IRC Logs for #crux Thursday, 2008-05-22

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Romsterman that was netsplit madness...00:44
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RomsternipuL, hmm nice idea using unionfs00:45
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Romstersomeone ins Sweden has there httpup file incorrectly set ...crux/romsterREPO01:01
pitillogood morning01:13
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rehabdollcan you be a bit more specific?01:43
rehabdollthere are 9 million of us :)01:44
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-libpciaccess: updated to
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xdpyinfo: updated to
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xdm: updated to
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xinit: updated to
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xf86-input-elo2300: updated to
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xf86-input-elographics: updated to
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xf86-input-keyboard: updated to
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xf86-video-cirrus: updated to
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xf86-video-neomagic: updated to
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xf86-video-s3virge: updated to
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xf86-video-savage: updated to
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-libfs: updated to
tilmanand 8 of those 9 million run crux? ;)01:44
rehabdollyes damnit!01:44
rehabdollits mandatory01:44
cptndon't forget the 6.5 millon swedes that live in Switzerland01:45
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tilmani disabled dmx in xorg-server but didn't kill xorg-dmxproto and xorg-libdmx01:50
Romsterok with ip needs to fix romster.httpup01:54
tilmanwonder which idiot's box that is01:54
cptnunpossible to find out01:54
tilmani'll hack up a ruby script01:55
tilmanwhich generates all possible hostnames01:55
tilmanand resolves them01:55
Romster$ host domain name pointer www.crux.nu01:55
Romsterand the peny drops...01:56
pitillocheck the portdb Romster... your repo isn't there..01:56
RomsterViper edited it and made a typo01:56
tilmanRomster: "dig -x"01:56
Romsterah i should get used to using dig more.01:58
Romsterpitillo, my httpup file is ok isn't it?01:58
Romsterothers seem to have no issues.01:58
pitilloRomster, yes, it's ok. I haven't changed here and I got it from the ML. (I checked the DB too and wasn't there)01:58
Romsterlooks like someone is doing a entire ports -u romster on me.01:59
Romsteryeah so i'll email viper again.01:59
Romsterand tell him of the error.01:59
pitilloRomster, I am who is getting all again... (1 computer atm and in a seconds another one)01:59
Romsteryou should run squid there.02:00
Romsteri got that here saves re downloading02:00
pitilloumm no problem with downloads rates (may be can hurt you more than me)02:00
pitilloRomster, btw, I will take a look and may be I will try to use a proxy to avoid redowloading things... Thank you for the tip02:01
Romsternp i use squid in transparant mode.02:02
Romstercomes in handy.02:02
Romsteri don't mind the uploading was just a tip.02:02
Romsteri got QoS setup so thing should run smoothly.02:02
Romsteri'm working on making my QoS more accessible in a program.02:06
Romsteras you could imagine tc isn't the easiest thing to work with.02:07
Romstertaken me time to learn it.02:07
pitilloI am having some problemswith p2p traffic here (not sure if they are isp related) but this is forcing me to start learning more about pf in my case (not using qos)02:09
cruxbot[xorg.git]: Fixed a bunch of port descriptions.02:10
Romsterpitillo, oh you on a BSD gateway?02:12
pitilloRomster, yes.. another way to learn a bit more02:13
Romsterah apparantly BSD has a saner QoS with pf02:14
Romsteri'm working on a module to make tc a lot easier to configure.02:15
predatorfreakRomster: PF and altq combined02:15
Romsterpitillo, i now run p2p and stuff with no limits set as you were geting files from me i had aMule running :P02:18
Romsterwith no limits, only tc doing it's job.02:18
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pitilloRomster, yeah, I ran it and I had some problems because I was disconnected until half hour or so (I didn't know if it was due a bad pf configuration or to my isp's traffic shapper)02:19
pitilloI got disconnected and I can't reconnect (lost connections and other errors) btw, this is one good reason to understand a bit bettter pf02:20
sepenmorning all02:22
pitilloyo sepen02:22
sepenpf rocks02:23
Romsterpitillo, i see.02:39
Romsterhi sepen02:39
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DarkNekroshi everybody ;)02:48
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Rotwangsepen: ping03:45
Rotwangsepen: new catalyst 8.503:46
sepenok and many thanks03:46
Rotwangnp ;]03:46
sepenadded to my .todo list03:47
Rotwangno hurries03:47
sepenIm also subsribed to ati rss news, no idea why don't nofify me03:47
Rotwangthere was 8.4 also03:48
tilman$1500.00 o_O03:54
tilmani guess this isn't the consumer product that we're looking for03:54
cptn-100$ preorder discount :-)03:54
tilmanyay ;)03:55
nipuLare removed directories supposed to stay in your git repo?03:57
tilmanno. maybe you didn't remove it correctly? ;)03:59
tilmanor maybe i'm misunderstanding the question o_O03:59
nipuLhmm they don't show up in ls-files04:00
nipuLjust on my file system04:00
tilmanwhat does 'git status' say?04:01
nipuLwell i didn't remove it04:01
nipuLit's old ports that got removed from opt04:01
nipuLall the files are gone, but the directory is still there04:01
tilmanworks as expected for me04:03
nipuLjust tried a rebase to be sure, and i'm up to date04:04
nipuLgit status says nothing to commit04:04
nipuLtried fsck, gc, prune, etc04:05
tilmanrm -r acroread;  git status04:06
tilmandoes it say anything?04:06
tilmanthen just do a 'rmdir $d' in your loop ;)04:07
nipuLi'm just curious why they didn't go away in the first place04:07
tilmansorry, no idea :|04:07
tilmantry resetting your tree04:07
tilmangit reset --hard04:07
tilmanthat will kill your local changes though04:07
nipuLgit clean -d04:14
nipuL!! -f04:14
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tilmangreat, mutt changed its header cache db format04:31
tilmansepen: i'll check out safe-env when i have some time04:40
sepentilman, nice, also Im writing a new mail for avoid missunderstanding of the point04:40
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cptnpitillo: your mail client does not automatically add line breaks04:44
cptnpitillo: see :-)04:44
tilmanright, i pondered bitching about that04:45
tilmanset editor="gvim -f +7 -c 'set fo=tcrq' -c 'set tw=72'"04:45
tilmanpitillo: ^^^04:45
cptnset editor="vim -c 'set tw=72' -c '+/^$' -c ':noh' %s"04:45
cptngreat, now I have to search for fo=tcrq04:47
Rotwangnano ftw!!04:47
tilmanit's some fold stuff that i probably don't even use :)04:47
* Rotwang runs04:47
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pitillopffff first time I see that. Thank you for advise me and sorry.04:48
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tilmanpitillo: not that big a deal. but it should be fixable easily04:48
tilmanwhat MUA are you using?04:49
cptn Sylpheed 2.4.804:49
pitillotilman, yes, it's strange I saw this first time. I am using sylpheed (it has an editor if I am not in wrong)04:49
tilmanhehe, i had the same problem with sylpheed (way back)04:49
tilmanthere's a checkbox somewhere for line breaks ;)04:50
sepenmail sent04:50
pitilloomg, all mails are equal since the last update from claws... Sorry04:50
tilmanan automated test environment thingy sounds nice to me04:51
jesse_I thought Romster had something similar already done.04:51
sepenpfff pitillo
sepenit has the same problem with your lines04:51
pitillo(wrap messages at 72 chars...) I don't understand04:52
tilmanalso wtf does 'pfff' mean in spanish? :>04:52
pitillosepen, I think I have since the last slpheed updte04:52
tilmanpitillo: maybe it means that your *editor* breaks them, but not in the actual text that is sent04:52
sepentilman, same as wtf I think04:53
pitillojaajaaja it's some kind of sight (try to make that sound in spanish...)04:53
sepentilman, also >  muhahahah == jajajaja04:53
cptnnote the single 'a's04:53
sepenfonetics differences04:53
pitillowell, I will take a look and I will make some test before posting again. Thank you a lot for told me that.04:53
tilmansepen: of course i know what 'jajaja' means... it's easy to figure out when you know spanish a bit ;)04:54
sepenbastard spaniards!!04:54
tilmansepen: 'pfff' is also used in german (and english somewhat, i think) but it's got a different meaning ;)04:55
tilmanso, it's confusing :p04:55
NyadI tried installing crux again and I had the same problem, it couldn't find the USB HD, I installed 3 times, each time making sure that I had every HD/scsi option enabled in the kernel04:55
sepenohh. noted!  tilman, we might vote for spanish cruxcon this year :)04:56
tilmansepen: well, i don't know of any plans for a cruxcon this year :D04:57
sepenor australian, where the sun lights are better04:57
tilmansepen: plane tickets to australia = $$$04:57
jesse_Nyad: are you saying the crux installer cd does not detect your usb hd?04:59
jesse_Oh nevermind. Since you claim you've installed it a couple times, the problem has to be elsewhere.05:00
cptnNyad: what about the USB host controller?05:01
cptnNyad: is that in the kernel too?05:01
Nyadno, it does and I can mount it. it's just that once I have installed it onto my usb HD and I set my grub from my ubuntu to boot from it. I get a kernel panic since it can't find the root fs since it doesn't detect sdc2   actually it isn't picking up and scsi devices at all. I have checked and checked and I don't know what Im not doing in building my kernel05:01
pitilloI hope I have it fixed now. It's very uncorfortable to read that mail...05:02
Nyadwhat must I do with that? enable it when I build my kernel?05:02
cptnNyad: yes05:02
cptnthey're modules by default too05:02
cptnso they can't be loaded before the disk is mounted05:02
cptnbut without Host controller, devices won't work05:02
Nyadok lemme try that. cheers05:03
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jesse_Another satisfied user? :p05:04
Rotwangubuntu fte!!05:05
Rotwangwhat about german cruxcon :D05:06
cptnjesse_: at least he keeps coming back :-)05:06
Rotwanglets say in berlin05:06
surrounderanyone here going to linuxtag next week btw ?05:06
Rotwangin the euro 2008 time :O05:06
tilmanRotwang: :D05:08
tilmansurrounder: not me05:08
Rotwangberlin is pretty close to breslau \o/ so i would come ;]05:08
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cptnNyad: so?05:17
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NyadI didn't find it. I'm gonna try again in a few minutes. I looked under device drivers, unless it's located elsewhere in the menu05:18
cptndid you search for exactly that string?05:18
RotwangNyad: i know05:18
Rotwangborrow kernel from somewhere else :D05:19
cptnNyad: since it's actually three05:19
cptnOHCI is probably the one you need05:19
NyadI searched.  /config_usb05:19
surrounderRotwang: o//05:20
Nyadk time to try. brb05:22
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jesse_cptn: indeed.05:23
Rotwangsurrounder: łot?05:26
tilmancool, i found a bug in mutt \o/05:31
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Nyadall of those modules are checked05:39
Nyadwith a *05:39
surrounderRotwang: sorry? :P05:40
Rotwang>:| ;] :D \:D/05:41
NyadHowever what I did was I just rebuilt the kernel so it compiles a lot faster, but I'm not sure if it would make a difference if I did it all from scratch so that all modules are compiled again05:45
RomsterNyad, it should only rebuild what it needs too.05:46
Romsterso should be ok.05:46
Romsterhi mwansa05:47
Nyadhmm, then its really odd that it doesn't work now. it still doesn't detect my sata drives either, perhaps that could be the problem?05:48
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cptnwell, sata is all as modules too05:56
cptnhe should just build a proper kernel05:56
Romstermake mrproper06:02
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Romstercptn, i also have a nice --clean shell function in my version of the chroot that could be adapted as a stand alone tool.06:05
Nyadcptn, it now detects my scsi hard drives, but not my USB HD and I've made sure that all of those USB options are enabled06:06
cptnNyad: does your USB host controller get detected?06:06
cptnohci_hcd: 2006 August 04 USB 1.1 'Open' Host Controller (OHCI) Driver06:06
cptnohci_hcd 0000:00:02.0: OHCI Host Controller06:06
cptnohci_hcd 0000:00:02.0: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 206:06
Rotwangi like awk handling floating point arithmetics in bash :P06:07
Romsteri just chose bc..06:08
Romsterbut i'll look into that.06:08
Rotwangbc is nice also06:08
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Rotwangshame that bash itself doesnt handle them06:09
Romsteryeah i was quite surprised at that.06:10
Romsterusing awk for floating point would be nice be one less dependency.06:10
Nyadcptn, how do I found out if it is detected? where would I look?06:12
cptnNyad: well, those messages I printed06:12
cptnNyad: these are from my kernel06:12
cptnthe ohci_hcd stuff06:12
pitilloRomster, if you can, take a look to prt-clean, I think it can be easier keeping the core list and then compare end remove06:13
cptnNyad: you should see something like this too06:13
Nyadso it shows that when I try and boot into the vmlinuz on the external HD?06:13
Romsterk but that function i made works for me.06:13
cptnNyad: yes, it should06:13
cptnNyad: alternatively, you could do root=<sata disk> init=/bin/sh06:14
cptnwhich will boot into a shell06:14
sepenRomster, yeah, as pitillo says, prt-clean might be a nice addon06:14
Nyadso root=/dev/sdc2 init=/bin/sh06:14
cptnis sdc2 the sata disk?06:14
cptnthen yes06:15
pitilloRomster, yeah, I know, but take a look to the process, how you do it, checking all ports in a dir. I think it's less resource eater making the diff06:15
cptnNyad: this will be a plain shell06:15
Romsteri could do that once with a cache file, i had thought of that.06:15
Romsterpitillo, the cpu hit is acceptable.06:15
cptnNyad: and I'm not sure how well it'll work06:15
Romsterbut i intend to use a cache file.06:16
Nyadcptn, what would I be doing with this shell?06:16
Romsteri'll look over prt-clean though.06:16
pitilloRomster, well, it's a good reason, but I think it needs more time and resources. I hope you can take a look and try to find problems or ways to do it better06:17
pitillothank you Romster06:17
sepenyeah many thanks06:17
Romsterdidn't say it was the right idea :P but at the time i made it it worked as intended.06:17
Romsterand as you know all my ports in contrib are done in my safe-build now.06:18
pitilloyeah, I have been following safe-build since some time ago...06:18
Romsterbe intersting to try your version out.06:18
Romsteri haven't done a lot more to it for awhile.06:18
pitilloyeah, you build them inside a clean/minimal chroot :)06:18
Rotwangbtw try to do arithmetics in (())06:19
Nyadcptn, brb, gonna test this06:19
Nyadcptn, thanks a lot06:19
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Rotwangand things like i++ looks neater than i=$i+106:20
Rotwangbut its only my point of view06:20
sepenRotwang, you mean   let i=$i+106:21
Rotwangsepen: yes06:21
sepenbash builting command, right?06:22
Rotwangits only code readability thing06:22
Rotwangsepen: let is also deprecated from what i know06:22
Rotwangim not a bash expert keep that in mind06:22
Rotwangbut all arithmetic things should be done in (())06:22
Rotwangit makes also code look cleaner06:24
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cptnNyad: I would have mounted /sys and checked what devices the kernel found06:26
Nyadok I will try that quick, brb06:27
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Nyadcptn, it doesn't work, same reason why it won't boot into it. it can't get into root sdc2 since thats the USB HD06:32
NyadI don't think the kernel is detecting it06:32
cptnbut before sdc2 was the sata disk...06:33
cptn[13:13] <cptn> is sdc2 the sata disk?06:33
cptn[13:13] <Nyad> ya06:33
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Nyadit's the USB HD06:34
Nyadwhich is also a sata06:34
cptnokay, sorry I meant connected as SATA06:34
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cptnNyad: maybe it would be easiest to build a new kernel06:35
cptnNyad: i.e. go through menuconfig and adjust it to your HW06:35
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tilmen:) hehe06:35
Rotwangtilmen: 0o06:36
Rotwangthere is more than one of you?06:36
tilmenlol, i better convert back till he notices me06:36
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cptnNyad: as the ISO finds the HD, it's only a configuration issue06:36
Nyadcptn, what do you mean, isn't that the same as what I've been doing all the time? or do you mean instead of recompiling, I should rather just install from scratch and compile the kernel that way?06:37
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cptnNyad: well, you've tried, and adjusted some options06:37
cptnNyad: but I'm not sure if you understood the impact of these06:37
NyadI probably didn't06:38
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cptnNyad: do you have a second PC?06:39
cptnthis would allow you to capture the boot up messages via serial console06:39
mwansaRotwang, what wm you play around wityh06:39
NyadI do but they all only have windows on06:39
cptnthat should work06:39
cptnNyad: quick question though:06:39
cptndid you change the kernel to make the build in sata drives supported?06:39
cptnbecause if not, the USB drive will be the first one -> sda206:40
Nyaddo you mean the ordinary sata HD's inside my pc?06:40
Nyadyes I did06:40
Nyadvery few things are left as modules in my kernel config06:40
Nyadthe size of the kernel doesn't worry me06:41
Rotwangmwansa: awesome06:41
Rotwangcokolwiek modulo 3 zawsze daje [0-2] ????06:41
Rotwangsorry:\ wrong window06:41
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cptnNyad: I'm really out of ideas06:43
cptnNyad: it would be interesting to know whether an USB stuff shows up in the boot messages06:44
cptnincluding USB mass storage stuff06:44
Nyadhmm. so what is this idea you had. I don't know how I would go about doing it so you would need to guide me06:45
cptnwell, if you have a serial cable, you can connect two PCs06:46
Rotwangmwansa: why do you ask?06:46
cptnand then on windows you need a terminal client06:46
cptnhyperterminal should work06:46
RomsterRotwang, ah yes it's a diferent language thing that also works.06:46
Romsteri'd prefer to use i++06:47
RotwangRomster: bash inherited many features from other shells06:47
Rotwangso i++ thing or for ((i=0;i<=10;i++)), also works06:47
mwansaRotwang, in search of a good wm i have tried everything outhere. so far pekwm is the favourable one06:47
Nyadcptn, I have a router which has all 3 of my pc's connected to it06:47
Nyadcptn, via a lan cable06:48
Rotwangmwansa: try awesome, its similar to dwm wmii06:48
cptnNyad: lan won't help06:48
mwansayea just compiled it :)06:48
cptnNyad: needs to be a serial null modem cable06:48
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cptnprobably not that common nowadays :-)06:48
Romsterbash inherted features from ksh csh and the origional bsd shell.06:49
NyadI don't have one of those06:49
Romstermwansa, i'm still liking pekwm.06:49
mwansaRomster, yeah pekwm is great06:49
RomsterNyad, i can make one but your too far to send to.06:50
Romsteri'm a electronics technician06:50
cptnNyad: one thing you should try is boot from the ISO06:50
cptnNyad: and copy the ISO kernel and /boot/initramfs to the USB HDD06:50
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cptnNyad: then change grub to support that06:51
cptn something like APPEND initrd=/boot/initramfs06:51
Romstermwansa, i have IceQua theme atm set.06:51
Romsterquite nice.06:51
Romsterand i changed my mouse pointers too.06:51
Nyadcptn, ok I can do that, it may work06:52
cptnNyad: another choice is to take a picture of the screen with a digital camera06:52
cptnNyad: but then it would help to use a small console font06:52
cptnotherwise, the interesting bits may be gone06:52
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Nyadthe problem is that when it starts up it zooms past the initial bits until it hits the kernel panic. after which I can't do anything06:53
Nyadand I can't scroll up with shit+PGUP06:53
cptnyeah, that's what panics are like06:53
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mwansaRotwang i like it! :P06:54
Nyadcptn, does it matter where on the external HD I put the 2 files? what about the file?06:54
Rotwan1mwansa: \:D/06:55
cptnNyad: it matters in the sense that you reference them from grub's menu.lst06:55
cptnare you sure you tested the correct kernels?06:57
cptn(just wondering :-))06:57
Nyadwhat do you mean?06:57
cptnI mean, did you always copy the newly built kernels to /boot/vmlinuz?06:59
NyadI've copied the 2 files from the ISO but what about the from the kernel I built and the from the ISO07:01
cptnthey're not needed for the kernel to work07:01
cptnthey're mainly usuful for debugging panics and oopses07:02
Nyadif it's used for debugging panics then perhaps it has stuff regarding what happens before the panic? just a guess07:03
NyadRomster, thanks for the offer :)07:04
cptnNyad: typically not for the unable to mount rootfs error07:04
Nyadok Im gonna test this idea quick, brb07:06
RomsterNyad, i always do /boot/ and /boot/vmlinuz- and i have multiple versions i can boot from.07:06
cptnNyad: wait07:06
Romsteri also do cp .config /boot/kconfig-
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Nyadcptn, ok07:06
cptnNyad: can you note the exact error?07:07
Romsterso i got a reference and only keep 3-4 kernels depends on what i am testing.07:07
cptnjust the very end of it07:07
Nyadok. I'll have to cause another panic then. brb07:07
cptnunless it works :-)07:07
Nyadthat too :)07:08
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Nyadnope. the ISO kernel doesn't work. here's what the kernel panic gives with the kernel I built:07:19
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NyadVFS : Cannot open root device "sdc2" or unknown-block(0,0)    it then gives a list of available partitions, none of which is my USB HD but it picks everything else up.07:20
Nyadkernel panic - not syncing : VFS : unable to mount root fs on unknown-block(0,0)07:20
cptnmmmh, strange07:22
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cptnNyad: that this message change when you tried different kernels?07:24
cptni.e. did the internal sata drives show up only later?07:24
cptnin the partition list07:24
Nyadinitially it didn't show my internal sata drives but that was because of some kernel things I didn't add. but once I had added them then they showed up07:25
cptnand did you manage to see something mentioning usb mass storage?07:26
cptn"USB Mass Storage support registered."07:26
NyadI did see that and it is enabled07:27
cptnno idea, sorry07:29
Nyadok. perhaps I should ask on another distro's IRC channel since they should know what they did with the kernel07:30
thrice`ck4up reports new gcc o.O07:31
cptnthrice`: 4.2.407:31
cptnNyad: if their kernel works, sure07:32
Nyadwhat other distro's are there that are similar to crux?07:33
Rotwangarch amybe?07:33
thrice`not many, actually07:33
cptnI think most offer an official kernel package07:34
mwansaRotwang: is it possible to restart wm without restarting X ?07:34
Rotwangmwansa: probably :\07:34
thrice`arch is close, but it's binary, and has worse packaging (imo).  gentoo is also sorta close, but has a much more complex packaging system07:34
Rotwangmwansa: try mod4 + shift + q07:34
Rotwangi dont remember ;]07:35
Romsterwoot new gcc07:35
NyadI would like a distro where I must compile all my packages from source, but the distro itself must be extremely light since I plan on running it on an eeePC which has only 800Mhz celeron and 512MB ram07:36
Nyadbut not gentoo07:36
RotwangNyad: damn small bsd \o/07:37
mwansaRotwang: wohoo mod4 + Ctr + R07:37
thrice`sounds like crux fits that bill07:37
Rotwangnever used it tho07:37
mwansa<3 awesome07:37
Rotwangmwansa: yes that was it ;]07:37
Rotwangawesome is awesome07:38
thrice`is that tiling?07:38
thrice`I never got the hang of those :(07:38
surrounderawesome <307:38
RomsterNyad, crux should work on that if you don't mind the wait of compiling, if you got a a few computers there distcc will ease that 800MHz slowness on compiling somewhat.07:39
jesse_I'm surprised, surrounder. You were supposed to adore FVWM. :>07:39
jesse_"fvwm <3" and out.07:40
NyadRomster, crux is perfect for what I want. I just can't boot it from an external HD :(07:41
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RomsterNyad, i'm sure there is a way.. maybe you must use a initrd.07:43
Romsterload support for usb then select the image on the usb drive.07:44
cptnNyad: I've booted CRUX from a usb memory stick before, so basically it should work07:45
Nyadcptn, how did you do it?07:45
Nyadalso the eeePC doesn't have a cdrom drive so I was going with NFS install07:46
cptnI think I used lilo back then07:46
cptnkernel without initramfs07:46
Nyadcptn, but isn't this problem independant of lilo or grub? since both require one to state the root partition07:46
Nyadnot just the kernel07:47
cptnit is07:47
cptnbut it's also independent from the distro07:47
cptnsince it's all during the kernel boot07:47
Nyadya, the problem seems to lie in the kernel configuration but I have it all set up. unless someone was to be really generous and give me a config file with the correct data, since that's smaller to send than a fully compiled kernel07:49
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cptnNyad: I think most here will gladly share their configs07:52
cptnbut it's hard to say whether they're correct for your setup07:53
NyadI can give any info they need07:53
thrice`the internet is probably the best place for an eeePC config.  I havent' heard of anyone doing crux on it yet, but wouldn't be surprised07:54
Nyadwhy not just make a generic one that will run on a crappy celeron but also support USB HD and sata HD07:54
cptnI guess booting from the iso, and the saving the output of dmesg, lspci and lsmod would be a good start07:54
thrice`in a pinch, you can also just use the one from the iso's kernel (zcat /proc/config.gz > .config )07:55
cptnthrice`: I think that's what he does07:56
cptnthe ISO config is copied to the kernel directory automatically07:59
cptnduring setup07:59
Nyadbut the ISO kernel picks up my usb HD, and I just added extra stuff so it should still support it07:59
thrice`oh, I never thought to look :(  sorry07:59
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Nyadcptn, what if I was to give you my config file for the kernel I built?08:35
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pitilloNyad, grub.conf and lspci at least too...08:36
Nyadthe grub is my ubuntu grub, not the crux grub btw.08:37
pitillodoesn't matter, you must check that you are booting the correct device and partition08:37
pitillodmesg on jurbuntu can be interesting too08:37
Nyadpitillo, there is no grub.conf only grub menu.lst08:41
pitillowell, it's the same08:41
Nyadand the other was dmesg, but what's jurbuntu?08:42
pitilloI mean the ubuntu's dmesg output08:43
Nyadthe actual files themselves? if no then I'm not sure how to get what you need08:43
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pitilloNyad, /var/log/dmesg08:45
cptndmesg, lsmod, lspci, fdisk -l would all me interesting08:47
cptnand the config08:48
pitillofdisk -l, good point08:48
cptnI can try with a USB memory stick tonight if I find one08:50
Nyadfdisk -l
cptnthis is not from the ISO, is it?08:51
Nyadthis is stuff that Im typing in ubuntu08:52
Nyadfrom konsole08:52
cptnwow @ lsmod08:55
cruxbot[core.git]: gcc: updated to
Rotwanga lot of shiv08:56
Rotwangyay, new gcc08:56
Nyadum, dmesg output is too large for konsole. whats so wow about lsmod?08:56
cptnwell, my custom kernel has 18 modules loaded08:57
cptnthe ubuntu one 9108:57
cptnNyad: run dmesg > /tmp/dmesg.out08:58
cptnand upload that file08:58
Nyadthat's half the reason I want to change. even though I have a fast pc, stuff isn't instant08:58
triis somebody using crux with a inital ram disk ?08:58
cptntri: the iso is08:58
triah ok sure - but does it make any sence for me to use a inital ramdisk after installing crux ?08:59
cptnNyad: dmesg from the ISO would be more interesting09:00
cptnNyad: you could of course use the ubuntu kernel to get started09:00
cptnassuming that it works with your external USB drive09:01
Nyadhm, so I make grub use kernel from ubuntu but still set root= to my USB HD?09:01
Nyadit does work with it09:01
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cptnNyad: yep09:05
cptnNyad: probably have to use ubuntu's initramfs as well09:05
cptnno idea about ubuntu09:05
cptntri: well, most don't use initramfs' AFAICS09:06
Nyadok. brb then09:06
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cptnI wonder if he remembered to copy the modules...09:14
Rotwangheh, i told easier to use kernel from other distro :P09:15
Rotwangbut of course nobody listen09:15
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Nyadno success when using ubuntu kernel09:22
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Nyadcptn, if you could try installing it onto a USB stick that would be greatly appreciated09:29
cptnNyad: but then that means that the ubuntu grub and ubuntu kernel couldn't mount a root file system09:33
cptni.e. only Ubuntu parts that failed to do the job09:33
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Nyadcptn, IT WORKED!!!! yay09:40
Nyadwith ubuntu kernel09:40
cptnso theoretically, you can just compare configurations09:41
cptnand build a matching kernel09:41
cptnor keep using the ubuntu one of course :-)09:41
NyadI'd rather compile a new one, I'd learn more that way09:41
cptngood choice :-)09:42
Nyadalso when I was in the ubuntu kernel I tried typing startx  and it recognized the command but didn't go in, gave a connection reset by peer error09:42
cptnhard to say09:43
cptnremember where ubuntu provides default configurations for pretty much anything, CRUX only installs whatever comes with the packages09:43
cptnwhich typically means that you have to configure stuff yourself09:44
mwansaor check with #ubuntu :-)09:44
NyadI'd love to install every piece of software from source, just not to the extent of LFS09:49
Nyadwhere is the config file for the kernel for crux?09:58
cptnNyad: on the iso in /crux/kernel09:59
cptnalso, you can zcat /proc/config.gz09:59
cptnif you're running the default kernel from CRUX10:00
Rotwangis it good idea to rebuild whole system after gcc bump?10:00
NyadI want the config for the one that I built10:01
tilmanRotwang: 4.2.3 -> 4.2.4 sounds safe to not do it10:01
cptnNyad: that's ~/.config in /usr/src/.../10:02
cptnforget the ~/ part10:02
Nyadits 3000 and 2000 lines!10:07
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thrice`"gcc 4.2.4 fixes regressions introduced in 4.2.3"  o.O10:14
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Romsterwonder what regressions.10:24
Romstercrap this means i gotta redo all the compilers..10:25
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tilmanRomster: how often do you compile fortran apps anyway? or gcj-using apps?10:43
tilmani don't even know wtf gdc is10:44
RomsterD compiler i toy with a bit. i mainly made gcj to compile azurious.10:44
Romsterfortran i use with fftw10:44
Romsterfortran seems to be used a bit for audio stuff.10:44
Romstermust have better math or something *shrugs*10:45
Romsterand mingw i made to compile reactos.10:45
Romsteri wanted to skip trying to learn C++ and go to D but i really don't know if D is gonna gain momentum.10:46
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Nyadwhat's D?10:48
Romsterwas thinking of removing mingw10:48
tilmannah, keep it10:48
tilmani'll point sepen at it next time he's annoyed at what kind of crap we have in opt10:48
RomsterGDC is a D language front end for the GNU Compiler Collection. It supports a number of targets and nearly all features of Digital Mars D.10:48
Romstertilman, lol..10:49
Romsterhoping D would replace C++ but dunno.10:51
sepentilman, what?10:52
tilmansepen: remember when you were pissed off because we had amule in opt? :D10:52
sepenI like mldonkey :)10:52
Romsteri think tilman wants to make a example of my mingw32-gcc compiler :P10:52
Rotwangamule sucks10:53
sepenwell tilman you known my opinion about opt ports10:53
RomsterIO i run aMule10:53
Romsterit works just fine.10:53
tilmansepen: yeah. it's okay, nevermind10:53
NyadRomster, so D is another programming language supported by GCC10:54
tilmanNyad: yeah, it's a modern(ish) OO language10:54
tilmanbut nobody seems to care :D10:55
RomsterNyad, kinda it's a add on to GCC10:56
Romsteryeah it seems to be not moving anywhere.10:56
Romstertakes the goodness out of C++ adds OO from python etc.10:56
tilmanoh well ;)10:57
Romstertrys to fix the sort comings of other languages.10:57
Romsterguess it wasn't ment to be.10:58
NyadI really don't see why people don't just write a compiler for python11:00
Rotwangbecause its scripting language :x11:00
tilmanthe term 'scripting language' doesn't make that much sense when you're talking about python11:01
tilmanNyad: python has a virtual machine, like java11:02
Nyadyes but they could write a compiler for the language itself11:02
tilmanmaybe some language features make it easier to deal with it in a VM11:02
RomsterNyad, D pretty much has the python OO model11:03
NyadD has a very clever name, since it seems like it was designed to superseed C/C++11:04
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Romstereven a game in D
Romsteryeah that is it's intention11:09
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RyoSRomster: have you played that game?11:13
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RomsterRyoS, nope maybe i should give it a try.11:18
RyoShaha maybe :p11:19
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RyoSmh, doesnt seem to be a game for me :P /me removes11:25
Romsteri hadn't looked into it much11:26
Romsterwesnoth is a nice game.11:26
tilmanError: could not create truetype face11:27
tilmansome font thing failed11:27
cruxbot[contrib.git]: gst-plugins-ugly: 0.10.7 -> 0.10.811:30
Nyadcptn, if possible, could you try install crux onto a USB stick, I'm not having much luck with these huge files11:34
cptnNyad: I'll see what I can do11:35
Romsternever have tried that either.11:39
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Nyadwhat timezone are you all in?11:59
tilmani'm the awesome cest ;)12:00
cptnsame here12:00
* Rotwang is in cest \:D/12:02
Nyadthe moment I get it working properly I'll add myself to the list12:06
Nyadya Im the first African!12:06
tilmancool. 5/5 continents of crux coverage12:07
Rotwangare you serious?12:07
Rotwangtilman: what about antarctica12:08
RotwangNyad: where do you live?12:08
NyadSouth Africa12:08
Rotwangnut what country12:08
tilmanRotwang: south africa _is_ a country :P12:09
Nyadthat is a country12:09
Nyadright next to zimbabwe12:09
Rotwangmy geography sucks12:10
RotwangNyad: egzotic place, for us europeans12:11
Romstergreenland has none like Rotwang said.12:11
Rotwangbut greenland is not a continent12:12
NyadRotwang, that depends12:12
RotwangNyad: what?12:12
Romsterwtf ozborne and wall O_o in Antarctica.12:12
Romsteris that some kind of joke.12:13
Nyadmany people from first world countries assume we have animals running around12:13
Rotwangcruxers in antarctica?12:13
RotwangNyad: yeah12:13
Rotwangthats true12:13
RotwangNyad: we have this kind of stereotypes12:14
Rotwangbut what can i say, im not from the first world \:D/12:14
Nyadantarctica? is that a joke or does someone really live there?12:14
NyadRotwang, where are you from?12:14
Romsteri dunno it's on that map.12:14
Rotwangmexico of europe :P12:14
surrounderwhere can I add myself to that map? :O12:15
Rotwangcptn should remove that entry from map12:15
Rotwangantarctica one12:15
Rotwangsurrounder: ask cptn12:16
surrounderRotwang: check, thanks :)12:16
Nyadis cptn short for captain?12:17
Romsteri never thought of that...12:17
Rotwangme too12:18
surrounderRotwang: hehe, your nick means something like "damned cheek" in dutch :P12:18
Romsterthe wang part makes me think of chinese.12:19
Rotwangsurrounder: lol12:20
Rotwangits from metropolis12:20
Rotwangmad inventor Rotwang12:20
Rotwangi habe invented anything tho12:21
NyadI thought rotwang was short for rotten wang which is rather crude12:22
Rotwangheh ;]12:22
RotwangNyad: so, are you student?12:23
Rotwangor do you work?12:23
NyadI am a student but I sortof have a part-time job12:23
Rotwangi ask out of curiousity12:23
Rotwangyou are like antipodes of europe:P12:24
Nyadnah I don't mind, I'm not on irc with people I've known for a day just so that I can be silent. ask anything you want12:24
Nyadpretty much.12:25
surrounderNyad: what's your shoesize? o//12:25
* surrounder runs12:25
Nyad11 or 1212:25
* Rotwang is tracking tilman on the users map12:26
Rotwangfound \o/12:27
Rotwangand sepen and pitilo are both from valencia12:28
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Nyadwhere's that?12:29
NyadRotwang, many of our roads are named after places in Britian12:30
Rotwangdue to blitish colonisation i suppose12:31
NyadI wish we still were12:32
Rotwangbrits had 1/3 of the world and lost it :*12:32
surrounderwe should've never traded new amsterdam with the britts :<12:32
Nyadonly coz of rebellion12:33
Rotwangi though tomake patch for pkgmk so it wont remove work dir so you can do changes to sources by hand and then invoke pkgmk12:36
Nyadnot too long till I relocate like the rest of us12:36
teKhello together.12:37
Rotwangis there such kind of patch already or i have to do it myself?12:37
teKrehabdoll: dhcpd 4.x does work for me12:37
tilmanRotwang: i think han has/had such a patch12:37
rehabdolldo you have ipv6 enabled in your kernel?12:37
teKdid a extra recompile12:38
Rotwangtilman: where is it?12:38
Rotwangif you know12:38
tilmandunno :D12:38
rehabdolland it worked without ipv6 too?12:38
rehabdollfor me dhcpd just bails out when it cant find any ipv6-stuff in /proc12:38
Romstergst-ffmpeg updated there build system yet it is borked...12:39
rehabdolland the -4 flag has no effect12:39
teKwtf, built from _my_ port?!12:39
rehabdollwell no, but with the same options you use12:40
teKthe only error I get when dhcpd is invoked with -6 explicitly is:12:41
teKWrote 0 leases to leases file.12:41
teKsubnet_number():inet.c:51: Addr/mask length mismatch.12:41
teKwhich is a configuration issue, I think12:41
rehabdollError opening '/proc/net/if_inet6' to list IPv6 interfaces; No such file or directory12:41
teK% sudo dhcpd -cf /usr/etc/dhcpd.conf12:42
teK[tek@basra][~]% echo $?12:42
teK% dhcpd --version12:42
rehabdollhave you tried it without any ipv6 stuff in the kernel?12:44
teKI recompile my kernel,  sec.12:44
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teKoh dear12:54
teKthose braindead dumbasses12:57
cptnNyad: I can't find a USB storage device right now, sorry13:02
Nyadcptn, ok thanks for looking :)13:02
cptnI know I have a memory stick somewhere, but I couldn't find it :-/13:03
cptnno problem13:03
* drijen bows before cptn 13:04
cptnnow that's the spirit!13:05
Nyadcptn,  is cptn short for captain?13:07
drijenno, its short for badass developer.13:07
teKrehabdoll: I think someone hit me with a hammer right NOW13:07
Rotwangcaptain planet!! to the rescue!13:07
drijen(this is suck up to cptn day)13:07
cptnNyad: from hockey, not military13:08
* Romster swats Rotwang 13:08
NyadI was thinking ships...13:08
Romsternot that cartoon gah..13:08
Romsterchild hood memory's in front of the tv flashing by now.13:08
drijenssh, ftp, gopher, http, scp, BY YOUR PROTOCOLS COMBINED.....13:08
* Romster facepalms13:09
* drijen passes Romster beer13:09
teKhey ho captain jack!^Winter-NET13:09
Romsteri think drijen watches too much tv...13:09
thrice`damn, where's piccard when youi need him13:09
drijenlol, i have not watched tv in nearly a decade13:09
Rotwangdont worry maam we are from the internets13:10
Romsterdrijen, very good memory then.13:10
tilmani can only offer
tilmannot quite appropriate though13:10
drijenRomster, indeed13:10
drijeni haev a picard facepalm13:10
Romsternext you'll be recalling widget or something.13:10
drijensounds familiar13:10
Romsteror maybe danger mouse :P13:10
RotwangRomster: where is that heavily patched pkgmk port of yours?13:11
Romsteryeah widgit was that purple alien13:11
drijenomg danger mouse ruled13:11
Romsteryeah it did13:11
drijensame for exosquad13:11
drijenand swat cats13:11
drijenwait, widget the world watcher?13:12
Romstergeez you do have a god memory.13:12
drijenhaha, they made video games of him thats how i remember13:12
drijenoh and that domino anitmated guy13:12
drijengames of him too13:12
teKrehabdoll: after having a look at the sources  ISC honestly requires you to chose ipv4 or 6 at compile time.13:14
NyadI love the way how animated characters and os stuff seems to fit together so well13:16
RotwangRomster: i cant find pkgutils-$version-source-diff-download.patch :x13:17
Romstermaking me think of them days i used to go play street fighter13:17
Romstershould be there..13:17
Romsterthat's disabled is work in progress.13:18
Rotwangmaybe im blind |[13:18
Romsterit's commented out.13:18
Romstermost of them patches are on FS waiting to be merged.13:20
Rotwangso ill write only for buildin from existing work dir13:20
RotwangRomster: so pkgmk do not delete work dir before building13:20
Rotwangyou can make quick changes by hand and check if they work13:21
Romsteroh i never bothered with that why do that when there is ccache.13:21
Rotwangccache you say, hmm13:21
RotwangIt acts as a caching pre-processor to C/C++13:22
Rotwangnot everything is written in C :D13:22
Romsternot much it doesn't cache.13:23
Romsterworks with other compiles and objects too.13:23
Romsterso what's wrong with kw ?13:23
Romsterif you stop a build half way thought a build() function how do you know what state it is in and what line to continue at?13:24
Rotwangi see it from the output13:25
Rotwangfrom the other hand you may use extract only13:25
Rotwangmodify sources13:25
Rotwangand lets say invoke pkgmk -b13:26
Rotwangto build package13:26
Rotwangsomething like putting read KEY in Pkgfile13:26
Romsterthere is -e like you said.13:26
Romsterextract only.13:26
Rotwangthats my point13:26
Rotwangextract only modify and build13:27
Romsteri do that alot pkgmk -e cd in do a patch cd out apply patch to Pkgfile then build.13:27
Rotwangthats the point \:D/13:28
Rotwangyou may check if your changes work in a fly13:28
Romsteri don't see the point of it but ok nothing to stop you from doing that.13:28
Rotwangand then modify Pkgbuild13:29
RomsterPkgbuild O_o we arn't slackware.13:29
Rotwangwell sometimes as i said earlier, use read KEY13:29
Rotwangfor doing such tings13:29
RotwangPkgfile ;]13:29
Romsterso how will this KEY work?13:29
Rotwangread KEY?13:29
Rotwangit waits for the input13:30
Romstermaybe i'll wait for you to make the patch then look over it.13:30
Romsteroh that type of key... thought you were refering to some type of hash key.13:30
Romsteryou were seeing if i implemented something ;P13:31
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Rotwangi also thought about colourful pkgmk outpu :x13:35
Rotwangto improve readability13:35
Rotwangbut i guess i would be beaten with a blunt axe, if i posted it on FS13:36
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Romstertake a look at my
Nyadthe .config file for the crux linux kernel says I should not edit it manually. but is it okay if I copy things from another config file as well as change things from m to y ?13:39
Rotwanghehe, nice13:39
RotwangNyad: im sure that your pc wont blow up13:39
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* Rotwang made a joke13:40
RomsterNyad, i've edited it before but need to be careful.13:40
Romster output of pretty_make13:40
surroundernow that's pretty :P13:41
Romsteri've not found anything else that does this stuff. i've searched and thought about writing my own.13:41
RotwangRomster: i thought about colouring pkgmk output13:41
Rotwanglike WARNING to yellow ERROR to red etc.13:41
Rotwanglittle improvement13:42
surrounderERROR to green, WARNING to pink and SUCCESFULL to red13:42
surrounderjust to annoy people13:42
Rotwanggood ide13:42
Romsterah yes i thought about also colouring the flags for optomising etc. so they were all one colour and the links another. then i found that;13:42
Romstersurrounder, haha13:43
Romsterjsut to make it more fun you could make it rotate the colours every few lines <<13:44
Rotwangor occasionaly execute bash fork bomb13:44
Rotwangonly to make building more exciting13:44
RomsterRotwang, what was it with aMule you hated? was it the kad not working?13:45
Romsterbecasue i got that sorted ages ago.13:45
Rotwangit crashed on me often :\13:46
Romsterand behind nat too.13:46
Rotwangim happy with mldonkey13:46
surrounderrandom colours in the output13:46
Romsteri used to have that only time it does now is if i try to seed kad with a invalid url.13:46
Romster300 clients on queue O_o13:47
Romsterwhat i don't get is some times i have none then bah everyone wants to get files off me.13:48
Rotwangmldonkey + µtorrent <-- pure evil13:48
Romsteryou use utorrent though wine....13:48
Rotwangi do!13:49
Rotwangbtw someone here uses gedit maybe?13:49
Romsterthe horror :P13:50
Rotwangim trying to get automatic shell Pkgfile highlighting, no luck so far13:50
Romsterwiki page on that.13:51
Rotwangeven people from gnome irc couldnt help me13:51
RotwangRomster: where?13:51
sepenRotwang, mldonkey also support torrents13:51
Rotwangsepen: i know13:51
RotwangRomster: thats vim :[13:52
Romsterso does opera believe it or not.13:52
Rotwangsepen: but somehow i got used to µtorrent13:52
thrice`i've recently switched to transmission13:52
Romstervim rules.13:52
Rotwangvim is nice13:52
Romsterat least that is native.13:52
Rotwangbut i wont get through tons of howtos only to edit files <<13:53
Rotwangi know it on basic level and thats enough13:53
Romsterit's hard to edit files with it...13:56
* Romster shakes my head...13:56
cptnRotwang: as far as I can see you have to edit gtksourceview13:57
Rotwangcptn: i edited13:58
Rotwang    <property name="globs">*.sh;Pkgfile</property>13:58
cptnlooks good to me14:01
Rotwangdoesn't work :{14:01
cptnRotwang: tried Pkgfile*?14:03
cptnmmmh, don't think that'll change anything14:05
Rotwangnah, still no change14:05
cptnRotwang: I think you also have to change the mime type14:06
cptnRotwang: text/plain14:07
Rotwang<property name="mimetypes">text/x-shellscript;application/x-shellscript;text/x-sh;text/plain</property>14:07
Rotwangthats what i had :\14:08
Rotwangno idea why it doesnt work14:08
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pitillohas someone a ups with crux? or can someone point me which can be the better place to put some files in a port?14:17
Rotwangwooohooo!!!! \o/ \o/ \:D/14:19
Rotwangi did it14:19
Rotwangmessed around with /usr/share/mime things14:19
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DarkNekroshi everybody ;)14:26
thrice`hi DarkNekros14:28 needs to be altered14:29
Rotwangand added new sub class of text/plain :x14:29
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pitillowell, if someone find nut interesting to be in contrib here I put the link and if can verify path at .footprints better14:45
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pitillo*paths at .footprint14:46
tilmanwhat's nut?14:48
tilmanah, ups stuff14:48
Nyadcptn, theres no chance my problem could be something not enabled in SCSI Transports is there?14:50
Nyadhey does a USB Flash count as a SCSI?14:58
tilmanNyad: yep, usb mass storage uses the scsi subsystem14:59
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bitwise__greetings...stupid thing to ask about i know, but does anyone have a functioning fflash player through firefox and is there any special thing i should know about beyond the installation instructions to get it work?15:02
thrice`there is a port for flash-plugin. should work simply after installing15:03
bitwise__i've used the port and i've manually installed15:05
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Nyad when I read man pages I often see this, -B, --always-make     and a description. will either of them do the same thing?15:19
RotwangRomster: AVAST!! Here be me sweet patchess --->
Rotwangit works great with pkgmk -e15:20
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Rotwanguseful feature in my opinion15:34
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NyadI want to reinstall crux from scratch instead of upgrade, however I still want to use the .config file that I have saved. How do I keep it so that I can use it in the installation?15:48
Rotwangcopy it somewhere :x15:49
Nyadits ok I figured it out15:54
Rotwangis it wise to post such patch on the FS?15:56
Rotwangor ML?15:56
tilmani'd post it on crux-devel for discussion first15:56
teKrehabdoll: I decided to switch back to 3.1.x16:13
cruxbot[contrib.git]: dhcp: switch back to 3.1.x branch16:19
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cruxbot[contrib.git]: mercurial: 1.0 -> 1.0.116:32
Nyadgoodnight all16:33
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Rotwanggood night16:36
Rotwangthats funny, Nyad is on the other end of the world but we have similar time zones16:36
Rotwangworld is fascinating \:D/16:36
NyadGMT+2 for me :)16:37
Nyadvery similar though. nice how vertically we are aligned so we get the same time16:37
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cruxbot[contrib.git]: nut: New port nut 2.2.216:55
pitilloI hope it can be usefull and if there is something bad, someone will tell me16:56
Rotwangthis is our job pitillo! as sepen said ;]16:57
Rotwangi also sent mail to develML, a lot of would's ;] well my english isnt perfect16:58
pitillomine is worse...16:58
Rotwangpitillo: usr/lib/pkgconfig/ is empty :\17:01
pitilloand the include too17:03
pitillothank you :)17:03
Rotwangpitillo: use prtverify :P17:04
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pitilloRotwang, did you see something with prtverify?17:07
Rotwangpitillo: no i just looked at the footprint17:07
pitilloah oki... :)17:08
Rotwangit would be handy also to merge pkgmk with prtverify17:08
Rotwangso prtverify is done imediately after build17:08
Rotwangso you dont need to think about it17:08
teKno. one tool, one job. function foo() + alias(es) can do the trick, too, I think.17:09
RotwangteK: true17:09
pitillowell, then you can test 1 port by port and in this way you can play with this util and verify repos17:10
pitilloteK, right17:10
sepenI use a breackpoint in the build() function with using 'read -p "<ENTER> to continue...", then you can go to work/src/ etc etc and do your prefered tasks17:12
Rotwangsepen: thats what i was refering to in my post17:12
sepenI used to use pkgmk -kw too17:12
sepenyeah Rotwang I'm reading it17:12
Rotwang-kw -b and -e would be very handy17:13
Rotwangcause read is hackish17:15
sepenpitillo, ping17:17
pitillosepen, pong17:17
sepenI think you could add a restart switch to the nut daemon script17:18
pitilloummm oki17:18
sepenrestart) $0 stop; sleep 1; $0 start;;17:18
pitillosepen, thank you17:19
* Rotwang wonders if sysconfdir shouldnt be /usr/etc instead of /etc17:24
teK /usr/etc sucks17:25
teKEOD! :>17:25
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cruxbot[contrib.git]: nut: Fixed empty dirs and added daemon's restart option.17:27
teKkids: do not use /usr/etc at home17:27
pitilloumm for a daemon like this I thought in both and decided to put it in /etc/nut.17:28
pitilloteK, ummm I really don't understand (are you joking to put it there or you see better in /etc/$name?)17:29
teKI dislike /usr/etc strongly,  /etc/{$name/,}$name.conf  is fine17:33
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pitilloteK, perfect, thank you. But may be in some cases can be good (final user apps for example) to put their configs there.17:34
teKwhat's a final user app17:35
pitilloummm for example dillo17:35
teKand then? All those files and directories under /usr/etc will be root-owned, too, right?17:36
pitillobut you can make a difference between config files (system apps, users apps)17:37
pitillomay be putting directly to /etc doesn't hurm more than the amount of files17:37
teKin the end, EUID == 0 has to care for them; I don't see an advantage17:37
teKno, we're on CRUX not on SuSE/RedHat, /etc should be somewhat clear und tidied up17:38
pitillocan be for some kind of sorting? to make that difference17:38
teK"I gotta reconfigure $USERAPP .. let's edit {/usr,}/etc/$USERAPP.conf " you see?17:40
teKthe other way round ("my" way): "let's configure $APP vim /etc/$APP[tab] -> no results -> @#!($&@$() friggling shit -> man $APP;find / -name $APP"*.conf" OR vim /usr/etc  etc.17:41
teKit's a matter of taste, no question :)17:41
pitilloummm well, I was trying to read something at fhs and the only mention to /usr/etc is something not allowed...17:42
pitilloteK, yes I see you point, I was trying to understand how it's done here and why it's done in that way17:42
teKI told $core-maintainer a while ago.. I don't give a single shit about FHS :)17:42
pitillothank you for your comment17:43
teKyou're welcome17:43
pitilloNote that /usr/etc is still not allowed: programs in /usr should place configuration files in /etc17:43
pitillothis is the only refernce to that path...17:43
sepen /usr is the second major section of the filesystem. /usr is shareable, read-only data17:44
sepenThe contents of the root filesystem must be adequate to boot, restore, recover, and/or repair the system.17:44
teKit's similar to those GNU people trying (and DOING) to evangelize this info shit in favour of man pages (and refering to info pages in man pages) .. it's driving me nuts17:44
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teKsepen: how old is unix? There's no need for some consortium to say what's to be done. History already solved this17:45
sepentek but I like an standard, sometimes I plained my partitions thanks to it17:46
sepenis not the same having /usr on a partition and / in the other one having dillo.conf i.e17:46
sepenI mean system config files should be in /etc17:46
sepennot applications config files17:46
teKyou got to have the experience to recover the system anyways; you have to get your partition's layour right yourself :)17:47
pitillosepen, then you would use /usr/etc/nut in this case?17:47
sepenfor nut no17:47
sepenI think nut its really important in a box17:48
pitillowell, then the same point. That is why I asked, because I wasn't sure17:48
teKthis discussion would be needless if there only were /etc ......17:48
pitilloteK, did you talk about this here? ML? FS?17:49
sepenteK, yeah and you mean the same for /bin and /sbin and try to avoid /usr/bin...17:49
teKsepen: no because it's in $PATH, I don't have to think about it as a user17:49
sepenI like /usr/etc as was defined by Per17:49
teKpitillo: no?17:49
pitilloteK, ah oki. I asked to take a look somewhere...17:50
pitillowell, time to rest a bit, goodnight17:51
sepen /etc/Configuration files for system software (daemons, etc)17:51
sepennut is a daemon too17:51
sepenbut not dillo17:51
sepennight pitillo17:52
pitillothank you for the aclarations and opinions :)17:52
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teKwoooah, Per said it, let's do it. Per dropped out. Per(?) did implement ports and pkgmk in bash, too. HELLO? bash is no standard17:52
teKand /etc/rc, of course. :-)17:53
sepennowadays we have a handbook, just I tried to do thing according to it17:53
teKmy goal to achive for CRUX is to get it to not require bash to run but any sh-compliant shell.17:54
RotwangteK: you evil person! bash ftw!!17:54
sepenwell expose that at ML17:55
thrice`that was already brought up pre-2.417:55
sepenfor getting more comments about users17:55
teKno, I have had comments from captain and juergen daubert (*avoiding to highlight*) and I will have to increase my influence, first. :)17:55
teKHan has a port which eliminates bashism from /etc and pkg*17:56
teKit was not integrated, if it was because of Han or by technical means, I don't know17:56
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RotwangteK: why not bash?17:59
Rotwangwhy doing step back?17:59
thrice`bash exists on almost all machines anyway; why complicate things ?18:00
thrice`just curious :)18:00
Rotwangbash is new better bourne shell \:D/18:00
teKwell, what do you think why bash is on most systems18:00
teKi'd pkgrm it instantly if i could because I don't need it.18:00
teKvi for example has to be included according to POSIX, bash not.18:01
Rotwangvi not vim, ha!18:02
teKyou heard of vim -v?18:03
RotwangteK: you heard about sh link to bash?18:03
teKthis argument is braindead, sorry18:04
thrice`so, would we have all shells in opt, and have the user install what they want ?18:04
teKwhat's with the symlink if bash is removed18:04
sepenIm using all my bash script also in my SunOS box18:04
sepenI like bash18:04
RotwangteK: its not braindead :<18:04
Rotwangits true18:04
sepen+1 Rotwang18:04
teKcrux forces me to have bash installed which I don't want to be forced to18:05
teKthat's my problem18:05
teK+1 for me! :p18:05
RotwangteK: there is not even shell port :x18:05
sepenteK, you are free to decide if you want crux18:05
Rotwangif thats the point18:05
teKsepen: rotfl18:06
sepenalso you can change it easily18:06
teKI'm free to try to change CRUX, too, right?18:06
sepenyou box18:06
sepen*your box18:06
teKwe'll see :)18:06
RotwangteK: yes you are18:06
sepenteK, bash its on core18:06
Rotwangbut dont expect that everyone will like your ideas ]:>18:06
teKI don't18:07
Rotwangbash is in core as in almost every other distro18:07
sepenplease explain this at ML or FS for more opinions bash Vs etc18:07
teK#!/bin/bash is NOT portable (yes that's no point for /etc/rc, probably) and bashism in #!/bin/sh is brainead18:07
Rotwangthats how progress is made ;]18:07
sepennot portable????18:07
thrice`i do remember there was a good discussion just before 2.4 was released18:08
thrice`perhaps to use dash to do init stuff, or something ?18:08
sepenteK, I'm using 'dyndnsup' my own script it 3 boxes with bash, crux, openbsd and sunos18:08
sepenwhereis the problem?18:08
teKgald you're speaking of sunos..18:09
teK<caesar> / # which bash18:09
teKno bash in /usr/xpg4/bin /baan/bse/bin /usr/sbin /usr/bin /opt/SMAW/SMAWtssv/tele/bin /opt/SMAW/bin /opt/SMAW/sbin /var/spool/Xprint/config/cmd18:09
teK<caesar> / # uname -a18:09
teKSunOS caesar 5.8 Generic_108528-09 sun4us sparc FJSV,GPUS18:09
thrice`i would say there would be a godo response if all init scripts worked in all SH, including bash.  but, I don't think bash will ever get out of core18:09
teKthrice`: that's perfectly ok18:09
sepenSun Microsystems Inc.   SunOS 5.10      Generic January 200518:09
sepen# bash18:09
sepenbash-3.00# bash --version18:09
sepenGNU bash, version 3.00.16(1)-release (i386-pc-solaris2.10)18:09
sepenCopyright (C) 2004 Free Software Foundation, Inc.18:09
teKI just removed dhcpd which is also in core/18:09
thrice`right.  we can't get TOO minimal :P18:10
teKsepen: great, nice for you. you're script still won't work on my solaris box18:10
thrice`hehe, true :)18:10
teKthrice`: so true :)18:10
sepenteK, so where is the problem?18:10
sepenmaybe we can help in something18:10
teKit's not portable. If you don't care about quality, ok.18:10
teKregarding your dyndns script18:11
teKMy point is: it won't harm anybody to put /bin/sh as shebang and remove bashisms. Agreed?18:11
teKPLUS I could remove bash18:11
sepenthats fine for me18:11
sepenI should use !/bin/bash18:11
sepenor equivalents18:12
teKno you got my points18:12
thrice`I think there just wasn't enough time to test prior to 2.4 coming out.18:12
sepenjust you need a configure for adapting to your system18:12
thrice`I seem to recall predatorfreak doing some stuff, but could be wrong18:12
sepenlike C sources have18:12
teKwhat for, sepen?18:12
teKthrice`: as stated before, han has a port doing just this18:12
sepenpffff bad port imho18:12
teKas a point for orientation18:13
sepenIm a openbsd user too, I never used Han ports in obsd18:13
sepenteK, my be the problem is not bash, and could be other commands inside the script, like sed, awk, cut18:14
thrice`i liked han.  he just got carried away a bit too easily18:14
teKI don't know Han that good (still remember the night when he parted #crux, though) but people I'm "fond" of dislike him :P18:14
sepennot all operative systems have the same implemtation18:14
teKsepen: yes but for /etc/rc this does not matter :)18:14
sepenthrice`, I don't say 'I don't like Han'18:15
teKwe don't want to have a FreeBSD/CRUX or something like that, don't we? :>18:15
thrice`or crux-ng18:15
teKHURD/CRUX *shiver*18:15
sepenI like CRUX18:16
sepensounds better than others :)18:16
teKbtw I have to be honest in this discussion, I put /bin/sh in all of my scripts but secretly rely on bashisms as on most system /bin/sh is a symlink etc.18:16
teKI consider this wrong, too.18:16
sepenyeah, that could be the issue18:16
RotwangteK: this is called progress :<18:16
Rotwangold things are replaced by new things18:17
Rotwangvi -> vim18:17
Rotwangsh -> bash18:17
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thrice`now that the goals are sorta sorted out, perhaps going to the ML is a good idea18:17
teKRotwang: +
Rotwangi dont give a shiv about them :>18:18
teKoh no, Rotwang. As strcat put it once (regarding no vi but nano on Gentoo): and even if nano could deliver pizza, vi has to be present according to posix, so i don't give a shit about nano18:18
teKRotwang: ooh, POSIX >>>>> FHS18:18
sepenteK, put this in your /bin/sh intead of symlink, or something similar   --- >   sh() { firstline=$(head -1 $0); [ "$firstline" = "/bin/bash" ] && bash $0 }18:19
RotwangteK: vi is linked to vim such as sh to bash \:D/18:19
teKthrice`: I planned to be able to present a fix prior to going to the ML18:19
sepenas an idea of trying to avoid symlinks to bash18:19
teKRotwang: I won't rediscuss this another time, see earlier tonight.18:19
Rotwangok ok18:19
sepensorry "$firstline" should be compared to #!/bin....18:19
Rotwangeveryone got some valid points18:20
Rotwanglet it be :P18:20
Rotwangbest place to dicuss this is ML18:20
sepenIm waiting more comments to safe-env :)18:20
teKhaven't looked at it. am busy with discussing bashstuff and getting my scribus port ready for contrib/ :-)18:22
teKoh btw sepen NetBSD can run without bash, too.18:22
sepenall BSD's have bash18:23
sepenyeah, but this is CRUX18:23
Rotwangok leave it :\18:24
sepenbash its on core18:24
sepenyeah leave it18:24
Rotwangi liek bash as much i liek mudkips18:24
teK*cough* portability18:24
Rotwanglet it be]18:24
sepentek someone has his own opinion18:24
teKI will begin putting /bin/zsh in all of my scripts :>18:24
teKsepen: of course18:24
sepenthe fact is that Pkgfile's required bash lines18:25
sepenthey are interpreted by bash18:25
Rotwangas pkgmk itself18:25
sepenRotwang,  yeah $ some_declarations; . Pkgfile; bash -x build()18:26
Rotwangarrays are also used etc etc18:26
sepenbuiltin commands ...18:27
sepenif we change bash, maybe we'll need to change a lot of Pkgfiles :[18:27
sepenso I need bash18:27
Rotwangthis can not happen18:27
thrice`well, pkgutils may go to C some time18:28
thrice`and the arrays can change to source="URL" , etc18:28
Rotwangno need for that18:28
sepenthrice`, also pkgutils6 branch;a=shortlog;h=pkgutils618:29
thrice`yep :)  I didn't want to say anything, just in case18:29
sepenIm going to prepare a tee18:30
Rotwangis it true that new pkgfiles will look like that? :
thrice`no idea18:34
thrice`i'm sure there is nothing decided at the moment18:34
teKif one can turn of the creation of /CRUX_META, great18:35
sepenpersonally I don't like META_CRUX18:38
* Rotwang too18:38
teKCRUX server -> I always disliked the server / client distinction18:39
sepenI was decided of using CRUX due to their Pkgfile's18:39
teKi'm out. gn8 ppl18:47
thrice`bye teK18:48
* teK falling into bed18:48
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nipuLhehe, just pulled an old mac i had in the shed and set it up for my kids23:30
nipuLthey're just sitting there mashing keys, having a blast23:31

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