IRC Logs for #crux Tuesday, 2008-06-17

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pitillogood morning01:15
Rotwangnot so good01:23
Rotwangbut still   morning01:23
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cruxbot[opt.git]: lesstif: cleaned dependencies03:42
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mwansamorning Rotwang, did ya manage to get iptables up and running ?04:04
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rehabdollshould hopefully work :)06:00
cptnrehabdoll: boots nicely at least :-)06:12
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* Frustrat|euej is testing :p06:37
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rehabdollill try to build a more polished iso later today06:45
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Frustratyeah polished version would be nice06:52
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mugwort13Hi all, is there an fglrx port for crux?  I search the repos. and didn't see one08:52
sepenmugwort13, contrib/ati08:55
sepenmugwort13, you mean ati catalist propietary driver, right?08:56
mugwort13I do, yes.  Sorry, I am converting from debian , old habits still remain08:58
mugwort13sepen: Thank you08:59
sepenmugwort13, you're welcome08:59
cptnprt-get fsearch fglrx* :-)09:08
pitilloaon, if you have a bit of time to take a look and see why I told about xorg-libxext.
pitilloteK, have you thought about the cacti port? it's quite surprising to see that kind of ports... to put that IMHO, don't put anything... I think can be better to make a wiki page or put a "better" port... Sorry for be boring with this talk again.09:31
teKit's just bad, not surprising :\09:40
pitillowell, really it's bad. But surprising because people interested will check the manual of that kind of applications09:41
teKyou're don't bore me it's a true point and I did promise to look after it which I didn't. I'll see and fix this tonight, sorry for forgetting this09:41
pitilloteK, no problem. If can be for help to you, the updated port in my repo is working fine here. May be it can be usefull for you, to take what you want or modify it if you see errors09:44
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pitilloteK, to you too09:45
cptnFrustrat: what's up with the nick changes?09:47
Frustratim frustrated09:47
Frustratand i want to express myself09:47
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aonpitillo: i see10:07
tilmanrehabdoll: \o/10:07
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pitilloaon, I hope it can be usefull, at least to understand why I told you about that dep too.10:08
aonyeah, i'm looking into it10:09
pitilloaon, thank you10:09
aonpitillo: mwm is built but then deleted, that's why build bails out without libxext but finddeps doesn't find it10:10
aoni'll hack it so that mwm isn't even built10:10
tilmanoh right, it's download day10:12
pitilloaon, oh nice.. btw isn't a prior thing to work on. I'm glad to see how do you work. Thank you again.10:12
aonwell i don't have anything else to work on :)10:12
rehabdollits probably not today, since they havent announced it yet :>10:13
cruxbot[opt.git]: lesstif: don't build mwm10:39
aonpitillo: should be better now10:40
rehabdollyay, new season of weeds \o/10:43
pitilloaon, thank you. I will take a look when I came home.10:51
pitilloaon, it builds fine now. I will check your patch later to learn a bit. Thank you again.10:55
aonwell, it just removes the mwm subdir from clients/Motif-2.1/Makefile.in10:56
aoncould've done it with sed but didn't feel like it10:57
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cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xf86-input-evdev: updated to
cruxbot[xorg.git]: xorg-xf86-video-amd: updated to
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Ovim-ObscurumHa, got Thinkpad 790 on eBay.12:04
Ovim-ObscurumInstalling crux on it :)12:05
aonwhat's 790, some ghetto pentium mmx machine?12:09
aonseriously, i can't find it on thinkwiki12:10
Ovim-ObscurumYes, it is.12:12
Ovim-ObscurumBut for 20 EUR ,- it's nice ;)12:13
Ovim-ObscurumI like all those ghetto pentium machines.12:13
aoni've demolished most of mine12:13
aonold x86's aren't that fun really12:13
aonbut i have a sparc that's too slow for ssh :)12:13
cptnmaybe you can unroll some loops ;-)12:14
tilmanaon: o_O12:14
tilmanhow old is that sparc?12:14
aonwith, uh, 16 megs of ram iirc :)12:15
tilman25 mhz? :p12:15
aoniirc yes12:15
Ovim-ObscurumHe's cute, isn't he: ?12:16
aonstock openbsd isn't probably the best os for that machine, though12:16
aonhaven't played with it in a while12:16
sepenaon, I run obsd in several old boxes without problems12:16
aonsepen: how many of them are 25MHz sparcs with 16MB of RAM?12:17
sepenajaja 25Mhz lol12:17
aoni know what openbsd runs on, i have my name in it ;)12:18
tilman"the CPU is really optimized to run UNIX, while an Intel processor isn't"12:18
sepenaon, and what about crux-sparc on it?12:18
aonwell, simply put:12:19
aonno way in hell12:19
aonfirst of all, it's for sparc6412:19
tilman$ ports -u12:19
tilmanUpdating core/openssh12:19
tilman<aon> DO NOT WANT12:19
aoni do have a blade 100, though12:20
aoniirc it has gentoo at the moment :)12:20
tilmanrehabdoll: please get me one, kthx12:57
DarkNekrostilman, perhaps we had to ask for one ;)12:59
rehabdollget me an address and i'll jump into my trusty french piece-o-shit car with a bat12:59
Frustrati'd like one too12:59
DarkNekrosrehabdoll, frenchmobile?? xD12:59
DarkNekrosawesome the IT crowd series xDD13:00
rehabdollbtw, the catalytic converter is shot. it will die a slow and painful death next year D;13:01
cruxbot[opt.git]: wine: updated to 1.013:03
rehabdollDarkNekros: have you tried turning it off and on again? :>13:03
DarkNekrosrehabdoll, yes, but it doesn't works xDD13:06
tilman\o/ :D13:06
DarkNekrosperhaps I had to plug it in xDD13:06
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Frustratnew firefox, nice :p13:31
* Frustrat just helped with breaking guiness recorld13:32
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FrustratNyad: o/13:32
Nyadhi Frustrat13:32
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Frustratpredatorfreak: o/14:11
predatorfreakFrustrat: Hi14:12
Frustratpredatorfreak: any thoughts about hplip update ? ;]14:12
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predatorfreakThere was one? o.O14:13
Rotwang2.8.5 Release14:14
Rotwang2.7 somethin is currently in contrib14:14
* predatorfreak updates14:14
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Rotwangi was close to insanity yesterday setting up my prnter ;]14:15
rehabdolltilman: should probably work a bit better14:16
NyadHi, I've just installed crux but I have to use a proxy to connect to the internet and I need to configure my system so that  ports -u  will work with this proxy14:16
cptnNyad: typically, ports -u uses rsync14:17
cptnchances are the proxy is only needed for http14:17
aonif you can't get through with rsync you need to use httpup14:18
tilmanrehabdoll: i haven't installed the other one yet. is it teh b0rked?14:18
cptnif you subscribe to httpup repositories, you can set up an httpup.conf; man httpup has some notes on this14:18
Rotwangrehabdoll: oh shiv14:19
Rotwangi downloaded previous one too14:19
rehabdolldoh :>14:19
rehabdollthis one atleast installs.. though i forgot to build a kernel so i couldnt test the system properly :p14:19
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rehabdollbut should be fine14:20
cruxbot[contrib.git]: hplip: Update to
Rotwangpredatorfreak: one more thing, when can we expect ff3 in opt?14:22
predatorfreakRotwang: When the sqlite issue is resolved.14:23
cptnpredatorfreak: why not just use the included sqlite?14:24
Nyadis it more adviseable to get apps from the repositories as opposed to downloading the source myself?14:24
cptnNyad: well, if you build from ports you can cleanly upgrade and remove them14:25
predatorfreakcptn: Why should I waste space duplicating what exists on the system?14:25
cptnNyad: and pkgadd will warn you if you get a file conflict, whereas make install typically just overwrites existing files14:25
cptnpredatorfreak: because that's what upstream advises to do14:25
lennartwhat about doing it as a temporary solution till the real issue is resolved?14:25
lennart(regarding ff3)14:26
predatorfreakThere is no temporary solution I see as decent.14:26
Nyadcptn, what do you mean subscribe to the httpup repositories? I don't follow14:26
predatorfreakEverything either requires code duplication or hacks I do not approve of.14:26
predatorfreakUntil that's resolved I'm keeping it external.14:26
Nyaddoes crux come with an irc client?14:27
aonnot by default14:27
RotwangNyad: not included in iso14:27
aonthere are at least three in opt14:27
tilmanirssi isn't on the iso? o_O14:27
aonit should be :)14:27
cptnNyad: for every httpup repository, you can download a filed called <reponame>.httpup14:27
Rotwangah yes it is ;]14:27
cptnNyad: then when you run 'ports -u' the ports are synced14:28
tilmanlennart: fyi, rotwang said your openttd port was out of date14:28
tilmanany news on the sqlite trac ticket re. sqlite3.pc?14:29
cptntilman: there was also no reaction on the mailing list14:29
cptnalthough there have been numerous discussions on other stuff in the meantime14:30
tilmani'd patch firefox' configure script14:30
predatorfreakMore confirmation of my initial suspicions.14:30
predatorfreakThey simply don't care about it <<14:30
predatorfreaktilman: I've already addressed that and won't do so again.14:30
cptntilman: maybe just use the patch from mozilla's bugzilla?14:30
tilmanwhoops, i missed that patch14:31
predatorfreakIf mozilla approved of that patch it'd already be in 3.0.14:31
lennarttilman, Rotwang: thanks, I'll update the port14:32
tilmanthis is ridiculous14:33
cptnmaybe someone else can pick up firefox for the time being?14:33
cptnthen once there's a solution for this predatorfreak can take it back14:33
predatorfreak... and here comes exactly what I expected.14:33
Nyadcptn, so to subscribe to the httpup repos I would do $ cd /etc/ports. $ mv httpup.rsync.inactive httpup.rsync  ?14:33
cptnno one loses14:33
Rotwanglennart: np14:33
predatorfreakI'll simply be kicked out of opt.14:33
predatorfreakFor refusing to apply a hack.14:33
tilmanclearly doing nothing at all isn't a solution to the problem14:34
predatorfreaktilman: I am doing something.14:34
tilmanand if a bunch of guys are in favor of hack #1, you MAY feel free to follow their advice14:34
predatorfreakI fixed sqlite3 outside of opt14:34
predatorfreakand am providing and maintaining it outside of opt.14:34
predatorfreaktilman: I may also not wish to if I think it's the wrong solution.14:35
cptnNyad: you can download httpup files from the port db14:37
cruxbot[contrib.git]: wavpack: 4.41.0 -> 4.50.014:37
cptnNyad: if go to and click on any httpup repo (first column)14:37
cptnNyad: for example
tilmanpredatorfreak: you should be given the Crux Stubbornness Award :p14:37
cptnthere's a "(get httpup/rsync)" link14:38
predatorfreaktilman: Romster already claimed that award.14:38
cptnNyad: download that to /etc/ports, and you're done14:38
tilmanhe'll have to return it14:38
cptnNyad: if you need them for core, opt or contrib let me know14:38
cptnNyad: if rsync works, there's no need for that14:39
Nyadok so once that is done I will be able to download everything with the proxy?14:39
cruxbot[opt.git]: rxvt-unicode: updated to 9.05.14:40
cptnif you configured httpup, that will work14:40
predatorfreaktilman: If I told you to randomly apply a patch that blindly accepts a broken glibc version to something, would you apply it?14:40
Nyadok, thanks, I'll let you know how it goes14:40
tilmanthat comparison doesn't work14:40
tilmanmozilla says 3.5.7 works, and we have 3.5.714:41
tilmanso fixing the version check like is discussed in wouldn't hurt14:41
predatorfreaktilman: What if someone was still using 3.5.3 or something?14:41
cptnpredatorfreak: that would work too14:41
tilmanthen the check would fail...14:41
cptn"For example, right now 3.5.7 is a topcrasher"14:41
cptnthere's only one version which causes the problem14:41
cptnbut they blindly require a newer version14:41
predatorfreaktilman: You and cptn and jue ALL bitched at me about not being upstream.14:42
predatorfreakNow you're telling me to apply a patch that upstream hasn't to Firefox.14:42
tilmanwe're patching software if necessary14:42
predatorfreakReversing your stance there?14:42
Rotwangpeace brothas14:42
predatorfreaktilman: By that same logic it's perfectly fine to fix sqlite3's pc file.14:42
cptnokay, let's just use the included sqlite then14:43
cptnno patches needed14:43
tilmanpredatorfreak: i think you're just playing dumb... have fun.14:43
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predatorfreaktilman: I think you're all as stubborn as I am.14:44
predatorfreakWe should really just establish #crux-flamewars at this rate.14:44
tilmanwhy mess up sqlite when it's just one app using it that's faulty?14:45
teKor change attitude14:45
teK(oh noez, tek sad the evil c-word)14:45
tilmanfix the problem where it really is14:45
cptnteK: :-)14:45
predatorfreaktilman: The probably really is sqlite's .pc file.14:45
predatorfreakThat's the base problem.14:45
cptnso let's summarize:14:46
cptnboth upstreams didn't fix it yet, although patches have been submitted14:46
cptnmozilla says: "I don't think we should have --enable-system-{sqlite,cairo} at all..."14:46
cptnso why don't we use the included sqlite?14:46
predatorfreakWhy don't I just say fuck it and stop wasting my time here.14:47
cptnwhat do you mean?14:47
predatorfreakJust remove me from opt, I'm done.14:48
predatorfreakI'll maintain my shit externally, I'm sick of this crap.14:48
teK oh dear :\14:48
cptnwell, if it's more important to you to have it your way than to have a working solution...14:48
cptnI guess that's in the best interest of the project14:49
predatorfreakcptn: My definition of a working solution includes non-hacky approach and don't duplicate code when not needed.14:49
cptnwe've been there14:49
predatorfreakand frankly, I'm sick of this kind of shit.14:49
cptnyeah, same here too14:50
* teK is scared by crux' fluctuation of maintainers :)14:50
tilmanthanks for your past efforts14:50
predatorfreakI have far better things to do than clash with the CRUX developers over this petty shit.14:50
* drijen is now scared14:50
* drijen hugs predatorfreak 14:50
aonsqlite doesn't add much to ff14:50
predatorfreakaon: It's required as-of 3.0.14:52
predatorfreakIf it wasn't, I would disable it.14:52
aoni mean that it doesn't make a huge piece of bloatware a lot more huge14:52
teKyou gotta find a solution TOGETHER, man this issue cannot split maintainers.. wtf?14:53
aonby terms of size, not functionality14:53
aonteK: apparently it can14:53
teKaon: you scared away romster *g*14:53
aoni won't go over that again14:53
teKyeah sure, that'd be pointless14:54
aoni'm sure core will sack me if they find my actions inappropriate14:54
predatorfreakteK: My solution is to say fuck it and concentrate on my work towards a fork.14:54
aonwhich you're already doing, so leaving isn't all that unnatural, now is it?14:54
predatorfreakNo conflicts of interest anymore.14:54
predatorfreakaon: I intended to wait until way way later.14:55
predatorfreakWhen the fork was actually something to speak of.14:55
teKpredatorfreak: which fork?14:55
predatorfreakRight now it's a revamped init system and our changes to ports.14:55
aonmm, well indeed that would've been a lot sexier, but what can you do14:55
predatorfreakteK: #hvlinux.14:55
drijenif i may break in, what is wrong with predatorfreak's wanting to wait for FF to reslove themselves14:55
cptndrijen: well, the bug was submitted almost 3 month ago14:56
cptndrijen: if mozilla would have wanted to resolve it, they would have14:56
cptndrijen: instead they suggested to use the included sqlite (source included in mozilla tarball)14:56
teKoh well.. forks are mostly pointless and wasted efforts.. see ubuntu vs. debian .. (and I think crux cannot be compared to debian regarding being conservatice etc.)..14:56
cptndrijen: but that's something predatorfreak doesn't want to do14:56
tilmanteK: it worked well for the BSDs!14:57
drijenallright - i am not the smarpest tool in the shed but it seems to me that package builds can me modified by the end user14:57
predatorfreakteK: We're going to change a number of things in CRUX without decimating KISS.14:57
drijenso applying a patch to it would be optional14:57
teKtilman: it did?14:58
teKpredatorfreak: it's simply sad, period.14:58
predatorfreakteK: TBH, I don't care what you think.14:59
teKall this energy could be invested in pushing CRUX together :)14:59
drijenalso, i would like to point out that sqlite can be used for other packages - so its not an entire waste14:59
teKpredatorfreak: yeah i'm just another crux user/contributor, so what..14:59
predatorfreakteK: I don't have the power to push CRUX together.14:59
predatorfreakThe core folks do.14:59
cptndrijen: the problem is a bit different14:59
predatorfreakand they are not pushing it together.14:59
teKoh well  that's an excuse14:59
predatorfreakThey're dividing it.14:59
cptndrijen: firefox 3 depends on a feature which isn't in the regular sqlite14:59
teK"they" don't fork, right?15:00
drijencptn, ah i understand now15:00
predatorfreakteK: They control CRUX15:00
predatorfreakThey don't have to.15:00
teKoh well :)15:00
cptndrijen: so either one has to patch sqlite, mozilla, or use the sqlite included in firefox15:01
cptndrijen: there are bug reports submitted in both projects, but no fixes have been applied15:01
predatorfreakcptn: I wouldn't call adding .MINORVERSION to the .pc file a "feature"15:01
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cptndrijen: using the included sqlite would slightly enlarge firefox, if the user already has sqlite15:02
predatorfreakIt's a single line of text that doesn't affect the main program one iota.15:02
cptndrijen: to me, wasting some space wouldn't be a problem until this gets resolved15:02
cptndrijen: and get firefox3 into opt15:03
predatorfreakWell, do whatever you want now.15:04
predatorfreakI don't care, I'll continue to maintain fierfox 3 outside of opt in the way I see fit.15:04
cptnpredatorfreak: so is your decision final?15:08
cptnor do you want to take some time to think it over?15:08
predatorfreakIt's final.15:09
predatorfreakI like CRUX, I dislike being a part of CRUX.15:09
cptnokay, could you then send a mail to crux-devel announcing this, with a list of ports you currently maintain?15:09
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predatorfreakSent, in addition, I want out of contrib.15:15
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teKpitillo: compiling mysql right now (for cacti) but i'm heading for my bed15:23
pitilloteK, don't worry. Doesn't matter to have it in this way one day more or less15:23
pitillotake your time to check the Pkgfile and footprint to see if you can see something bad15:24
teKyes, I had a look at your dependencies and i'm thinking about mod_php as it's not really required if your using fastcgi15:24
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pitillopredatorfreak, don't leave... don't make the comunity lower15:25
predatorfreakpitillo: It's already done.15:25
drijenpredatorfreak, you will be missed15:26
predatorfreakDoubt it <<15:26
teKhe doesn't care15:26
* drijen sighs15:27
pitillopredatorfreak, people who work, will be missed, and more in little comunities15:27
rehabdolloh for gods sake15:29
rehabdollwhat a crappy backlog15:29
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drijenrehabdoll, i just got an image of you, surrounded by toddlers, cleaning crap off the wall, and crying15:34
rehabdollseems i get my daily dose of that from #crux.. atleast today :>15:35
drijeni still love crux15:35
drijencrux devs are my heros.15:35
Rotwangmine too15:37
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Rotwangand i started whole ff flame :x15:41
* Rotwang is ashamed of himself15:42
rehabdollyeah, its entirely your fault15:43
* predatorfreak slaps Rotwang15:44
Rotwangff the new pandoras box15:44
predatorfreakDon't open it <<15:44
predatorfreakIt'll eat your skin.15:44
brointhemixpred, don't go15:45
* drijen cusses15:45
brointhemixyou're a part of the legend, you've been there ever since I joined15:45
drijenanyone know of a reason why HAL would suddently start mounting things root only15:46
drijenlike external backup harrddives...15:46
Rotwangdrijen: do you get error starting udev like unknown netdev group15:46
brointhemixdrijen: that's because evil Rotwang made predatorfreak angry :)15:46
drijenmy *nix install is a bit borked, but no reason why it shuold suddenly block access to my drives15:46
brointhemixand now the boxes are rebelling :)15:46
drijenno erros15:46
predatorfreakSince when was I part of the legend?15:48
predatorfreakand my decision is final.15:48
brointhemixI mean, when I started usint CRUX you already were there15:49
predatorfreakI've been here for awhile, but CRUX has drifted from what it was.15:49
Rotwangbrointhemix: predatorfreak is forking :D15:49
brointhemixso now when you leave it's kinda like the cornerstone is trembling15:50
brointhemixdrifted? in what way?15:50
predatorfreakwhen tilman leaves the cornerstone is trembling for CRUX.15:50
predatorfreakbrointhemix: Developer differences <<15:51
brointhemixthere ale always differences between people, always15:51
brointhemixeven in the most solid community15:52
Rotwangunfortunatelly those differences cause wars and other stuff :x15:52
brointhemixbu the trick is to see beyond it15:52
brointhemixfind the compromise15:52
brointhemixdevs will argue from time to time15:53
brointhemixPLD Linux Distribution had such a dev fight some time ago15:55
drijendebian has one everydau15:55
drijenbecause debian is on crack15:55
Rotwangcrax ;]15:55
Part`brointhemix: right, 5 years ago. ;)15:55
Rotwangand what happened?15:55
brointhemixthe project leader left beaten but the PLD survived15:55
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brointhemixbut why do it the Polish way? let's do it the "better" way, let's find a solution :)15:56
rehabdolli wish i had more time to really contribute back15:56
brointhemixso that you stay with us and contribute to the benefit of all, what you say predatofreak?15:57
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brointhemixand I'm telling you, if a Pole wants to reason instead of fighting, that must mean something :)15:58
predatorfreakbrointhemix: I'm through with contributing to CRUX.15:59
predatorfreakI simply don't want the drama anymore.15:59
brointhemixpredatorfreak: no second thought on that?16:00
predatorfreakI've said it already, my decision is final.16:00
predatorfreakIt's too aggravating.16:01
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morlenxusTime to update the firefox port. :)16:02
brointhemixpredatorfreak: too bad :(16:03
brointhemixbut I accept your desision16:03
Rotwangmorlenxus: sshhh16:03
predatorfreakmorlenxus: You do it.16:05
morlenxusI don't have access :)16:08
Rotwangmorlenxus: you have to your personal repo :p16:09
morlenxusI can wait. :)16:16
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RyoSah its really sad to see you go predatorfreak16:48
RyoSyou did a great job!16:48
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Rotwangpredatorfreak you did a lot of good work for crux17:11
Rotwangsadly this conflict couldnt be resolved less "brutal"17:12
predatorfreakRotwang: I can't be arsed with political drama over this shit.17:14
Rotwangor it could be?17:14
predatorfreakI have better things to do than get into politics.17:14
Rotwangi hate politics17:15
Rotwangjaeger still maintains gnome repo?17:19
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Rotwangpredatorfreak: btw, im looking forward for your new distro ;]17:23
predatorfreakRotwang: Give us enough time to get it off the ground first.17:27
Rotwangand romster?17:29
Rotwangromster maintains so much ports he could throw distro on his own ;p17:30
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predatorfreakdrijen: Yeah, it's me and Romster brainstorming ideas and fleshing them out17:34
Rotwangis it going to be source based?17:36
Rotwangno i wont kiss you :{17:47
luxhwhy not? =(17:47
Rotwangbecause your nick is too hard to pronounce17:48
Rotwangsleep time ;]17:51
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rehabdollbah, like 20% of my extensions work with ff317:54
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Tuxbublinggnite folks19:13
cruxbot[opt.git]: [notify] openntpd: new user/group19:28
cruxbot[xfce.git]: xfce4-radio-plugin: Updated 0.3.0 -> 0.3.120:12
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Cheikhshi guys is it possible to install Crux w/out having to build the kernel but just use the one that comes with the install CD20:39
infinitycircuitCheikhs, i don't think the one with the install cd is fully functional in terms of network drivers, etc.20:40
Cheikhsok what i am trying to avoid is the .config file is there one generic one there already20:41
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infinitycircuitCheikhs, zcat /proc/config.gz20:55
infinitycircuitsorry i didn't notice your message20:55
Cheikhsthat is ok20:59
infinitycircuiti have a question--i want to compile a new kernel for crux (2.6.26-rc6), but i see that crux doesn't seem to use a initrd. is there anything special i have to do to the kernel to get it to work without a initrd other than disabling initrd?21:05
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infinitycircuitwhy can't i use chsh to switch to zsh?23:36
infinitycircuitit keeps saying "/usr/bin/zsh is an invalid shell"23:36
infinitycircuiteven hard linking /bin/zsh to /usr/bin/zsh produces the same error23:37
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Cheikhshow are u doing it are u using chsh23:44
infinitycircuitodd it works for root but not for user23:49
infinitycircuitzsh wasn't in /etc/shells...i just manually changed it and it worked23:51
Cheikhsits what i thought23:53

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