IRC Logs for #crux Friday, 2007-10-12

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namenloshi, anyone ever tried git-svn?04:12
tilmanyes04:16
namenlosi tried a git-svn init, but it says, that SVN::Core is missing.04:17
namenloshow did you get your sources?04:17
tilmanyou need subversion-perl04:18
namenlosaaahh, there is already a port... (thank god)04:18
tilmannot sure that one's working04:19
tilmani copied mine to http://crux.nu/~tilman/subversion-perl04:19
namenlosi was messing with alien::svn and module::build...04:19
namenlosi'll keep that url in mind, thanks. first ill give the contrib port a try.04:20
tilmanoh, maybe prologic incorporated my diff04:21
tilmanyeah, he did :)04:21
namenlosthe contrib port works here.04:31
tilmanhttp://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=2007101120504414104:42
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SiFuh_be back later, not that anyone iwll miss me05:32
SiFuh_haha05:32
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rehabdollnew openssl release06:45
tilmanhttp://crux.nu/gitweb/?p=ports/core.git;a=commitdiff;h=4837a9ce399d751d3d4a1b4cf23173380fbc0ea206:45
rehabdollfeel free to push it into 2.3 too :)06:48
tilmani probably won't06:49
rehabdollthats quite the bollox-patent btw06:49
tilmansee my mail to crux-devel06:49
rehabdollah06:51
rehabdollwhat a bummer06:51
jjpkrehabdoll: yeah. Good ole' mafia days are back07:09
jjpkPay me, or else07:10
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pedjaany opinions on antec PSU?08:29
pedjaare they any good?08:29
pedjathey are, for sure, better than my current cheap, lightweight pos of psu...08:31
jjpkThey should be fine.08:33
pedjajjpk: around 80 euros for 550w model (tp-550) here.08:34
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j^2what happens if  nfs mount is declared 2x in fstab?13:22
aon'already mounted'?13:23
tilmanj^2: http://crux.nu/~tilman/nfs.jpg13:24
j^2but no errors? like i have it with the host name then the ip13:24
tilmanhey aon13:24
treachpresumeably the same as if you mount the same drive twice13:24
j^2tilman: always a help13:24
j^2;)13:24
tilmani live to give13:24
tilman:D13:24
RyoStilman: hasse ma ne mark? *SCNR*13:27
tilmanE-U-R-O13:28
tilmanhaste ma ne mark is soooo 90s (or earlier :)13:28
RyoShaha13:28
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aonhey tilman13:35
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acruxhi14:00
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jjpk"ziomg, no one is here. /quit /quit /quit" :D14:07
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tilmanOH NOES14:09
tilmanopt/kqemu doesn't compile on 2.6.2314:09
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jjpkToo new and improved.14:18
RedShift2.6.23 carries alot of changes14:22
RedShiftand I bet 2.6.24 even more14:22
RedShiftafter that I really think they should cool down a bit14:22
RedShift2.6 looks more like a development branch than a stable kernel14:23
jjpkThey did once say that it is left to the distros to "stabilize" kernels.14:26
RedShiftreally?14:27
jjpkNot a good policy in my opinion.14:27
RedShifthow nice of them14:27
RedShiftNOT14:27
jjpkMight work for the largest distributions, but seriously.14:27
jjpkMaybe they've stopped caring about their work, hence releasing it half-baked.14:28
jjpkkernel.org does not really give you much options either. Use old old kernels, where nothing happens or use the new kernels with maybe too much happening.14:29
RedShiftthey are maintaining 2.6.16 as stable14:37
RedShifthttp://www.eu.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v2.6/ChangeLog-2.6.16.5414:38
aoninteresting14:38
RedShiftIIRC ofcourse14:39
wbeeneare any distros actually using 2.6.16 instead of the latest?14:39
RedShiftI think ubuntu LTS does that IIRC14:39
wbeeneah ok14:39
RedShift(LTS = long term support, the ones that get 5 years of support)14:40
wbeeneyea, i know14:40
RedShiftbut whatever, if it were up to me, I'd just stay one release behind14:40
RedShiftwe're at 2.6.23.1 now, I'd use 2.6.22.10 (which is the latest for 2.6.22)14:40
wbeenemaybe from a distro standpoint; personally i just update occasionally with whatever is newest14:41
RedShiftthen when 2.6.24 is out, use 2.6.23.<latest>14:41
wbeenei think i'm still using what came with crux14:41
wbeene2.6.20.314:41
treachman, linux development is just going so fast it feels like it's about to disintegrate. :/14:43
wbeenei kindof like gnome's regular release cycle14:43
RedShifttreach: well, I remember reading "develop fast and release fast" somewhere14:44
RedShiftor was it "develop fast and release often"14:44
tilmanrelease early, release often14:44
treachRedShift: well, considering your nick, I suppose you're aware of the phenomen "dispersion" :p14:44
RedShifttreach: well... shit happens :D14:45
RedShiftI think it would be pretty major when the linux kernel gets forked14:45
treachwell, the problem is the same as with a ray of light or a radio signal.14:46
treachit's composed of a lot of different signals with different frequencies, all traveling at different speeeds.14:47
treacheh, "speeds"14:47
RedShiftyes I know14:47
RedShiftbut the stuff that's unmaintained is usually very obscure stuff not by alot of people14:47
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RedShiftand when something does get unmaintained someone else picks it up14:48
treachwell, no matter what, I feel sometimes the speed is so high it's getting tough to get even the most basic stuff synced.14:48
jjpkThey should do a few clean up releases.14:50
treachjust watch the latest; 9 rc's, and then another release rigth on top of it, fixing even *more* bugs.14:50
RedShiftjjpk: they already do that14:50
RedShiftthey backport patches from current development to the latest "stable" release14:51
RedShifthence the fourth number in the kernel series, dedicated to fixing critical bugs and security issues14:51
RedShifttreach: yeah they did release very short after the ninth RC14:52
wbeenehow long before we have 5 numbers in a kernel version? :P14:52
RedShiftwe already have 5 numbers in the kernel versions14:53
wbeeneargh :P14:53
wbeeneok14:53
RedShift2.6.23.1 is 5 numbers right? :P14:53
wbeenenot if you cound 23 as twenty-three14:54
wbeenecount14:54
treachhey, that's uncalled for14:54
RedShiftin our language we have "getallen" and "cijfers"14:56
wbeenehuh?14:56
treachsure, numbers and digits..?14:56
RedShiftyes14:56
RedShiftthat was the word I was looking for, digits :D14:56
treach"tal" and "siffor", fwiw. I guess most languages have the distinction14:57
RedShiftbut that leaves me to a more important task14:58
RedShifttoilet time14:58
RedShiftbrb14:58
mike_kRedShift: http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanb/documents/away_msgs.html15:08
aonit's highly important to report when you go to the toilet15:08
mike_kseems so15:09
jjpkEven more important is to have a wifi receiver jammed to your skull.15:09
jjpkThen using it to communicate from beyond, namely the toilet.15:10
RyoS/name ryo|pimpingmygf15:10
mike_kaon: how is your deep forest operations?15:10
RyoSsnap15:10
aonmike_k: fine15:10
RedShiftthere, done15:11
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vfuller_hello?15:12
RedShiftI wonder why we aren't filling ourselfs with liquor and mating with other humans like regular people do on fridaynights15:12
vfuller_its still friday afternoon15:12
vfuller_where im at...15:12
vfuller_anyways, i have package problem15:13
vfuller_when i do "pkgmk -d -i" for audacity15:13
vfuller_it says theres an md5sum mismatch15:14
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jessicai'm looking for some help!15:15
mike_kjessica: where did you get that port from?15:15
aontry to redownload the tarball15:15
jessicaokay15:16
jessicai used the website15:16
jessicathree of the pkgfiles were empty15:16
jessicathe crux ports search15:17
jessicastill got problems15:17
jessicai;m using the one from www.diedrickdevries.net15:18
jessicai used the httpup command, then tried to use pkgmk, then i got an md5 mismatch, which is weird15:18
jaegeryou could check the type of the file, make sure it got downloaded properly15:19
jaegerif not, get it from another place15:19
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jessicaoh i see, just change the source url in the Pkgfile?15:21
jessicathat'll probably help me15:21
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vfullerproblem solved15:21
thrice`you can also view why the md5 sum fails, as it's stored as ".md5sum" in that directory.  see what's it's expecting15:21
vfullerokay15:22
mike_kalso take a look at: http://crux.nu/Main/Faq#ntoc2315:23
mike_kthat is sourceforge who changed something again15:23
mike_kaudacity site has the same broken url15:23
vfullerah okay15:24
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mike_kafter adjusting /etc/hosts this urls should work: http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=623515:24
jessicathank you, linux is so hard sometimes15:25
mike_kand after getting the right tarball you can emal the maintainer about that change.15:25
jessicanow what md5sum is it checking against? the one in the tarball?15:26
jessica*just a little question to help understand better*15:26
thrice`it compares the md5sum of the source tar vs. the .md5sum in that directory15:27
jessicawhere does the .md5sum in the directory come from? the httpup?15:27
thrice`it's uploaded by the port maintainer15:28
thrice`along with the .footprint and Pkgfile15:28
mike_kwhich was created by the packager, when he downloaded the source for first time15:28
jessicaoh, so one is created when i do an update?15:28
mike_kno15:28
mike_kjust if it is absent15:28
tilmanit's downloaded from the server15:28
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jessicaokay15:29
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thrice`you CAN update it, upon updating the port, with pkgmk -um15:34
jessicaokay15:38
jessicathat worked15:43
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jessicathanks15:50
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jjpkThrow your brain out day.17:03
jjpkDo not read documentation day.17:04
treachfsck.squishy /dev/brain17:07
treachEXIT: ERROR 417:07
jjpk:D17:09
jjpkThe same applies to the political messenger on our mailing list. :D17:10
jjpkI know I know, this is spam, BUT I WILL SEND IT REGARDLESS. muhaha17:10
treachyeah. damn idiot17:11
* drijen gives treach and jjpk a beer17:12
jjpkBesides, Ron Paul won't win.17:13
jjpkToo radical.17:13
treachmaybe he's sane. :x17:13
treachFor american politicians that seems to be a radical trait..17:14
tilmandoes he run for president or what?17:14
jjpkThe way I understood his "stance" is that he represents the old school thought, the type you will not find anymore in the mainstream.17:14
treach"Hey, lets do something radical, really out there! Let's elect someone sane for a change!"17:14
jjpkNanny state versus the militants, go pick. :D17:15
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jjpkRight, since it's friday, *no one* is using freenode, leading the admins to do whatever they do. nice17:21
tilmanChanServ(ChanServ@services.)- [#ubuntu] Welcome to #ubuntu17:21
tilmanChanServ(ChanServ@services.)- [#typo3] Welcome to Typo3 Official IRC17:22
tilmanwtf?17:22
jjpkhaha17:22
treachplaying netsplit, more interesting than chess. :>17:22
jjpkThe ubuntu conspiracy? resistance is futile, all your distro are belong to us.17:22
treachI think that's ballmers line17:23
treachthat guy seriously needs a bullet in the head17:23
tilmansome hours i got the impression that some guys used "ubuntu" when they really meant "linux'17:23
tilman:/17:23
jjpkI thought his line was "your ass and your money are ours"17:23
jjpktilman: yep. since it's big and popular, and no one bothers to dig deeper, the rest is history.17:24
treachtilman: sure you don't mean they meant "GNU/Linux"? ;)17:24
jjpkubuntu = one and only linux. :D17:24
treach(I think I just made it into tilman's ignorelist. :P )17:27
tilmanwhat makes you think you weren't there before?17:27
tilmanoh, wait.17:27
RyoSlol17:30
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jjpkcyclers17:54
jjpkWonder what else will pop up at these hours.18:04
jjpkNight brings out the odd and the decrepit. :p18:04
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Raizenanyone here who can help me?20:44
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Raizenhey predator20:45
predatorfreakHi.20:45
Raizenif I upgrade my kernel, what do I need to do to ensure I can compile external modules safely against the new kernel when I load under it?20:45
Raizeni tried doing that with a kernel upgrade and20:45
Raizennvidia couldn't compile right20:46
Raizenafter I uninstalled it20:46
Raizenmeh20:46
jaegernothing you can do unless you know how to patch it20:47
Raizenyou can't?20:48
* Raizen boggles.20:48
Raizenso then how are you supposed to compile nvidia against a new kernel if you upgrade>?20:49
jaegernot if the new version breaks it20:49
Raizenor any other external module20:49
jaegeryou just rebuild the port if there's no incompatibility20:49
Raizenah20:49
Raizenwell20:49
Raizenit had issues with my kernel headers when I replaced my20:49
Raizen2.6.23 kernel with a 2.6.23.1 kernel20:49
Raizenor osmething20:50
jaegerthat's pretty odd20:50
RaizenI uninstalled the nvidia package20:50
Raizenthen I tried to reinstall it20:50
predatorfreakRaizen: Yeah, it is odd.20:50
Raizen:|20:50
predatorfreakESPECIALLY since nvidia works perfectly here.20:50
Raizeni think i'll remove the nvidia package first20:50
Raizenbefore I perform any kernel compilation20:51
Raizenetc20:51
predatorfreakYou shouldn't have too.20:51
Raizenjust remove it before I reboot into the new kernel?20:51
predatorfreaka kernel compile never even touches the nvidia module.20:51
Raizenwell the old one becomes invalid and needs to be recompiled, right?20:51
predatorfreakRaizen: It should just not-load on new kernels due to being in the old kernels directory.20:51
predatorfreakRaizen: Only if the kernel has changed enough to warrant it.20:52
predatorfreakThings like adding or removing one driver generally don't affect binary compatibility.20:52
Raizenoh I think I know what did it20:52
RaizenI moved the kernel source around a bit20:52
Raizenshould I just leave the kernel source where it is?20:52
Raizenhrm20:53
Raizenhow funny20:53
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Raizenthe madwifi package can't compile against my kernel20:53
RaizenI guess I need to use cvs20:54
Raizenerr20:54
Raizensvn20:54
Raizenthats what the #madwifi people suggested20:54
jaegerworth a try20:54
Raizenif it compiles20:54
Raizeni'll write a pkgfile for it :)20:54
Raizenno sense writing a pkg file if the source won't even compile20:55
predatorfreakKernel source should always be in /usr/src/20:55
Raizennod20:55
predatorfreakand the current kernel source should be symlinked to /usr/src/linux :)20:55
jaegerI never symlink it20:55
jaegerever20:55
Raizenhow do I check what symlinks are currently in place?20:56
RaizenI had this package that refused to compile and complained about a missing20:57
Raizenasm/system.h O_o20:57
jaegera kernel build should fix that20:57
jaegerI just leave the source in /usr/src/linux-2.6.xx.y20:57
RaizenI did that20:57
Raizenbut20:57
Raizenit still complains20:57
Raizencould you see if you can fully compile the complib part of the 0.0.6 golem package?20:58
Raizengolem.sourceforge.net20:58
RaizenI haven't had any luck on any of the distros i've tried20:58
Raizenpredator?21:00
Raizenhow do I update the symlinks to my kernels source when I upgrade kernels?21:00
predatorfreakrm /usr/src/linux; ln -sf /usr/src/linux-VERSIONHERE21:01
RaizenI don't have a /usr/src/linux21:01
predatorfreakEh don't worry about it.21:01
RaizenI have a /usr/src/linux-2.6.23.121:01
predatorfreakmost things go by /lib/modules/`uname -r`/SOMETHINGTHATIFORGOTHERE21:01
Raizendoes the source automatically do that when you build it?21:01
predatorfreakDo what?21:02
Raizenupdate symlinks so that you can compile against the new kernel?21:02
predatorfreakNo, the symlink is a compatibility trick for old, broken packages which expect the source to be at /usr/src/linux.21:02
Raizenoh21:02
jaegerwhich you should almost never need21:03
Raizenso then do the newer ones get the source location from the running kernel?21:03
predatorfreakRaizen: No.21:03
* Raizen boggles.21:03
jaegerthey should get it from /lib/modules/`uname -r`/source21:03
predatorfreakjaeger: Actually, build.21:03
jaegerwhich is a properly created symlink installed with modules21:04
jaegerwell, both are21:04
predatorfreakAt least, most I see use build.21:04
Raizenso why do you need to store the source code in /usr/src?21:04
jaegeryou don't, technically21:04
Raizenif its located in /lib/modules/kernel/source?21:04
jaegerit's not, that's a symlink21:05
Raizenheh21:05
jaegerlrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 23 Oct 10 22:21 build -> /usr/src/linux-2.6.22.921:05
jaegerbut it's created by the modules install process21:05
Raizenrofl21:05
jaegeryou could build your kernel in /what/the/fruit/linux-2.6.xx.y if you felt like it21:05
Raizenis /usr/src used to store anything but kernel source?21:05
Raizenit sounds like it could store the source for everything you have on your system21:06
jaegerit's used for whatever you want to store, really21:06
jaegermine typically only has kernel source in it but I build things out of my homedir most of the time if I'm not using ports21:06
Raizenbut I personally purge the leftover source code21:06
predatorfreakThe original intention for /usr/src was to store source code.21:06
Raizenand just leave the include stuff21:06
predatorfreakThat's actually what Red Hat and gang use it for.21:06
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Raizenfor libraries that need21:06
Raizenthem to compile21:07
predatorfreakRaizen: This is CRUX, not freaking Red Hat.21:07
predatorfreakWe don't work that way :P21:07
jaegerif you want to store all of your source in /usr/src there's no reason you cannot21:07
predatorfreakRandomly purging kernel source is a bad idea anyway.21:07
jaegeryour choice21:07
Raizencan I safely delete the old kernel source if I replace it with a new kernel?21:07
predatorfreakand all includes and the like are installed anyway, leftover stuff should be cleaned up by pkgmk/prt-get/etc.21:08
predatorfreakRaizen: As general policy I leave the last kernel I built in /usr/src.21:08
predatorfreakBecause I like to have a backup with full source.21:08
predatorfreakBut that's just me.21:08
RaizenI'm asking after I've booted into my new kernel21:08
Raizenand it checks out21:08
Raizenbut you know distros these days21:09
Raizenlike to package binary and source seperately21:09
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jaegerit's generally safe to remove versions you're not actively using21:09
jaegergenerally not being always :)21:09
Raizenthats bad if you compile anything yourself21:09
Raizenman21:10
Raizenis anyone else having issues with sourceforge's download redirector lately?21:10
predatorfreakI force it to use easynews, so it never randomly goes here or there then there or here.21:10
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jaegerthey don't seem to police their mirrors well at all21:10
jaegerI force it to easynews as well21:11
RaizenI feel I can fully trust jaeger's httpup repo...21:12
thrice`don't trust jaeger !21:12
predatorfreakRaizen: Watch out, his ports might rape you :P21:13
Raizenwhys that?21:13
* Raizen rolls his eyes.21:13
predatorfreakRaizen: Actually, that was sarcasm.21:13
Raizenhrm21:14
Raizenif I wanted to use a kernel on the PS2 linux, what kernel would you suggest I use?21:14
Raizen2.4.x series of 2.2.x?21:14
Raizenor*21:14
predatorfreakAnything that would work?21:15
predatorfreakI've no idea, I've never used PS2 Linux.21:15
jaegersame here, no idea21:15
predatorfreakChrist do ASUS really need to ship motherboards with a fake off-board soundcard (when in reality it's just an external DAC and output board)?21:16
predatorfreakI mean, 300 dollars and you get some useless bundled apps, a good motherboard and a shitty DAC sound board.21:17
predatorfreakBlarg.21:17
RaizenI don't use asus21:17
Raizenthe only manufacturers i've dealt with are biostar and ecs21:18
predatorfreakNext board I buy will probably be a Gigabyte, since they seem to be the only ones making SANE single boards.21:18
Raizenbiostar seems pretty nice21:19
jaegerI've got asus, biostar, gigabyte21:20
jaegergigabute are my favorite lately21:20
predatorfreakGigabute?21:21
jaegerindeed21:21
predatorfreakjaeger: Is that a new manufacturer? :P21:21
jaegerno21:21
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mwansai use an indeed motherboard they are pretty good :P21:22
jaeger198621:22
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Raizenirssi...21:24
Raizen:)21:24
Raizennow if only I could find a good command line mud client with all the features I need21:24
predatorfreakAwesome thing is now that the X38 boards are out, P35 boards are gonna be getting cheaper :321:24
Raizenhow much faster is i686 compare to i386? i wonder21:26
Raizencompared*21:26
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jaegerI'm really happy with my Gigabyte P35 so far21:29
jaegerGA-P35-DS3L21:30
predatorfreakjaeger: If I can muster a good 300 bucks, I'm probably gonna wind up buying one of those boards, a C2D and a decent case.21:31
predatorfreakFreaking tiny-ass Micro ATX cases :(21:32
RaizenI use an ATX mid tower myself21:34
Raizenenough working room21:34
Raizen:)21:34
Raizenwithout being too large21:34
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RaizenI personally use lilo22:06
Raizenerr22:06
Raizenoops22:06
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Raizenanyone here?23:41
mwansashhh we tryina sleep23:43
Raizenanyone know how I can configure lilo to display a prompt so I can load a secondary experimental kernel?23:58
mwansaadd prompt23:59
Raizenand a second entry for the other kernel?23:59

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