IRC Logs for #crux Tuesday, 2013-08-20

BurnZeZWorkster: Thanks00:09
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frinnstBurnZeZ are your ports up to date? i think this was fixed with some glibc-32 commit07:26
frinnstoh, sorry. nevermind07:26
frinnstnot sdl-32 :)07:26
frinnst=======> Building '/usr/ports/pkg/libsdl#1.2.15-2.pkg.tar.gz' succeeded.07:26
frinnstfor what its worth07:26
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frinnstwhy are hp's 146gig sas drives still so fucking expensive?09:00
teK_do they relabel ohter drivers, too? We once bought fujitsu sas disks which were, in fact, seagate drives09:03
teK_frinnst: did you try sdl-2, too?09:03
frinnstyeah they all do. these are usually seagate with hp firmware09:03
teK_doh :-009:03
frinnstsdl-32? no, i dont use it and dont have the deps installed to test09:04
frinnsthm, doesnt fujitsu still make their own drives?09:04
teK_we were offered this in 2007:09:05
teK_HD SAS 3Gb/s 146GB 15k hot plug 3.5"     6x 304,0009:05
frinnsthah, how sad09:06
frinnst these are 2.5" 10k09:06
frinnstmaybe one can find on ebay or something09:07
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frinnst3 drives: Current bid:09:08
frinnstUS $58.9909:08
teK_fucking aurad (web interface for lsi/fsc raid controller) won't work09:09
teK_The connection was reset09:09
teK_so I can't tell you which disks are in there but I think we had a mix of fsc and seagate labeled disks09:10
frinnstOur old netapp had a mix of seagate sas and fujitsu fc iirc09:13
frinnstnew one has hitachi09:13
teK_doesn't matter; ssds crush them all together in term of performance09:14
mike_kany idea why some ports were trying to find old version? gtk being the most painful and I had to rebuild all its deps recursively.09:15
frinnstdid you rebuild harfbuzz?09:15
mike_kwhen in fact only boost depends on icu directly09:15
mike_kI have no that beast09:16
frinnstthe icu/harfbuzz adventure a while back was a big mess09:16
frinnsticu infects everything :)09:16
mike_kfrinnst: thanks. I've came across harfbuzz while searching, but somehow decided it was not present on my system (09:17
frinnstpango depends on it (and gtk depends on pango)09:19
teK_libpng was fun, too09:30
frinnstenjoy that :D09:44
frinnst(on hold for 3.1)09:44
frinnstbreaks everythiiiiing09:44
teK_how old is png? how old is libpng? why a 'major' version change every year (and a half)?09:48
frinnst has been widely used and tested for over 16 years.09:49
frinnstaccording to wikipedia09:49
teK_ok then.. wtf09:51
frinnstwhy the api/abi breaks every once in a while.. dunno, poor design?09:56
frinnstit has its fair share of security issues, so trying to keep up to date with the most maintaaned version09:56
frinnstwatching backup to tape progress bars sure is fun!09:59
teK_tar has a progress bar? With Gentoo's patched -g flag?10:09
frinnstno, veeam backup10:10
frinnstslower than netbackup for some reason10:11
teK_this vm thingy, right?10:24
teK_does it freeze the VM or does it use some kind of hdd and memory snapshots?10:29
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: subversion: updated to 1.8.111:14
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: neon: updated to 0.30.011:14
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: libsdl2: initial import11:14
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: subversion-bashcompletion: bumped version number11:14
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: openldap: updated to 2.4.3611:14
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Romsterand i just finished doing a sysup....11:15
rauzhi guys11:16
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Romsterwhy did he quit...11:17
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Romsterthere you are.11:20
Romsteryou crashed or something?11:21
Romstersoemoen had isues buuilding libsdl can you take a look?11:22
Romsteri haven't looked yet i had some hardware issues to deal with. and a few hours of fsck11:22
sepenhmmm libsdl 1.2?  or new libsdl2?11:23
Romsterlibx11 prottype clash in header file for libx11 or something....11:24
Romsteri don't have the log11:24
sepenI added a patch about libx11 in the past11:24
Romstersaw it at work11:24
Romsteri saw tht11:24
sepenBuilding succeeded here11:24
Romsterok guess it was him then...11:25
sepenwait, I'll change my MAKEFLAGS and try11:25
Romsterrebuilding it on my working system. since i use it.11:25
Romster-j20 here11:25
sepen-j4 here11:26
Romsterthat built ok11:26
Romsterguess BurnZeZ has broken something.11:26
Romsterwhat uses sdl2?11:26
sepenRomster: well, sdl2 is also a library for people who want to write source or migrate existing one11:27
sepenagain libsdl built ok here11:28
sepenmaybe he has an old copy for the port, no idea11:28
Romsteryeah dunno....11:29
Romsterah added it for convenience i see.11:30
Romsteri have yet to make sakura use gtk3 and newer vte too.11:31
frinnstteK_: regular vmware snapshot with guest processing (vss, sql truncating etc) for windows11:42
frinnstyou guys dont run vmware, right?11:42
teK_not in production11:42
rauzlibsdl update did work just fine for me too11:42
teK_I'm still stuck and somewhat undermotivated with migrating win2k server into a VM11:43
frinnstwell, if you have esxi installed i'd suggest giving the trial a go11:43
frinnsthah, KILL IT WITH FIRE11:43
frinnstwhat do you need win2k for? some super-custom-business-critical application?11:44
sepenwasnt it= FIGHT FIGHT WITH FIRE11:44
teK_it's esxi, yes. Killing it with fire would mean costly migration of the archiving software and jukebox hardware11:44
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Romsterwish it was all in linux it would be so much easier to migrate stuff11:46
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: samba: update to 4.0.912:24
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: rpcbind: update to 0.2.112:24
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: spamprobe: fix build with giglib 5.x, patch provided by Alan12:24
cruxbot[core.git/3.0]: libgmp: use install instead of cp to install gmp.h12:25
cruxbot[core.git/3.0]: libdevmapper: update to 1.02.7912:25
cruxbot[opt.git/3.0]: lvm2: update to 2.02.10012:26
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teK_Romster: yes indeed but then you cannot sell products for migrating installations (os/software) :)13:07
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jaegerI love vSphere/ESXi, we use it for most of our infrastructure here13:26
jaegerhaven't used veeam, though13:26
jaegerfrinnst: one of my coworkers and I will be at VMworld next week, should be interesting13:28
teK_still sceptical. :>13:33
rauzwe are useing m$ hyper V for windows virt. and kvm for our linux stuff13:37
teK_because it's more code thrown on the same problem and more code means more bugs.. and yes there are mitigations in place -> scepticism13:38
frinnstjaeger: ooooh, jealous13:39
teK_And I am very well aware of the advantages and the increased flexibility that comes with virtualised environments .. you trade that for more code and complexity :)13:39
jaegerteK_: I'm not sure what you mean... was just curious, though13:39
jaegerThe code side of things is invisible to us13:39
frinnstunfortunately you cant handle a very diverse infrastructure with kvm regardless of frontend imo13:40
frinnstwell, maybe if you have more time than money :)13:40
jaegerI've used kvm very little and hyper-v not at all so I can't really compare them all that way13:40
jaegerI love virtualization, though13:40
frinnsthyperv has its uses. We run a replica solution for a customer over wan, veeery slick13:41
rauzi have to say the hyperV stuff works very well for the M$ stuff (servers desktop virt.)13:41
tilmanteK_: yeah, better only run apps that are made of <= 10k loc13:41
rauzthe download url in the pkg file for lvm2 does not work13:43
teK_tilman: yeah .. :P13:43
teK_frinnst: what's the matter with kvm?13:44
jaegerteK_: regarding that win2k server, any way you can p2v it with kvm instead of having to rebuild?13:45
jaeger <-- for example13:45
jaegerer, that's the wrong link, meant to link virt-p2v13:46
jaegeranyway, that's the idea13:46
teK_I'd prefer vmware in this environment tbh, because it's not certain how long I will be available for servicing this company/kvm. Our hardware supplier has inhouse knowledge of vmware so this would be the better choice in this case13:46
jaegerOh, I guess they're on the same page13:46
teK_sweet... :)13:46
teK_I had success with vmwares p2v product with a win2k machine13:47
teK_and it's not that I think that virtualisation 'd be braindead.. I maintan qemu for a reason13:47
jaegerI had to use vmware's converter a few months back to rescue a server 2003 machine, it was a mess13:49
teK_yeah :\13:49
jaegeribm desktop machine with 2 IDE hard drives in some weird software RAID1 setup I didn't even know server 2k3 could do13:49
jaegerone drive had failed a long time ago, the other was clicking and in the process of dying13:49
teK_I did not manage to get an uptodate version of this tool even though I "accquired" stuff from some shady .to sites :P13:49
jaegertook us over 30 minutes just to boot it to run the p2v tool13:49
teK_ok but it was not the p2v's fault?13:50
jaegerIt was in a rack in the main hospital, sitting on top of some other machine... no UPS13:50
jaegerno, p2v worked fine, the hardware was dying quickly13:50
jaegerwe were lucky we got it that day, we'd probably have lost it otherwise13:50
jaegerNothing that flashy, sadly :)13:50
teK_what's wrong with me :\13:50
teK_I think we already discussed this but without a real concept for fault tolerance I'd never virtualise our domain controller or the "SAP" server13:51
jaegerAnyone use NFS 4 with an active directory/kerberos integration setup?13:51
jaegerOur only servers that aren't virtualized are exchange now... the windows guy did finally virtualize AD, though it took him 2 years13:52
jaegerer, 3 years13:52
teK_he's scared of having to reinstall the exchange stuff13:52
jaegerWell, only things that are vital... I have some data analysis servers that are physical13:52
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jaegerhaha, right :P This is a guy who regularly breaks exchange in the middle of business hours13:53
jaegerhe's not "afraid", he's a bad sysadmin13:53
Romsteryeah shit like that should be done outside of business hours13:54
teK_shit like that should be installed outside my company13:54
jaegerMy favorite one was when he tried to add a blacklist type service to exchange13:54
jaegerhe put the blacklist service host into a whitelist input13:55
jaegerand was surprised when email from every other host stopped13:55
Romsterda faq...13:55
jaegerThen swore up and down he hadn't changed anything when I found the problem13:55
teK_that's the thing you get to hear from ordinary users.. SHAME on him13:56
teK_you should have asked what he changed before he did not change anything13:57
jaegerIf our users didn't rely so heavily on outlook calendaring I'd have replaced exchange with postfix and dovecot or something13:57
teK_same here13:58
teK_so it's exchange for calendars and sendmail for internal mail :P13:58
jaegerexchange is also a bad IMAP server sometimes... this morning, for example, it told me I had 19 new messages in my cron folder, so I thought something was throwing errors... it was really only 4 messages but it didn't tell me that until I opened the folder13:59
teK_smart caching !!114:00
teK_I think that MS got sloppy in their only strong domain which is, to me, UI/usability in terms of joe average user.. best example is Windows 814:06
frinnstoh my...14:06
frinnstjaeger do you use pwqgen for passwords? just a heads up, it can generate some non-sfw passwords :)14:07
jaegerI use pwgen14:08
Romsternon-sfw passwords ftw14:09
Romstertitsarseman :D14:09
frinnsti cant share it, im using it in production! :D14:09
Romsteroh shit better change that password14:09
jaegerteK_: I find windows 8 pretty amusing, honestly. I've got it on my laptop at work and the first thing I do when booting it is start desktop mode14:09
frinnsthad to write a disclamer in our docs :)14:09
jaegerteK_: to me that's a failure on MS' part :P14:09
Romsterso it generates curse words?14:09
teK_jaeger: there's a tool for that. It even has a start button!14:10
frinnstyeah pwqgen generates human-readable passwords14:10
frinnstfredrik@farnsworth:~$ pwqgen14:10
teK_and yes: failure on MS' side14:10
teK_ass8licker*cunt :D14:11
frinnstteK_: CLOSE! :D14:11
jaegerteK_: I don't really see a need for a tool since it's one click away... but my point was that if I immediately hide their new interface they've not succeeded in making it better :)14:11
teK_yes, it sucks :p14:11
teK_as simple as that14:12
frinnstislam+nepal6Worse <- hmmm :)14:12
drayevargi like cheese8grunteater, that's a pretty good nick14:13
frinnstalias pwqgen="ircnickgen"14:14
drayevarglol, yeah14:14
teK_I will be at a wedding this weekend.. the band's name/website is drumsdick -_-14:14
jaegerIronically my coworkers hate the passwords I generate with pwgen14:14
teK_jaeger: then hash them14:14
frinnstif you remember your passwords you are doing it wrong14:15
jaegerI mostly remember them via muscle memory, I would be hard pressed to actually tell you the characters14:15
frinnstyeah same here (the few i do remember)14:15
frinnstbut i have maybe musclememory capacity to store 5 passwords, tops14:16
jaegerget more muscle RAM!14:16
frinnstwhat does muscle swap look like? D;14:16
jaegersounds messy14:16
frinnstyes, gore14:17
teK_ok guys.. seriously14:17
jaegerSorry, it's not serious day.14:19
teK_oh ok, go on14:19
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cruxbot[contrib.git/3.0]: pip: update to 1.4.115:09
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.0]: virtualenv: update to 1.10.115:09
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.0]: stevedore: update to 0.1015:09
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.0]: stevedore: update footprint15:09
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.0]: virtualenvwrapper: update to 4.1.115:09
guzzanoHi, prt-get still does not remove orphaned dependencies?15:14
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sepenguzzano: do you mean something like apt-get autoremove?16:05
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sepenI used to run prtorphan16:06
sepencomo que soy de valencia ;D16:09
sepenguzzano: if you have a patch then you can file a ticket and attach your patch, see
sepenguzzano: no hagas cosas en vano, consulta con la gente en la ML o pon el ticket en flyspray16:11
sepenguzzano: please, use english here16:13
sepenit would be better to talk in spanish on private chat16:14
guzzanoOh, sorry, is that my english es very bad...16:14
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tilmanfrinnst: new firefox :D16:33
tilmanfrinnst: nvm ._o16:34
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frinnsttilman: WHO'S YOUR DADDY?!18:04
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