IRC Logs for #crux Wednesday, 2008-04-23

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pitillogood morning01:05
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tilmanwoo, new intel driver with xvmc support01:18
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xf86-video-intel: updated to
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Romsterwhat happend to ck4up -f foo, ~./ck4up/foo.conf01:29
RomsterError: Configuration file foo not found !01:29
Romsterlike bull..01:30
pitilloRomster, ck4up -f /home/pitillo/.ck4up/ck4up.test here is working fine01:34
Romsterdo i have to use a full path now?01:34
pitilloummm I will check wit ~, 1 sec01:35
pitilloseems to be working fine too01:35
Romsterck4up -f romster01:36
RomsterError: Configuration file romster not found !01:36
Romsterls .ck4up/romster.conf01:36
Romsterfile exists it used to work before i updated ck4up01:36
Romsteronly the default ck4up.conf is working now.01:37
pitilloRomster, yes, here only with the name (ck4up -f test.conf) doesn't work (I don't really know how it worked before)01:43
Romster~/.ck4up/$name.conf, and use ck4up -f $name01:44
Romsterused to work just fine now it says file not found but it exists.01:44
pitilloRomster, send Jue a mail talking about this01:47
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Romsterpitillo, i just downgraded to ck4up 0.2.4, and ck4up -f romster, now works so Jue has made a bug.01:53
Romsteri'll report it01:53
Romsterhi sepen01:53
sepenRomster, what bug?01:54
Romsteri've just discovered a bug in new ck4up that it wont work with the -f option01:54
sepenIm using ck4up fine now01:54
Romsterdefault file is fine but if you use -f othername01:54
Romsterit wont work01:54
sepen$ crontab -l | grep ck4up01:55
sepen0   5   * *   * ck4up -v -f ~/.ck4up/contrib.conf 2>&101:55
sepen30  5   * *   * ck4up -v -f ~/.ck4up/xfce.conf 2>&101:55
sepenhere working really fine01:55
sepenyou don't need basedir anymore01:55
Romsterwtf i tryed that too. and why the full path?01:55
pitilloadding the full path works fine, with the file name, it doesn't01:55
Romsteri never used the base directory01:55
Romstergrr *tests again*01:55
sepenRomster, read the new manual too01:56
Romsteri looked though it.01:56
sepenRomster, where's located your 'romster' file?02:05
sepenyou must give the absolute path as its explained in the manual02:06
Romsterit's in /home/romster/.ck4up/romster.cong02:06
Romsteri've never in the past.02:06
Romsteras you can see from that pastebin02:07
Romsteroh great now i have todo ck4up -f ~/.ck4up/romster.conf02:08
Romsterbefore i could do ck4up -f romster02:08
sepenas many other *nix tools02:08
Romsteralot more typing now.02:08
Romsterthe man page is not clear on this.02:09
Romster-f <file>, --config <file> < where does it even say <path/file>02:09
Romsterhmm i'd say ck4up should look in ~/.ck4up for the file name if there is not a absolute path said.02:10
Romsterthat way i can do ck4up -f romster, or do ck4up -f ~/.ck4up/xfce.conf02:11
Romsterbut it's pointless as it's in the .ck4up directory anyways02:12
Romsterit would be helpful when you got a file in another directory.02:12
Romsteri'm emailing jue good thing i hadn't yet.02:12
sepenRomster, please read carefully02:12
Romsterand sugest.02:12
Romsteri have read the man page02:12
sepen  ~/.ck4up/ck4up.conf.  ck4up creates a database with the same full pathname but the extension replaced by .dbm02:13
Romsteri can't do the same method i've done many times before.02:13
Romsterthat just says it'll make a ~/.ck4up/ck4up.dbm02:14
Romsterdoesn't say i need to use a full path on the -f option.02:14
sepenyeah, hmmm02:14
Romsteras in my pastebin you can see what i used todo...02:14
Romsterthat now requires a full path.02:15
sepenbut the default file is ~/.ck4up/ck4up.conf (absolute path)02:15
Romsterand i've /always/ done ck4up -f [foo|bar], which means ~/,ck4up/foo.conf or ~/,ck4up/bar.conf02:17
Romsterso all tools arn't meant to look in there dot file anymore..02:18
Romstererr dot directory.02:18
Romsteri can see an advangage of using a full path to ck4up form some cases but i was happy with the old way.02:19
Romsteri'll take the discussion up with jue, and suggest ck4up looks in ~/.ck4up/ if a full path is not set.02:22
sepenRomster, i,e: lilo it doesn't02:23
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Romstersince when did lilo come into this chat. and what example of that i just run lilo with the default lilo.conf02:31
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sepenuhhh ttp://
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cptnRomster: as far as I remember someone here asked jue to change that in ck4up02:49
sepencptn, was me02:49
cptnRomster: to allow placing files outside ~/.ck4up02:49
cptnsepen: oh, okay :-)02:49
sepenjue commented this at Changelog file in sources02:50
Romsterhmm fun..02:59
Romsteri liked the old format.02:59
Romsternow i have more typing or set a ugly alias or something to get around it if i wish or patch the file.02:59
cptnI guess there could be both02:59
Romstera compromise could be done to use the old format unless a full path is specified.03:00
cptnso relative shouldn't work?03:00
cptndoesn't sound too intuitive to me03:01
Romsterhmm well if there is no / in the $name then use ~/.ck4up/$name.conf03:01
cptnwhat about this:03:01
Romsterotherwise use the path if relative or absolute, that would solve both problems?03:01
cptncd ~/.ck4up03:01
cptnck4up -f romster.conf03:02
cptn-> error as there's no ~/.ck4up/romster.conf.conf03:02
Romsterlol i never thought of that...03:02
cptnit's probably not a common case for files in ~/.ck4up03:02
cptnbut I think the option was requested to have files outside that directory03:02
Romsterthe .conf is appended by ck4up or used to be.03:02
cptnI'd rather add another option03:03
cptn-f <file>, -c <configname>03:03
Romsteri can see the benefit of saying were to look, all i'm saying is if only the name and no path at all is said to -f to use the old ck4up behaviour.03:03
cptnalthough -c is already used03:03
Romsterand the man page of ck4up didn't really say i have to use a full path now unless i read it Wong.03:06
cptnwell, it says <file>03:06
cptnnothing about ~/.ck4up03:06
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Romsteryeah... and i tyred to use the same behaviour as the previous version.03:16
Romsterand of course it's been changed.03:16
Romstermade me think it was a bug as i looked at the man page03:16
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elioradwhat does seub stand for?04:24
Romsterno idea tryed google.04:28
elioradok. so how do you set up a network then04:28
L3thaldarn that gameguard04:29
Romstereliorad, on crux?04:30
Romsterand you need to be more spefic.04:30
Rotwangeliorad: handbook04:31
elioradfollowed instructions --> changed to using dhcpcd04:31
Rotwangeliorad: read the handbook carrefully04:31
Rotwangcarefully *04:32
cptneliorad: sounds like everything's fine then04:32
elioradlife is good04:32
Rotwangcptn: thanks for adding me to the user map, everythings ok :D04:33
cptnRotwang: you're welcome04:33
cptnnow all you have to do is recruit more users in Wroclaw ;-)04:34
Rotwangim trying ;]04:34
Romsteri should see if i'm on that map.04:35
Romsterso the non-functional map is functional? and wheres the output of the map again?04:37
cptnnot really04:37
cptnI occasionally generate a map from the public wiki on
elioradim using crux inside a virtual box is that ok?04:38
sepencptn, Im writing a minimal but functional php file for auto-generation of cruxmap04:39
Romstercptn, ah so how do i get the cordinates can i use ?04:39
sepenRomster, sure04:39
cptnsepen: okay :-)04:39
pitilloeliorad, yes04:40
Romsterhmm can't see the cordinates wonder where...04:40
cptnRomster: if you click on "link to this page", you should find it in the url04:41
cptnthe 'll' parameter04:42
elioradpitillo: have you experience with this configuration?04:42
Romsterah thanks i didn't think of that.04:42
cptnRomster: the more complete map is
pitilloeliorad, I had crux virtualized in a windows and linux hosts...04:43
Rotwangeliorad: simply copy and paste the dhcpcd net script from handbook04:44
elioradis it true that only virtual box runs systems of real hd04:44
elioradas opposed to virtualpc and vmware04:45
elioraddont ask?04:45
Romsteri guess i'm gmtP10 as i'm +1004:45
pitilloeliorad, or ask in vbox channel to answer that question04:46
elioradtrue, thanks04:46
cptnRomster: Armidale, Brisbane, Nambucca and Melbourne are also in gmtP1004:47
cptnif any if these is near you :-)04:48
Romstercptn, added to the map.04:49
Romsteryeah Melboune is close like 4 hours from me.04:49
Romsteri'm like one of the odd ones out on the map now.04:49
cptnI can add you to cruxmap if you want04:49
cptnthough that one's independent of the wiki page04:50
Romstercptn, sure.04:52
Romsteri think i got it right.04:52
cptnokay, added04:53
Romsterthere is one in melbourne i see.04:53
rxicptn: hey04:55
Romsterhmm should add that to the wiki as a link.04:56
cptnhey rxi04:58
rxiyou can change me from nambucca to melbourne btw04:58
rxinoo .. prologic isnt around05:01
cptndone :-)05:01
Romstercptn, hope you don't mind what i added to
rxithanks mate05:02
Romsterto ask you to be added.05:02
Romsterreally need some way to include that map on the wiki if that's possable.05:02
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RotwangCEST == GMT + 2 ?05:03
tilmanCET = GMT + 105:04
tilmanso you're in GMT+105:04
Rotwangso timezones are set incorrectly at the cptns cruxmap05:05
cptnthat's DST05:06
cptndaylight savings05:06
Rotwangaha, ok05:06
cptnGMT+1 (base timezone) + 1h DST05:06
Rotwangvelencia is GMT + 2 DST ?05:07
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f1yhm i have weird problem with my graphic card05:15
f1ylinux sees all parameters of it, windows sees nothing05:15
f1ywindows cannot read any informations about this ati radeon 9600 pro rv350ap05:15
f1yparameters like ramdac, chipset and such05:16
Romsterno idea but sounds like a driver issue.05:16
f1yi dont give a damn about windows, i just want to make sure if this card isnt damaged somehow05:16
f1yRomster: yes, but what is interesting - it worked on windows05:17
Romsterwell windows does that crap nothing new.05:17
f1yi've tried 3 versions of catalyst and windows could not work with these drivers05:17
Romsterif works in linux fine your windows is screwed up.05:17
f1ytried those with .NET framework and those without05:18
Romstertried with a fresh windows install?05:18
f1yand on linux it works with ati drivers and with fglrx drivers but only to 8.40.4, newer catalyst fglrx's freeze whole linux05:18
f1yRomster: tried on fresh xp, 2k, 2k305:18
Romsteri can't get the late nvidia driver to work i'm still on 100.14.1905:19
Romsteron a 7600GS so no idea seems you got some crazy problem too.05:19
f1yand because of slabcache rewriting in newer kernels those older fglrx's dont compile on kernels > 2.6.2205:20
Romsterany patches about maybe?05:20
f1ydont work because of this slabcache_obj, which goes to k_SlabCache or something like that05:21
Romstergo google and ask in various channels i guess.05:22
f1yi've tried on archlinux forum, but noone answered :)05:23
elioradperhaps use an old kernel side by side until the new ones have a patch05:23
elioradif you call 2.6.* old05:24
f1yhm this is good idea, i will try it05:24
elioradhappy could help out05:27
f1ythank you :)05:27
elioradwelcome ;)05:35
L3thalf1y: np :P05:39
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f1yhm is there a way to bind some key (fe windows key) as insert?07:41
f1yi have no insert in my keyboard ;/07:41
f1yinstead i have two windows keys and one key for opening menu also in windows07:42
cptnf1y: X11 or console?07:45
f1yX11 is not a problem, but console is a big problem for me, have no idea how to do it07:46
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cptntypically, remapping keys is fairly easy07:47
teKZSH knows the bindkey builtin command, dunno 'bout bash07:47
cptnhowever the windows key is usually just a modifier07:47
cptnso that might be different07:47
teKmaybe setkeycodes(1)?07:47
f1yand the problem is that there are two windows modifiers, one is needed for dwm binds...07:48
f1yhave to separate them if this is possible07:48
cptnin the console, you can just create a new keymap07:48
cptncheck in /usr/share/keymaps07:49
Romsterwindows "menu" key 117 set to be used as the Insert key07:49
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cptnalthough I'm actually not sure if you can do "Ins" this way07:50
Romster115 and 116 are them tw keys.07:51
Romsterxmodmap ?07:51
cptnthat's for X1107:51
cptnf1y: maybe have a look at the 'keymaps' man page07:52
cptnthat one has an example with Insert even07:52
cptnfor X11, xmodmap can do the trick, however IIRC it's deprecated in 7.x07:52
cptntilman might know07:53
f1ykeycode for insert is 110, so logically i should rewrite windows keys with its value, right?07:53
cptnuse the keycode for the windows key to generate 'Insert'07:54
cptn   keycode <code> = Insert07:55
cptn(according to the man page)07:55
f1y# dumpkeys | grep Insert07:55
f1ykeycode 110 = Insert07:55
cptn^ "Yep, XKB takes over its entire feature set."07:56
cptn(over from xmodmap)07:56
f1yhm have to read plenty of stuff then :)07:57
cptnunfortunately, I can't test it since I'm only on a remote session07:58
cptnbut I've made custom keymaps to remap regular keys07:58
cptnwhich worked fine07:58
cptnwhether Win keys can be remapped I'm not suer07:59
Romsterno idea but i'd remap my insert key to a new spot as it's a pain to bump it.08:00
f1yhm i have never remapped keyboard, every day another experiences08:00
Romsterright next to my backspace key.08:00
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Romsteri did a alias for devork before that's all i've ever done.08:00
cptnf1y: what you could try is to change into a text console, and run 'showkey'08:00
cptnnote: to exit this program just wait a couple of seconds :-)08:00
cptnwhile the application runs, you can press the windows key08:01
cptnif you get a keycode out of it, you're pretty much done :-)08:01
f1yyay, it is 125 and 126 \o/08:01
cptnwhich keymap are you using?08:02
f1yi believe this is it: /usr/share/kbd/keymaps/i386/qwerty/
cptnso you can unzip that, rename it (something like, and append that line08:05
cptnthen run 'loadkeys pl-ins'08:05
cptn  keycode 125 = Insert08:05
f1yim trying it right now :)08:05
Romsterthought there was a easier way to remap...08:08
Romsterand there is smaller files of modifyer keys or something i don't fully understand it i did poke around in them files looking a few months ago.08:09
Romster~/.Xmodmap  oh wait that's depreciated is everything o the net i find out of damn date.08:10
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cptnRomster: well, xmodmap should still be fine08:10
cptnRomster: but it's for X1108:10
cptnwhile f1y also wanted it outside of X08:11
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Romsterwasn't sure how to for console.08:11
cptnfor X11, something like xmodmap -e 'keycode <code> = Insert' should work08:11
cptnagain, not tested08:12
Romsterah mike_k handy.08:12
Romsterbasicly need todo it for linux then xorg seperately.08:13
cptnmike_k: according to the man page, that's something different08:13
cptnor maybe I don't understand it correctly08:14
mwansaRomster, is your gfx card ati ?08:14
mike_kcptn: I have not followed your discussion. I just use /usr/bin/setkeycodes 6d 88 to make "RF-kill" switch pretend it is F1208:15
Romstermwansa, no nvidia geforce 7600GS08:15
cptnmike_k: okay, then it should probably work08:17
cptnf1y: so if you want you can try mike_k's suggestion too, then you could do without a custom keymap08:17
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f1yyaaay, it works!08:24
f1yi have a beautiful insert key instead of windows-menu key08:24
f1ycptn: thank you :)08:25
f1ythank you all :)08:25
f1yah and one more - how to sign myself to the map of crux users?08:26
f1yRotwang has shown me this yesterday08:26
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cptnf1y: I can add you08:31
cptnjust need city/coordinates and your name if you want that08:31
cptnof course, if you live in any of the existing places in poland no coordinates are needed :-)08:33
f1yhm one of the bigger Polish cities - Gliwice08:33
f1ynearly 200 thousand ppl :D08:33
f1yand name... hm just f1y :)08:35
Romstermust give first name <<08:35
f1yhm might it be: Bartosz S. ?08:36
f1yi know, i know, hard to say it :)08:36
cptndoesn't really matter to me08:36
cptnif you prefer the nick as name, that's fine too08:36
f1yno, let it be Bartosz S.08:37
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Romstertricky one to pronounce.08:38
RotwangRomster: what about Grzegorz ?08:38
Romsterjust as hard if not more.08:39
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f1yhaha there is one Polish comedy, when one Polish says its name, and German officer tries to spell it08:39
f1yfunny as hell, cause this name is: Grzegorz Brzeczyszczykiewicz :D08:40
Rotwangadres chrząszczłewoszyce powiat łekołowy ;]08:40
f1yhaha true08:41
Rotwangyeah that was probably the funniest part of the whole movie08:41
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Rotwangive heard that some polish king had very good and simple way to find spies, everyone suspected simply had to say three words: miele młyn, soczewica and chleb08:44
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Rotwangfind a spy KISS method ;]08:44
f1yRotwang: you now that our names are the same, but mine is just a Slavic form of yours08:46
cptnf1y: okay, you're on the map too :-)08:53
f1ycptn: thank you :)08:53
Romsterya know what would be cool to have crux send off your details for the map :P08:54
Romsterfor every installation08:54
cptnincluding the version :-)08:54
Romsterwhy not.08:54
Rotwangi thought the same ;]08:54
cptnso after the release of a new version, you could see it spreading08:55
Romsterthat would be awesome.08:55
cptnI also thought about adding a field how long a user has used crux08:55
sepencptn, Im just using csv files for storing user(single/city-multiuser) cordinates08:56
cptnwith a slider where you can go from 2000-now08:56
cptnand see how the userbase grew08:56
Romsterah or declined.08:56
Romsterlost a few too. at least to irc.08:57
cptnyeah, that's also a problem of the map... no one asked to be removed so far08:57
cptnso we probably have some stale entries as well08:57
cptnit could send out periodical reminders with generated urls one has to visit to stay on the map08:58
sepencould be niceful if cruxbot can add entries directly08:58
mwansa_err whats this crux map ?08:58
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mwansacptn, add me to it :P09:00
Romster i've added the link to that url ^09:01
cptnRomster: maybe we should remove the coordinates from the wiki for now09:02
Romstercptn, joined date could be used.09:02
Romstercptn, i was thinking that have you got all of them?09:02
cptnlet me check09:02
cptnsepen: looks like text to me09:02
sepencptn, yes atm Im playing with csv files for storing coordinates09:03
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sepenmore easy for adding user in future09:04
cptnit's not exactly hard at the moment09:05
sepenmaybe in a near future09:05
sepencrux is growing more and more09:05
sepenand his comunity09:05
f1yhundreds... thousands... millions... whole world!09:06
Romsteruniverse :P09:07
f1yand aliens with CRUX on their spaceships09:07
Rotwangpredatorfreak ?09:08
sepencptn, is not hard, but I think its more easy for migration if its stored on csv files09:09
sepeni.e migration to psql or mysql09:09
cptnI'd rather go for a more commented format than a more structured one though09:09
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mwansaRomster, made my entry what next ?09:10
cptnleave 5$ in the box next to the crux office09:11
mwansawill do :D09:11
cptnmwansa: which entr is yours?09:11
* Romster giggles09:11
mwansathe very bottom one09:11
Romsteri don't see a entry.09:11
mwansamust enter valid code O_o09:12
mwansa!!! % Christchurch, New Zealand | -43.531639 | 172.636642 | gmtP1209:12
mwansaKelly | mwansa\\09:12
cptnokay, I'll add that09:14
Romsterah the kapacha09:14
Romsterwhich i still easy for bots might i add.09:15
cptnmmmh, great, another DST rule09:15
Romsterah you need one for every half hour i think.09:17
RomsterDST is a pain.09:17
cptnwell, it's especially painful in .au09:17
cptnwhere not all parts have it09:18
Romsterplus someone messed up and my DST ended a week later than what all the phones and computers said..09:19
Romsterso i dunno who messed that up09:19
sepencptn, done for single users
sepenat this point only we need something like add.php for adding cordinates to csv's09:20
cptnmwansa: I added you, but the time is still wrong09:21
sepenin future maybe replaced for mysql queries ...09:21
mwansacptn, yea i figured. just remebered it was moved from +12 to +1309:22
cptnthat's GMT+12 + 1 for DST, which IIRC ended in on april 609:23
Romsteryes it ended april 6th here but the times ended on the computer a week early.09:23
Romstergo figure?09:23
Romsterwhat sets the DST time something in glibc?09:24
Romsterah nice one sepen09:28
Romstercptn, ah so my timezone file was a week out..09:28
Romsterhmmz some binary format.09:28
sepenRomster, this link appears inside the cruxmap code as wrotes cptn09:29
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Romsterman DST is so complicated programers must hate DST09:32
Romsterhaving all these diferent zones.09:32
cptnalso, some countries sometimes change it09:33
cptnI think in 2006 Australia delayed it because of the commonwealth games09:33
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Romstercptn, that is correct.09:35
Romsterand recently extended it.09:36
Romsteri always thought it was for the office people to get some sunlight to walk there dogs etc than being cooped up all day.09:36
Romsteryet others say it's to save power and there is no proof it actually saves power than to use more power.09:37
cptnmwansa: fixed :-)09:37
Romsterso i've lost the true meaning of what DST is for.09:37
RomsterNote: Many countries/territories change days of transitions to DST from year to year.09:37
Romsteron that site...09:38
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mwansacptn, except its am here not pm09:39
cptndoesn't say pm here09:41
mwansawhat happend to prologic ?, did he leave crux ?09:43
rehabdollreal life (tm) ?09:45
cruxbot[contrib.git]: tor: ->
Romster24 hour time ftw09:49
Romsterthis am/pm is a pain.09:49
cptnrehabdoll: I moved you to the map too BTW09:52
cptnfrom the public wiki page09:52
rehabdolldamn, now i'll be swamped with groupies :(09:54
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Romsterrehabdoll, lol <<09:56
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cptnrehabdoll: it's worse for mwansa, since he's the only one one the island :-)09:57
mwansaha ha, not for long hopefully. planning to move to melbourne09:57
mwansain search of better ISP's09:57
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cruxbot[contrib.git]: yacy: 0.56 -> 0.5813:32
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namenlosanyone knows, where the version control sources for ports are?16:47
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Rotwang /var/lib/pkg ?16:48
namenlosi mean the git repository on:
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Egon30There is no x86_64 bit version of Crux right ? Just i686 optimized 32 bit eh ?17:54
predatorfreakEgon30: It's really not "i686" optimised.17:55
predatorfreakIt's whatever the crap you change the march to optimised.17:55
predatorfreakThe default CDs are just built for i686.17:55
Egon30predatorfreak: ah just like *BSD i.e global make.conf ?17:56
predatorfreakBut, there is no x86_64 distro yet.17:56
predatorfreakerr CRUX distro*17:56
predatorfreakThere was in the past, but they died off.17:56
predatorfreakEgon30: Yes, only we call it /etc/pkgmk.conf :)17:56
Egon30predatorfreak: Crux seems like it would be my perfect Linux OS since I'm experienced linux user and like *BSD I was just hoping for an x86_64 distro since I have a core 2 duo CPU17:57
Egon30predatorfreak: oh well nevermind17:58
predatorfreakx86_64 doesn't behave much different from x86.17:58
predatorfreakIt's a lot of hype.17:58
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predatorfreakThe performance differences are largely negligible too, plus you'd probably wind up wasting disk space for shit like Flash.17:59
Egon30predatorfreak: I know it is but running a 64 bit CPU on 32 bits is like taking the sparc plug out of 4 cylinders in a corvette and then driving it on the remaining 4 cylinders -- sure it will work but I dunno that it's optimal18:00
predatorfreakNo, it's not.18:00
predatorfreakThe benchmarks have been done a million times.18:01
predatorfreakThe only things that benefit are very, very math-intensive applications.18:01
predatorfreakand even then, the gains are under 20% in 99% of cases.18:01
predatorfreakThe average desktop experience will not change significantly.18:01
predatorfreakThe most legitimate gains from going to x86_64 are for very high memory setups.18:02
predatorfreakBecause x86_64 addresses much larger amounts of memory much more easily.18:02
predatorfreakand doesn't require hacks like PAE and shit.18:03
Egon30predatorfreak: what's the total amount of packages in the ports tree ?18:04
predatorfreakDepends on which repos you have enabled18:05
Egon30predatorfreak: all18:06
predatorfreakEgon30: I don't have every single repo out in CRUX land enabled.18:06
predatorfreakI couldn't say.18:06
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