IRC Logs for #crux Wednesday, 2008-02-27

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Romsterhmm waht todo now.. and why is my qemu not releasing my shared memory...00:10
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pitillogood morning01:21
aonmorning01:26
Romsterhi01:28
Romsteri have a crazy problem i got used memory in /dev/shm i can't see anything in lsof and i can not umount it. kqemu filled it up...01:29
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NicePicsWhere can I get the efika patchset for 2.6.24+ ? Is it just the sound patch?01:32
Romsteri don't know of it01:34
Romsterisn't even listed in ketchup file so it's not so popular maybe. guess google for it.01:35
Romstersince when is that crux related?01:35
Romster#linuxhelp01:35
NicePicsacrux|ppc: requesting latest efika patchset01:36
Romsterhe is marked away.01:41
Romsterbest to either idle and wait or email him.01:41
NicePicsok, thanks01:44
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ryuo hey Romster01:57
ryuodid you give the theme i ported to pekwm a try?01:57
Romsterah no i should..01:58
Romsteri'm liking that theme.01:58
Romsteri can't release shm memory for some damn strange reason bloody kqemu module..01:59
ryuoi noticed :p02:00
ryuoeven afteri unloaded kqemu02:00
ryuoit wouldnt release the memory it used02:00
Romsterso smae issue..02:00
Romstersame*02:00
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Romsteryeah that's jsut it and i can not umount it and lsof says nothing for shm02:01
Romsterso it arn't jsut me.02:01
Romsterryuo, you find a solution or just rebooted.02:01
ryuonope just had to reboot02:02
Romsterbah that sucks02:02
ryuoi'm considering just using virtualbxo02:02
ryuo:p02:02
Romsteri've not tryed that ever yet.02:02
Romsterkinda used to qemu02:03
ryuoit has soemthing useful that qemu doesnt02:03
ryuo"seamless integration"02:03
Romsterunless vbox works nearly the same.02:03
ryuoreminds me of wine02:03
Romsterhmm02:03
Romsteri use wine to but it's no good for somethings yet02:03
ryuofor example, the titlebar fo windows'll show on top of your native one if you have one02:03
ryuoi tried it for awhile...02:04
ryuothe way its structured, its like a free open source version of vmware02:05
Romsteron another note i've changed my tmpfs defaults too noexec,nosuid,defaults02:07
Romsterread about root kits using tmp.02:07
Romstermight aswell goto the new kernel version while i'm at it. ont he reboot02:09
teKI just got a magazine from Fujitsu Siemens were Marc Shuttleworth is interviewd. There's a picture of himming sitting in front of his Library. There's a Book (by Richard Aellen) standing next to him titled 'CRUX'.02:10
teKc02:10
ryuoheres a thought02:10
ryuohow can a root kit use /tmp to hijack a system it cant get root access to02:10
ryuoO_O02:10
Romster /tmp can run anything as any user has has access to the system, mainly servers with php/apache etc exploits.02:11
ryuowhich is why its a good idea to chroot jail servers heh02:12
Romsterhttp://www.layeredtech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=359002:12
ryuoonly provide them with what they need ;)02:12
Romsteryeah02:12
Romsterso if they screw up it's all in the chroot.02:12
ryuothat way if they get hacked, they only effect their jail02:12
Romsteryep02:12
ryuoa smart way to keep your whole system from suffering02:12
Romsterevery little bit helps though.02:13
ryuoonly server i would run that lets outsiders in is...02:13
ryuoat system level is sshd02:13
Romsterya02:14
ryuoits a good idea to chroot jail external users who you dont know well02:14
Romsterso they can't leave /home/user02:14
ryuoromster02:14
ryuodo symlinks for binaries work in chroot?02:15
ryuoor do you have to copy the whole thing02:15
Romsterhard symlinks work.02:15
Romstersoft ones fail.02:15
ryuothat would be useful for...02:15
ryuolinking what you want them to be able to use without02:15
Romstersafe-build hardlinks some files02:15
ryuohaving to copy the whole binary02:16
Romstersaves space.02:16
ryuowhats the difference between soft and hard links?02:16
ryuo*boggles*02:16
Romsteralthough i'm not over sure what editing a chrooted hardlink would do.02:16
ryuohrm02:16
Romstersoft just points to the other file.02:16
ryuoif you wanted to stop them from being able to02:17
Romsterhardlinke uses the file's node.02:17
Romsterhardlink*02:17
ryuochange what it links to you could...02:17
ryuomake it root editable only02:17
ryuoin fact02:17
Romstersymlinks are the permission of the existing file.02:17
Romsterthat it points too.02:17
ryuothe only directory i've ever created with mode 777 is02:17
ryuothe /tmp02:17
ryuosides02:18
ryuowho really needs execute priveleges in tmp?02:18
Romsterhmm does tmp even need executable access.02:18
ryuoonly time your noexec would cause problems is in02:18
ryuocompiling02:18
Romsterlol...02:18
Romsteryeah but i have a tmpfs in /usr/ports/work02:18
Romsterfor that02:18
Romsterset as pkgmk user.02:19
ryuoprobably a good idea to compile as a non-root user02:19
ryuoa malicious Pkgfile can fuck your system up02:19
ryuothough rare02:19
ryuoi noticed your not likely to find malicious software under linux vs windows02:20
ryuoyou know what i think is funny romster?02:22
ryuoI found an instance when bzip2 does worse than gzip02:22
ryuoi tried compressing my themes tar with gzip and bzip2, and bzip2 was larger02:22
ryuoo_o02:29
ryuowish i knew how to remaster a crux iso, so i could lower its size with lzma compression02:30
ryuointeresting. arch now has regularly builds of e17 in community02:31
pitilloregulary builds?02:33
pitillo"stable" snapshots of a development wm?02:33
ryuoregular builds02:33
ryuosome guy builds cvs snapshots every 2-4 weeks i hear02:33
pitillowhat I said... "stable" snapshots of a development wm02:34
ryuopitillo, its been developement for 8 years02:34
ryuox_X02:34
pitilloryuo, yes?02:34
pitilloxD02:34
ryuoonly way to get e1702:34
ryuopersonally i wouldnt make any themes for it...02:34
ryuobecause in 1 month it could be too out of "date"02:35
pitillopersonally I don't use any theme wich isn't the default02:35
ryuoits starting to come along though02:35
pitilloI am waiting the new default theme, wich will be a nice one02:35
ryuoit has a file manager thats coming along02:35
ryuostill i dont like e17 much02:36
Romsterryuo, yeah i compile as pkgmk for packages now.02:36
ryuoit has no good clocks for the panel02:36
pitilloryuo, I don't share that opinion. But the best, like I said yesterday, is to have choices02:36
ryuodigital clock is way too small for me to read02:37
ryuoi dont like analog02:37
ryuoetc02:37
pitilloryuo, there are 2, the analog and the digital one, if you don't like them, you have the choice of making another one and share it with the comunity02:37
Romsterryuo, tilman said he would add in lzma support for libarchive so then things will work good for compression then.02:37
ryuo<-- i dont know how to code in linux, so shadda up <_<02:37
pitilloshadda?02:38
ryuoshut up02:38
ryuo<_<02:38
Romsterlol02:38
pitillodo you mean I must shut up?02:39
ryuo=p02:39
pitillopffff02:39
ryuoRomster: would be nice, heh. crux is already small on the CD, just thought it could be shrunk even more02:40
ryuofor people who wish to download but have slow connection speeds02:40
ryuoevery piece you can shave off is good02:40
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Romsterryuo, thats why i'm working on intergrating xdelta into pkgmk and wanting lzma02:43
Romsterhmmz02:43
RedShiftuh delta packaging is so useless03:02
RedShiftsomeone at archlinux tested it and the binary diff were nearly as large as the new packages, rendering delta packages useless03:02
RedShiftthey decided to implement it anyway - wtf03:02
Romsterbinary yes but i'm doing it at the distfile stage..03:04
Romsterdiff of old and new version of foo.tar03:04
Romstertake a look to the wesnoth xdelta files beteween versions 1-6MB approx compared to downloading over 100MB every file change.03:05
Romsterthat's what i'm talking about.03:05
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cruxbotopt.git: imagemagick: updated to 6.3.9-004:00
Romsterhmm 6.3.9-0 is beta 6.3.8-11 is stable.04:02
Romsterlovely..04:02
Romsternow i have to really fix ports that break with that version.04:02
pitilloummm interesting, I don't know how but seems that nat isn't working with vbox now...04:03
pitillolet go giving a try rebuilding some deps...04:04
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namenlosRomster: in your moc port it would be (imho) not a bad idea, to also install the keymap.exaple file to /usr/share/moc04:57
namenlosi had to extract the sources to find the file...04:58
Romsterhmm04:58
namenlosonly a suggestion04:58
Romsterwould make it easier to use.04:59
namenlosyepp04:59
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Romsteri already install the config.example05:01
namenlosRomster: yes, but not the keymap.05:06
namenloslunch05:06
Romsterdone pushing it now.05:07
Romsterand done.05:08
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ryuohey Romster05:36
Romsterya eh still haven't doing a sysup and rebuilding all my pythong stuff atm just uped my python to 2.5.205:36
ryuoRomster: feel like making a method for compiling a kernel that makes it easier for people to compile their own?05:37
Romstersomeone already have packaged the kernel.05:37
ryuofor crux of course05:37
Romsteris it too hard todo the kernel as it is?05:38
ryuowell05:38
ryuosome people have difficulty with configuring it05:38
Romsterall we really need is a decent guide of what is absolutely requred and to use lspci and lsusb to find what device drivers a person needs.05:38
ryuoi noticed that hwd, some utility arch has in its repos, can identify lspci and what modules go with them, if any exist, usually05:39
ryuosometimes i just get tired of customizing kernels for a specific system...05:40
ryuotakes several hours of my time to go through all the options05:40
ryuomaybe we could write a set of scripts to help with the configuring of the kernel new crux users use...05:42
ryuobut this might be better left to05:42
Rotwangryuo: you may use kernel from differnt distro ;]05:43
ryuomake config05:43
ryuoetc05:43
ryuoa set of guidelines would probably be easier05:43
ryuoi wonder why the kernel still supports the ISA bus05:44
ryuothat thing is so deprecated its not even funny05:44
namenloswhy can't i use "§" as a key for moc?05:44
ryuoŸ05:44
* Romster shrugs05:45
ryuo”able for 2 please.05:45
ryuocool alt+ codes work :d05:45
ryuo«05:45
Romsterhow did you get alt+codes to work?05:45
ryuoi'm using them on my virtual console05:45
Romsteri miss that feature05:45
ryuoin irssi righ now05:45
ryuonot sure if they work in xorg05:46
Romsteralt+numpad was one thing i used to use alot.05:46
Romsteri doubt it i'd offound it if it did.05:46
ryuohmph05:46
ryuodoes not work in xorg05:46
Romsteri've thought of a hardware configuratior but the kernel changes so damn fast it would be a nightmare to keep up with05:46
ryuobut it works on the regular console05:46
ryuowierd05:46
Romsteri want it in xorg damn it.05:47
ryuoRomster, how about we write a blueprint for compiling a kernel?05:47
ryuoor guide05:47
ryuoor whatever05:47
Romstereh maybe i do have a lot of tigns todo as it is.05:47
Romsterthings*05:47
ryuolike most important components05:47
ryuoetc, PATA/SATA controllers05:48
Romsterlibata hotplug can't really do FS05:48
Romsterother than defaults for new systems.05:48
ryuoi've never used SATA, etc, hotplug05:49
ryuoseems kinda stupid05:49
Romsterand not always want kernel video as they may want to use binary video drivers.05:49
ryuoi do use scsi hotplug for USB devices but thats it05:49
Romsteri've removed core/hotplug05:49
Romsteron all my systems05:49
ryuoI've even seen PCI hotplug05:49
ryuoand my question is "when would i ever use this?"05:50
Romsteryeah05:50
Romsterthere is even cpu and memory hotplug *shrugs*05:50
ryuoi'm used to shutting down to do any hardware changes05:50
Romsterthat's even mor erare than finding pci.05:50
Romstermore rare*05:50
ryuothe only hotplug i find useful is for stuff like USB05:50
ryuowhere you have to have it05:50
ryuoor its kinda useless05:50
Romsterusb is hot plug by design05:50
ryuono duh =p05:51
Romsterwel defalts for ACPI etc would be nice for power saving.05:51
ryuoi streamlined an old version of windows to use for my virtual machine05:51
Romsterwell*05:51
ryuowindows 200005:51
ryuoi streamlined all the hotfixes available onto it and removed IE/WMP05:52
Romsteri have win 3.11, win xp home xp pro, 98se, win me (worst ever)05:52
ryuowhen i tested it, the machine reported only05:52
ryuo~45 MB of ram being used05:52
Romsternot bad05:52
ryuowindows 2000 is light by design05:52
ryuounlike XP...05:52
ryuomeh05:52
Romsterif only this kqemu didn't steal my /dev/shm <<05:52
ryuo«05:53
ryuo<_<05:53
ryuodo you use the frame buffer at all?05:53
Romsterfscking thing.05:53
ryuoI've started using it for my virtual consoles05:53
Romsteri haven't actually i dunno how that works.05:53
ryuoset to 256  colors05:53
ryuoits most useful feature is you can change the resolution05:53
Romsterbut it's on the install cd so maybe i should mess with it sometime.05:53
Romsteri'm in xorg most times on my desktop pc.05:54
ryuoand it also opens up devices to output video to framebuffer instead of xorg05:54
ryuoi even heard xfce4 will run in  the framebuffer05:54
RomsterO_o05:54
ryuoRomster, did you know theres pseudo "window managers" for text mode? XD05:55
Romsteryeah05:55
Romsternot used any of though.05:55
ryuoi guess if you wanted an old style computer05:55
ryuoetc, DOS, you could use the framebuffer for your graphics needs05:56
ryuoand it'd be like DOS =p05:56
ryuobut really, how many people really prefer the framebuffer over xorg?05:56
ryuosome cross-platform apps will work in the framebuffer, but only because their based off sdl05:57
ryuoman i'd probably switch to using text mode exclusively if i could get all my apps to work in it :p05:58
ryuobrb06:02
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Romstersweet Makefile for safe-build now.06:15
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ryuohey Romster06:54
ryuohad a chance to try the theme i ported?06:55
Romsterargh i'm messing witha  makefile guess i should try it before i forget...06:55
ryuo<_<06:55
ryuoi found a new panel app06:55
ryuolooks pretty interesting06:55
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ryuoonly problem is it that it uses a few obscure libraries06:56
Romsterbah how do i escape $ in a Makefile...06:56
Romster\$ don't work.06:57
Romsterhmm if there arn't many just port them if it's any good.06:57
ryuoi'm trying to get it running first06:57
ryuorunning from a terminal in xorg gives me some errors06:58
ryuonothing i cant fix06:58
ryuolike missing fonts06:58
ryuostuff i dont even have installed06:58
ryuoit does use imlib2 though06:58
ryuonot as though imlib2 is bad...06:58
ryuojust seems redundant sometimes06:58
Romsterah crap i think i need to use $$06:59
ryuoi can count my fingers all the apps i've ever used that used imlib206:59
ryuoon my*06:59
Romsterheh06:59
ryuofeh, idesk, eterm, and now this terminal06:59
ryuoerr07:00
ryuopanel07:00
ryuooh and pypanel07:00
ryuoyou noticed how perl is a de facto standard on all linux boxes, and python is also one, but not always present?07:00
Romsteryay that got it.07:01
ryuohrm python 2.5 has an update07:01
ryuo2.5.207:01
Romsterfeh is nice07:01
ryuofeh is okay, but i dont like it much07:01
ryuoi would prefer a GUI image viewer over it07:01
ryuosome stuff i've grown used to using a GUI for07:01
Romsterffmpeg giblib libast pekwm07:02
Romsterthat i use imlib2 on.07:02
ryuopekwm doesnt use imlib2 actually07:02
ryuonot anymore07:02
RomsterO_o07:02
Romsterhmm07:02
ryuoit draw png and jpeg directly now07:02
ryuodraws*07:02
Romsteroh07:02
Romsterthat needs tobe fixed then.07:02
ryuoas does the DL url07:03
Romsterthat got changed.07:03
ryuoi have a few different distros i use in different environments07:03
Romsterbut the entire pore looks ecky.07:03
Romsterport*07:03
ryuoonly 3 i really like any more07:03
ryuoarch, crux, and lunar07:03
ryuoon my future UMPC device, i might just stick to the framebuffer instead of xorg07:04
ryuoin some cases,  xorg is more of a burden than its worth07:05
Romsterhmm now to see how bad i borked safe-build this time, i've added a Makefile moved some stuff and added in a option to chose what crux version to use on the command line.07:06
ryuowhats safe-build07:07
Romsterxorg is good for a full blown desktop07:07
Romsterdon't need ti for smaller stuff.07:07
Romstermy chroot wrapper to build ports in.07:07
Romstermy little project07:07
ryuosadly, i know of no browser thats as good as firefox but will run in the framebuffer07:07
Romsterfirefox3 <<07:07
ryuofirefox3 runs in the framebuffer?07:07
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ryuoi'm sticking to 2 until 3 is stabilized07:08
Romsterdunno but ti's a step up from 207:08
Romsterit's*07:08
Romstertrench has ported it.07:08
ryuoi'm waiting until mozilla officially replaces 2 with 307:08
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Romsterlol don't hold your breath ryuo07:09
ryuoit'll probably be a good while07:09
Romsterya07:09
ryuoa year at most hopefully07:09
ryuojust wish you guys had a seamonkey port =p07:09
ryuoits a nostalgic web browser for people who used to use mozilla/netscape =p07:10
Romsteri used to use mozilla07:10
Romstersomeone had a port i copyied it but didn't get to build it right.07:11
ryuomaybe you can try making a seamonkey por07:11
ryuoport07:11
ryuothere isnt one really in all the crux ports07:11
treachiirc predatorfreak has/had a working port for it07:11
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Romsteri haev a seamonkey port but it's unfinished.07:11
ryuoimho, flock is a wierd browser07:11
Romsterdunno where i copied it from.07:12
Romsterbut wen i went to compile it i lost a stack of files out of the .footprint07:12
ryuoi find web browsers a hastle to setup a pkgfile for07:12
Romsterdilo is a werid browser.07:12
ryuousually you have tons of patches to apply07:12
ryuoas well07:12
ryuonot to mention all the config options07:13
ryuobrowsers are one of the most complex internet apps to date07:13
Romsterfun++;07:13
Romsteryeah07:13
Romsterother than tunderbird.07:13
Romsterthunderbird*07:13
ryuoeasy to use, but hard to deal with at the technical level07:13
ryuolooking at all the config options in firefox07:13
ryuomakes me feel like i'm looking through a windows registry07:14
ryuomost of the options make no sense07:14
Romsterlol07:14
Romsterhkey_hash stuff.07:14
ryuoi betcha configuring FVWM would be easier07:14
Romsterlolz07:14
Romsterman i'm puting a pizza on i'm f'ing hungery now. <<07:15
ryuoi like pekwm pretty well07:15
ryuohas all the features i've come to expect in a window manager07:15
ryuoi setup my pekwm theme with all pngs07:15
ryuooptimized with optipng07:15
ryuo=D07:15
Romsterfor me that was in KDE then jumped into pekwm i've got used to most of pekwm07:15
thrice`have a good screenshot of your pekwm all setup?07:16
ryuoi dont have all my supplemental software but i can show you my current window decor, etc.07:16
ryuosupplemental, like panels.07:16
Romsteri still need to figure out transparancy07:16
ryuonice thing is, pekwm also has a harbour which works with dock apps07:16
ryuoRomster, i got transparency working =D07:17
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ryuoI use it in my window buttons07:17
Romsterhow does that stuff work?07:17
ryuoand rounded borders07:17
ryuoi set it up in gimp by adding the alpha channel07:17
ryuoand when the buttons are loaded by pekwm07:17
ryuothe alpha parts absorb the titlebars background07:18
ryuoalpha transparency is used in pixmaps to give windows rounded edges as well07:18
ryuoor to make them look transparent07:18
ryuounlike some window managers that can't handle transparency at all07:18
Romsterholly hell if i haven't broken anything in this safe-build verion i'll be suprised, http://hg.shortcircuit.net.au/romster/rev/1a2b499cf42907:19
ryuothrice`: still want a snapshot?07:19
Romsterryuo, ah07:19
treachis that Holly Fucks bsm sister?07:19
Romsteri need a good read of seting transparancy stuff in xorg.07:19
ryuoRomster, i implement it in a basic form in my pixmaps07:20
ryuoit can be used by both xpms and pngs07:20
Romsteranyways now i'm gonna put a pizza in the oven.07:20
Romstertreach, good one..07:20
ryuoin russia, the oven puts the pizza in yo07:20
ryuoyou07:20
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ryuookay if you want a picture...07:26
ryuohttp://members.byond.com/Ryuo/files/pekwm.png07:26
thrice`ah, nice :)07:26
ryuoi posted my theme to box-look.org07:27
Romsterya i'm so gonna load that up after i get food <<07:29
Romsterdunno how you can handle the scroll bar on the left.07:29
ryuowhich one?07:29
ryuothe one in aterm?07:29
Romsteraterm07:29
ryuooh07:30
Romsteryeah07:30
ryuoi havent configured it yet =p07:30
Romsterah07:30
ryuoi like using optipng on a theme after i'm finished with it07:30
ryuoreduces the file size even more07:30
Romstersounds good07:31
ryuomain reason i like png over xpm07:31
ryuobetter compression07:31
ryuobut some WMs only accept xpm07:31
ryuoya know07:32
ryuoif xf86 hadnt gone insane07:32
ryuowe'd still be using it07:32
Romsterhmm07:32
ryuopekwm reminds me of FVWM, its configuration can be defined to just abotu anything07:33
ryuoyou can name your stuff just about anything ;)07:33
ryuomaybe one day pekwm can set your background for you07:34
ryuoright now you have to use a 3rd party program to do that07:34
Romsteryeah i use feh for my background.07:36
Romsterwould be nice if i could have a diferent background for each desktop07:36
Romsteri think it's possable.07:37
ryuonever thought about that07:37
ryuomaybe if you could make each workspace a display?07:37
ryuoso you tried that theme yet? :o07:43
Romstereating right now07:55
Romsterthen i will07:55
Romsterater my stomach stpos bitching at me07:55
Romsterafter*07:55
treachstops. :p07:56
ryuoStomach: FEED ME BIATCH07:56
Romsterstops*07:56
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ryuo<_<07:56
Romsterya07:56
ryuoi had to change the doubleclick delay time to 350ms over the default 250ms07:57
ryuomy normal double clicks fall under 35007:57
treachnice.. google gets really confused with big numbers apparently. :D07:57
treach889 million Euros = 1.317498 billion U.S. dollars07:58
ryuoactually wouldnt it be07:58
ryuo~1.8 USD?07:58
ryuobillion*07:58
treachryuo: well, I kind of doubt the exchange rate is *that* bad07:58
ryuotreach: its currently about 2x07:59
Romsterlol07:59
treachnote the use of million vs billion..07:59
ryuoi should know...07:59
treachwheras if you use 1 million it gets it right07:59
ryuoodd07:59
ryuoits funny08:00
ryuoaustralian money is worth even less than american :>08:00
treachnot that I'd mind if they had finded MS  1.317498 billion dollars. :p08:00
treachfined*08:01
ryuopfft08:01
ryuoMS has over 40 billion it seems08:01
ryuoif you take MS's bid for yahoo seriously08:01
jjpkThe cost of doing business within the EU. ;)08:01
treachthey don't08:01
treachryuo: that deal would make them borrow money, for the first time ever in their history08:02
ryuomy thoughts were08:02
ryuoMS is sure desperate08:02
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jjpkDesperate? I doubt that.08:02
treachyeah, when you're at the top, there's pretty much only one way to go08:02
ryuoi betcha the only reason the IE got upgraded is because firefox started to "steal" their browser market share.08:02
treachof course. there were no reason to care before08:03
jjpkThey are trying to find new niches to profit from, as their adventure in the EU are becoming increasingly more expensive.08:03
treachjjpk: I doubt they will leave us alone.. :/08:03
ryuoi wonder if microsoft is starting to feel the weight of trying to keep up on all their different business fronts08:03
jjpkThey can afford it for now, they'll do anything to delay opening up their specs to allow for "better" interoperability with rival products.08:03
ryuoi get the impression mozilla is winning against IE, but i could be wrong...08:04
treachI don't think so. This is a fight they can't win, and shareholders will not sit idle and watch them waste billions on childish tantrums08:04
jjpkI disagree.08:05
jjpk(about the mozilla winning market share from IE)08:05
treachjjpk: if they waste too much money on this the board members could get sued.08:05
ryuoi wouldnt be surprised if microsoft is starting to crumble, slowly but surely.08:06
jjpkMS has hit a roadblock, but it is very unlikely they will disappear.08:06
ryuono empire lasts forever08:06
jjpk*nothing* lasts forever.08:07
treachexactly, as shown with IBM, Digital, the roman empire, etc. ;)08:07
ryuoMS probably views FOSS as the guerillas that are try to "upsurt" its power =p08:07
treachursurp?08:07
ryuoor that08:07
ryuosome words i've rarely seen used08:07
ryuo:X08:07
jjpkPerhaps in the server market, but on the desktop FOSS has a very, very long uphill battle.08:09
treacheh, make that "usurp", typing out of control. ;/08:09
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treachthat's mostly a marketing thing, the same could once be said for ms08:10
treachI mean nobody could claim DOS was superior to mac os back in the day, but it still won that battle.. :/08:10
ryuo"Remember kids, its the people with money who win!"08:11
ryuo<_<08:12
jjpkBetter technology is not a clear winner.08:12
treachno, it's the people who defines the rules who win.08:12
jjpkMarketing is massively important.08:12
jjpkThose who can dictate the terms.08:12
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jjpkYou might also lose out if you are unable to find a way to distribute your products widely and quickly.08:15
treachwell, I'd say that's a bigger problem for people farming vegetables than software companies, but ok, that too. :p08:16
jjpkSuppose a good way around that is having your own apparatus to move your product and advertise your services.08:16
treachit's not that easy to compete in marketing when *all* media reports as soon as your competitor as much as farts. :/08:17
jjpkAye.08:18
jjpkNon-news is news these days. incredible...08:18
ryuojjpk: Welcome to celebrity news.08:21
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jjpktreach: has anything new showed up on the pirate bay court case?08:58
treachno, not really. it's scheduled to go to court sometime near summer iirc08:58
treachit might even happen until autum.09:00
treach*not* even09:00
treach"If you don't have a case, drown everyone in paper and try to confuse them". :/09:00
jjpkThe typical scandinavian / nordic option.09:01
thrice`pirate bay is accused of...helping provide medium for piracy, basically ?09:01
treachthrice`: tbh, I don't know what they are accused of. I'm not even sure the prosecution is..09:02
jjpkCopyright infringement and all that jazz.09:02
thrice`well, they are different, since they don't actually track torrents, I thought09:02
jjpkThe prosecution and the state are putting an impressive shitkicker show.09:02
treach"Assisting with preparations to commit copyright infringement" or something like that iirc.09:02
thrice`ah, right09:03
treachwhich is completely silly for lots of reasons.09:03
jjpkThey would have a solid case if piratebay actually held the copyrighted material.09:04
treachbut they don't.09:04
jjpkThey don't, which kills the prosecution's case.09:04
treachand it's a complete waste of money.09:04
thrice`heh09:05
treachthis whole thing makes me just jangry.09:05
thrice`I don't think they're concerned about finances09:05
treach*angry09:05
jjpkthrice`: of course not. It is about putting a show: make the public think the government is doing something.09:05
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jjpkNot to mention the foreign interference aspect.09:05
treachjjpk: there are at *least* two other things that kills it as well.09:05
treach1. If you are to be convicted for assisting with a crime (sorry, don't know the proper english term) then *someone* has to be convicted for the original crime first.09:06
treachand so far nobody have.09:07
jjpkIt would be a shellshocking thought IF the swedish authorities are not appeasing the movie and recording industry lobbies.09:07
jjpkI think we will be seeing some sneaky maneuvering by the courts and the state because they are in trouble with this case.09:07
treachsecondly, "assistance" only applies if the original perpetrator commited a crime that resulted in a sentence consisting of minimum 2 years in prison.09:08
treachso far, nobody did.09:08
treachof course, I fully expect them to get convicted in the first instance, which constists largely by easily confused laymen.09:09
treach"consists"09:09
jjpkWonder if any last-minute law additions or changes will be thrown in to "help" the prosecution.09:09
treachdoesn't help09:09
treachunless you make the law retroactive, which would be extremely suspect09:09
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Romsterwould be like lets sue dvd burner makers they give us a means to priate software.09:16
Romstertreach, you seen this? http://freshmeat.net/projects/ramlog/ looks like a way to reduce disk access.09:16
treachRomster: yes. it's stupid, and a political play. unfortunately the lower rank courts here are notoriously stupid.09:17
treachthey have even admitted screenshots provided by the branch organisations as evidence in court!09:17
treachinsane09:18
Romsterso it'll get pased to a biger court and they'll just laugh at it.09:18
treachyeah, hopefully. they are usually not as stupid or prone to bend to political pressure, even if that happens too.09:19
Romsterscreenshots, that's a joke right?09:19
treachno. unfortunately not.09:19
Romsterdang.09:19
* treach hangs his head in shame09:19
treachit's a fucking disgrace09:19
Romsterthere is no case relaly jsut a bunch of fuckwits that think they have a case but don't09:20
Romsterreally*09:20
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ryuoRomster?09:46
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ryuohrm10:02
ryuoi'm gonna add some shadow color to my theme10:03
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* ryuo knocks on Romster's skull. Anyone home?11:01
* ryuo notes the skull is hollow.11:01
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cruxbotopt.git: zsh: updated to 4.3.511:30
cruxbotopt.git: postfix: updated to version 2.5.111:30
cruxbotopt.git: pinentry: updated to version 0.7.511:30
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tilmanqemu: fatal: triple fault12:42
tilmanwooooo12:42
RyoSdang-12:42
thrice`heh12:55
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ryuowee13:25
cruxbotopt.git: nvidia: Update to 169.12.13:27
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jaegerlovely, the nvidia build bug is back for me on this machine13:39
RedShiftlovely!13:39
RedShiftI had a costumer once that said that all the time13:40
jaegerthe oddest part is only this machine is affected13:40
jaegerI've had no trouble elsewhere13:40
RedShifteverytime I explained something, bad or good, he said "lovely"13:40
RedShiftalways cheerful :D13:40
jaegerheh13:40
jaegerI might switch to a binary distribution for this machine, will save time. still got plenty of other crux boxes13:41
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thrice`jaeger: there was recently a new driver release...try that?13:43
jaegeryeah, the new one is the one that breaks13:44
jaegerand until I installed 2.6.24.2, the last one broke as well13:44
thrice`or, just build on another box and scp it over :)13:44
jaegerI've done that a few times, built the same kernel config on the macbook pro and copied13:44
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predatorfreakjaeger: Blame me? :P13:52
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jaegerpredatorfreak: only if I actually believed it was your fault, which I don't. :)13:57
predatorfreakjaeger: Doesn't hurt to shift the blame anyway :P13:58
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jtnlhello14:03
predatorfreakjtnl: Hi14:06
jaegerheyo14:07
thrice`jaeger: do you dual boot crux on the MBP?14:08
jaegertriple boot crux, windows vista, and mac os x14:09
jaegerI don't have linux on it right now because I needed to reinstall it to test work stuff but that's my usual setup14:09
jaegerI wish I could find a good font for the os x terminal... Terminus would be ideal but I can't find one that works with it14:11
tilmanisn't there a ttf version of terminus?14:11
tilmani'm just guessing that ttfs would work ;P14:11
jaegerthere is, but for some reason when I install it in the mac font book thingy it shows up as an empty font14:12
joacimnone of the 3rd party fonts I installed on my mac looks right14:12
joacimthere is always something wrong with them14:12
jaegerthat's been my experience so far, I've no idea why it's so difficult14:13
predatorfreakjaeger: I never understood why people love Terminus so much.14:14
predatorfreakI just use rxvt-unicode and dejavu sans serif XD14:14
joacimI prefer DejaVu Sans tbh =)14:14
jaegerI can't speak for everyone but I like it so much because it's just damned clean to read14:14
tilmani love smooth in my terminals14:14
predatorfreakjaeger: Does it support glorious unicode? :P14:14
jaegerI'm certainly willing to try others if I can get them working :)14:14
jaegerno idea14:15
predatorfreakWell... seeing as it's an old-fashioned bitmap font14:16
predatorfreakI'd probably be boned for Unicode14:16
joacimI dont think it supports every character under the sun, but there was enough to talk to people from western nations =)14:16
joacimis14:17
predatorfreakjoacim: I require Cyrillic, at least XD14:17
predatorfreakand generally Japanese too.14:17
joacimpaste some moonrunes. then jaeger can tell you if they worked or not =)14:18
predatorfreakМашина Времени14:19
predatorfreakМастер14:19
predatorfreak:)14:19
tilmanrunes, not question marks14:19
* tilman slaps predatorfreak 14:19
predatorfreaktilman: I don't type in Finnish runes, screw you!14:19
predatorfreaktilman: But, more seriously.14:20
jaegerheh14:20
joacimI'm watching スケッチブック ~full color'S~14:20
predatorfreakEnable UTF-8 in your client14:20
predatorfreakThat's why they're marks for you :)14:20
tilmani think that would mean i have to restart irssi14:20
tilmanDO NOT WANT14:20
predatorfreakI dunno if irssi even supports UTF-8.14:21
joacimit does =)14:21
predatorfreakPlus it might be the terminal your using too :P14:21
predatorfreakonly uxterm and rxvt-unicode fully support UTF-8 on Linux, that I know of.14:21
tilmanprobably is14:21
joacimdont forget Terminal, Gnome terminal and konsole =)14:22
predatorfreakBLOAT!!!!14:22
predatorfreakBURN IN ETERNAL HELLFIRE!14:22
joacimsuperior scrolling speed14:22
sepennot yet supported in mrxvt14:22
predatorfreakjoacim: I debunked that shit once.14:22
joacimI did my own benchmark, Terminal was a bit faster, but i still prefer urxvt14:23
predatorfreakAll the scrolling speed tests actually wind up being more limited by X redraw rate.14:23
predatorfreakSome apps just have less shit in between them and X.14:23
predatorfreakSo they redraw faster14:23
joacimah14:23
predatorfreakor do less crap that slows them down.14:23
predatorfreakI remember someone said urxvt took like 1 min to scroll 10K lines of text14:24
joacimTerminal and gnome terminal has annoyances that prevents me from being comfortable with them14:24
joacimand konsole is just too hard to use14:24
predatorfreakand my box did it in ~4 seconds14:24
predatorfreakSo, I went "BULLSHIT!"14:24
joacimI think my linux framebuffer (at 1280x1024x24) did it in 2 minutes14:25
predatorfreakI like the client-server thingie in urxvt, the proper unicode and such.14:25
predatorfreakStandard vesafb framebuffer is completely unaccelerated14:25
predatorfreakSlow-as-fuck.14:25
joacimI noticed :p14:25
jaegergnome-terminal used to be one of those that was REALLY slow14:27
jaegerit's far better now14:27
predatorfreakjoacim: I recently switched over to the fancy-new Userspace vesa driver.14:27
predatorfreakWorks really nice, faster too :P14:27
joacimuvesa?14:28
predatorfreakGot merged in .2414:29
predatorfreakBeen out-of-tree for awhile now, but was a bit buggy.14:29
joacimah14:29
joacimI will try it in .24 =)14:29
joacimwhen i upgrade to*14:29
predatorfreakRequires a bit of setup.14:29
predatorfreak(needs klibc, v86d and an initrd)14:30
predatorfreakklibc & v86d are in my ports tree14:30
joacimI played with the patches some time ago, but went back to vesafb because I couldnt get widescreen resolutions14:32
predatorfreakDepends wildly on the monitor and card.14:32
joacimI will make sure my next monitor supports fixed aspect scaling out of the box =)14:33
joacim4:3 resolutions on a 16:10 screen looks like crap14:33
jjpkjaeger: ++ on the Terminus font.14:37
jjpkIt's a nice and clean font to read.14:37
teKRomster /  tilman: any news regarding my application?14:37
jaegerhrmm, DejaVu Sans Mono actually works well in osx terminal14:38
jaegerjjpk: :)14:38
jjpkpredatorfreak: utf-8 works well in irssi. It even has a decent to and from utf-8 converter.14:38
thrice`don't think i've ever tried Terminus14:39
jjpkIf you like monospace fonts, terminus is great.14:39
predatorfreakjjpk: Kinda hard to convert Unicode Cyrillic to anything else easily :P14:39
thrice`huh, i'll have to find a screenshot14:40
jjpkpredatorfreak: apart from converting to KOI8-{R,U}, you kind of do run out of options. :p14:41
predatorfreakjjpk: Exactly :P14:41
predatorfreakBetter to just keep it unicode14:41
predatorfreakand utilise a unicode terminal :)14:41
jjpkSeems not everyone is sold on utf-8 enabled filenames and capability.14:42
jjpkI think it's good because you just need one encoding for most character sets.14:42
predatorfreakGentoo converted over to it, as did Fedora and most of the other distros.14:43
predatorfreakMight as well just make the switch14:44
treachit still doesn't work flawless. :/14:44
predatorfreaktreach: I dunno, I been running UTF-8 forever here14:44
predatorfreakNever hit a major problem.14:44
treachI guess it might be related to those famed special chars. :p14:45
jaegerI don't care as long as everything works :)14:45
jjpkWithin a month it will be a year and a half since my two crux boxes have been using utf-8 as file encoding and text encoding.14:46
jjpkSo far so good.14:46
joacimI never really experience problems with unicode14:46
jaegerwhat kind of effort is required to switch?14:46
joacimexcept on norwegian EFNet channels14:46
treachI tend to get squares and other unprintable chars left in the terminal if I type something, change my mind and backspace etc. :/14:46
jjpkjaeger: it was not very demanding.14:46
joacimsome people there still thinks iso is the "official" charset of efnet14:46
jjpkSet a few options in the kernel, find utf-8 capable fonts, set your locale properly through your shell rc file.14:47
predatorfreakjaeger: Nothing much really..14:47
predatorfreakJust what jjpk said.14:47
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jjpkYou also need a small change in /etc/man.conf, but it's not rocket science.14:48
rehabdollutf8 works flawless here14:48
jaegerah14:49
jjpkProblems tend to come from stuff you have not written.14:49
jjpkUsually those are fixed with the 'recode' command.14:49
jjpkor iconv.14:50
jjpkI thought it would have been slightly more painful but I'm pleased up to now.14:51
predatorfreakjjpk: what's the change in man.conf? I never actually encountered that...14:51
jjpkRemove a switch from NROFF or something like that, -Tlatin*, I forget at the moment.14:52
jjpkfound that tip from either the gentoo wiki or its documentation when I was preparing the boxes for utf-8.14:53
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ryuohey romster15:27
* ryuo pokes Romster with a stick.15:27
jtnlhi DarkNekros ryuo15:27
ryuoman i like my new shell :D15:28
ryuoi've replaced bash with fish =)15:28
treachI don't think a shell you could easily fry sounds like a good idea. ;)15:30
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ryuotreach: it stands for friendly interactive shell15:31
ryuo<_<15:31
treach:) that would be fis. :D15:32
ryuosh comes from shell15:32
ryuo-.-15:32
treachmeans "fart" in my native language. :>15:33
treachmmh, doesn't look too bad, but what happens if you need to redirect the screen output?15:34
jaegerwhy not bas and zs and pdks then instead of the *h counterparts? :)15:34
treachbecause those aren't fun. :)15:35
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ryuowell15:44
ryuoi figured out how to redirect the screen output to a file in fish15:44
ryuolike this15:44
ryuogzip -h >> test15:44
treachI was mostly wondering wrt the coloring. that tends to cause problems15:44
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ryuodont knock it till ya try it? =p15:45
treachI didn't knock it, I was just curious.15:45
ryuothough i must admit some of the features are annoying15:45
ryuooh i see what this is15:46
ryuoauto completion!15:46
ryuothis could be handy15:47
ryuoI made myself a nice color prompt =p15:47
ryuolike...15:47
ryuoroot@noentry ~ >> (its in yellow)15:47
predatorfreakRyoS: BAH! all of their fancy stuff can be done with ZSH!!!15:50
predatorfreakand zsh is infinitely cooler sounding15:51
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predatorfreakPlus changing the syntax on functions is just plain silly.... there's nothing wrong with how you define functions in sh, in fact it's more readable than their format o.O15:58
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predatorfreakViper_: zsh 3.4.5 = Horribly busted when it comes to tab completion.16:06
predatorfreakerr 4.3.5*16:06
Viper_hmm16:07
Viper_will have to check that, because it's working not that bad here16:07
predatorfreakViper_: rm ~/.zcompdump; compinit; vim blah<tab> :)16:07
predatorfreakvim complete on ANYTHING is horribly broken16:08
Viper_is it's only vim?16:09
predatorfreakViper_: As far as I can tell.16:10
predatorfreakBut that's a huge deal for me :)16:10
Viper_hmm ok i will have a look at it16:10
Viper_i am also using vim :>16:10
Viper_perhaps we can use the vim completion stuff of 4.3.416:10
predatorfreakFor the moment I just reverted to 4.3.3.16:10
predatorfreakerr .4*16:10
Viper_but still staying on 4.3.516:11
predatorfreakViper_: I dunno if it'll mix well.16:11
Viper_me neither :>16:11
predatorfreakBut if you wanna try, go for it! :)16:11
Viper_yeah16:11
Viper_thanks for your hint, btw16:11
predatorfreaknp.16:12
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RyoS22:50:41 < predatorfreak> RyoS: BAH! all of their fancy stuff can be done with ZSH!!!16:19
RyoSplease please Oo'16:19
RyoSdont scare me out of nothing :S16:19
RyoSzsh works fine here, 4.3.516:19
predatorfreakWhoops sorry.16:20
predatorfreakryuo*16:20
RyoS;D16:20
predatorfreakRyoS: Tab complete loves you.16:20
RyoSi love it16:21
RyoS^^16:21
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ryuoif you like "z" so much...16:28
ryuowhy don't you use more "z" apps?16:29
ryuo<_<16:29
predatorfreakryuo: zsh is all the z I need.16:29
treachzip the complainer. :>16:29
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ryuowhat about zile?16:29
joacimzmutt16:29
treach;D16:29
ryuohow about zmud? XD16:29
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ryuozfs is cool :/16:30
treachzmutt sounds like somthing to deal with the spam. :>16:30
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RyoStreach: more like something to deal with :p16:30
ryuointeresting16:31
ryuoafter 2 years of no updates16:31
ryuostumpwm is finally being updated again16:31
ryuoi swear... people are trying to turn firefox into the beall and endall app...16:31
ryuoa firefox extension that turns it into a WM...16:31
ryuo>_<16:31
joacimI just want a browser16:34
joacimfirefox is a bit too heavy for my tastes16:34
treachmidori seems like a good idea, and the source is there :>16:34
jjpkIt is slightly annoying because only have stripped down, basic text browsers or those all-inclusive gui browsers (firefox)...16:35
treachfirefox has gone bonkers, konqueror needs kde and the gnome equivalent whatever it's called today have the corresponding problem.16:36
treachnot much to chose from, except opera, maybe.16:37
ryuotheres seamonkey16:37
treachand that would be less bloat than ff..?16:37
ryuoi believe its slightly lighter...16:37
ryuothough not entirely sure16:37
ryuoits does offer more apps in one package though16:38
ryuohtml editor, email program, web browser, and irc client16:38
predatorfreakRyyIt's better.16:38
predatorfreakryuo*16:38
ryuoHuh16:38
ryuo?!16:38
predatorfreakJust gotta disable all the bloody extra apps16:39
predatorfreak(Then it comes out as smaller than Firefox)16:39
ryuowell16:39
predatorfreakStill large though16:39
ryuoseamonkey is intended to be more than just a web browser16:39
predatorfreakTBH, all I would want IS the browser.16:39
ryuowell if you have need for any of the others16:40
ryuoin xorg16:40
ryuoyou could use the version in seamonkey and save some space16:40
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ryuothe more popular firefox extensions are available in seamonkey16:40
ryuonamely adblock16:41
ryuohv3 looks promising but is still too bleeding edge16:42
predatorfreakI found that in order to cut down the blasted wastefulness on disk space for Firefox though16:42
predatorfreakIt's better to tell it to link all of it's stuff statically.16:42
ryuoisnt that ironic?16:42
ryuotypically dynamic linking is better16:43
predatorfreak(It still dynamically links all the other things like GTK, X shit, etc, any external library)16:43
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predatorfreakThe draw back is that you need AT LEAST 512MB of RAM with at least 300 or so MB of swap16:43
predatorfreakor 1GB of RAM.16:43
ryuoto do what?16:43
ryuocompile it?16:43
ryuoor run it16:43
predatorfreakYes.16:43
predatorfreakOnce you get to the final link it eats RAM like shit16:44
treachjeez.. someone is *still* developing apps using tk..!?16:44
ryuoyep16:44
jjpktk will not disappear :p16:45
ryuoi wonder if theres any better gecko based browsers16:45
predatorfreakryuo: Next release on Firefox I'm going to push some minor improvements to opt from my tree, but sadly, static build won't be pushable due to the chances of it not building for some folks16:45
treachthere is kazehakase, but it's quite immature, too.16:46
ryuosadly, geckos the only decent html rendering engine on linux16:46
ryuoexcluding opera16:46
predatorfreakI already pushed some debloating stuff, but didn't bump the release because it wasn't worth the rebuild.16:46
predatorfreakRyoS: Webkit, KHTML16:46
RyoSXD16:46
RyoSjesus christ :D16:46
predatorfreakDAMN IT16:46
ryuopredatorfreak: you fail16:46
predatorfreakryuo***16:46
RyoSi will start throwing tcp/ip eggs at you! :P16:46
predatorfreakWORK BETTER TAB COMPLETE16:46
joacimI dont like kaehakases "interface modes" (beginner, amateur, expert, etc..)16:47
predatorfreakryuo: No decent browsers for either though.16:47
ryuo*nod*16:47
predatorfreakExcluding Konqueror.16:47
RyoS:>16:47
ryuoKonqueror kinda sucks16:47
predatorfreakBut fuck, I don't want KDE for a browser16:47
ryuoyou have to have gtk2 for any flash player to work16:47
treachjoacim: just set it to expert and forget about it. :>16:47
RyoSpredatorfreak: thats what bothers me with konqueror16:47
ryuoflash-plugin or even gnash16:47
joacimbut the ui gets too messy :p16:47
ryuomain reason i hate kde16:48
treachmmh, it's not mature as I said.16:48
predatorfreaktreach: Problem is you still need either Firefox or xulrunner16:48
predatorfreakBoth of which are still FUCKING HUGE16:48
joacimI just want the beginner toolbar and expert config tools =)16:48
ryuotheres flock and songbird16:48
ryuobut16:48
joacimlolifox16:48
ryuothose are more like special purpose web browsers than anything else16:48
predatorfreaksongbird isn't really a browser.16:48
predatorfreakFlock is a mod of firefox16:48
predatorfreakSame with lolifox.... creepy browser there too16:49
predatorfreakPedofox...16:49
joacim:]16:49
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RyoSi smell some /b/tards *SCNR* :D16:49
predatorfreakjoacim: Go back to #elementaryschool, you pedo.16:49
ryuo...16:50
* ryuo cracks joaxim's nutz with his nutcracker.16:50
ryuo<_<16:50
joacimmy last girlfriends father already did that to me16:52
treachpredatorfreak: did you check it out, or did you just have a kneejerk reaction?16:52
predatorfreaktreach: For what?16:52
treachyour pedo ranting16:52
predatorfreakOh, lolifox at one time had a straight link to 4chan's "lolicon" board.16:53
predatorfreakThen they removed it later16:53
treachk.16:54
joacimI wasnt on 4chan when they had a lolicon board16:55
ryuorofl16:55
joacimi found it some time after they removed it16:55
treachIt basically came across as a ff version for anime nuts.16:55
ryuoMS fined 1.337 billion16:55
ryuoPWNED16:55
joacimfound 4chan16:55
predatorfreaktreach: I thought they had some random extensions in it too.16:56
predatorfreakBut TBH, they could have split out the extensions16:56
predatorfreakand provided the artwork separate.16:56
treachmaybe, can't say I looked too hard at it. ;)16:56
predatorfreaktreach: I was only messing with joacim anyway.16:58
predatorfreakBut, side note, Industrial music is fucking addicting.16:58
rehabdollhaha /b/ = win16:59
jjpkAny names in particular?16:59
predatorfreakjjpk: For industrial? KMFDM, Ministry, Skinny Puppy, Nine Inch Nails.17:00
predatorfreakI can't freaking stop listening to Jesus Built My Hotrod by Ministry...17:00
joacim/c/ will always be better =)17:00
jjpkEarlier Ministry is great.17:01
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predatorfreakjoacim: /cm/, screw your women!17:01
joacimI prefer to look at girls  :317:02
predatorfreakjoacim: Difference of taste.17:02
predatorfreakjoacim: I mostly lurk /mu/ and /co/ though.17:03
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joacim/e/ is good too i guess17:06
joacimI sometimes find good art there17:06
predatorfreakjoacim: I traditionally anonymously contribute to the "HIPSTER GARBAGE" bits on /mu/.17:07
joacimI just lurk17:07
joacimnever post17:07
predatorfreakjoacim: No fun!17:08
joacimalways watching17:08
predatorfreakIt's more fun being anonymous17:08
predatorfreakand saying "HIPSTER FAGGOT!"17:08
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predatorfreakLet's you get out those trolling urges17:08
joacimI'm not a good troll :-/ I feed more than I troll17:10
predatorfreakI troll better than I feed :317:11
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RomsterteK, prologic said it was fine i guess it's upto tilman if you get added or not.18:10
Romsterthe big web browser chat again18:11
treachbig problems usually creates big (and useless) discussions. :P18:12
predatorfreakRomster: We keep coming back to it because all the browsers suck!18:15
treachisn't there IE4Lin or something like that? :p18:15
predatorfreaktreach: BURN!!!!!18:16
jaegerIE is not excluded from the "browsers that suck" list18:16
jaegernone of them are :P18:16
predatorfreakjaeger: In fact.18:16
predatorfreakIt's number 1 on that list!18:16
predatorfreak"All browsers suck, some just suck less."18:16
treachpredatorfreak: that won't help. I'm firewalled. :D18:16
* predatorfreak nukes treach's firewall18:17
joacimall email clients suck too18:18
joacimI've never been able to find one I liked18:18
predatorfreakjoacim: Everything sucks.18:18
predatorfreakSome just suck less.18:18
Romsterpredatorfreak, yeah not one does exactly what i want.18:19
treachwell, there are degrees even in hell wrt email clients.18:19
Romsteryeah that hardly works anymore18:19
Romsterie4linux18:19
Romsterunless you use a lokd wine version18:19
Romsterold*18:19
jaegeryou could try wine-doors, I think it's IE6 in that one18:20
jaegerhttp://www.wine-doors.org/screens/ss-winedoors-1.png18:20
Romsterie4linux has support for 5,5.5,6 and 718:20
Romsterhmm18:20
treachas a kde user, I'm pretty happy with konqueror actually, I just wish it handled js better and that there was something similar to noscript. :/18:20
joacimI wish I could disable javascript18:21
joacimmost sites I visit break if i disable it18:21
treachyeah, sucks. :/18:21
Romsteryeah i hate sites that require JS18:22
Romsterit's ment to enhance but not be damn well required in my books18:22
treachkonqueror supports whitelisting, but that's rather backwards. Noscript is just much easier.18:22
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Romsteryeah i like noscript18:26
Romsterpredatorfreak, nvidia-169.12 jsut came out.18:52
predatorfreakRomster: ports -u18:52
Romsterah.. lol18:52
jaegerhe updated it hours ago18:52
Romsterdamn it.18:52
predatorfreak:)18:52
predatorfreakNoticed during my Gentoo-forums-check-of-the-day18:53
predatorfreakRicers jump on every new release :P18:53
Romsterah18:53
treachpredatorfreak: ck4up ftw. ;)18:55
Romsteryeah i use ck4up all the time.18:55
Romstersometimes it misses something and i gotta edit the conf18:55
predatorfreakI use it for tracking some things, nvidia just doesn't track well via ck4up.18:56
predatorfreakAlso, STUPID BASH!18:56
predatorfreakWhy can't it have a damn method of testing if something is numeric or not built in?!18:56
treachuse zsh instead then. :)18:56
predatorfreaktreach: It's a shell script I distribute.18:56
predatorfreakzsh isn't a viable option.18:56
treachheh, ok18:56
Romsteractually it would be nice to setup rss feeds on everything that has them18:57
Romsteruse sed -e 's/[0-9]*//', i guess.18:58
Romsterunless there is a better way maybe grep dunno.18:58
predatorfreak[[ `echo $num | sed 's/^[-+0-9][0-9]*//' | wc -c` -eq 1 ]]18:58
predatorfreakO.O18:58
Romsterand test for output18:58
predatorfreakTHIS IS INSANITY18:58
predatorfreakFFS.18:58
Romsterrofl18:58
predatorfreakEven perl has a test-if-number option18:58
Romsterwhat about decimal dot?18:59
predatorfreakI hate you bash.18:59
predatorfreakI hate you bash.18:59
Romsterthat should be sugested for the next realse..18:59
Romsterrelease*18:59
predatorfreaksed 's/^[-+0-9].[0-9]*//'19:00
predatorfreakBest I can come up with.19:00
Romsterecho 457.5762 | sed -e 's/^[-+0-9].[0-9]*//'19:02
Romster.576219:02
Romsterfailed..19:02
Romsterah \.19:02
Romsteror the . is any char and not a actual period.19:02
predatorfreakdamn it.19:03
Romster's/^[-+0-9]*\.[0-9]*//'19:03
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Romsternot sure how good that is but it's a improvment.19:03
Romsterdon't really need the + ?19:04
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Romsterpositive numbers don't have + on them19:04
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Romsterand hmm 234.255.4 failes so if more than one period exists it's a invald number.19:05
predatorfreakI feel like naming this function "WHY DON'T YOU HAVE THIS BASH"19:05
Romsterlol19:05
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predatorfreaksed 's/^[-0-9]*\.[0-9].*$//'19:06
predatorfreakI hate bash.19:06
predatorfreakI mean, for fucks sake, ZSH has this!19:06
predatorfreakHow hard is it to put in a simple bloody function to test if something is numeric or not...19:07
Romster's/^[-0-9][0-9]*\.[0-9]*$//'19:09
Romsterlimits - to the first char so - can't be 0-94.319:09
Romsterbut has to be -094.319:10
Romsteralthought the 0 is not needed just a example.19:10
predatorfreakRomster:  's/^[-0-9]*\.[0-9].*$//' works best19:10
predatorfreakActually...19:11
Romsterand you can't do .*$ on the end or 123.456.789 gets though you need to error or return false if you see more than one period.19:11
predatorfreakRomster:  's/^[-0-9].*$//' works best19:11
predatorfreakThat even gets19:11
Romsterecho -547.445.252 | sed -e 's/^[-0-9].*$//'19:11
predatorfreak1545.4545.453465.65465.3454619:11
Romstermore than one period is nto a number though?19:12
Romsterunless you don't care about that.19:12
predatorfreakThe period isn't matching periods.19:12
predatorfreakIt's matching everything else.19:12
Romsterbah you took the \ off the \.19:12
predatorfreakThat's the point.19:12
Romsteri didn't notice till you said.19:12
Romsterso 123.456.789 is numic but invalid with the 2 dots.19:13
Romsternumeric*19:13
predatorfreakSo then we shouldn't match it? XD19:14
Romsterdunno what's it gonna be used for?19:15
Romsterhow critical does it have to be.19:15
predatorfreakMaking sure shit's actually a valid number?19:15
Romsterwill it see comas too? 123,456.719:15
predatorfreakNo.19:16
Romsterk so that rules that out.19:23
Romsterso check for one dot if 2 error.19:23
Romsterlooking at a case finction.19:23
Romsterhmm i thought {1,3} matches 1-3 chars.19:24
Romsterbut eh you don't need a coma so thats not needed to check correct comma placement.19:25
Romsterecho 52 | sed -e 's/^[0-9]{1,3}$//'19:37
Romster5219:37
Romsterwtf?19:37
Romstermatch 1 to 3 chars that's 2 chars so it should return nothing.19:38
Romstermeh damn regualr expressions.19:38
Romsterjust messing around and ound that.19:38
Romsterfound*19:38
Romsterhmm ok i had to escape the curly brackets strange.19:45
predatorfreak 's/^[-0-9]*\.[0-9]*$//' is "good enough"19:46
predatorfreakI don't have a billion years to rape regexes19:46
Romster<<19:48
Romsterwhy is it i had to escape curly brackets yet on this site http://www.zytrax.com/tech/web/regex.htm it dosn't.19:48
predatorfreakRomster: The proper thing would be for BASH TO NOT SUCK.19:48
Romsteryeah19:48
Romstera C function to check isnum19:48
Romster-isnum19:48
Romsterwould be ideal.19:49
predatorfreakYes.19:49
Romsterif [ -isnum $1 ]19:49
Romstermaybe someone can hack bash and add ina  function then submit the patch to the bash devs19:49
Romsteralthough the rfc might not even have anything in it for such things then again bash has crap in it that's not standared in the rfc too.19:50
Romsteranother option would be to have a small executable to call.19:51
Romstermaybe bc might work dunno.19:52
predatorfreakRomster: Optionally, I could just convert to bloody perl.19:53
Romsterya if you like perl.19:54
predatorfreakRomster: Less annoying than Python..19:55
Romsterreally..19:55
predatorfreakWell, matter of opinion.19:57
predatorfreakBut I prefer perl to python19:57
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Romsterthen convert it to that then  guess.19:58
Romsterif you think it's worth it.19:58
Romsternote to self don't touch any more d-net eathernet switches. there carzy fucks that do stuupid things and don't restet properly on a short power intruption.20:03
Romsterhmm i shouuld add in a big capactor in that unit that would get around that.20:03
Romsteri got the first few ports pluged in right i just noticed the last few leds were lit saying i had all the leads at the end of the unit and not at the start O_o20:04
Romsterwhen i went to get a coffee.20:04
thrice`jaeger: which boot loader do you use on macbook ?20:08
jaegerrefit/lilo20:11
thrice`no issues setting it up?20:13
jaegernone20:27
thrice`jaeger: sweet.  might try to dual boot it with crux.  os x is getting boring :)  looks like hardware is well supported20:31
jaegerwhich generation?20:32
jaegermine's 3rd gen (santa rosa) and is quite well supported20:32
thrice`1st20:32
jaegernot sure on those but I'd guess they work well20:35
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thrice`yeah, gentoo page has decent outline20:41
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predatorfreakRomster: Irk, writing a clean DVD ripper how I want in Perl too fucking bitchy.21:07
RomsterPerl being too bitchy?21:08
predatorfreakRomster: I would be raping the code for 3 days straight to get basic functionality <_<21:08
predatorfreakRomster: Actually, I forgot my coma.21:08
predatorfreakRomster: Irk, writing a clean DVD ripper how I want in Perl, too fucking bitchy.21:08
predatorfreakThere21:08
predatorfreakBut basically, yes.21:09
predatorfreakPerl's a bitch.21:09
Romsterarn't there dvd rippers already or do none do what you want.21:09
predatorfreakThey're all GUI fancy-shits or busted horribly in some way.21:09
predatorfreakMy homebrew script is the only thing I find remotely usable for a command-line ripper.21:09
Romsterhmm i've just done it manually.21:12
Romsterbut it is a bitch to do it manually.21:12
Romsterwrite it in C and call the programs? is that possable.21:12
predatorfreakRomster: My script automates 99% of the grunt work.21:12
predatorfreakRomster: Pfft, I might as well use shell script if I'm going to do that.21:13
Romsteris it in your repo?21:13
predatorfreakand I know shell a shitload better than I know C.21:13
predatorfreakNah, still not "perfected" it yet.21:13
predatorfreakSo I keep it in my git repo.21:13
Romsterk21:13
predatorfreakgit clone rsync://dcaf-security.org/git/convmedia.git21:14
predatorfreakThere's some pretty hefty requirements though, most of which are in my repo XD21:14
predatorfreak(Plus my other personal scripts for media shit is in there, my CD ripper and audio conversion script)21:15
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Romsterah21:27
Romstergit over rsync.21:27
Romsterrsync: link_stat "/convmedia.git/packed-refs" (in git) failed: No such file or directory (2)21:29
Romsterhmm seems i don't get it becasue of that error..21:32
predatorfreako.O21:34
predatorfreakUhh... works for me....21:34
predatorfreakone sec21:34
predatorfreakRomster: Should work fine...21:35
predatorfreakWorks properly on my box.21:35
predatorfreakThe ports open, the server is DMZ'd, there's no block against outside users...21:35
Romsterhttp://rafb.net/p/jvVOC975.html21:38
predatorfreakRomster: Try now.21:39
Romster/usr/bin/git-clone: line 321: 11916 Segmentation fault      git-ls-remote "$repo" > "$GIT_DIR/CLONE_HEAD"21:39
Romsterno idea..21:39
predatorfreakO.O21:40
Romsteri'm on lateist git too.21:40
predatorfreakThis is just weird..21:41
predatorfreakThere.21:58
predatorfreakFucking git busted their rsync sync...21:58
Romsteroh21:59
predatorfreakRomster: git clone git://dcaf-security.org/convmedia.git22:00
predatorfreakBam.22:00
predatorfreakMagic.22:00
Romsternow that worked.22:01
Romsterso git borked there rsync...22:01
Romsteri'm horrifyed.22:01
predatorfreakShit happens.22:01
predatorfreakI'm off for tonight though, getting late and I'm getting tired.22:02
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