IRC Logs for #crux Saturday, 2009-04-25

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sirmacikHi o/02:52
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DarkNekrosmorning :)03:14
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tilmanwhat the crap is wrong with arora?05:16
tilman'copy link location' doesn't do shit05:16
tilmanafaics it doesn't copy to the selection buffer, and it doesn't copy to the other thing of which i forgot the name :P05:17
tilmanprimary selection/cut buffer i think05:17
Rotwangworks for me (tm)05:18
cruxbot[core.git/2.5]: findutils: updated to
teKarora used more RAM (and was slower) than FF here05:51
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Rotwangbad news06:13
Rotwangim short on beer and cigarettes06:13
teKkids and women first!06:16
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VileTimesHey folks. I keep getting the same "kernel panic" when I try to install Crux 2.5: not syncing: unable to mount root fs on unknown block(3,65). Crux 2.4 installs without a problem, so I'm at a total loss as to what could be causing this error on two separate machines. Any ideas?08:43
aondo you have the filesystem you use for / built in the kernel?08:44
thrice`sure, it's likely a problem with the kernel08:44
VileTimesYes. EXT3. I get this error even with a vanilla kernel (no mucking about in menuconfig).08:45
RotwangI shall spare the children08:46
Rotwangbought some beer08:46
aoncorrect fstab?08:47
VileTimesYeah, I checkd that too. The funny thing is Crux 2.4 runs no problem.08:48
thrice`I didn't realize there was a "default" config :|08:48
aonme neither :)08:49
thrice`otherwise, it can be your harddrive controller too08:52
VileTimesSorry if I'm not using the correct terminology. I try not to offend, but I do fail at times.08:53
thrice`no, you're fine :)08:53
Rotwangi have no cigarettes tho :<08:53
Rotwangcouldn't afford them08:53
Rotwangdamn they are like two euro a pack08:53
VileTimesNah, I'm going to check the .config file one last time. Otherwise, I'm going back to 2.408:53
thrice`that error can mean a couple things.  either your FS support isn't in, your harddrive controller (sata, ide) isn't in, and it can't mount your partition, your lilo.conf points to the wrong partition, or your /etc/fstab points to the wrong devices08:54
aonRotwang: more like four here, stop complaining08:54
thrice`in the US, they just got a huge increase08:55
joacimI think a 20-pack is 75 NOK (around 8.6 euro) here08:55
thrice`I want to say (as I don't smoke) close to $6 here08:55
aonsomething ridiculous like that in the uk too, i've heard08:56
aonbeen trying to stop too, so far so good :)08:56
Rotwangaon: but you earn more ;D08:56
thrice`more money for beer instead ;)08:56
aondon't earn that much as a student :)08:57
VileTimesThanks for the tips thrice. I'll double check all of this things this time around.08:57
thrice`I would avoid 2.4, honestly, as it's ports aren't updated anymore08:58
VileTimesYes, I noticed that. Perhaps a 2.4 install with a 2.5 upgrade via CDROM would be less painful... hmm..08:59
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VileTimesAnother question: has anyone managed to get mplayer to play video to the framebuffer? I'd love to ditch X for good...09:20
teKmplayer -vo fbdev ~/foo.avi09:40
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tilmancrap, forgot about the firefox update :(13:18
aongoddamn openoffice is bad13:21
aoni wonder if it would make sense to start following the development releases of wine13:21
aonthey add pretty nifty stuff, and it's a while since 1.0.1 already13:21
tilmanjust say no and use latex :D13:22
aoni would13:22
aonbut it's this "computing 101" course we have13:23
aoni failed it in autumn due to lack of interest :)13:23
tilmanw t f13:23
aonyou can gather 100 points in total, of which you have to gather 8013:23
aon_but_ you can only miss one of the assignments13:23
aoni can't really fathom why it is mandatory13:24
aonwho studies cs if they can't use a computer13:24
aon(actually way too many people it seems)13:25
thrice`that's insane13:26
aoni missed two in a row because i remembered the deadline wrong and was visiting my mum without my laptop13:27
aoncame home a hour too late13:27
aonand the teacher was just "sux, better luck next time"13:27
thrice`I had a couple of those, but the teachers were pretty relaxed.  example, all mechanical engineers are forced to take an electrical engineering course :(13:29
aonthere's all sorts of crap, luckily it pretty much seems to end after the first year13:29
aonUI stuff etc :)13:29
aonor rather HCI13:29
aonwhich wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't all WIMP13:30
thrice`"sorry my assignment was late, I was doing homework that I actually care about, and might actually contribute something usefu" :>13:34
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aoni'm a bit scared of studying anyway13:34
aoni feel that java is better in some aspects than c++ :)13:34
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rehabdollawesome name14:26
DarkNekrosXPM -> it's the same thing I do with my virtual machine, but cheapest xD14:31
cruxbot[opt.git/2.5]: git: updated to
cruxbot[opt.git/2.5]: xulrunner: updated to
cruxbot[opt.git/2.5]: firefox: updated to
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thrice`oh no, zee irssi port is aged :|14:44
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aonthrice`: file a bug :)14:57
thrice`is viper still around?14:58
thrice`easier just to move it to /usr/ports/mine :)14:59
aoneasy, but not a solution15:01
aonguess i gould just go ahead and bump it15:02
aon(or someone else)15:02
VileTimesHmmm... very odd. So I re-installed CRUX 2.4 and used the 2.5 CDROM to upgrade the 2.4 installation. I compiled kernel and told grub where to find it along with Old kernel - no problem. New kernel - same kernel panic. I'm stumped.15:03
thrice`it just proves that your kernel config is wrong15:03
aoncopy the config from your old kernel15:04
aonand run 'make oldconfig' to see whether there's some new stuff you might like15:04
VileTimesThanks. I'll give that s shot.15:07
VileTimesSorry if my questions seem n00bish, but I don't exactly compile linux kernels for a living. :)15:19
joacimcould this be an issue with libata?15:20
thrice`quite possibly :)15:22
VileTimesWell, no big deal if this doesn't work out. I'll just use Crux2.5 packages and use the old kernel.15:25
thrice`heh, I remember switching to crux; it was the first time I had leanred to compile a kernel too15:33
VileTimesI compiled a kernel once before years ago because I desperately wanted wireless under Linux, and the only way to do that was to compile a 2.6 kernel. 2.4 was the standard back then.15:34
VileTimesThat worked!15:36
VileTimesThanks, aon.15:37
VileTimesI can't tell you exactly what was causing the trouble unfortunately.,15:42
thrice`don't ask questions, just use it :)15:52
VileTimesOh, I most certainly will use it. I'm building a Crux home entertainment computer with a couple of very sizeable hard drives and an SVIDEO out. :)15:57
VileTimes... and a wireless keyboard.15:58
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jesse_aon: that Halla-aho case is one ridiculous minority appeasement circle jerk.16:04
jesse_You can criticize christian dogma all you want and it is unlikely anyone will even look your way.16:04
jesse_BUT, once you throw your hat into the political islam ring, you're toast.16:05
aonchristian and/or otherwise "major"16:05
jesse_Yay freedom of speech/expression and religion, but we don't really maintain them to be that important after all.16:08
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cruxbot[opt.git/2.5]: irssi: updated to 0.8.1316:11
thrice`thanks aon16:12
jesse_The irssi team took their time on this release. :D16:12
aondo you remember how long it took from 0.8.9 to 0.8.10? :D16:12
aon0.8.9 10 Dec 2003, 0.8.10 11 Dec 200516:13
jesse_Even that seems ages ago. :p16:18
VileTimes"Halla-aho" ... interesting name.16:18
VileTimesIs he an elected official?16:19
aonin the helsinki city council, yeah16:20
VileTimesI can't read his blog, so I'm not too sure what he's all about.16:21
VileTimesWe had a group of people here in Quebec who wanted to pass laws outlining exactly what Muslims can and cannot do (i.e., no stoning women, etc.)16:22
VileTimesThey were from a small town. They received a great deal of attention from the media.16:23
jesse_I suspect he is causing more than his fair share of heartburn to others because he is a supposedly educated person, a slavic linguist phd. This alone rubs many the wrong way because academics are supposed to be all for wishy washy multiculturalism and so forth.16:23
VileTimesI suspect that he's being an attention whore, much like the prom queens in Herouxville, QC.16:24
VileTimesLaws are already in place that stop folks from stoning one another (among other things).16:25
jesse_He strikes me as someone who is trying to portay himself as a martyr for free speech. Yes he is provocative, but that is goes with the territory of these so-called 'rights'.16:26
joacimI had a run-in with a linguist once. Now I avoid her like the plague16:27
jesse_Exactly. Canada is not a theocracy where Sharia flies as it pleases... at least not yet.16:27
aonVileTimes: it's not that much about what laws allow and what they don't, it's about who gets treated in accordance with those laws and who doesn't16:27
VileTimeserr... you mean stoning is ok in Helsinki? Maybe Hallo-aha has a point.16:28
joacimMy crystal ball didn't work and I tried to get her to explain her problem properly. she refused because she meant she had told me everything I needed to know16:28
VileTimesjoacim ... high-five, bro. :D16:28
aonVileTimes: no, of course it isn't16:29
jesse_joacim: how so? Did you receive a cryptic attempt in deciphering what the problem was? :D16:30
VileTimesWhen the Herouxville dolts started making noise about all of the Muslim immigrants, our Prime Minister reacted by saying "pffft .. who cares", and rightly so.16:30
joacim"my computer doesnt work"16:31
jesse_Love those problem descriptions \o/16:32
jesse_It don't work. Fix it. NOW.16:32
joacimshe never did what she was told either. she did something different and when things got worse she blamed it all on the people who tried to help16:34
VileTimesYou have just described the human condition, joacim.16:34
aoni guess european problems aren't american problems and vice versa, and that's how it preferably should stay, too :)16:34
joacimsorry about my grammar. cant make proper sentences if i dont use lots of profitany16:35
aonsounds a bit like my mother16:35
jesse_In the sense of following instructions or being somewhat handicapped in forming clean sentences? :D16:35
VileTimesCanada is quite different compared to the US, aon. Our "conservatives" make Obama look like Hitler. :)16:36
aonah, but canada, by some definition, is america :)16:36
aon(read: you don't have a PTR record and i'm too lazy to whois your IP)16:37
VileTimesThen why can't I get a job in the US without a lot of paperwork? :(16:37
aonjesse_: finished with the mil already?16:38
jesse_A combination of fear, greed and selfishness in no particular order, it happens in most countries. :p16:39
jesse_Yeah, I was discharged into the reserve in January.16:39
aonah, right16:40
aonyeah, but what did u do there? :)16:41
jesse_Tried to avoid getting selected for one their endless 'nakit'. :D16:42
aonhehe :D16:43
aonyeah, ViestiR seemed to have awfully lot of them16:44
VileTimesYou Fins are weird. Who doesn't like to be selected for endless nakit?16:44
aonluckily the sauna was almost always on so you could go hide there :p16:44
aonat least the female officer candidate didn't come and tell you to do stuff there16:44
aongood times16:44
jesse_VileTimes: 'nakit' refers to a special task which by definition is never pleasant.16:47
aon'nakit' means 'frankfurters' but that doesn't make any sense really16:48
aonanyway, i've had some pleasant such tasks16:48
aonlike demolishing old beds with a crowbar when others were rehearsing for the oath parade16:48
VileTimesSo you Fins are afraid of ze nakitness? Vy iz dis?16:49
jesse_While 'nakit' does indeed refer to a sausage, it's also slang for finger which is usually how they pick the unlucky idiots to do some busy work. :D16:50
aonah, i've never heard any etymology16:51
VileTimesPicking unlucky idiots to do some busy work with "the sausage" (or "the finger")? No wonder Hallo-aha hates Muslims. They'd never understand.16:53
jesse_aon: the idea hit me one day during one of those pesky outdoor field exercises.16:53
aonthere are also women in the army16:54
aonand you have to sleep with them in the same tent!116:54
aonvery unmuslimy16:55
jesse_One of the earlier exercises where we had to build the command post HQ, guard it then get one verbal scolding after another from the officers and staff nco's regarding how incompetent we were. :D16:55
jesse_Sausages are also verboten! Why you might ask? They contain pork. ;)16:56
jesse_That's another no no in Islam. :D16:56
aoni spent some time messing with the command-xa-202 too, since that's where we were located for most of the time in exercises after i left the nco school16:56
aon(we = my two-man comms repair group)16:56
aonannoying place, too many officers :p16:57
VileTimesOh, jesse_, not all sausages are the same.16:59
jesse_Some of the last exercises were not too bad because the only officers were our instructors and some of the lesser breed, ie engineering officers. :p16:59
jesse_VileTimes: I know. :p16:59
aonthey're pretty nice16:59
aoni've even eaten pizza that was paid for by a engineer senior lieutenant :)17:00
aonwell captain, nowadays17:00
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VileTimesThis is all very meaty, far too much for me to digest in one sitting. Can we have dessert now?17:02
jesse_aon: :D. Let's just say they tend to not give you heat about not behaving/looking soldier-like. :D17:04
aonviestir is also the home of probably the only long-haired captain17:05
aonnot an engineer tho iirc17:05
jesse_That's why they have one of those obsessive-compulsive vice company commanders to handle those superficial nuicances. ;)17:06
jesse_Case in point; we had yet another field exercise in Säkylä and he pops out sometime around 2-4 am and starts grilling the second guy guarding the HQ entrance.17:08
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jesse_Name your war-time hierarchy, mission and who leads each semi important section.17:09
aonah, right, that stuff17:09
aonwere you supposed to compete for something called "ritarinmalja" or such?17:10
aona major asked me that stuff once when we had such competition, i didn't know half of it because we had just been migrated to the staff co. from signals earlier17:11
jesse_Siirto did and they won, not entirely sure what happened with kaapeli, but the keskus guys did not even get a visit from them. :D17:11
aonactually I was the operative company leader at that point and didn't realize it at that moment :)17:11
aonsince the rest of them hadn't arrived yet17:11
aonand the signalman who was the other half of the group was vice-company-leader, of course :p17:12
jesse_I'm sure herra majuri was deeply impressed by that moment.17:12
aonapparently he had been shouting to the sgt who was with us about us not knowing anything and just sitting and having coffee and donuts at sotku17:13
aonwhich, indeed, might seem a bit peculiar in the middle of an exercise17:13
aonperhaps he'll fix his own sanlas if there's a war, then :)17:14
jesse_Yeah, it seems being in a sotku while on an exercise is not exactly the most effective nakkisuoja. :D17:15
aonit's strange that we're talking here instead of when half of the terms are finnish :)17:19
aonwell not like there's any more urgent traffic17:19
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NecrosporusCRUX is too minimalistic: diff: command not found17:42
aonyou don't have diffutils installed17:43
NecrosporusIt is from live CD17:43
aonyou're supposed to use it to install crux17:44
thrice`no need for diff on the install CD :>17:44
aonnot to do development work17:44
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jesse_It's an installation cd, not a live disk.17:46
aonwell it is "live", how would you install anything from a dead disk? :)17:47
jesse_True. :p17:48
NecrosporusOk, I made pkgadd `find /cdrom -name '*diff*'`17:49
Necrosporusaon, I need to verify backup before I install17:49
aonuse md5sum or something?17:49
Necrosporusmd5sum failes17:50
NecrosporusSo I need to find, where the diff17:50
NecrosporusI think, why don't you made CD like DragonFlyBSD: CD is image of filesystem with some additional files, so user will can install it by cp -au /cdrom/* /mnt/ and then removepkg cdimage17:56
NecrosporusOr make package before this17:57
thrice`personally, I like to spend the least amount of time possible in the live environment17:59
NecrosporusI going to install CRUX on partition currently containin mustdie ME. I installed it long time ago. I think, it should contain no useful files, but no sure, so I backup18:01
thrice`never hurts :)18:02
NecrosporusHave you ever tried Dragora?18:04
thrice`nope, never heard of it, either.  a linux distro, or some BSD?18:05
NecrosporusGNU/Linux, http://dragora.org18:06
tilmanlulz, spanish only? o_O18:07
aonwho needs english when it is "Recomendada por la Free Software Foundation."18:08
thrice`aha, finally got wicd working.  damned /usr/etc for dbus :>18:11
aontilman: you know c++, right?18:12
VileTimesTo think I was laughed out of here for not being able to get wicd to work.18:12
tilmanaon: somewhat18:13
aonare pure virtual functions like a child you never had to you?18:13
tilmanpure virtual = abstract18:13
aonbut still :)18:13
tilmandunno how to answer that18:14
aonmore specifically, how the hell does one override something like class Foo { virtual void foo(const Foo&)=0; }18:14
aonif your subclass is Foo118:14
tilmanrephrase without the metaphore please :P18:14
aonand you'd need to give that foo() a Foo1 instead of Foo18:14
aongiving it Foo seems outright dangerous and confusing18:15
tilmanyou said "Foo has a method foo that takes a Foo"18:15
tilmanso Foo1 needs to provide foo(Foo&)18:15
aonhmm, right18:16
tilmanadditionally, it might also provide foo(Foo1&), but that's another method18:16
aoni'm supposed to derive classes from a class with just an abstract operator==18:16
aonand that seems somewhat stupid18:16
aoni mean, the subclasses will have nothing in common anyway18:17
aonor if they do, at least not stuff coming from the superclass :)18:17
tilmanwhy? it means you can compareinstances of those subclasses nicely with ==18:18
aonso you think they just expect the real type to be checked inside that function?18:18
aonand comparisons made based on that18:19
aonk :)18:19
tilmandynamic_cast + null check18:19
tilmanc++ sucks18:19
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aoni said earlier today that i think that i prefer java18:20
aonand that is something, that18:20
tilmanbeing able to compile it to machine code sure is nice18:20
aonwell yeah18:20
aonbut i'm running a window manager made in CL atm, so ... :)18:21
aonare you sifuh?18:21
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matrix_hello rehabdoll18:23
matrix_va gör du18:26
Necrosporustilman, distro itself uses english interface too18:27
thrice`you just have trust that it's awesome and install it18:28
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NecrosporusAnd can you add /var/lib/pkg/db file to cd? I need to make it by itself if I need additional utils on cd environment is not enough18:29
Necrosporus* myself18:30
NecrosporusIs ext4 on 2.5 stable enought?18:32
thrice`ext4 is not available on 2.5's kernel18:33
NecrosporusI mean crux 2.518:33
thrice`me too18:33
thrice`ext4 became stable in 2.6.29.  the kernel provided on crux 2.5 is 2.6.2818:34
thrice`wait, 2.6.27 even :)18:34
teKI bet it will suffice for installation18:34
NecrosporusHeh, live environment able to make ext4, but not to mount18:37
thrice`you just need to download newer kernel sources18:37
NecrosporusWhat packages can I exclude from core? bin86 and lilo (I have GRUB already installed)18:38
aonwhy would you want to exclude bin86?18:40
NecrosporusHm, it's assemcler. So I won't exclude18:40
NecrosporusSo lilo only?18:41
aoni dunno if it's a good idea to exclude anything from core on your first install18:41
aonbut exim, iptables, nfs-utils, ppp, rdate, tcsh, any utils for filesystems you don't have18:42
aon^^^provided that you don't need those apps for some other purpose18:43
aonit's not like base is very huge even if you install everything18:44
NecrosporusI need bluetooth to use mobile phone as modem18:48
VileTimesI'm with thrice. If a goofball n00b like me who has never installed a source-based distro before can get this working, it has to be fabulous.19:00
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thrice`VileTimes: :)20:08
NecrosporusHow Can I save temporary state of menuconfig?20:10
thrice`sure, exit out, and then the .config will be updated if you save20:12
NecrosporusSo if I exit make menuconfig and run it again, all option I choosed will be preserved?20:25
aonit asks you whether to save or not20:25
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thrice`so long as you save, yes :)20:44
NecrosporusSo many options... I tired... Configured about half...20:45
aonwhat do you mean? it's only 04:4620:46
thrice`the good thing is, once you get a working config, you can re-use it over and over :)20:46
aonalthough probably 05:46 wherever you're at20:47
NecrosporusI know. But I configured it from one computer, seems I should reconfigure to laptop20:47
NecrosporusSun Apr 26 10:49:29 IRKST 200920:48
Necrosporus/exec -o LANG=C date20:48
aonah right20:48
aonirkutsk has it's own timezone? :)20:48
NecrosporusWhy not?20:49
NecrosporusI'm not in Irkutsk, bu almost close20:50
aonah, apparently all the russian timezones are named after some city20:50
NecrosporusI think, when I compile kernel for crux I'll able to use it with Slackware20:51
aonno reason why not20:52
thrice`once you move to crux, there is no reason to use slackware anymore, however ;)20:52
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NecrosporusI Slackware is more reliable, because it made by Saint Patrick :P21:38
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nipuLgoogle code now supports mercurial23:50

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