizenso you know what was installed for a dependency?17:32
treachno17:32
treachthe package management doesn't work that way17:32
treachsince that would be tremendously complicated17:33
Raizenwill it tell you if you try to remove something that is a dependency?17:33
treachno.17:33
Raizenfigured17:33
Raizeno well17:33
treachdependency management is done by the user17:33
predatorfreaktreach: Well, basic dependency management is done by prt-get ;)17:35
treachonly when you install stuff17:35
predatorfreaktreach: Yeah, afterwords it's up to you :P17:39
treachyup17:39
treachwell, it's up to you when you install stuff as well. it's not like the deps are forced17:40
Raizenjeez18:06
Raizenfirefox takes forever to compile18:06
treachyep18:06
Raizenreminds me of wines compile time18:06
treachwhat hardware do you have?18:06
* Raizen faints.18:06
RaizenAthlon 64 X2 4600+18:07
Raizen1 GB ram18:07
treachwell, not too shabby then.18:07
treachTakes about an hour here.18:07
Raizenunfortunately18:08
Raizeni wonder18:08
Raizenhow large is firefox 1.5 on ram usage?18:08
treach64 MB or something, to start up.18:08
Raizenman18:08
Raizenits near impossible to get a non text mode browser on18:08
Raizena 32 MB system18:09
treachmmh, I had luck with opera once upon a time.18:09
Raizenwell18:09
treachnot sure how much it has balloned since then18:09
Raizenopera won't work for the PS218:09
treachotherwise there's always dillo. :P18:09
Raizenits a non-x86 processor18:09
Raizenhow light is mozilla/seamonkey?18:10
treachsame as ff, approximately, so I don't think "light" is the right word18:10
treachpresumeably you could run them on 32 MB ram, but prepair for insane swapping.18:11
Raizenlinux feels like its spreading like wildfire18:11
Raizenits used in a lot of different systems18:12
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Romster@google -lucky Romster18:42
clbRomster: http://www.romster.com/18:42
treachffs18:42
Romsterok so it finds the rom site that's not mine18:42
Romsterwhat treach18:42
RomsterRaizen, i got icewm in my private repo.18:43
Romstersame name as my nickname here, in portsdb18:43
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Romsterya could use upx to reduce the size of a distro by compressing binarys too if ya want to save more hdd space.18:46
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Raizen_hey predator20:10
Raizen_did you compile your kernel with ACPI?20:11
Raizen_I'm wondering if I should just disable it since I don't use a laptop20:11
j^2Raizen_: yep you should20:15
j^2if you dont need it dont build it ;)20:15
Raizen_should I disable CPU scaling too then?20:15
j^2are you going to use it? ;)20:15
Raizen_probably not20:15
j^2then dont put it in ;)20:16
Raizen_do I need ACPI for my UPS to work though?20:16
j^2no idea20:16
Raizen_its not connected to the computers hardware20:16
Raizen_only the power cord20:16
j^2then nope you shouldnt have to worry about it20:16
Raizen_I think i'm just gonna make all my stuff builtin to the kernel20:17
Raizen_and only include module support for20:17
Raizen_binary and external stuff20:17
Raizen_not part of the default kernel tree20:17
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predatorfreakRaizen_: No ACPI = No ability to do a shutdown and have your box power off on it's own.20:56
predatorfreakNor a lot of other useful things which ACPI helps with.20:56
predatorfreakIt's far from just a Laptop thing.20:56
jaeger-but many of its features don't require acpid to be running or even installed21:05
Romsterthe acpi daemon that i got in my services array.21:06
Romsternot over sure waht it's required for but since my system complained i stuck it in there.21:07
RomsterACPI is good for desktops too. save power on hdd, monitor, and other stuff.21:10
Romsterages ago i span down the root hdd that wasn't a wise move it didn't reactivate when it needed it and froze my system lol.21:11
predatorfreakjaeger-: I didn't see anything about acpid?21:28
predatorfreakHe was asking if he needed ACPI in his kernel.21:28
jaeger-I thought the discussion was still on the x log acpid thing, ignore me if that's not the case :)21:28
predatorfreakNot that I know of.21:29
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