IRC Logs for #crux Wednesday, 2012-10-31

diversethat is after systemd took over and change their chain of command :P00:01
diversefrinnst: ping00:02
diverseo/00:02
diverseDoes Crux have a way to globally set or remove dependencies for all packages?00:08
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ujuheeeeeeeeeeeeeelp ! heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep !01:42
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ujucrux on virtualbox cant boot after install01:44
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frinnstwhut?01:52
frinnstwell, he did give it 5 minutes..01:53
diversehmm?01:53
frinnst"uju"01:53
niklaswemorning01:53
tilmanmourning01:57
niklaswehow are you tilman ?01:57
tilmanpretty good01:58
tilmanquit my job yesterday01:58
niklaswetilman: why? got a new one or?01:58
tilmanye01:58
niklaswenice=) where will you work now then ?01:59
tilmanstill in the south west of germany, somewhat near the french border. karlsruhe, if that name means anything to you02:00
Romsterhttp://vimeo.com/4851400302:00
niklaswetilman: ah, I meaned which company and what will you work with ? :)02:01
tilmani'll still by developing unix applications02:02
tilmans/by/be/02:02
tilmanmostly linux though, and no osx \o/02:02
Romstergood news02:02
niklaswe=)02:03
frinnstgood news everyone!02:03
Romsteri realyl want to avoid windows8 but no one has bought anythign with windows 8 from the shop /yet/02:03
tilmanthey are building medical devices/systems02:03
Romsterbut i'm dreading it.02:03
tilmanso maybe my next big bug will hurt people ;)02:03
Romsteroh dear02:04
frinnsthah, thats the spirit!02:04
Romsterdid oyu say triple shot of morphine? coming up.02:04
joacimi'm sure you'll break some hearts02:04
Romsters/shot/dose02:04
Romsteri'm sure they have stringent testing to prevent bugs.02:05
tilmanprobably won't tbh ;)02:06
diversefrinnst: Does Crux have a way to globally set or remove dependencies for all packages?02:08
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tilmanthere he is02:11
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frinnstdiverse: not sure i understand what you mean?02:21
diversefrinnst: have you used Gentoo before?02:21
frinnstno02:22
frinnstwell, yeah02:22
frinnsta bit02:22
joacimi believe he is talking about something like use-flags02:22
frinnsti guess you refer to USE flags?02:22
joacimor she02:22
diverseremember the "USE" variable? Something like that in Crux i mean.02:22
frinnstah, no02:22
frinnstnothing like that. but various configure-scripts usually autodetect additional libraries etc that you might have installed02:23
frinnstso you might want to add PKGMK_IGNORE_NEW="yes" in /etc/pkgmk.conf02:24
diverseoh?02:24
frinnst(just ignores NEW files from the .footprint)02:25
frinnstotherwise it will throw an error02:25
niklaswean02:25
diversefrinnst: so prevent the NEW files will prevent extra dependencies from coming in02:34
diverse*preventing02:34
frinnstno02:34
frinnstthere is no real way of globally preventing new deps to be pulled in02:34
frinnstso for example gtk3 is crap and ugly but i require it for transmission. a couple of other ports that i use (emelfm2 and audacious) will link against it instead of gtk2 if detected02:35
frinnstof course, you could prevent that with --disable-gtk3 or whatever in those ports but its not ideal02:36
frinnstbut to be honest, I dont find it a big issue at all.02:36
diverseI see your point, it becomes kind of redundant to prevent such.02:41
frinnstyeah sorry for not being more clear, i've not had my coffee yet :)02:42
frinnstthere are more articulate folks in #crux that can explain it better :)02:43
diversewell its good in a way, it prevents breakage.02:43
diversefrinnst: in your case, do you still need gtk2?02:45
frinnstyeah02:45
frinnstthere are not many ports that use gtk302:45
frinnstalso, our gtk3 port depends on gtk202:46
frinnstfor now02:46
diverseoh?02:46
diversedoes gtk3 really depend on gtk2?02:47
frinnstyeah we use --enable-gtk2-dependency for it to integrate and play nicer with gtk202:47
diverseah nice02:47
frinnstsince most stuff still depend on gtk202:47
diversedoes the ports have mplayer2 in it?02:49
frinnsthttp://crux.nu/portdb/?a=search&q=mplayer02:49
frinnstthe one in opt is mplayer1 afaik02:50
diversedoesn't look like there isn't any02:52
niklasweyay now I running crux 2.8 :)02:54
diverseniklaswe: how is the experience?02:55
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diversefrinnst: for non existing ports, I would have to create my own?02:56
frinnstyep02:56
niklaswediverse: like 2.7 :)02:56
frinnstbut its really simple02:56
niklasweI have just upgrade it to 2.802:57
diversefrinnst: thankfully the Pkgfiles look similar to PKGBUILDS. But of course, I know why. :)03:00
diversefrinnst: are the .footnotes generated?03:03
diverseniklaswe: is it easy to upgrade to the newer version without reinstalling?03:05
niklaswediverse: yupp03:06
diverse:)03:06
niklaswediverse: it will generate .footprint when you building the package.03:06
diverseniklaswe: great :)03:07
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frinnsthttp://i.qkme.me/3rkl43.jpg03:32
diverserofl03:34
diversewhich planet is that?03:35
joacimjupiter03:35
diverseheh03:35
Romsterdiverse, like prt-get install foo --ignore=bar03:52
niklaswehaha it´s so funny to our sales ppl talking to our helpdesk guy :P04:02
niklasweour helpdesk guy, can you save all files you want to keep on this external drive... the "user (sales)" hmm sure, but can´t I draw the whole folder instead..04:04
niklasweyour helpdesk guy.. deep sigh... yeeeeeeeeeeees you can...04:04
prologichmm04:05
prologicinteresting04:05
prologicI still have (unfinished) a pkgutils implementation in Python04:06
prologicit needs pkgutils.pkgmk finished and pkgutils.pkgadd implemented - but other than that it's almost complete04:06
prologicgawd this code is dated 200704:06
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Romsterlol04:13
Romsteryou just wanted to beat hans shell pkgutils didn't you.04:14
prologicI think so04:16
prologicI might still finish this though04:16
prologicI often find myself in situations where I want CRUX's pkgutils on another distro or system04:17
prologiceg: OS X04:17
frinnst.. why?04:17
prologicor some other distro04:17
frinnstwhy not just recompile for that distro?04:17
frinnstthats what i did for slackware :)04:17
Romsteryeah that woulnd't be a bad thing to have.04:18
prologicfrinnst, not always possible04:18
prologicconsider you're on an old box with an old toolchain04:19
prologicwhat do you do?04:19
Romsterproblem is if oyu break python your screwed.04:19
prologicif you can't even compile pkgutils04:19
prologic-but- it has Python 2.4 :)04:19
prologicOr, you're on a Debian system where you can't install anything new because it's package management tools has gotten stuck in some weird way04:20
Romsteri've had major issues in windows updates getting suck but never seen that in linux.04:20
Romsterguess it's possible with all the dependency handling.04:21
prologicOn another topic, looks like I might be getting two of these for our new Office: http://www.fit-pc.com/web/purchase/order-direct-intense-pc/ (Office @ Home)04:21
prologicand installing CRUX 64bit on them :)04:21
Romsteri would stay the hell clear of the celeron cpu ones.04:23
Romsterso slow04:23
prologicno no04:24
Romsterbut considering the i3 one there is a considerable amount more... i'm guessing you'll get the slow cpu04:24
prologicgoing the Core 9y ones04:24
prologici704:24
Romsterah the fast ones.04:24
prologicof course04:24
Romsterdepends on your budget really04:24
prologic$836/unit bare bones is really good04:24
prologicthrow in 16GB of DDR3 SODIMM 1600Mhz RAM for $115.0004:24
frinnstdoes the case function as a heat-spreader too? just watch out if you compile stuff on it so you dont get burn injuries :)04:25
prologicand an Intel 520 series 60GB SSD for $105.0004:25
prologicgrab a Samsung 22" LCD from a local sho04:25
prologicwhatever kbd/mouse04:25
prologicand you're done04:25
prologicfrinnst, lol04:25
prologichopefully at some point I'll also have my home rack-mounted infrastructure built04:26
prologicso compiling on the desktop won't happen as much04:26
Romsteri'm sure the fans will do a decent amount of work and the i7 runs cool most of the time.04:26
frinnstits a fanless design romster04:26
prologicI'm pretty sure these are fanless desktop units04:26
prologicno fans, no moving parts (if you go SSD)04:26
prologicshould run fairly cool and quiet04:26
Romsterwell i hope it's heat pipe to the aloy case then.04:26
frinnstand it seems to be mobile cpus on those boxes04:26
prologic*nod*04:26
prologicthey are04:27
Romsteroh lap warmers not toaster ovens.04:27
prologicwho needs a Quad-core 3.2Ghz desktop anyway :)04:27
frinnstbut yeah, my i7 shipped with a tiny cooler compared to my old q660004:27
Romsteri have one04:27
prologichey04:27
prologicI still have an AMD Sempron 2400 here04:27
Romster3.4GHz and i can OC this if i need too.04:27
prologicso I won't complain upgrading to these04:27
frinnstI have a shitty old dualcore E8400 at work04:28
Romsteri think of it this way i wont need to upgrade for a long long time04:28
Romsteryou not going to look at some cluster setup for compiling prologic ?04:29
prologicoh definately04:29
prologicbut that'll be in the rack :)04:29
* Romster nods04:30
prologichttp://www.kickstarter.com/projects/adapteva/parallella-a-supercomputer-for-everyone04:31
prologicI'm getting one of these fairly soon04:31
prologicI pledged $99 for a 16-core machine to play with04:31
Romstersweet04:35
RomsterWe could put 1,000 cores on a single chip in two years.  Are you ready for that?04:35
Romsterdo want04:35
Romsteri'll bbl04:36
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krueMy favorite multi-core chips: http://www.greenarraychips.com/06:21
krue144 cores. but they are more comparable to an FPGA than a "standard" CPU.06:21
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cruxbot[opt.git/2.8]: alsa-lib, alsa-oss, alsa-utils: updated source URL08:51
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zenwalkuserhi10:28
zenwalkuserjaeger, remember my xorg problemn yesterday? I finally figured out what causes the problem. It's not the kernel, it's Xorg! Crux' xorg does not support the cirrus vga card emulated by quemu, if I blacklist cirrus and cirrusfb then Xorg comes up if I don't blacklist one of them Xorg seqfaults.10:30
frinnstyeah you need to use the modesetting driver10:31
zenwalkuserfrinnst, it looks that it's using vesa now because scrolling on tty is very slow10:35
frinnstyes unless you specify a driver in xorg-conf it will use whatever it finds that work10:36
frinnstjust remove it and install the modesetting driver instead10:36
zenwalkuserI am not using anx xorg.conf, how do I figure out which driver it is using?10:37
frinnstcheck the xorg log10:37
zenwalkuserany xcommand, I know there is one I just forgot10:38
frinnstless /var/log/Xorg.log10:38
zenwalkuserfrinsst, no I mean there is a cli tool like setxkbmap but just that shows running xservers details10:42
zenwalkuserfrinnst, it's using vesa, that's a pitty, got cirrus driver working on other distries with the same kernel config, any clue what might be missing in crux' xorg and where to get it?10:50
frinnstwith the risk of repeating myself multiple times: xorg-xf86-video-modesetting11:01
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zenwalkuserfrinnst, is that a package that I must install from contrib repro?11:12
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horrorStruckanyone using werc on a crux machine?11:28
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zenwalkuserfrinnst, xorg-xf86-video-modesetting installed but it's still not working with cirrus ;(11:37
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cruxbot[opt.git/2.8]: elinks: update to 0.12pre611:50
cruxbot[opt.git/2.8]: spectrwm: update to 2.1.011:50
jsehorrorStruck: if you're referring to werc.cat-v.org it did work with lighttpd.11:52
horrorStruckjse: yes exactly, did you have to do anything special apart from standard installation instructions?11:53
horrorStrucki'm using 9base FWIW11:54
jseIt took its time but that's due to this idiot between the computer and the chair.11:54
horrorStruckyou're still running it?11:55
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jseNot at the moment. That machine is falling apart due to its age so it's out of commission.11:56
zenwalkuserblacklisting only cirrusfb but leaving cirrus starts up openbox but the xsession crashws right after trying to open xterm11:56
jseBoth plan9 and 9base worked. Make sure the variables are exported and have the plan9/9base bin in your $PATH.11:57
zenwalkuserI installed xf86-video-modsetting package...11:57
horrorStruckjse: ok, thanks. i can get the sample sites up but some weird things happen11:57
jsehorrorStruck: no problem.11:57
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frinnstbut did you remove the other crap?12:04
frinnstplease understand that if you run xorg without a config file, xorg will throw a bunch of drivers and see what sticks12:04
tilmanxf86-video-modesetting is crap; install the proper driver12:05
frinnstwhat do you suggest for qemu then?12:06
tilmanoh, qemu12:07
tilmansorry.12:07
tilmandidn't read much of the backlog ;)12:07
frinnst:>12:07
tilmanfrinnst: now you've ruined my evening!12:07
tilman;)12:07
frinnstsorry12:07
frinnst:/12:07
tilmanzenwalkuser: does xf86-video-modesetting work with the cirrus? do we have KMS support for cirrus?12:08
frinnstwith new kernels you do12:09
tilmanotherwise you'd need xf86-video-vesa i believe12:09
frinnstbut its in staging12:09
tilmanok12:09
frinnst3.6 or something i believe12:09
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zenwalkuseryes have kms support for cirrus12:19
zenwalkuserseems default packageset of crux install cd is not shipping full xorg so what I am missing?12:21
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VileTimesSo my Arch Linux install finally crapped out on me after the last upgrade and I think this is an ideal time to make the complete switch over to Crux.13:08
jseLess typing and more doing. crux doesn't install by itself just yet. :)13:09
VileTimesVery true, however the reason I'm here is because I'm (obviously) stuck in the installation process. My kernel is compiled and the system boots just fine. Wireless seems to be a problem, however. I have a Thinkpad T60 that uses the Intel3945 NIC, so compiled in the iwlwifi-3945 driver into the kernel and downloaded the necessary firmware from the Intel site. lspci -v says that the card is using the correct driver (iwl3945), but wh13:13
jaegerWhat does dmesg say about it?13:15
VileTimesdmesg seems to identify it correctly and doesn't complain.13:16
jaegerok, so what's the actual problem? Don't think you got to that part, it was cut off13:16
VileTimesI can't bring wlan0 up. wicd doesn't understand it, and an iwlist doesn't work either.13:17
jaegerdoes ifconfig -a show it?13:17
VileTimesYes, it's there.13:17
jaegercan you bring it up manually with 'ifconfig wlan0 up' ?13:18
VileTimesYes, no problems there.13:18
jaegerafter doing that do the other tools work?13:18
VileTimesiwlistwlan0 scan says the interface doesn't support scanning.13:19
VileTimeswicd likes my current wired connection, but can't seem to access wlan0 for scanning either.13:20
jaegerI've not used wicd, can't help there...13:20
jaegercan you manually connect to your wireless network with iwconfig or wpa_supplicant, leaving wicd out of the picture?13:21
VileTimesI'll give it a shot.13:21
VileTimesAh! I just got an error saying "Can't read /proc/net/wireless" ...13:23
jaegersounds like a good place to start13:23
VileTimesThis was after I tried to assign an essid to the interface via iwconfig.13:23
VileTimesOk ... how do I create this file?13:25
jaegerYou don't create things in /proc, it's populated automatically13:25
jaegerso if something is missing from it that usually means you're missing a driver or some kernel support13:25
VileTimesThanks. I'll see if I can find some details.13:26
frinnstRotwang: thunderbird needs a couple of updates. security fixes13:44
rauzVileTimes did you compile it as a module or did you compile the driver fix in the kernel ?13:47
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VileTimesNo, I compiled it into the kernel, rauz. The driver is definitely there. I'm recompiling now with some options that should give me the wireless extensions that I need.13:49
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rauzok i had some trouble with this driver on my thinkpad the solution was to build the driver as module13:49
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VileTimesAlright ... hopefully next time I'll log in to #crux, I'll be doing so wirelessly. :)14:05
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VileTimes... aaaand there was much rejoicing!14:13
jaegeryay!14:13
jaegerNow we can eat Robin's minstrels.14:13
VileTimes:)14:13
nogagplzwicd is so cool14:14
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Rotwangfrinnst: indeed14:43
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VileTimesOk! So this install is definitely coming along. One thing I'm having a difficult time figuring out is the kernel option that'll activate the VGA port on my Thinkpad. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that won't be in the Device Drivers/Graphics Support section of the kernel config, right?14:59
jaegerIf you have video output on the LCD the VGA output should work as well, unless that particular laptop controls it via a separate GPU or something15:16
VileTimesOdd ... I get no boot messages from my second screen and xrandr only recognizes my laptop's display and nothing else.15:22
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jaegerYou might do some searching for linux on that specific model laptop, someone has probably run into that before15:35
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vee_sup guys21:19
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