IRC Logs for #crux Monday, 2013-01-21

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Romsteri'd say evening but there is very few of us...00:05
niklaswehow are you guys?00:06
prologicvery few?00:07
prologicthere's at least 3 or 4 or us :)00:08
timcowchipare you guys n Sweden?00:08
timcowchipI'm in Oregon00:09
timcowchipme and Linus00:09
prologicno we're in AU00:15
nogagplzyeah austria woooo00:19
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bedisI passed my WE to upgrade from 2.8 32 bits to 3.0 64 bits :)00:22
bedismy first crux upgrade.00:23
frinnstWhere women glow and men plunder?00:29
bedisheh almost00:29
nogagplzcan't you hear the thunder00:30
frinnstYou better run, you better take cover.00:30
nogagplzbuying bread from a man in brussels00:30
frinnsthe was six foot four and full of muscle00:31
nogagplzI said do you speaka my language00:31
frinnst.. alright, i'll leave it there :D00:31
Romsterhaha good lord00:33
n_y_chello everybody)) finally downloaded the iso (with speed GPRS/EDGE)). I hope these impressions will be the same or more as with dwm. right now, I'll start testing in qemu.01:12
n_y_c ***01:12
n_y_c$ sensors01:12
n_y_c k8temp-pci-00c301:12
n_y_c Adapter: PCI adapter01:12
niklaswehave someone create kvm templates ?01:48
juetilman: thanks, though I tend to say it's not a pkgexport fault, IMO we should only run the case statement in pkgmk.conf if $PKGMK_ARCH is set, or extent the first case to "64"|"")01:56
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Romsterniklaswe, prologic has made openvz for crux.02:42
prologicwell correction02:44
prologiccrux containers for openvz02:45
prologicor templates02:45
Romsteroops i meant containers but i didn't type that.02:46
diversepitillo: thanks for putting it back in crux02:50
frinnstwow, zimbra is pretty horrible02:52
frinnstits outlook connector keeps crashing outlook - nice02:52
frinnstenterprise software my ass02:52
diverseok, it was active, just not listed.02:52
pitillodiverse: no problem, there were a small desync there, now I'm just finishing my machine upgrade to 3.0 and e17 seems right. I'll try to put hands on e17 repo again this week and fix branches02:59
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: wine: 1.5.21 -> 1.5.2203:02
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cruxbot[opt.git/2.8]: wine: 1.5.21 -> 1.5.2203:11
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niklasweRomster: yes I know that, but I wondering if someone has make image-template in kvm03:55
cruxbot[xorg.git/2.8]: xorg-xf86-video-intel: updated to 2.20.1904:03
cruxbot[xorg.git/2.8]: xorg-rgb: updated to 1.0.504:03
cruxbot[xorg.git/3.0]: xorg-xf86-video-intel: updated to 2.20.1904:03
cruxbot[xorg.git/3.0]: xorg-rgb: updated to 1.0.504:03
cruxbot[xorg.git/3.0]: Merge branch '2.8' into 3.004:03
bedisabout 3.0, libreoffice still points to the x86 architecture04:11
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frinnstlaughed my ass off04:48
prologicI'm a qualified software engineer04:51
prologicmy god what a disgrace04:51
prologicto think you can do what takes years ot experience and learning to do for only $300?04:51
prologichuh? :)04:53
prologicwhat part of my ranting didn't you get? :)04:53
prologicgood post - very funny04:53
prologicwish I could build an iOS app and pay my mortgage off04:54
Romsterbedis, poke the maintainer of that port.04:58
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bedisRomster: I'll do it05:35
bedisI've already patched the port :)05:35
bedisto install it by myself when upgrading to 3.005:36
frinnstrotwang maintaned a x86_64 version for 2.8, but i guess he hasnt reacted to 3.0 yet05:36
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diverseprologic: its a gimmick to get your money06:00
diverseof course ;)06:00
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prologicof course :)06:01
prologicit has to be right? :)06:01
prologicI mean it takes 8 years of a single person's time to write an async framework in python06:02
prologicwith what little spare time I have nowadays with a bub 'n all :)06:02
diversebut before that, how many years of knowledge would have been needed to get started?06:08
prologicmany! :)06:09
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diverseprologic: isn't it great that there are so many libraries that do all the hard work?06:15
prologicsure are :)06:16
prologiceg: was written in 2 weeks flat :)06:16
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systemd_suxXdid someone of you ever experienced problems with imap over tls while imap unencrypted still works fine?07:15
systemd_suxXto my understanding it's the same process listening on port 143 for tls AND unencrypted connections07:16
systemd_suxXso IF imapd process had a problem I would expect to get connection failed on unencrypted connection attempt as well...07:16
fireglowlol systemd_suxX: nice nickname07:20
frinnstwhat imap daemon are you using?07:20
systemd_suxXfreglow, ;D07:20
systemd_suxXfrinnst, uw impad07:20
frinnstoh, THAT imap daemon07:21
frinnstthe industry standard one07:21
systemd_suxXfrinnst, it was working fine until this morning and suddenly tls connections hang while unencrypted connections are still fine, smtp is not affected still can sent out mails via tls encrypted smtp07:21
systemd_suxXi guess I need to resart the impad might be cuased due to high load or a power flicker, however I have no acces to the machine at the moment and I still wonder why only tls connection and not both tls and unengrypted connection is affected...07:24
cruxbot[core.git/3.0]: pkgutils: update to 5.35.407:31
cruxbot[opt.git/2.8]: samba: update to 3.6.1107:39
cruxbot[opt.git/2.8]: cifs-utils: add rc script07:39
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: cifs-utils: add patch to fix mount when a cred file supplies a username07:41
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: fontforge: include freetype source, thank you Rotwang07:41
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: wine: 1.5.21 -> 1.5.2207:41
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: samba: update to 3.6.1107:41
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: cifs-utils: add rc script07:41
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: Merge branch '2.8' into 3.007:41
rmullI'm glad that 2.8 is still getting some updates - I just went 2.7->2.8 a few weeks ago :|07:45
cruxbot[opt.git/2.8]: mupdf: initial release07:57
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: mupdf: initial release07:57
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: Merge branch '2.8' into 3.007:57
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tilmanjue: i agree actually :)09:27
rmullIs there a 3.0 pure non-multilib x86_64 iso anywhere?09:29
tilmanrmull: glibc-32 is only 17 mb of disk space =)09:32
juermull: not convinced?09:38
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rmulljue: I just feel weird about having things lying around that I'll never use09:42
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juermull: 17 mb is more or less nothing nowadays and we gain much from having only one version of CRUX09:50
tilman.oO(what happens if you pkgrm glibc-32?)09:56
jaegertoolchain breaks09:57
tilmanok, that sucks ;d09:57
tilman(i mean, can't do that then)09:57
tilmanrmull: fwiw, you don't *have* to have ia32 emulation in your kernel if you don't need it09:57
lennartanyone else having huge stability problems with thunderbird on crux 3.0?09:57
tilmanrmull: so it really comes down to the toolchain09:58
tilmanrmull: .. being able to do a little more than you need09:58
rmulltilman: Yep09:58
lennartstability problems as in crashes pretty much instantly09:58
tilmanrmull: so i guess if you tweak core/{gcc,glibc} you're set09:58
rmulltilman: One version of crux is fine - but there used to be an x86_64 ports overlay that replaced these toolchain components. I was thinking maybe we'd see something like that for 3.0 as well, but was noting that it may not be something the maintainer is interested in anymore09:59
tilmaniirc the old x86_64 overlays were a bit different09:59
tilmannot just toolchain09:59
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rmullYes, there were a few other components, but gcc and glibc and binutils and util-linux are among those replaced10:01
rmullIn core-x86_64 at least10:07
rmullAnyway, I'm not going to fight too hard for this, since in the end it's not a big deal10:07
rmullI know the discussions were lengthy10:07
jaegerlennart: haven't finished my upgrade yet but I'll report back on that this afternoon10:08
lennartjaeger: cool, thanks10:08
jaegerstill thrashing libpthread-stubs leftovers at the moment10:09
lennartso you went with the risky update technique? ;)10:09
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jaegerI wouldn't say risky, I used the ISO and booted into it... but lots of rebuilding for libpthread-stubs 0.2 -> 0.310:10
frinnstlennart, what cpu are you using? i3,5,7?10:11
lennartfrinnst: amd fx10:11
frinnstdoes it have avx instructions? and you build with -march=native or something?10:11
lennartjaeger: that's what i was thinking, so i just went and deleted everything and did a clean install10:11
jaegerlennart: I usually do clean installs, felt like a challenge this time10:12
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lennartfrinnst: it does have avx and I build with -march=bdver210:12
frinnstah, try adding $CFLAGS -mno-avx10:12
frinnstlike the firefox port10:12
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frinnst(mozilla sucks)10:12
lennartfrinnst: ahh :) I'll give it a try. Thanks10:13
noobmanSorry to be cutting in, but I have this dilemma => I have a laptop on which I plan to install linux without any desktop environment or fancy stuff and choices boil down to arch linux and crux... can any body point out advantange of crux over arch; even a link will do..10:13
frinnstno systemd, source based10:14
lennartnoobman: last arch update I did on another box totally trashed my system and I did a clean install of debian10:14
frinnstprobably the biggest differences10:14
tilmanalso no systemd10:14
frinnsti have never used arch :)10:14
noobmaninteresting... does systemd affect boot times significantly ?10:14
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rmullnoobman: crux community is smaller, though helpful10:15
jaegernoobman: really it's a subject question - I'd suggest you try both and see which you personally prefer10:15
noobman@rmull => I can see that, totally awesome community and documentation10:15
rmullsystemd probably boots faster, but it may not be worth the disadvantages10:15
jaegerIf it's a slower/older laptop arch may appeal to you since you won't have to build all your packages10:15
rmulland the disadvantages are often matters of opinion10:15
jaegerif you don't mind the build time that's a non-issue, though10:15
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noobmanalso arch is a rolling release...10:17
frinnstas is crux, pretty much atleast10:17
noobmanokay that answers all my doubts, also have to read documentation more carefully, thanks10:18
jaegerhope it helps :)10:19
frinnstyou should probably know how to build a kernel if you plan to use crux10:19
frinnstits no big deal, but it usually scare off the faint of heart :)10:19
noobmanyeah I have  experience building kernels... but I ignorant about distros, I was always in care of ubuntu until recently things started to change(you know what I mean :) )10:20
rmullnoobman: the other thing about crux is that you might be required to package your own software, since the supplied ports are not as vast as what you get from arch. ON the other hand, writing your own Pkgfile is pretty easy :)10:24
noobmaninteresting... lemme look in to documentation for that... I hope it doesnt involve steep learning curve10:26
rmullNot too bad. Look at some example Pkgfiles to see.10:32
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lennartfrinnst: yay, it worked. Thunderbird is running fine now :) Thanks10:50
lennartjaeger: if you're on an amd cpu as well you might want to try what frinnst said (adding -mno-avx to CFLAGS)10:51
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frinnstlennart: nice, i'll mail rotwang and suggest he adds it to the Pkgfile11:24
lennartok, thank you11:25
rmullDoes it work fine on CPUs that have the avx feature?11:31
lennartonly if you disable that feature during the build11:32
tilmani wonder if it's a bug in gcc or a bug in mozilla11:32
jaegerlennart: xeon here11:37
jaegerglad you got it sorted out, though11:38
lennartall thanks to frinnst11:40
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diversebedis: ^11:43
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joe9 /ws 4413:44
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diversequiet channel we got20:07
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tilmanteK_: afaics opt/gnupg  misses a dependency on libpth22:43
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Romsterindeed diverse23:42
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Romsterhmm i'm on amdfam10 and no avx instruction i guess it's removed on newer amd's23:47
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Romsterintel can have avx too.23:52
prologichey Romster23:56
prologicknow any cheap dedicated hosting down our way?23:57
Romsterulikely but i can ask andrew that does our hosting stuff tomorrow.23:57
prologicgreatly appreciate it23:58
Romsterhosting down under is often more costs than overseas23:58
prologicI want another box in AU23:58
prologicbut I don't want to pay more than $100/month23:58
Romsterbut it makes sense for a local site23:58
prologicdual/quad core with 8GB ram is all I need23:58
Romsterand how much space?23:58
prologicit's not most costly23:58
prologicwe just rip ourselves off23:58
prologicgreedy aussies :)23:58
prologicie: I want a small 1RU box with a Intel Core i3 with 8GB RAM and a 500GB SATA hdd23:59
prologicthat's all :)23:59
prologicor something similar23:59

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