IRC Logs for #crux Wednesday, 2009-03-04

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pitiIIogood morning01:24
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Weisbeckerjaeger, ping03:02
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weisbeckeropal needs the portable tools library for ekiga as a dependency iirc03:06
weisbeckerhey f1y :)03:09
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nipuLwho needs /r/funny when you have sepen03:35
sepenjo jo.03:35
sepennipuL, put a sepen in your life ;D03:37
sepenat least, you will be more happy03:38
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kzkhow to install UTF-8 support  in CRUX ?05:30
kzkset LANG to utf-805:30
kzkwhat about console keyboard & console font ?05:31
kzkin /etc/.profile, right ?05:33
roberthhad some setup for this way back.05:36
roberthbut I seldom log into console any more.05:37
roberththink I also used kbd_mode to check whether console was in unicode, and had a good font set up as argument to unicode_start.05:41
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cruxbot[contrib.git/2.5]: slim-themes: initial import06:34
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spaceninjaanyone knows how to change my user's main group? Everytime I create a dir or something, the group associated with that dir becomes "users"07:07
spaceninjaI want it to be spacenina:spaceninja07:07
spaceninjawhere do I change that?07:07
mike_kspaceninja: usermod -g spaceninja spaceninja07:09
mike_ksee usermod(8) ащк вуефшды07:09
mike_k* for details07:09
spaceninjaok thanks07:10
teK_$EDITOR /etc/passwd07:13
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spaceninjaaha now I see07:16
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* gcov ehi ehi ehi08:33
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sepenDarknekros, be aware with funny links, :D09:07
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Darknekrossepen, I know, but it's funny xD09:07
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Darknekrosread the comments for more fun ;)09:11
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spaceninja1someone is trying to send me a file called startkeylogger09:12
spaceninja1his name is Cheeese, how do I find out which channel he's on?09:12
Darknekrosspaceninja1, somebody has a bot in his machine xD09:13
spaceninja1Is it safe to save?09:13
spaceninja1I mean, I have to run it right?09:14
Darknekrosspaceninja1, I don't think so...09:17
spaceninja1I saved it but it wouldn't start09:20
spaceninja1but I believe it was a windows viruZ09:20
spaceninja1the download didn't start09:29
spaceninja1I didn't try to run it :P09:29
Rotwangid dl it and see what it was09:34
sepenmaybe some kind of steganography code ;D09:42
spaceninja1hmm, so my computer could be infected?09:45
spaceninja1im not going to take any chances, reformat09:45
jaegerhrmm... trying to use dosemu/freedos to make a bootable USB drive and every time I run sys from dosemu the partition table gets eaten09:45
sepenhmm bootable usb drive with dosemu?09:48
pedjaAnyone else got this .footprint mismatch with qt4?
sepenops, shouldn't appear09:53
pedjaI guess it means that cptn has mysql installed, which gets picked up by qt4, and I have sqlite09:53
sepenyeah it seems09:54
pedjano worries there :)09:54
pedjaqt-4.5.0 is binary compatible with 4.4.x, so nothing should get b0rken.09:56
Rotwangnew qt at last in ports \o/09:58
Rotwangim able to update mah kde09:58
sepenon this commit he removed the mysql stuff09:58
thrice`going to 4.3.x trunk? :)09:59
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sepenbah' xfce46 rocks!! hehe10:03
* Rotwang checks out lates available sources10:04
Rotwangsepen: some people have feeling that xfce is bocoming too gnomish10:05
sepenand what are the arguments?10:05
pedjaI like xfce46 very much, it10:06
Rotwangif i look back ~1,5 year xfce was comp[letely different imo10:06
sepenI love xfconf10:06
pedjais a sterp in a right direction as far as I am concerned10:06
Rotwangnow it it tries mimic gnome a bit, but thats my personal feeling10:06
sepenRotwang, sure, also crux 2.0 is too different if you look back too ~1.5 years10:06
pedja'mimic gnome'? how?10:07
sepenimho xfce is for people who want a complete desktop environment but not as large as kde or gnome10:07
sepenalso I think that thunar, xfburn, etc. etc are better apps than their opponents (nautilus, k3b, etc.)=10:08
sepenbut its just my personal opinion10:08
pedjai played with kde-4.2, and I can't see what the hype is about.10:09
Rotwangkde is nice10:09
sepenalso kde and gome work perfectly for most desktop users10:09
pedjasure, it looks nice, lots of eyecandy etc.10:10
sepenRotwang, sure10:10
sepenbut you need the whole QT stuff10:10
pedjafor someone running away from windows, I tend to recommend KDE to people.10:12
Rotwangits funny because i use kde, but most apps i use are gtk ;>10:13
Rotwangpidgin firefox thunderbird pcman tec.10:13
thrice`xfburn is getting very nice10:15
sepenthunar and xarchiver too ;D10:17
thrice`sepen: have you ever used squeeze?  I like it more than xarchiver :>10:18
sepenI'll try, but what about deps?10:18
thrice`I don't think any, outside of xfce libraries :)10:19
sepenI'll should take a look10:19
sepenthanks thrice`10:19
sepenand what about thunar integration?10:19
thrice`hmm...I'm not sure I have tried10:20
sepenohh thunar-archive-plugin10:20
sepensame than xarchiver, many thanks thrice`10:20
sepenI'll push in the repo when have sometime10:20
sepenwell time to goback home, lateR!10:21
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thrice`hi cptn10:28
cptnpedja: should indeed not be there10:31
cruxbot[opt.git/2.5]: qt4: remove from footprint10:31
thrice`wow, that was fast :)10:32
cptnhey, it's just removing one line from the footprint :-)10:32
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pedjacptn: I thought so :)11:07
pedjayay, wireshark is choking on 40Mb capture file.patience, patience...11:08
tilmanpedja: did you forget to set a filter? :P11:10
pedjatilman: it takes a while to generate statistics, I want to see conversations/endpoints.11:14
spaceninja1pedja: how do you run wireshark as root?11:15
pedjaI don't ;)11:16
pedjaI used sudo before.11:16
spaceninja1but how can you configure the interface?11:16
spaceninja1I don't like sudo, hard to configure11:16
pedjatshark/tcpdump for capture, wireshark for analysis.11:16
tilmanspaceninja1: wtf?11:17
pedjasudo has a nice man page, it's not that hard.11:17
tilmanspaceninja yourhostname=(ALL) ALL11:17
spaceninja1but still, wireshark freezes when i start it as root11:17
spaceninja1way too much11:17
pedjait's not recommended to run it as root.11:17
tilmani'm the adventurous type11:18
tilmanbut i only use wireshark once a year for 5 minutes :P11:18
thrice`bah, that's not adventurous :)11:19
spaceninja1still doesn't work, even with sudo11:20
pedjaI'm playing with capture file from
tilmanpedja: cool, thanks11:21
pedjaspaceninja1: what doesn't work?11:21
spaceninja1I can't klick on the buttons11:22
pedjatilman: np, there is a lot of cool stuff there.11:22
tilmani meant the wiki link ;D11:22
pedjaoh.ok :)11:22
pedjai though you wan't to be a hax0r too ;)11:23
tilmani'll check the other one too :p11:23
spaceninja1wireshark freezes11:23
spaceninja1but it runs perfectly with a normal user11:23
pedjaso, what's the problem?do a sane thing, use tcpdump/tshark to capture traffic.11:24
pedjathen play with it in wireshark.11:25
pedjaif you are interested in visualisation, check out
spaceninja1so wireshark needs tcpdump or tshark to work?11:26
spaceninja1I know what the problem was11:27
spaceninja1when you start wireshark as root, you get a "pop up" window that warns you that you shouldn't run it as root11:27
spaceninja1but it was behind wireshark11:27
spaceninja1and I didn't see it11:27
spaceninja1omg, I have had this problem for months11:28
spaceninja1you had to press OK11:31
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Rotwangsepen: i has an error upgrading arora!!oneone12:00
cptnI updated to arora 0.5 with qt 4.4.3... so maybe the update to 4.5.0 broke it12:01
Rotwangill try to figure something out myself when kde update finishes12:02
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spaceninja1time to install crux + gnome13:21
treach"Forgive them, because they do not know what they do" :>13:22
dru1dtrue ;)13:31
dru1dspaceninja1: On eeepc?13:31
spaceninja1nah, on my desktop, but I guess I could run it on my eeepc13:31
spaceninja1but openbox looks really good on it13:31
spaceninja1with mrxvt13:31
dru1dI use only ratpoison ;)13:32
spaceninja1I tried it, felt too geeky, I couldn't handle it13:32
treachrp is nice, as is dwm, provided that you don't want/need a systray and stuff like that13:33
spaceninja1I'll give it a second try someday13:34
dru1dI use only console..13:34
dru1dAnd customize ratpoison with dzen.13:34
treachdru1d: might as well skip x, and go straight for the fb then. ;)13:35
spaceninja1omg I need a job13:35
spaceninja1I'm dying13:35
dru1dtreach: Usualy i hear that ;]13:35
dru1dFrom many people.13:35
spaceninja1yeah x is bloat13:36
spaceninja1I wish someone could make minimalistic hardware13:36
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treachspaceninja1: why? What makes it more "bloated" than say... vista, or osx? :>13:36
spaceninja1too many copper wires13:36
treachI kind of doubt that.. :p13:37
spaceninja1I guess I can't have everything clean13:37
Rotwangkdebase build breaks, damn :<13:38
dru1dRotwang: shame on you13:38
Rotwangfiggin KHolidays13:38
spaceninja1omg kde is the mother of bloat13:38
treachkmix, kopete, akregator, kmail, konsole, irssi -> 305MB ram.13:39
treachbloated how?13:39
spaceninja1ok, what if you wanted to install kolourpaint13:39
spaceninja1look how many packages you need for that13:40
spaceninja1you need kde-graphics and dep13:40
spaceninja1not acceptable13:40
treachyou know, those libraries are used by heaps of other applications.13:40
spaceninja1but still, you need to install krita13:40
treachlike everything from okular, which is great, to koffice wich is rapidly becoming pretty good.13:40
dru1dMy girl uses kde.13:41
spaceninja1ok, I wont deny that kde apps are nice13:41
dru1dnot so bad i think13:41
spaceninja1I've always considered kde to be a girly desktop13:41
spaceninja1ah, sorry, on a bad mood :)13:42
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treachbad blacksmiths keep blameing their tools13:42
dru1dWell that are tools, You decide how tu use it.13:43
dru1dAnd you customize you env.13:43
treachkde migh, or might not suit everyone, but tbh, bloat is probably the only thing I you can't accuse it of, or at least not to any large degree.13:43
dru1dBtw. my desktop:13:44
treachhah, cool scheme, one might think I was you.. :D13:44
spaceninja1is gnome considered to be bloated compared with kde?13:44
treachspaceninja1: basically, yeah13:45
spaceninja1I hate seeing myself from a "third" perspective13:45
spaceninja1it makes me realize how stupid I am13:46
spaceninja1lol, afk13:47
thrice`I admit to using kde4 for awhile, but have since reverted to something lighter.  perhaps it was just a phase :)13:49
spaceninja1treach: hehe nice one13:50
treachthrice`: I'm addicted, I guess I'm too fond of clever stuff. :p13:53
jaegerthey're both bloated, hard to compare :)13:53
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treachjaeger: I'd agree that they are both "big", but bloated is relative, especially if you compare to the competion. ;)13:54
jaegerdru1d: what is the info bar at the bottom? part of rp or conky or something else?13:54
dru1djaeger: dzen13:55
dru1dwith bash scripts13:55
jaegertreach: well, I didn't hear anyone say the competition is not :)13:55
jaegerdru1d: nice13:55
jaegerI might set up something like that on my eee13:55
jaegercurrently running easy peasy 1.0 but I don't care much for it13:56
dru1dI have crux.13:56
dru1dEalier fbsd.13:56
thrice`treach: using Rotwang's ports?13:56
treachjaeger: indeed not, I was just hinting at that I have a hard time finding a system "bloated" when it weighs in at about 2 GB, when the competition weighs in at 10 times as much, _without_ any applications.13:56
thrice`I don't think linux would have 90% of its users without gnome or kde, so we can't complain too much :)13:57
treachthrice`: no, not yet. thinking about giving it a shot, but I don't have the time to change right now13:57
jaegerI suppose that's fair. I was thinking more along the lines of feature and effects bloat but yeah13:57
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thrice`I have yet to track down my xorg-lockup issues on 64-bit crux14:03
thrice`seems to be esp. noticable after suspend/resume14:03
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treachisn't everything? :>14:19
thrice`well, as in, my entire laptop hard-locks upon resuming :)14:22
thrice`i found a gentoo bug from their 64-bit and exact chipset, so I'm hoping a fix-thrice-issue.patch  comes out of it :)14:22
treach"attempted resume" :p anyway, bugs sure creep out when you try suspend/resume.. :/14:22
thrice`i dual-boot with slamd64, which is still on xorg 7.3, and have actually never had suspend fail on that14:23
treachmmh, xorg seems to get buggier with each relase.14:24
thrice`it'll resolve itself eventually, I suppose14:24
thrice`I think the bugs just shift around :)14:25
treachannoying though that some of the people working on the radeonhd drivers apparently got laid off14:28
jesse_"The board of directors said costs need to be cut: I know, cut those open source jerks out of the loop, they do nothing of value anyway"14:35
treachinternal politics I guess. the culture within a company is hard to change, even if the top brass is in on it.14:38
treachAnd novell used to be about as closed as you could get14:38
thrice`well, I can understand cutting theoretically, non-value-added people\14:39
treachwell, it's not like the historical parts of novell brings in any _new_ incomes.14:40
thrice`neither do many CEO's, but getting rid of them wouldn't solve much (well, perhaps in some industries... :)  )14:41
treachnetware is still where they make the bulk of their income, but the customers are all using legacy installations.. so cutting of the people who actually brings in new business seems a tad stupid14:41
thrice`yep; we're using windows-based, groupwise 6.5 here at my work14:41
treachnovell, and sun is going the way of the dodo, I'm afraid. Then things will get ugly.14:43
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jesse_Relying completely on cash cows is probably not the greatest strategic choice in the long run.14:55
treachindeed. sun, novell, sgi. same story, different timelines.14:56
treachthe problem with the high end; you can't advance as fast as the people behind you are catching up, there is less place for improvement, and the marked that actually need your products keep shrinking.14:58
thrice`yep, of course15:04
treachof course it's obvious. even so an amazing amount of companies have fallen in exactly that trap.15:06
thrice`our r&d budget is slowly approaching $0 :)15:07
treachthrice`: what are you selling? I seem to remember you saying something about being locked up in a basement in germany, transcribing german drawings, but I assume the time where useful stuff could be gained from captured german ww2 aircraft designs are over. :p15:09
thrice`there's *always* a market!15:12
Rotwangheh ;}15:12
treach"Kom och köp konserverad gröt". :p15:13
treach(famous sketch on the topic)15:13
treach"Everything can be sold with murderous advertising, come and buy, come and buy preserved porridge" :p15:15
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jesse_Make it look shiny and spin it as the greatest thing since sliced bread and you'll have a winner.15:36
treachno, since preserved porridge. ;)15:36
treach"porridge in a can" :D15:37
jesse_zomg, latest and greatest evar!
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sepencptn, same here with arora, I'll try with the new qt4 now16:24
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namenlosgood night...16:55
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thrice`I think qt 4.5.x is supposed to add netscape-plug capability to arora17:40
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voltaichello all17:43
voltaicI have a general xorg related question.17:45
voltaicdo the main xorg packages get updated from release to release? packages such as xorg-server, mesa3d, etc.17:45
treachgenerally speaking, no.17:46
voltaicoh ok.17:46
treachsame as all other packages in crux. "latest stable".17:47
treachor maybe I misunderstood what you meant with "from release to release"?17:47
voltaicI've been following up on new xorg developments. there are some nice updates to Intel graphics hardware, but some of the packages in xorg are out of date.17:47
voltaicxorg-server 1.6.0 came out last week I think.17:48
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thrice`yes, but xorg-server 1.6 needs libs that aren't yet released as stable17:48
voltaicmesa3d was updated a while ago. I believe there were some dri updates as well.17:48
voltaicI see17:48
thrice`also, mesa 7.3 is not a stable release :)17:48
treachI bet tilman will push 1.6 about 1 second after those libs are released. :p17:49
voltaichaha, that's good to know :)17:49
treachhe's usually pretty quick with following xorg, so I don't think there's much to worry about. :)17:49
voltaicI like playing around with these things from time to time. but I'm never sure if I should spend the time to write my own ports, only to find out that the repository was updated a day later.17:50
thrice`heh :)17:50
voltaicI think I will wait.17:51
voltaicthank you for helping treach.17:51
treachno problem17:51
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hexhamwhat is this?18:42
thrice`this is the internet18:42
treachI dunno, can't see what you're looking at. My crystal ball is on repair.18:43
hexhamis it M irc18:43
aon2here i'ts XXL irc18:44
aon2wtf happened to my nick18:44
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treachhexham: are you drunk, kidding or just clueless?18:44
* thrice` prays for the former18:45
hexhamI have got here through a java app on Motorolla phone18:45
treachok, that would make you "clueless", that's ok.18:46
hexhamI remember Irc a chatt app I used to chat through it 8year ago18:46
treachthis is a channel on something called irc. you can find out more about it on wikipedia for instance.18:46
hexhamThx but i dont trust wikipedia18:47
* treach stops feeding the troll.18:47
aonthis is probably the thing i've least expected on this channel at this hour18:48
hexhamtreach> thrice`> aon> have a good chat.... Bye bye.18:50
aonsee you18:50
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treachpah, "I don't trust wikipedia"... wrt something like irc. *boggles*18:54
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treachyay, another ff update. :>19:48
treachwtf.. gnome is now a recommended dependency of firefox?19:52
jaegerthat's a little jacked up19:53
treachjust to make sure nobody thinks I'm pulling stuff out of my rear.. :P19:53
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nipuLi'd assume the optional gnome requirement is for things like "open containing folder" in the download manager, etc21:12
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