IRC Logs for #crux Tuesday, 2012-09-18

LukcIs imake usable only for Xorg?00:21
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tilmanRotwang: oh, you want to have it create new symlinks00:39
Rotwangyes00:39
tilmantar should work %)00:39
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niklaswehas someone try out sensu monitoring??02:37
frinnstnope02:40
frinnstare you just shopping around, or have you tried it?02:41
niklaswefrinnst: just shopping around.02:51
frinnsthttp://linuxplumbers.ubicast.tv/videos/systemd-for-the-user-session/02:54
frinnst;D02:54
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sepenhi05:17
Romsterhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=US&v=87E6N7ToCxs05:29
Romsterhi05:29
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cruxbot[opt.git/2.7]: whois: update to 5.0.1906:13
cruxbot[opt.git/2.7]: vsftpd: update to 3.0.206:13
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Romsterrandomly find this http://tinypic.com/usermedia.php?uo=xDroBU9Q%2BPQg5lY6XWwrC4h4l5k2TGxc08:18
frinnstheh, I wonder who took it08:29
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LukcIs there a specific rule saying the Pkgfiles must be read only by bash? ’Cause some of them are posing problem when parsed with zsh.08:36
jaegerI'm not a zsh user so I can't really say with authority that it could replace bash for pkgmk purposes but pkgmk is a bash script09:00
jaegerso it expects bash syntax09:00
Romsterhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANdt8LuPaEg&feature=related09:11
Romster/usr/bin/pkgmk should invoke bash09:12
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Romster#!/bin/bash for it's shebang line09:12
Romsteryou can have your shell in zsh and pkgmk will call bash when used.09:13
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Lukc:/09:17
Lukcjaeger, would a request to make the Pkgfiles also parsable by zsh be considered seriously?09:18
LukcIn the bash Pkgfile, you just need to write :1:3 instead of ::3 to make the file compatible with both shells…09:18
jaegerI honestly couldn't say. I guess it depends on how much work would be required. Personally I've never used zsh so it doesn't have much value for me... but others might want that, don't know09:19
LukcIt doesn’t require much work.09:19
jaegerYou could always suggest it on the mailing list09:19
LukcOk… :/09:21
jaegeraside from the ::3 syntax there are some ports that use something like ${version%.*} as well09:22
LukcWhich is no problem. :)09:22
LukcThe exact same syntax is used in zsh.09:22
jaegerok09:22
jaegerOut of curiosity, why the need for zsh parsing? Are you editing pkgmk to use zsh instead or have you symlinked bash to zsh?09:23
LukcAnd the ::3 problem is present only in bash’ and readline’s Pkgfiles.09:23
jaeger(or something entirely different?)09:23
LukcSomething entirely different. :p09:23
LukcI am trying to modify pacmoon to make it work on a barely modified Crux.09:24
LukcAnd I’d prefer stick to zsh to use pkg++ instead of pkgmk in the future.09:24
RomsterLukc, i don't know if that's really possible even if oyu do you still need bash for automake09:24
Romsterpacman or pacmoon09:25
Lukcpacmoon09:25
Romsterthe later i have no idea about.09:25
Romsterurl what is it?09:25
Romsterpkg++ ?09:26
LukcIt is a emerge-like tool made for Arch Linux, designed to use AUR.09:26
Lukcpkg++ is my modified version of pkgmk (pkgxx.org)09:26
Romsterwhat advantages does it have over our current pkgutils?09:26
LukcWhat? pkg++ or pacmoon?09:26
Lukc(https://github.com/nuisanceofcats/pacmoon)09:27
Romsterso your trying to use pkg++ or pacmoon *confused*09:27
LukcBoth. \o/09:27
LukcI know, it’s crazy.09:27
jaegerWhy use it on crux? Just for grins?09:27
Romsteri have a pure bash version of pkguutils made by han floating around here somewhere.09:27
jaegerNot trying to discourage you, just curious why the effort09:28
Romsteri'm curious what your trying to achieve.09:28
Romsterbecuase i often hack on stuff and try different things.09:28
Lukcjaeger, pkg++ is made to work on several distributions, but I currently have no tool capable of handling dependencies and stuff like that, and that’s why I’m modifying pacmoon.09:29
LukcAnd if I’m trying to use it on Crux is because I use Crux too. ^_^”09:29
Romsterah your trying to use pacmoon to replace prt-get09:29
LukcMore or less, yes.09:30
Romsterhttp://homepage.boetes.org/software/crux/han/pkgutils/ looked though this?09:30
Romstermight give you some leverage.09:31
LukcI don’t remember having seen it, no. Thanks.09:31
Romsterhttp://homepage.boetes.org/software/crux/han/prt-get/09:31
Romsterhe is a big fan of bsd and zsh iirc and debashed it.09:32
Romsterin shell09:32
Romsterhmm does not look like he rewrote prt-get in shell though09:32
LukcNope.09:33
Romsterbummer09:33
LukcBut it seems he managed to get full zsh+bash compatibility in his pkgmk, at least.09:33
Romsteroh we do have elenia or something too jaeger09:33
Romsteror is that long dead. i've never tried that.09:33
Romsterhe has yes.09:34
jaegerdon't look at me, heh, I've never touched ilenia09:34
jaegerit was one of the cruxppc tools09:34
Romsterah09:34
LukcAnyway, about the zsh stuff, only three Pkgfiles are posing problem, and two of them just need a s/::3/:1:3/.09:35
Romsterwhich ports are those?09:36
Romstercontact the Maintainer perhaps they may change it to be compatible.09:36
LukcRomster, bash and readline.09:36
LukcOk.09:36
Romsterok that be jaeger sicne he is a core dev.09:36
Lukc:p09:37
Romsterthough i think jue has the final say on what goes.09:37
LukcIt’s a one-character modification that doesn’t change anything. :o09:37
Romsterif it's trivial and wont break our stuff i don't think jue would disagree.09:37
Romsterso ask jue :)09:37
LukcOops, maybe not.09:38
jaegerI don't have any objection to it, for what that's worth09:38
RomsterLukc, be sure you test and make sure you are correct though and that you haven't missed anything.09:38
Romsteri know all my stuff has bashisms.09:39
Romsterbut since we use bash i haven't been worried.09:39
LukcRomster, I just did that and it’s :0:3 instead of :1:3. :’°09:39
LukcBut except from that, it worked on both bash and zsh. /o\09:39
Romsteroh so it can't handle blank ::09:40
s44Hi. I have a question: is in linux a virtual device for lan card? Something like /dev/eth?09:40
LukcYep.09:40
Romstername-${version::3}09:40
s44I'm looking for it in google, but i can't find anythinig about.09:40
LukcThe other problem is with sqlite3 and a printf in the Pkgfile, but I have no idea what could be done about it. :/09:42
Romsteri usually use name-${version%.*}09:42
Romsteralthough that would break if you only had 2 dots instead of 3.09:42
LukcYep. :/09:43
* Romster looks up zsh variables09:45
jaegers44: ethernet devices don't get entries in /dev, so not really09:45
jaegers/ethernet/network/, I should say09:45
s44But other things have virtual devices; why lan cards no?09:46
s44And how can i list my lan cards? (instead ifconfig)09:46
s44Is there a place in linux where can i find information about my net devices?09:46
Romsters44, ls /sys/class/net/09:47
Romsterdon't use ifconfig09:47
Romsterhttp://jengelh.medozas.de/2008/0219-ifconfig-sucks.php09:47
s44Romster: thx :-)09:48
LukcIs /sys/class/net portable? I mean, on non-linux systems?09:48
Romsterno problem.09:48
Romsternot sure. it's exported as part of the kernel.09:48
jaegers44: that's just how the kernel works (as far as the lack of device files goes)09:48
Romster"ip addr" replaces ifconfig09:49
Romstermight be safer to parse that, not sure.09:49
LukcOk.09:49
Romsterhmm why is it hard to find ksh stuff.09:51
Romstererr zsh i mean09:51
Romsterhttp://unix-linux.itags.org/q_unix-linux-programming_100151.html ah here we go09:52
LukcRomster, man zshall is very complete.09:53
LukcAnd man zsh-lovers too.09:53
Romsterif i want to install it.09:53
Lukcman pages are usually available on-line. :/09:53
Romstertrue09:53
Romsterbut i'm looking for the zsh equivalent to this http://www.tldp.org/LDP/abs/html/refcards.html09:54
Romsterhttp://www.bash2zsh.com/zsh_refcard/refcard.pdf ah this might be helpful09:56
LukcRomster, the stuff I know on your page, I use it on zsh. :D09:58
Romsterhonestly finding stuff in zsh even with all them links on https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Zsh#See_also is still effort. be easier to just install zsh and test myself.10:02
LukcIt’s also better to install zsh.10:02
LukcIMHO. O:)10:02
Lukcs/also/always/10:02
Romstermeh not if it takes me years to get used tonot using bashisms. if i did make it my shell.10:03
Romsternot to mention all the wongdoers that use !/bin/sh when they should be using !/bin/bash10:03
LukcInstalling it is not using it, you know…10:03
Romster#!/bin/bash10:03
Romstertrue10:03
LukcYou should not use #!/bin/bash but #!/usr/bin/env bash, btw.10:04
Lukc’Cause bash isn’t always in /bin.10:04
Romsterthat's only if you don't know where bash is gonna be.10:04
Romsterit's always in /bin/ on crux10:04
LukcYep.10:04
Romstereek zsh does not like my bash prompt10:05
Romster\n\[\033[1;34m\]\u\[\033[0m\]@\[\033[1;31m\]\h\[\033[0m\]\n\[\033[0;32m\]\d \t\[\033[0m\]\n\[\033[1;37m\]\w\[\033[0m\]\n\$10:05
Romsteranyways not worried about that10:05
LukcIt seems.10:06
Romsterecho ${version::3}10:06
Romsterzsh: closing brace expected10:06
Romsterthere is closing brace there }10:06
LukcIt is expected before the first :, I guess.10:06
LukcBut s/::3/:0:3/ will solve the issue.10:07
Romsterhmm10:07
Romsterwhat the hell delete key jsut jumps right one spot like pressing right cursor...10:08
LukcDo you want a descent zshrc ?10:08
Romsteri see it does not understand :: as being :0: you'd think they could support that.10:09
LukcYes, but they don’t.10:09
Romsterjaeger, mind editing them two core ports to have ${version:0:3} on bash and readline10:09
jaegerI'd like to see if jue has any objection first but if he doesn't it's fine with me10:10
LukcOk.10:10
Romsterwont break bash so i don't think it'l be a big issue, but yeah wait for jue10:10
RomsterLukc, yeah a zshrc would be nice to get me started.10:10
frinnstzsh, eeew10:10
frinnst:)10:10
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Romsterif i do plan to play with zsh some more.10:10
LukcOk, try http://lukc.upyum.com/zshrc10:12
Romsteryou should also try changing the mime type of unknown files to plan/text10:13
Romstergot the file but it's not binary as the web server thinks and having it as plain/text means people can view it in the browser too.10:13
Romsterone of my pet hates on web browsers.10:14
LukcRomster, I’m not the admin of the web server, but I’ll transmit the message.10:14
Romstercool10:14
Romsterthanks for that file i'll read though it before i use it, i'll probably change a few things first.10:15
Romsteroh custom ls colours cool been meaning to try those.10:16
Romster-jtrucks/Wallops- "Ninety percent of everything is crap."10:16
Romsterwhat is the point of that wall message...10:16
RomsterLukc, btw i think with that patch han uses on prt-get it'll also work in zsh10:17
Romsteror was that only bsd that hasn't got . for source to execute a file.10:18
LukcRomster, I don’t use pkgmk or prt-get, and don’t plan to, so it doesn’t interest me as much. :p10:20
Romsteryour missing grep colouring10:21
Romsterunless that's in your /etc/profile10:21
Romsterexport GREP_OPTIONS='--color=auto'10:22
Romsteralias grep='grep $GREP_OPTIONS'10:22
LukcRight.10:23
LukcI always forget to put it in the damn file.10:23
Romsterhehe10:24
Lukc(also, I usually prefer --color=always)10:24
Romsterwell i'd be keen what you come up with.10:24
Romsterhmm what's the difference?10:24
LukcWith pacmoon?10:24
LukcRomster, auto does not color when piped.10:24
LukcAnd I often pipe in less. /o\10:24
Romsteryeah pacmoon and your pkg++ where is that url for pkg++10:24
Romsterah10:24
Lukchttp://pkgxx.org10:25
Romsterrewrite of pkgutils as such?10:25
LukcNope. Only a fork of pkgmk. :p10:26
LukcBut it builds debs, rpms, or others depending on the distro you’re on.10:26
Romsteralso on another note nogagplz used pkgutiuls on a arch system to install some stuff that arch was either lacking or did horribly wrong.10:26
LukcAlso, it works best with a slightly modified format of Pkgfiles, because I was too lazy to parse the comments…10:26
LukcAhah. :D10:27
RomsterLukc, oh neat i was wrondering if there was such a generic tool that understood more than one package format.10:27
LukcWell, there are more, but none did as well. :p10:27
Romstermodular? does it also handle ebuilds those would be a pain to handle.10:27
LukcTo use them as recipes or to produce them?10:28
LukcIn any case, no. It was too complex compared to Pkgfiles.10:28
Romsterto use there recipes to produce the binary files.10:28
LukcNope.10:28
Romstermodular to accept other formats in future?10:29
LukcYes.10:29
Romstergood i may look into that project.10:29
Lukc:)10:29
Romsteri have some other ideas floating around to try out on another test system10:30
Romsteryou on freenode much?10:30
Romsterwhat channel?10:30
LukcNope, I’m only on XMPP.10:31
LukcCurrently.10:31
Romsterah oh well i can probably email you off the site or something.10:32
Romsterif i need to talk to you in future.10:32
Romsterwhy would i want to disable wallop messages when i turned them on to know more insight on server upgrades and such not for opers to abuse wallops...10:33
Romsterjtrucks... oh dear... guess he likes to send random messages now.10:34
LukcYes, you can. My mail’s on it.10:34
Romsterk10:35
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cruxbot[contrib.git/2.7]: clamav: updated to version 0.97.610:57
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juegenerally no objections, but I don't get it why it is a problem for some/few people that pkgmk is a bash script ;)11:12
LukcBecause we don’t like bash. O:)11:13
juesorry, but that's not a valid reason11:13
jueinstalling bash is a overhead of around 700k, so it's really nothing compared to the other stuff you've to install11:15
Lukcjue, I disagree. Installing zsh without its modules or libraries is 50k lighter. \o/11:17
LukcBut, I think the license is a more important reason.11:17
LukcAnd the fact zsh is cooler, and having two shells is useless.11:17
jueLukc: well, that discussion is pointless11:18
LukcYes.11:18
Lukcjue, but anyway, how is it a problem to make Pkgfiles usable with both bash and zsh?11:19
jueas I said above, I've not objections to modify the affected ports11:21
LukcOk. :)11:22
Romsteryeah i too don't see why it's nt run by bash unless autotools and everything else does not break when ran by zsh too?11:25
Romsterwhich is highly unlikely as gnu requires bash last i looked.11:25
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nogagplzRomster, I since changed that to some hideous pkgbuilds though, when in rome... :P13:34
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jaegerguessing pkg++ uses zsh instead of bash, hence the issue13:35
Lukcpkg++ uses zsh because I chose so, therefor it’s not really the issue.13:37
jaeger11:25 < Romster> yeah i too don't see why it's nt run by bash unless autotools and everything else does not break when ran by zsh too?13:40
jaegerwas answering that13:40
LukcOk, sorry.13:41
jaegerLukc: any advantage to the :0:3 syntax vs. the %.* syntax?13:59
jaegerI guess if you run into a version from which you need to cut more than one dot13:59
LukcYes, that.13:59
LukcI don’t see anything else, right now.14:00
jaegeryou can expand the latter to %.*.* so both ways work, I guess, one's more characters14:00
Lukc:0:3 seems more stable to me when the versions change.14:04
jaegeryay, SMART data is actually warning a user that the drive is failing for once14:09
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kruehttp://code.dogmap.org/lintsh/ may be helpful14:18
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Lukckrue, the point of the article seems to be mainly to comply with /bin/sh.14:38
LukcWhich is neither what we want or what we can do with minimal changes to the Pkgfiles.14:38
Lukc(sh has no array support)14:39
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joe9 http://codepad.org/zY4WwHWE i am trying to figure out if there is any way to run this executable file without actually messing up my system.15:02
joe9Is there some chroot or something similar that I can do for this?15:03
teK_if it's an exe file and you have vbox / windows vm: try cuckoo15:03
joe9no, it is a linux executable15:04
joe9teK_:15:04
jaegeryou could create a chroot for it if you wanted to, sure15:06
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