IRC Logs for #crux Thursday, 2011-11-17

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Romstergood evening.01:57
Romstermorning pitillo :)01:57
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pitillohey Romster, good morning :)02:34
horrorStruckafternoon guys02:35
Romstermorning or afternoon horrorStruck?02:36
crshdafternoon...02:40
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Romsteryo crshd every time i see your nick i think of crashed.02:53
crshdthat's intended02:53
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Romsterthen i think of windows :D03:00
Romsterand work....03:01
Romsterand strangling all the idiot customers that never learn.03:01
frinnstwindows is turning my hair grey03:02
frinnstsbs 2011....03:02
Romsteri haven't touched that yet03:06
frinnsti envy you03:06
frinnstits fucking retarded.. everything is hidden behind guides03:07
frinnstand the suck03:07
frinnstthey03:07
Romsteri'm not looking forwared to windows 803:07
crshdme too, because it's going to make me like linux even more :D03:09
Romsteri have to help the customers navigate....03:09
Romsterwhen that's out.03:09
crshdoh, wait - you said *not*. misread that...03:10
Romsteryeah reverse of03:11
horrorStruckRomster: utc+7, not too far from you03:13
crshd+8 here...03:13
crshdalmost time to go home... just 2 more hours to kill03:14
horrorStruckyou finish late03:14
horrorStruckwhere are you?03:14
Romsterah i'm on +11 now with DST03:15
crshdMY03:15
Romsteraustralia mate03:15
Romsteroh oyu talking about crashed03:16
Romsteryour*03:16
horrorStruckyou're03:16
horrorStruckhehe03:16
horrorStruckwe're the lower east side crew03:16
* Romster glares at horrorStruck 03:16
* horrorStruck checks defnition of glare and definition has even more unknown words.03:19
horrorStruckwhen is the last time you used squinted03:20
crshdnever03:20
Romsternever03:20
horrorStruckhehe03:20
Romsterglare evil look03:20
horrorStruckcan't beat a good ol' smiley03:20
Romsternope03:23
horrorStruckRomster: you're using gcc 4.6.x aren't you?03:25
Romsteryes03:31
Romsterbut a older glibc than crux's03:31
Romsterbeen meaning to redo my toolchain but i'll wait for glibc to become stable i might bump upto glib 2.13 though.03:32
horrorStruckdid you have a lot of issues?03:32
horrorStruck(with 4.6?)03:32
Romstera bunch of ports failed due to more errors but those can be turned off with -wno- and -fno-03:34
Romstera couple of ports wont compile with gcc 4.6.1 jsut have a gcc 4.5.3 port to use CC=gcc45 on those03:35
horrorStruckhmm ok. thanks a lot03:35
Romster4.6.1 is jsut a bit more strict about coding.03:35
horrorStrucki'm playing with gold and -flto and i guess they're more mature in 4.6, i'll try.03:37
Romsteri haven't touched gold yet.03:37
horrorStruckgot it enabled in 4.5.3 and i use it by default, just for fun actually.03:38
Romsterany brackage?03:38
Romstererr breakage03:39
horrorStrucknot really until now but -flto is full of wreck03:39
horrorStruckgold alone is ok03:39
horrorStrucki'm using latest binutils FWIW03:42
niklaswedoes crux has openafs as a package ? or most I build one?03:46
horrorStruckniklaswe: you can search for ports on this page http://crux.nu/portdb/03:49
horrorStruckupper right corner03:50
niklaswehorrorStruck: oh thanks, I didn't see that..03:51
horrorStrucknp03:51
niklaswehmm and the answer on my question is that i must build a package for openafs :P03:51
horrorStruckhehe03:52
horrorStruckluckily packaging in crux is a real pleasure03:52
niklaswethe first thing is to install crux and after that build the packages :P03:52
niklaswewas 6 years ago i used crux :)03:52
niklaswebut I lilke "the ports" and packages management.03:53
horrorStruckcan't agree more03:53
horrorStruck(ont sure if that's proper english, anyway)03:53
niklasweit like freebsd/openbsd package management :)03:53
horrorStruckmade simple03:54
niklaswehehe :) but i know what you mean so :)03:54
crshdcrux ports > bsd ports03:54
niklasweyeah :)03:55
niklasweI stupid question.. how should you do with this..03:55
niklasweI have 2 disks.. (2TB x 2)  should you use raid1 and use lvm over the raid or.. just use raid1 ?03:56
prologicyou can do whatever you like03:56
niklasweI cant decide how i want it03:56
prologiclvm is just a logical volume allowing you to expand your volumes over any number of disks or raids03:56
prologiclvm over raid1 sounds okay to me03:56
prologicthen say you put a 3rd TB disk in later03:57
prologicjust add that to your lvm03:57
prologicbut of course it won't be part of your raid1 set03:57
Romster-flto is very buggy still03:58
Romsterhttps://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-lvm2/04:00
Romsterhttp://docs.redhat.com/docs/en-US/Red_Hat_Enterprise_Linux/6/html/Logical_Volume_Manager_Administration/index.html04:00
Romsterhighly recommend you read over those niklaswe04:01
niklasweRomster: Im using lvm right now and I know how it´s works. but is more.. must I have it.. more like that :P04:02
niklasweor  does i need it..04:02
Romsterwell that depends if you want the benefits of lvm04:02
Romster"or do i need it"04:02
niklasweyeah  thats the question.. do i really need it :P04:03
Romsterwell you can make multiple logical volumes you can resize them, you can make snapshots do stuff in a snapshot discard or merge it back into origin LV.04:03
Romsteryou can pvmove on a live system onto a new disk with zero downtime.04:03
Romsteryou can grow to as many disks as you can throw in the system.04:04
Romsterif none of that takes your fancy you don't need lvm.04:04
niklasweI can only have 2 disks in the system04:04
Romsteris that all..04:04
niklasweyeah ( thats why I have 2TB x 2).04:04
Romsteryou can't grow it later with a addon card?04:05
niklaswenope :/04:05
Romsteror even migrate the disks to a new machine then add more.04:05
horrorStruckRomster: suprisingly, opensuse released yesterday is supposed to have been built with -flto (what they say), dont know how they did that04:05
Romsteror even use iscsi and add more disks from another pc.04:05
RomsterhorrorStruck, hmm with lots of patches i'd imagine.04:06
horrorStruckyep04:06
Romsterfedora seems to be the bleeding edge testing distro.04:06
Romsterthat filters the patches back to upstream04:06
Romsterwhile ubunto gets the boobs.... noobs04:08
Romsteror those too lazy to run a real distro.04:08
horrorStruckdifficult to use anything else than lfs after crux i guess04:09
crshdyeah, fedora is always pretty up-to-date - i ran it back in 2008, because it was the first to adobt the 2.6.27 kernel, which i needed for my wifi card04:10
crshdthat was before i started building my own kernels :D04:10
Romsterthen curse that it wont bot :D04:11
Romsterboot*04:11
horrorStruckthis is the best entry test for crux04:12
horrorStruckeven it should be pretty east with localmodconfig nowadays04:12
Romsteryeah it filters the would be crux users from the too dumb or lazy to learn.04:12
crshdyeah, it's nice - keeps the noobs away :D04:13
Romsterfunnily enough i've never used that localmodconfig04:13
horrorStrucknever tried either04:13
Romsterwell crux is for experienced users04:13
Romsterprologic, helped me get acquainted with linux more before that i really was stuck into ms-dos more so than windows.04:14
Romsterdid compile and run a few things on servers though but not serious desktop use.04:14
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rauz_hi04:37
Romsterlo04:41
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ThePubgood morning folks04:54
crshdg'evening04:59
ThePubsuppose there's that point of view too :)05:04
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niklasweare ppl using lilo or grub in here?05:45
teK_lilo.05:46
teK_but it's a matter of taste05:47
aonyeah, lilo as well05:53
niklaswebut does lilo has lvm-support on /06:02
niklaswehow have you setup your local ports ? do you build your own packages in /usr/ports/local or something like that?06:18
horrorStruckusing syslinux here, actively developed, simple configuration and modular, i love it. it can only boot ext* and btrfs however IIRC06:22
horrorStruckniklaswe: i have followed this layout the first time i installed crux http://crux.nu/Wiki/PostInstallationNotes it's nice to work with and you have the extra security to build ports as a user. i do that for any crux machine now.06:27
horrorStruckah local ports, sorry i misread06:28
horrorStrucki just have ports/{local,scm} dirs in my home dir, nothing special... you can tell prt-get to use any directory as a repo anyway06:30
niklaswe ah, I dont have prt-get installed06:35
niklaswe<--- building openafs packages :) will see if it works later..06:36
niklasweits not for work :P but Im in moment 22 :P06:36
niklaswestupid question again.. if I will add kerberos as depenices in Pkgfile is it dependecies="path/to/kerberos.tar.gz ? does someone has a good manual? :D06:52
frinnstno, its the port $name variable06:55
frinnst# Depends on:  zlib libmpc06:56
frinnst(from core/gcc)06:56
frinnstlooking at existing Pkgfiles is probably your best bet in figuring out how they work06:57
frinnstits pretty self-explanatory06:57
horrorStruckhttp://crux.nu/Main/Handbook2-7#ntoc26 is agood start too06:57
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niklaswefrinnst: hmm true..08:09
niklaswehow can i see in which packages su command is in08:09
niklasweis it in coreutils?08:09
frinnstprt-get fsearch su08:10
niklaswefrinnst: ty08:13
frinnstinga problem08:13
niklasweI trying to build heimdal.. but the system was fucked up ^^08:13
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Romsteri was about to push bost then found a bug https://svn.boost.org/trac/boost/ticket/6131 and loonycyborg was kind enough to do a testcase and report it. so i'll have to hold off on the boost bump until that's solved.08:23
Romsterbost/boost08:25
niklaswecan someone tell me why heimdal will overwrite su command http://pastebin.com/xTuHPV7G08:43
Romsterniklaswe,  you must have a /usr/bin/su in that port too but why?08:46
Romsterthis is why you check the footprint08:46
rmullniklaswe: According to their website: The login and su programs installed by Heimdal link against Heimdal libraries as well as crypto and db libraries. We move these libraries to /lib to be FHS compliant and in case when /usr is located on a separate partition which may not always be mounted.08:47
rmullhttp://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/view/5.1/postlfs/heimdal.html08:47
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niklasweto get raid1 and lvm to work must i only complie it the drivers in the kernel.. and also add mdadm and lvm to services? right?09:50
frinnstlvm is autostarted on boot if installed10:00
frinnstthe udev-rules for mdadm should be enough to start simple setups10:00
joe9niklaswe: i do not have mdadm started. I have it compiled into the kernel10:01
niklaswejoe9: okey, so if I complie raid1 inot kernel then i dont need mdadm? :)10:01
frinnstyeah, you should not keep them as modules or there may be race-issues on bootup10:01
frinnstyes you do10:01
frinnstbut it will autostart10:01
frinnstyou dont need to change anything (probably)10:02
joe9frinnst: I do not have mdadm service started and everything seems to be working fine.10:02
frinnstyou do, actually :)10:02
frinnstit starts and tells the kernel what to do10:02
frinnstbut theres no daemon10:02
joe9i am not using lvm, btw.10:02
frinnstcheck out the mdadm.rule in /lib/udev/rules.d/10:03
joe9oh, ok. that makes sense. I do not see anything in ps.10:03
frinnstnah, mdadm doesnt run as a daemon10:03
joe9my .config of linux kernel: http://codepad.org/E61XeBlC, niklaswe, if that helps.10:03
frinnstbut adding something like "mdadm --monitor --daemonise --mail=root@obra.se --delay=1800 /dev/md0" to rc.local might be a good idea10:04
niklasweI have only use debian to setup lvm and raid1.. and thats not good.. because it doing everyting to you10:04
joe9niklaswe: i used to debian before too.10:04
joe9and other than the kernel option, I did not do much different.10:04
joe9the raid1 stuff seemed to be the same.10:05
joe9s/used to debian/used to use debian/10:05
joe9frinnst: why is it a good ideat to have the mdadm --monitor service?10:06
joe9let me google that.10:06
niklaswethe problem i had problem to find my / when i try mdadm + lvm before :P10:06
niklasweand then i had raid1 and lvm complie into the kernel..10:07
niklaswemaybe i missed something.10:07
joe9with raid-1 only, I think that is enough. do not about the lvm stuff, though.10:08
niklaswewill do backup so :)10:08
joe9mdadm --monitor --daemonise --syslog --scan --delay=1800 /dev/md0 /dev/md210:16
joe9frinnst, thanks for your help. I am adding this command  to /etc/rc.local10:16
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niklasweoh this will take along time to move 230gb to my external disc10:42
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niklaswemm will be intressting to see if it will boot up now or not :P12:38
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niklaswesomeone here? :13:20
rmullProbably13:26
niklaswe.) yay13:29
niklaswermull:  what are you doing?13:29
joe9niklaswe: what happened, did it work?13:29
niklaswejoe9:  not done yet. have just complie kernel13:31
niklaswemust read how lilo should be configure with raid13:31
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joe9i have a debian install lying around, just in case crux did not work out for me. that is keeping me from using a 2 disk raid-1 array. i am still undecided when I should wipe  that out and make it a 2-disk raid-1 crux array.13:33
joe9i currently have 2 degraded raid-1 arrays, one with debian and another with crux13:33
joe9the debian is from my pre-crux days.13:33
joe9any thoughts/experiences, on when I should forget the training wheels (debian disk) and move onto crux.13:34
joe9I have been on crux for more than a month atleast and am happy with the way things are.13:34
joe9haven't booted into debian during my time on crux.13:35
niklaswehmm lets see if it will boot now then.. the  problem i have is that i cant find rootfs13:35
niklasweI used crux around 2002 -200313:35
linXeahi niklaswe o/ seen you around on ULUG, correct ?13:39
niklaswelinXea: yeah thats correct13:40
linXeanice seeing another CRUX fan from  my part of Sweden13:41
niklaswe=)13:41
niklaswehmm mdadm.conf should be store in /etc13:41
rmullniklaswe: Not doing much, just at work13:42
niklasweoh13:42
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niklaswelinXea:  har du kört lilo med raid1 och lvm?13:47
niklaswesom root13:47
linXeahm, ja.. på slackware 12.1 för länge sedan13:49
linXeakommer ihåg en del om du behöver fråga något13:49
niklaswemaybe we should taking private13:50
linXeaup to you, personally I don't see the problem keeping it here in this channel, but it's up to you13:50
niklasweure we can take it hre.13:51
niklaswehere*13:51
niklaswein my lilo.conf i have this  boot=/dev/md0 raid-extra-boot="/dev/sda,/dev/sdb" root=/dev/vg0/root13:52
niklaswewhat has i forgott?13:52
joe9my lilo.conf: http://codepad.org/R8XueVME13:52
linXeanever used anything like that niklaswe ... seem overkill imo13:53
niklaswejoe9 will check :)13:53
joe9did you do this: lilo -H && lilo -M /dev/sda ?13:53
linXeahttp://frugalware.org/paste/12022 this is what I used..13:53
niklaswejoe9: hmm no i  forgot that.13:55
joe9I need to upgrade to grub at some point.13:56
joe9good to know that there are still some folks on lilo.13:56
niklaswethe problem is that i fortgot mdadm -D --scan >> /mnt/etc/mdadm.conf :(13:57
niklaswehow did i "rescan after already create md13:57
joe9i think linux autodetects that, doesn't it?13:57
linXeamdadm -Es > /etc/mdadm.conf && mdadm -As13:57
linXeachange to whatever you use in your chroot'ed environment of course.13:58
joe9Warning: Partial RAID-1 install on active disks only; booting is not failsafe13:58
joe9Warning: Faulty disk in RAID-1 array; boot with caution!!13:58
niklasweyeah but i must mount up raid, and lvm first13:58
joe9do you see those errors with lilo?13:58
niklaswenope13:59
niklaswejoe9 the problem is that i cant find rootfs...14:04
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niklaswethis is the error messages i got.. : EXT2-fs (md_d0): error: unable to read superblock FAT: unable to read boot sector Kernel panic - not syncing: VFS: unable to mount root fs on unknown-block(254,)14:11
joe9lilo version?14:12
joe9LILO version 23.2 (released 09-Apr-2011)14:13
joe9is what I have.14:13
niklaswedefault with crux installation14:13
joe9what is the kernel version?14:13
joe9i am on 3.1.1 and it worked on 3.0.4 too.14:13
niklasweI dont have any internet connection sso i will fix new kernel later.14:14
niklaswebut thats not the problem i thinks..14:14
joe9the kernel raid-1 stuff did not work properly in the earlier versions, imho.14:15
joe9I think jaeger might have some thoughts on that.14:15
joe9what kernel version are you on?14:16
niklaswerigth now 2.6.3514:16
joe9and, do you know if the kernel raid autodetect stuff works in that kernel?14:17
niklaswenot for sure..14:18
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joe9wanna try this? append = "root=/dev/md0"14:25
joe9don't bother14:25
joe9it seems to be able to see that root is on md_d014:26
niklaswehmm will try now14:35
niklaswe....14:49
joe9not successfull?14:55
niklaswenope14:56
niklasweI will try installed grub instead.14:56
joe9i think it is your kernel rather than lilo.14:58
joe9jaeger is good at this. check with him, btw.14:58
niklaswehmm m maybe  i would try to download 3.0 then14:58
niklaswesweet 11.2M/s =) i love fiber15:03
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linXeaniklaswe: http://bit.ly/t5wcoS this might help you ? .. I know I looked for answers here when I last did set it up..15:44
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niklaswehmm soon i will give up..16:11
joe9no luck with the kernel either?16:11
niklaswenpe, the problem is that i missing something in the configuration16:12
niklasweits very annonying16:12
joe9and, you have don lilo -H and lilo -M /dev/sdX, correct. and the lilo.conf is similar to mine.16:13
joe9s/don/done/16:13
joe9what else could it be? metadata?16:14
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joe9what metadata version?16:14
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niklaswe0.9016:14
niklaswebut it has problem to find the root partition (lvm)16:15
joe9mdadm --detail -- can you show that?16:15
joe9can you try without lvm? just to make sure that the raid-1 stuff is ok?16:16
joe9why don't you hang around till jaeger is online, before giving up?16:18
niklaswemust go to bed soon :) thats why16:18
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niklaswehum hum16:26
frinnsthttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XF7b_MNEIAg16:27
frinnstfuture supervillain16:27
niklaswefrinnst: do you know what I must have in lilo.conf so it find my lvm root?16:28
frinnstno clue, i dont run my raid5 as a root-fs16:28
frinnsttoo much headache16:28
niklaswehmm..16:29
frinnstyou run a initrd?16:30
niklaswenope I have complie lvm,raid into the kernel16:32
frinnstim pretty sure that wont work16:33
niklaswei wondering if i should skip raid :P16:34
jseIt makes more sense to manage mass storage with lvm rather than having the system boot from it.16:34
frinnstfor your root-fs, probably16:34
niklasweor maybe have boot and / on raid and rest on lvm (storage)16:37
frinnstyou will need initrd for a raid or lvm root-fs16:41
frinnsthttp://en.gentoo-wiki.com/wiki/Root_filesystem_over_LVM2,_DM-Crypt_and_RAID16:42
joe9frinnst: i do not use initrd for a raid-116:46
joe9root-fs16:46
joe9with lilo and 0.90 metadata16:46
frinnstits required for 1.216:47
joe9yes, it is.16:47
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jaegerI don't know if it's been mentioned already but in addition to 0.90 metadata you need the partition type set to fd for auto-assemble at boot18:06
linXearunning raid on systemdisc is overkill imo. Usually not necessary either.18:07
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Romsternot really raid1 makes sense for root for HA.19:27
Romsterand swap else if swap disapears while it's being used system can crash.19:28
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RomsterWhile trying to retrieve the URL: http://crux.org.pl/19:42
RomsterThe following error was encountered:19:42
RomsterConnection to 94.23.0.106 Failed19:42
RomsterThe system returned:19:42
Romster(111) Connection refused19:42
Romsterpitillo, ^19:42
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