IRC Logs for #crux Saturday, 2012-10-20

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LukcOh noes!00:25
LukcBtw, why are some x86 and x86_64 ports separated?00:26
NecrosporusLukc, check it out00:28
Necrosporuspossibly there's different sources00:28
Necrosporusmaybe it's some binary only stuff like adobe flash or nvidia00:28
LukcNecrosporus, yeah, but why isn’t everything in the same port? :|00:30
LukcIt wouldn’t be that difficult to do a if arch is x86; then …; else … ; fi.00:31
NecrosporusLukc, why to overcomplicate things?00:37
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Romsterisn't cruxbot reporting contrib 2.8 posts?00:50
Romsteri pushed boost in contrib 2.800:50
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Romsteroh noes not Lukc :P00:50
RomsterLukc, i've thought of everything in same port but then footprint is a issue and also not always the same maintainer does both.00:51
RomsterIMO that would be ugly.00:51
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LukcI see.00:52
LukcWell, shouldn’t the footprints be architecture independant? :|00:52
Romstercontrib 2.8 mkvtoolnix: 5.0.1 -> 5.8.000:54
RomsterLukc, when we release CRUX 3.0 we will be on x86_6400:55
Romsterand then i686, as i would imagine will shrink to an overlay of only ports that differ from x86_64 to get i686 to work still00:55
Romsteras unofficial.00:55
Romstervery few of us devs have non 64bit cpus anymore.00:56
Romsteri'm on multilib with nogagpl_z and jaege_r and possibly a few others unofficial too.00:56
LukcI should hack some kind of musl-Crux. :(00:56
Romsteri'm slowly unbreaking contrib 2.8 considering i got the most ports in there.00:57
RomsterLukc, you even using crux or you just like to bug us about crux?01:00
LukcRomster, I’m using Crux right now. :p01:01
Romsterwhich flavor?01:01
Lukcx86_64 :301:01
LukcBut I used i686 on my netbook until two weeks.01:01
Romsterah so like me but without multilib01:01
Romsteri was about to do a for loop then i remembered i already edited pkg-url to do that for me...
Romsterthat's one of my utilities i've built.01:06
Romsterpkg-url -b -m 'Danny-Rawlins' |xargs |vs-database01:07
Romsternow to wait then i'll have the new versions to check01:07
Romsterexcept it wont work on sourceforge yet, i need to parse the javascript with something like spidermonkey or something else haven't found other options yet.01:08
Romsterthen i can interfraty that with scrapp and i'll have me a spider for source urls.01:10
Romsterwhat -_-01:15
Romsterit's my version updater finder project.01:15
Romsterpkg-url could double up as a source file list without -b it'll print the entire file url and name. so those few that have no internet at home could install crux too.01:17
Romsterwith a few trips to work and home -_-01:17
Romsterhmm i probably should add a prt-get quickdep option to fetch those distfiles.01:18
Romsteri'm full of ideas with limited coding ability and time.01:18
LukcIt’s just that I was more attracted by Frugalware’s approach of sources and versions tracking.01:18
Romsteroh i was doing that with up2date comamnd i made copied off Frugalware01:19
Lukc(they use a up2date= version in each Frugalbuild)01:19
Romsterbut then i was thinking i'd rely on the source= line than a speffic up2date= line in every port.01:20
Romsterthen i was like i'm sick of broken distfiles and ones that move to different locations01:20
LukcHey, I like the idea.01:20
Romsterthen an idea sprung lets spider the source url for the files as most have a file list.01:20
LukcI’m gonna implement that in pkg++.01:20
LukcNext year.01:20
Romstergood luck i got way more work todo.01:21
LukcI understand.01:21
Romsteri'm going to use scrapy to spider all the source mirrors and project sites looking for distfiles.01:21
Romsterfetch the sums/signs download a select few mirrors check file matches sum, if not discard that mirror.01:22
Romsterones that match make a metalink file of that new version and it's mirrors.01:22
Romsterthen i'll make my own mack to pkgmk to use metalink files with aria2c01:23
Romsterbut that's only the beginning.01:24
LukcI didn’t even know aria2c. :|01:24
Romsteri also tokenize the version strings and sort them so ic an sort them in version order.01:25
Romsternot perfect yet but close.01:25
Romsteroops wrong url01:25
Romstercrappy mock up but behind the scenes is about 500 lines of code to do that.01:25
Romsterauto fetch new versions try to build in chroot -_-01:26
Romsteraria2c is great01:26
Romsteri got it packaged in romster/01:27
Romsteraria2 sorry the binary is called aria2c01:27
LukcThat’s nice. :)01:27
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LukcYeah, I found out pretty easily anyway. :p01:27
Romsterit's a ton of work and i've re-written this liek 4 times now.01:27
Romsteronly work on it off and on so it'll be ages before it's done.01:28
Lukcpacmooning aria2 right now. :301:28
Romsterplans on a libvs written in C for version sorting, i'm sure that would make it into a few package managers.01:29
LukcOr packages builders.01:29
LukcFor pkg++ I had to rewrite my own vercmp(), lastver(), etc.01:29
LukcThat sucks a bit. :-|01:29
Romsteryeah this would make all that obsolete.01:30
Romsterso you know how difficult it is to get that to work.01:30
Romsteri must be crazy to try building a monster like this but i got a genuine interest in this pet project.01:31
LukcWell, you wouldn’t be the first crazy developer. :D01:31
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Romsteri could get more crazy and parse mailing lists and RSS/ATOM feeds later on too.01:32
Romsterand rely on spidering site that hasn't got such a feed.01:32
LukcThat’d be fascinating.01:33
Lukc(== cool)01:34
Romsteri read fascinating as being cool wicked awesome unbelievable01:35
Romsterok unbelievable might be a little wrong...01:35
LukcThat’s it. :D01:35
Romsterthat's why i was keen on what you were doing when you said about writing your own pkgmk etc.01:37
LukcI see. :301:37
LukcWell, I’m not really writing it all. I forked it from pkgmk.01:37
LukcThough I had to rewrote some parts several times, true.01:38
LukcBut still, I don’t consider I’ve “written” it.01:38
Romsterwell forked it and rewrote parts.01:38
Romsteri do the same stuff.01:38
LukcI also use pacmoon instead of prt-get, which I forked too. :p01:39
LukcI’m kind of “Oh, that thing is half-cool! Let’s fork it!”.01:40
Romsterwhat's do different about that anyways?01:40
LukcIt gets ports from collection I haven’t fetched with `ports` yet. :×01:41
LukcAnd, I’d want in the future to be able to use on non-Crux distributions too.01:41
LukcWith support of splits, useflags and all that stuff.01:41
Romster17:41:37 up 2 days, 17:19,  1 user,  load average: 6.06, 3.99, 2.6101:41
LukcBut, as I’m not actively working on it, it may take time.01:41
Romsterbit under load for a quad core.01:41
Romsteruseflags O_O01:42
Romsterwhy not use gentoo for that01:42
Romsteri always say build it and they will come.01:43
LukcGentoo… :|01:43
LukcGentoo is kind of bloated in the “source distributions” category.01:43
LukcI used Gentoo a lot in the past.01:44
LukcBut, if only ebuilds tend to be so complicated…01:44
LukcAnd there’s Python mixed with bash everywhere.01:44
Romsterthere is no why in hell any distro could use use flags without a very large dev userbase.01:44
Romsterto test every possible combination01:44
LukcYou don’t need to use thousands of useflags like Gentoo does either.01:45
LukcThey have flags for aqua or win32. :|01:45
Romsterand overlays01:45
Romsterlets not start to look at mingw in gentoo.01:45
LukcTheir crosstools stuff is pretty cool, however. :301:46
LukcI began to work on something similar using bmake Makefiles, btw. And it almost works fine. \o/01:47
* Romster makes coffee01:47
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prologicwhere's the latest iso image?02:04
Romsterlook in the mailing list.02:06
Romsteryou'll probably want frinnst's x86_64 though02:11
prologicare we at final?02:15
prologicor rc3?02:15
prologicany known issues?02:15
Romsternote that a ton of ports in contrib are broken stil02:15
Romsternone that i'm aware of but i haven't ran 2.8 yet02:15
Romsterim slowly fixing my ports02:19
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prologicbeen thinking about how to fix crux lately02:49
prologicif I can get some of you guys onboard with the idea it'd be awesome02:49
Lukc“fix Crux”?02:58
LukcWhat awesome idea?02:58
LukcWhy wasn’t I told there was a revolution going on, here? :(02:59
nogagplzfix crux so it can't reproduce with strays03:20
nogagplznot fix crux03:20
LukcWhat? ô_o03:43
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* Romster shrugs04:28
LukcThere are two things I dislike with Crux’ iso.04:37
LukcThere’s no cool automated framebuffer.04:38
LukcAnd there’s no bépo keymap. :D04:38
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LukcHum… 2.8 seems to boot with difficulty, here.06:23
LukcBut that’s a udev problem (I think…), so let’s ignore it.06:23
frinnstwell lets not ignore it and instead tell us what happened :)06:24
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LukcI’m working on it.06:25
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LukcWell, I decided trying alternative solutions, such as replacing udev.06:31
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LukcHum… I guess my kernel configuration might have forced the problem.06:55
LukcAnd I’m still not sure what the problem is.06:56
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prologicman if a framebuffer is your only problem07:32
prologicyou've got bigger issues :)07:32
Lukcprologic, such as?07:35
LukcHow can you live without a decent FB?07:35
prologicbecause that's not the issue I see07:36
Lukc(but, it’s not like it really mattered, as a decent FB is easily installed :|)07:36
LukcNo, that’s not.07:36
jseInstall and configure your frame buffer AFTER you've installed the system.07:44
jseInstallers are not pieces of art; they're for installing or performing quick administration.07:45
LukcUh, I was talking about the installation media. :|07:46
LukcBesides, I installed half my cruxes without the installer…07:46
jseStill failing to understand why this is any issue.07:46
LukcIt’s not.07:46
LukcDon’t bother.07:47
* jse mumbles something about cognitive dissonance...07:48
* Lukc mumbles something about correct typography and UTF-8…07:49
jseprologic: your call was on point earlier.07:51
tilmanLukc: LOL, '...' annoys you?07:58
jsetilman: it's not typographically correct so absolutely. :}08:01
prologicwhat I want to try and fix is coherency in the crux commonity and it's development08:01
prologicto that end (I hope) I'll have time to help build some tools around that08:01
Lukctilman, two hundred percents. (no, it doesn’t)08:03
tilmanLukc: then maybe you shouldn't make comments like that one :>08:03
Lukctilman, it’s still “not typographically correct”. :308:04
tilmannobody gives two shits08:04
LukcI see.08:04
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pedjaI get db.incomplete.transaction error when I try to install 2.8-rc2 in VirtualBox.It breaks just before filesystem package.11:42
pedjamd5sum checks out.11:43
pedjadamn, I am stupid...11:48
pedjaI actually forgot to mount root system at /mnt...11:49
pedjaand now it installs just fine :)11:49
pedjasorry about that.11:50
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frinnstpedja: stop scaring me like that12:40
pedjasorry :)12:40
pedjakernel is building atm, that might take a while...12:41
pedjasome kind of sanity check in the setup would be nice ;)12:42
pedjaor in big red flaming letters "are you that sure you know what are you doing?"12:44
pedjaO.K Computer is one of the best albums of all times...for me :)12:46
frinnstbut in rainbows might be better actually12:47
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pedjaI never listened to it.I might have it somewhere...12:48
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frinnsthaha DaViruz12:48
frinnstlovely hostname12:48
frinnst"seems legit"12:49
pedjakriminalpolisen I get, but what is 'riks'?12:50
frinnstrike = kingdom12:51
jseState or kingdom.12:51
frinnst[ 1231.168353] WARNING: at fs/btrfs/tree-log.c:3716 btrfs_log_inode_parent+0x3bf/0x410()12:51
pedjaso, 'royal criminal police' ? :)12:52
frinnstnah, more like "fbi" :)12:52
frinnststate is a more accurate translation in this case12:52 is a kingdom, no?you have royal family, afaik, or is it more complicated than that?12:53
frinnstwell yeah12:54
frinnstbut our king is pretty lame12:54
frinnstand nobody cares12:54
pedjalike .uk, then?12:54
frinnstbut with less prestige12:54
pedjaI remember blonde royal highness, princess smth, at the Nobel Prize party few years back.Nice rack :)12:57
frinnstyeah shes the only highlight12:58
pedjayep, that is her :)13:01
frinnstcomplete concert13:10
pedjaRadiohead 2010-01-24 - Radiohead For Haiti <--awesome13:12
pedjaI found it on some Radiohead fan site some time ago.13:14
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Lemon06Hi all, having problems to install Vmware Tools on Crux19:04
Lemon0664bits :/19:15
frinnstyeah, it's a pain. the perl-script to install is is pretty specific for rhel iirc19:15
Lemon06i did months of searchs and im not that skilled but i found this page and it seems to be related :
frinnstI attempted it at work, but gave up since i had no real need for it and it would require too much work19:16
frinnstjaeger probably has some hints if you wait around a bit19:16
frinnstdoes the "installer" contain any binaries? i dont remember19:17
frinnstmost (all) binary-only tools usually require some 32 bit libraries for some retarded reason19:18
frinnstprologics blog does not seem to load19:19
Lemon06only scripts i think since they need gcc i guess ?19:19
frinnstIt's not just you! looks down from here.19:19
frinnstthe main script is a perl-script iirc?19:19
Lemon06i noticed but only one url works here19:20
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frinnstprobably assumes a bunch of perl modules are installed that are missing19:20
frinnstwhat kind of error message do you get?19:21
Lemon06Prologic blog says : So all-in-all, if anyone reads this article or comes across the same problem; recompile perl with "-Darchname=x86_64-linux"19:22
Lemon06well the first problem was the rc0.d to rc6.d directories missing but i already "fixed" that by creating the dirs19:24
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Lemon06yes main script is perl, however i need to restart from scratch...the 64bits problem came after few problems i solved .. months ago19:33
frinnstdo you have a real need for it? what i wanted was to be able to see the guest ip-address and to do graceful shutdowns from vcenter19:35
frinnstbut the work wasn't worth it :)19:35
Lemon06good point, im not sure, all i want is the best performance possible19:36
Lemon06bandwidth management for memory,disks,network ?19:37
Lemon06it works fine w/o VMware Tools else19:38
Lemon06some people says its only required for shutdown scripts etc but im not sure19:39
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jaegerLemon06: are you running multilib or pure64?19:51
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Lemon06is there a way to check it ? ^^19:52
jaegercan you build and run 32-bit code?19:52
jaegerwhich ISO did you use to install?19:52
Lemon06wait..i must precise i use MineOs Crux19:52
Lemon06its not an official Crux iso19:53
jaegerAh. No idea if mineos has a multilib version so I'll assume pure6419:53
jaegerthe only real difference is an extra package on multilib, I imagine19:53
jaegerI don't run any pure64, though, so not 100% sure19:53
jaegeranyway, you need to create /etc/pam.d and /etc/rc.d/rc{0,1,2,3,4,5,6}.d directories19:53
jaegeryou don't need to put anything into them but the vmware tools installer expects them to exist19:54
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jaegerReading the buffer now I see you already created the rc.d dirs, still running into problems?19:57
Lemon06launching putty to copy/paste19:58
jaegerI've got a mineos crux server here, actually, and it's running the vmware tools properly. It's 32-bit but theoretically 64-bit should work fine as well19:59
jaegerneed to run an errand, I'll be back probably within an hour20:01
Lemon06ok so the install is ok until it starts the /usr/bin/ script20:01
Lemon06ok i need to sleep anyway (3am here) maybe could we look together tomorow ?20:02
Lemon06next time i mean20:03
frinnstyeah 3am here too20:04
Lemon06Jaeger as Op i guess he uses to be there...thanks both anyway, i'll be back20:05
* Lemon06 sleeps well wondering what's the best perf choice: 32bits OS with Tools or 64bits w/o Tools....20:11
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Romstermorning all20:36
Romsterwell i should say after noon just past noon20:36
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prologicif Lemon06 comes back in21:02
prologicsomeone tell him, that I am the author of the blog article he linked to in y privmsg to me21:02
Romsteri was suprised at that and why is that blog not loading either you need to fix that prologic21:03
RomsterThe system returned: [No Error]21:03
RomsterA Timeout occurred while waiting to read data from the network. The network or server may be down or congested. Please retry your request.21:03
jaegergrr... why is dspam no longer inserting headers into my emails?21:03
prologicahh yeah21:03
* jaeger grumbles21:03
prologicthere is a known bug with sahriswiki21:03
prologicI think something to do with the way I'm using sqlalchemy21:04
prologicI haven't manged to find what the problem is to fix ityet21:04
Romsterwondering why your not using some pythonic database than wrappers to sql?21:05
prologicI am21:06
prologicI have a funny feeling it's locking up somewhere21:07
prologicand causing a deadlock21:07
prologicif you go to for instance21:07
prologicthat works21:07
prologicbut the main wiki rendering doesn't21:07
prologici'm thinking of rewriting the search module21:08
Romsterwhen i was messing with python i always hit brick walls when it came to database integration.21:09
jaegerI wrote quite a few python scripts that talked to postgresql and mssql at my previous job, worked fine for that21:09
Romsterusing SQLAlchemy-0.7.9 ?21:10
prologicdatabases aren't the issue21:11
prologicand integrating them into an app not that hard21:11
prologicit's the framework that's always the problem21:11
prologicit may or may not be doing what you think it is21:11
prologicand inevitably screwed you over somehow21:11
jaegeryeah, never used sqlalchemy, I just used the appropriate db modules21:11
jaegerpyscopg2, etc.21:11
prologicfortunately circuits.web has a web-based debugger21:12
prologicI wonder if I added that to sahriswiki's component structure or not21:12
Romsternow might be a good time to integrate that pyhton database abstraction layer. might kill two birds with one stone.21:12
Romsteryou really need a error_log file for such debugging purposes if at all possible.21:13
prologicI only have the memory monitor21:13
prologicyeah that's the thing though21:14
prologicit's not erroring :)21:14
prologicand I do use SQLAlchemy21:14
prologicbut I think SQLAlchemy is the problem21:14
prologicthis is how I'm going to figure this out in future21:16
prologicI'll add WebConsole to the app21:16
prologicwhen this happens again I'll be able to get a python web shell21:16
prologicbut have to password protect that :)21:17
Romsterindeed and add in number of attempts to lock out that ip21:20
Romsteri often wonder why no one uses pgp keys instead of passwords on a web site.21:20
prologictoo hard to implement?21:21
prologicbut 3 auth failures and lock the ip out is a good idea21:22
prologicI should write a component aht does that21:22
Romstermore like most users wouldn't know how to use it.21:22
prologicwhat I'd also like to add to circuits in general is a manhole like twisted has21:22
prologicand a manhole over ssh21:22
Romstermanhole to the internals?21:22
Romsteryou got it all event based so a debug listening event would work?21:25
prologicthis is the MemoryMonitor component in circuits.web21:25
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Romsteri clicked on a trace link and it says waiting.21:26
Romstermaybe that's the same bug as you mentioned the trace links time out21:44
Romster Firefox can't establish a connection to the server at
Romsteryou really ought to implement the http error codes than to just let it time out...21:45
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prologiccould be21:57
prologicnot sure21:57
prologicit's offline atm21:57
prologictrying to work out how to protect an arbitrary web component and requests to it's channel in a loosely coupled way21:58
Romsteri could use your framework though i have some ideas.22:00
Romsteron an entirely different thing, how do i allow more than one application to use hardware 3d acceleration?22:03
Romsterreally bugs me that a program can take exclusive control of video/audio nodes and forces other programs to not work correctly.22:03
Romsterthere is dmix for audio but what is there for video?22:04
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prologicand circuits-minpor22:18
Romsteryeah opengl acceleration or direct rendering open program falls back to software when the /dev/.... device is locked by another process.22:20
Romsteri don't see the irc bot in there :/22:21
prologicI never publicly published it :)22:23
Romsteri know someone else looking for a decen't bot but i cna't recomend it as it's broken :/22:23
Romsterand i may use it myself too.22:23
prologicgive me 15mins22:24
prologicI'll fix it :)22:24
Romsterno rush not needed today.22:24
prologicyou'll have it in working order again22:24
Romsteri thoguth you wree keen on your AI stuff too.22:24
prologicit's not that broken :)22:24
Romsterthe other person i speak of is using an eggdrop still with issues.22:25
jaegerclb is an eggdrop22:28
jaegerer, used to be an eggdrop22:28
jaegerold but solid22:29
jaegerwill probably actually switch back to that at some point22:29
Romstertry prologics bot it's solid if he kept maintaining it's code base.22:32
jaegerI've started my own as well but haven't put much effort into it yet22:33
Romsterjaeger, maybe you might know i can't find the correct search terms, looking for a way to not block access to direct rendering when one app locks it another can't use it.22:34
Romsteri got runescape working with OpenGL with firefox-32 bit and java 6u* but then when i got xine-ui running it messes me up...22:35
jaegerI don't know a way, never had a need for that sort of thing22:36
Romsteri need some type of mixing i'd imagine to composite all the images into one, i really don't know.22:37
Romstershame i couldn't palm off the job to my other video card then display it on the same screen even.22:37
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