IRC Logs for #crux Saturday, 2008-11-29

klickhaha =)00:02
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klickNo real need for a /boot nowadays is there? Since most machines can boot beyond 1024 cylinders, etc.00:37
treachnot that I've noticed but I tend to be careful with my partitions anyway00:38
treach(separate root,usr,var and home)00:39
klickI got 30G's to play with here =)00:39
treachsounds plenty00:40
klick30 giga bytes of storage that is..00:40
klick=)00:40
treachgot that00:40
klick32MB /boot, 20G /, 7.5G /home and 2G swap00:41
treachI'm not using more than 310MB on my / currently, and thats suse. ;p00:41
klickhaha =)00:41
klicktreach: How do you calculate the size needed for usr, var, home and /?00:42
treachI've got 512M / , 4.5G /usr and 1G var, rest is home00:42
treachexperience. :p00:42
klickI guess I need to actually check disk usage more often than I have done before00:43
klickand I00:43
treachsince it depends on what you're planning on installing and how you plan to use it, it varies too  much for any really useful general advice.00:43
klickand I've been using Linux since '98... I should hide in a corner00:43
treachheh00:43
klickI can always repartition and reinstall late00:45
treachgenerally speaking though 20 G for / is insane, and 7.5 for home is too little to be useful, IMO00:45
klickI'll make / 10G then00:47
treachas long as it works for you. :)00:47
klicksure =)00:47
klickI won't probably use more than 5 anyways...00:48
klickXorg, xterm, fvwm, vim and gcc/autotools is what I want00:48
treachhah, I don't think that'll be more than 1 or so. :P00:48
joacimdont forget zsnes00:49
klickhaha00:50
treach+ /usr is ~ 3GB here, and that's a pretty loaded kde installation00:50
treachoops  "/ +"00:50
klickAnd XP requires at least 8GB...00:51
treachwindows is a joke00:52
klickyeah, definitely00:52
treachvista is beyond redicolous.00:52
joacimmy /usr is 6.2GB.00:55
ahmrahtcheerthere's one GREAT thing about Vista00:55
joacimI have games installed.. important games that i play every single day00:55
klickhaha00:55
klickWhat kind of games?00:55
klickahmrahtcheer: What?00:55
joacimxbill00:55
klickoh, hah00:55
treachahmrahtcheer: yeah, it makes all harddrive manufacturers jump with joy. :p00:55
ahmrahtcheerpeople are dumping p2 and p3m laptops on ebay00:56
joacimand doom3. I play doom3 once every 6 months00:56
ahmrahtcheera few weeks past i bought a P3mobile, 256MB RAM, 20GB hdd IBM ThinkPad, for $8100:57
ahmrahtcheerit'd been barely used00:57
klickjesus00:57
treachthat's nice, all you need is a bit more ram and a ssd. ;)00:58
ahmrahtcheerthis model, the T21 can handle 512mb00:59
joacimmillibit isnt much these days01:00
treachnever was :p01:00
treach256MB is a bit too little IMO unless you plan on staying with console apps or having very few apps running.01:01
ahmrahtcheertreach i have a 512mb swap partition, and i don't really start getting into it unless i load OOo01:03
klickVista is crap, but I have to say, the XP GUI actually does look quite dull when compare to Vista side-by-side.01:03
ahmrahtcheerthey both look crappy against e1601:04
treachahmrahtcheer: I guess you don't do image manipulation or eclipse or something like that. :p01:04
klickFvwm rules them all.01:04
ahmrahtcheerbut i don't like e1601:04
treachthe vista ui sucks donkey balls.01:04
klickhaha01:04
treachit's probably the worst crap I've ever seen01:04
klicksure does01:04
ahmrahtcheeri stick with WindowMaker and have used the same background for 2+ yrs01:05
klickWin 2k actually has the best UI of all Windows versions, IMO.01:05
klickFvwm mimicking MWM here..01:05
treachI guess it looks ok if all you ever do is open and close a few windows, but once you start doing more than that aero is mercilessly exposed as what it is: Unfinished crap.01:06
klickI wonder if that was the correct word.01:06
treachI'm running kde 4.2 here and fvwm on my laptop.01:06
klicknice :)01:07
ahmrahtcheermy screenshot:  http://tornadowood.us/images/background.jpg01:07
treachwell, *I* like it. :P01:07
klickNice.01:07
klicktreach: Fvwm beats everything, imo . :)01:07
treachahmrahtcheer: nice, good old wm. :D01:08
ahmrahtcheertreach yeah, it's getting a little long in the tooth, but i like it01:08
treachyep, it's easy to get going, fast and really stable.01:08
joacimMacOSX is miles better than Vista01:09
klickI'll give you a shot once I've got this setup.01:09
treachjoacim: sadly, that doesn't say much. :/01:09
joacimMacOSX even comes with a collection of decent shells out of the box.. bash as the default =)01:09
klickbash is absolutely lovely01:09
joacimI switched to zsh01:09
treachheck, I'd be tempted to say win 3.11 is miles better than vista. :Z01:10
klickhaha01:10
treachs/z/>01:10
klickI kind-of like the Win3.11 progman better than the taskbar.01:10
joacimwith my laptop i really dont do anything but read mail, surf the web, and play cave story. So its perfect for what I use it for01:10
ahmrahtcheershoot, MS-DOS 3.X was better.01:10
ahmrahtcheeryeah, it was buggy, but the bugs were predictable and could be worked around.01:11
treachwell, 3.x wasn't too bad.01:11
joacimdoesnt vista come with progman?01:11
treachahmrahtcheer: IIRC that was one of the less buggier DOS releases01:11
treachjoacim: I don't think so.01:12
klickHrmph, qtparted didn't set hda8 as being of type swap. Changing the partition type using cfdisk shouldn't damage the mbr, etc, should it? Iirc I've used PartitionMagic before to shrink C: and then use cfdisk to create the Linux partitions.01:12
ahmrahtcheertreach i ran a BBS on it for 5 years01:12
joacimit did come with win2k afaik01:12
joacimcant remember if ive seen it in xp01:12
treachwhat? You didn't run it on OS/2? :D01:12
treachahmrahtcheer: ^01:12
treachjoacim: I don't think I've seen it since 200001:13
ahmrahtcheertreach, i didn't, 'cause i was primarily a machead,but my g/f used it01:13
treachheh.01:13
joacimmkay01:13
treachAlmost everyone I knew who ran a BBS did it on OS/2...01:13
treachthose were the days. :D01:14
joacimbeen looking to start my own BBS =)01:14
ahmrahtcheerthe main reason i didn't use it was 'cause i had a 28k autoexec.bat file01:14
joacimI have everything but the modem01:14
treachyikes01:14
treachklick: "No"01:20
klickgood01:22
ahmrahtcheeri spent more on zorched modems than i did on all of the rest of the BBS hardware combined01:22
treachyou might have to actually remove the partition to make it work though.01:23
klickyeah, I removed all Linux partitions, qtparted somehow didn't create them in correct order01:23
klick/dev/hda8 was before /dev/hda5 etc01:24
treachbrilliant stuff.01:24
klickyeah, really01:24
klickcfdisk worked fine, it created a 2GB at the end which became hda7, then when I created a partition before that it changed it to hda8... which qtparted did not.01:25
treachfdisk++01:26
klickDo you guys install everything from core?01:30
treachI think the rule is that you're supposed to do that, at least it's not adviced to leave things out unless you *absolutely* know what you're doing.01:31
treachthat said, "No" :p01:31
klickhaha01:31
klickIt includes stuff like reiserfsprogs, tcsh, etc... I do not need those01:32
treachok, just keep in mind what you leave out in case you hit problems later.01:32
klickyeah01:32
treachI think I've seen some crazy shit actually depending on tcsh, for instance.01:33
klickI guess I'll have to install that one then. :)01:34
treachbah, probably not01:34
treachiirc it was some crufty archaic old shit nobody sane should touch01:34
klickhaha01:36
klickit would complain then anyways01:36
treachyeah01:36
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klickArgh, why does Xorg require python?03:02
tilmanxcb's code generator is written in ython03:11
tilmanpython is the new perl...03:11
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cruxbot[opt.git/2.4]: wpa_supplicant: update to 0.5.1103:17
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cruxbot[opt.git/2.5]: gvim: update to 7.2.5103:30
cruxbot[opt.git/2.5]: wpa_supplicant: update to 0.5.1103:30
cruxbot[opt.git/2.5]: Merge branch '2.4' into 2.503:30
cruxbot[core.git/2.5]: vim: update to 7.2.5103:32
cruxbot[core.git/2.5]: man-pages: update to 3.1403:32
cruxbot[core.git/2.5]: udev: updated to 134.03:32
cruxbot[core.git/2.5]: Merge branch '2.4' into 2.503:32
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cruxbot[opt.git/2.5]: dosbox: build with gcc 4.3.03:55
cruxbot[opt.git/2.5]: dosbox: build with gcc 4.3.03:56
cruxbot[core.git/2.5]: filesystem: suggest to use relatime.04:18
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klick10:54 < cruxbot> [opt.git/2.5]: dosbox: build with gcc 4.3.04:29
klickwoops04:29
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sepenmorning04:32
Falcon|morning04:32
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sepenRotwang, did you finally test my mult-driver for ports?04:56
Rotwangsepen: not yet04:56
sepenI'll glad to see your results04:57
Rotwangk, ill let you know04:58
sepenheh04:58
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Rotwangtilman: filesystem fstab md5sum mismatch05:01
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tilmanfucking hell05:04
cruxbot[core.git/2.5]: filesystem: fixed .md5sum.05:06
tilman:(05:06
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estersHi folks05:44
tilmansup05:44
estersTrying to start openbox05:45
estersTried X -configure; X -config /root/xorg.conf.new and none of the input devices work05:46
estersX starts, but I have to do a hard reset05:46
tilmantry the crux mailing list05:46
Rotwangsirmacik:^05:46
Rotwangits the allowemptyimput issue i guess05:47
estersAny suggestions ?05:49
Rotwangesters: wait a few minutes05:49
estersSure05:50
Rotwanghttp://lists.pld-linux.org/mailman/pipermail/pld-users-pl/2008-November/071110.html05:53
Rotwangadd Option          "AllowEmptyInput" "off"05:53
Rotwangto ServerLayout sedction05:53
estersThanks :)05:54
estersGonna test05:54
estersMouse doesn't work05:54
estersctrl+alt+backspace too05:55
estersBut switching between terminals work05:55
tilmanthe server zapping might be disabled by default05:56
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cruxbot[xorg.git/2.5]: xorg-xf86-input-evdev: updated to 2.1.0.07:01
tilmans/Path/Device/ in xorg.conf if you happen to use evedev :)07:01
tilmanhttp://gnomecoder.wordpress.com/2008/11/29/add-to-panel/07:13
tilman;D07:13
aon:)07:14
Rotwangahhh i get it now ;]07:20
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cruxbot[opt.git/2.4]: fakeroot: update to 1.1107:57
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cruxbot[opt.git/2.4]: gtk-engines: revert to stable version 2.16.108:12
f1yGosh, some git problems... I need a beer -.-08:19
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cruxbot[opt.git/2.5]: rake: updated to 0.8.3.08:50
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cruxbot[opt.git/2.5]: cdrdao: extended gcc patch (thanks Till)09:01
cruxbot[contrib.git/2.4]: boost-jam: 3.1.16 -> 3.1.1709:08
cruxbot[contrib.git/2.4]: gst-ffmpeg: 0.10.5 -> 0.10.609:08
cruxbot[contrib.git/2.4]: sdl_image: 1.2.6 -> 1.2.709:08
cruxbot[contrib.git/2.4]: boost-jam: forgot to remove a not needed echo during debugging09:11
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estersHi again :)10:47
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thrice`mm, gonna re-install 2.5 on my lappy :)12:08
estersI'm reinstalling crux again :)12:08
thrice`did you see the 2.5 RC ? :)12:09
estersYes12:09
estersSpeaking of which12:09
estersIs CRUX rolling-release ?12:09
thrice`well, most things will keep updating.  stuff like glibc, gcc, etc.  usually don't update, since they are a PITA  :)12:10
joacimrolling in between each major release i guess :p12:10
estersWhat will happen when 2.5 comes out, will it automatiacly update my port tree ?12:10
estersautomatically*12:10
thrice`if you install 2.5 RC, you will be all set :)12:10
thrice`tilman: the iso *is* a bit tricky to find on http://crux.nu/Main/Download  btw :)12:11
tilmani copied the announcement from the 2.4-rc1 announcement12:13
tilmanwhich was probably copied from the 2.3 announcement12:13
thrice`ah :)12:14
thrice`alright, bbiab; gonna give the iso a shot :)12:14
tilmanfor now i'll trust that interested parties hit the master mirror and find the 2.5 directory12:14
tilman:D12:14
thrice`i might play with udev too :)12:15
tilman\o/12:16
estersGrub ><12:23
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estersNow that is a wtf12:40
estersI sorta installed grub on top of my hdd's MBR, but still when I boot I get the GRUB edit menu12:40
thrice`no idea; I haven't used grub in awhile :|12:42
ahmrahtcheeresters, google:  gentoo grub errors12:44
ahmrahtcheerthat should give you a link to a list of GRUB error messages and suggested fixes for 'em12:44
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pitill0esters, how did you installed it? following the automatic setup in the handbook?12:50
esterspitill0: Both, automatic and manual12:52
estersI also tried from the GRUB documentation12:52
estersActually it doesn't complan, I only get the grub edit console when I'm booting into the hdd12:53
pitill0I got it when I use automatic setup, using manual went well12:53
estersFixed :)12:55
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estersBooted from a LiveCD and installed using root(hdx,y) & setup (hdx)12:55
thrice`nice :)13:00
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estersHhh13:11
estersI compiled charset support to UTF-813:11
estersI try to mount a FAT usb stick13:12
estersIt fails13:12
thrice`did you generate utf8 locales?13:14
estersNope13:15
thrice`if you're on 2.5, the glibc package won't provide all locales.  see the handbook to generate them :)13:16
estersMhm13:16
estersDone :)13:16
thrice`a little more work, but it trims down glibc a ton :)13:17
estersthrice`: what is your output of 'locale' ?13:19
estersIs it "POSIX" ?13:19
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klickesters: It's POSIX here.13:41
klickesters: What does POSIX really mean when talking about locales?13:41
estersI don't know13:41
estersI followed this - http://crux.nu/Main/Handbook2-5#ntoc5413:42
klickah13:42
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thrice`alright, everything has built well so far, with a few stale python ports14:28
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klickThis is annoying, I can't uncheck the deprecated 802.11 networking stack15:14
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* joacim is shamed to say that he has never filed a bug report or posted on a mailinglist18:35
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