IRC Logs for #crux Monday, 2014-05-12

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thetornainbowhey guys, getting ready to install crux on its own partition (no more VM), but i wasn't sure how to setup /boot and the bootloader01:03
thetornainbowi dual boot arch + windows atm, and have arch's /boot mountpoint set to the EFI partition that windows had natively, and grub is already installed01:05
thetornainbowcould i mount crux's /boot to the existing EFI partition with grub already on it, and let grub find the kernel image for crux? or will grub detect vmlinuz images across disk partitions? or should i just write a script in /etc/grub.d/ that probes for kernel images on crux's part?01:07
prologicignore /boot as such01:08
prologicI almost never setup a separate boot partition01:08
prologicyou can if you wish :)01:08
prologicI just setup a single / (root file system)01:08
prologicoh EFI? :)01:09
thetornainbowyep :)01:09
prologicI have no experience with EFI :(01:09
prologicin any case whatever Arch can do CRUX can do01:09
prologicjust with a little more typing from you :)01:09
thetornainbowit's not too bad to point /boot to EFI partition that windows makes, then write a little entry for grub to go off of, but i wasn't sure if grub could load windows, arch, and crux and if so, how it would find the image unless i just wrote it myself.01:11
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nogagplzoh well go the other way, just add an entry pointing to your crux kernel and rootfs02:23
nogagplzdead simple02:23
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teK__diverse: you may use for perl08:07
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Romsteralso at with the most common crux source files.08:44
nogagplzhow big is that dir overall romster?08:46
Romsterdoing another run on it now...08:48
Romster12GB abouts.08:49
Romsterfew old files on it though08:49
Romstercore opt xorg contrib compat-32 romster08:50
Romsterdunno whos else i should be tracking.08:50
Romster even have a sum file08:51
Romster*.log *.list files too for downloads.08:52
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frinnstRomster: but do you have a sum of *MD5SUMS* ????08:58
frinnstrecursive checksums required08:58
frinnstwtf the locale-maketext url is broken again?09:00
frinnsthm, seems like has some issues09:00
Romsterno it seems the entire site is down.09:02
Romsterfrinnst, haha09:02
Romsterthe perl site must of got over loaded and broke due to the sudden influx of downloads i guess09:09
BitPuffinmornin folks09:16
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Romstermorning BitPuffin10:02
BitPuffinhey Romster10:03
BitPuffinRomster: I wanted to point something out yesterday but you weren't here10:03
Romsteroh what was it? broken port?10:03
BitPuffinRomster: basically, the jack port in contrib should probably ship with the jack dbus stuff because otherwise jack_start etc (which is commands that come with jack) is completely useless10:04
Romsteri do read the backlog but i didn't see anything.10:04
Romsterjack dbus -_-10:04
Romsterbeen awhile since i ran jack10:04
Romsterws on my previous install.10:04
BitPuffinwell it is useful10:05
BitPuffinit's better than having to restart jack all the time :P10:05
Romsterfelt heart broken when wine dropped jack support.10:05
BitPuffinthey did? I'm pretty sure there are ways to run wine stuff with jack10:05
BitPuffinlike you can run REAPER in wine and have it show up in jack I believe10:06
Romsteryeah but they had native support.10:06
BitPuffindidn't know that10:06
BitPuffintoo bad they removed it10:06
BitPuffinjack is the shit10:06
BitPuffinbut I guess they didn't give jack shit10:06
BitPuffineither way10:06
Romsteri complained and they said unless someone is willing to maintain it....10:07
Romsterso dbus how did you enable that?10:07
BitPuffinthe way the jack port is packaged is that it includes both the jack and jack-dbus commands, but it doesn't actually come with the dbus plugin for jack10:07
Romsteri never had an issue using jack without dbus in the past.10:07
BitPuffinor wai10:08
BitPuffindoes it come with the jackdbus command?10:08
BitPuffinI guess maybe the problem is that I'm starting it with jackd10:08
Romsterunless i was using the older jack-audio-connection-kit10:08
BitPuffinyeah it might just be my fault10:08
BitPuffinwill have to check when I get home10:08
BitPuffinor actually probably not10:08
BitPuffinbecause I can't run jack_start10:09
nwehow can I read the dump-file from rndc dumpdb -all10:09
BitPuffinbecause it will throw a python error that dbus can't find jack stuff or whatever10:09
Romsterprt-get fsearch jack_start10:10
Romsterdoens't even exist10:10
Romsterunless it's an extra binary when dbus is present.10:10
Romsteri need to check it.10:10
BitPuffinuh not sure if it is called jack_start10:14
BitPuffinI think it is jack_control start actually10:14
BitPuffinmy bad10:15
BitPuffinI'm just pulling what I can remember off the top of my head10:15
BitPuffinI'm at work10:15
BitPuffinso mac os x10:15
BitPuffincan't verify stuff :P10:15
Romsterthey use macs at work...10:17
Romsterthink you need to test and report at the time your findings. i can always look back in the log10:18
Romsteror flyspray or email me if it's easier.10:19
BitPuffinI can test when I get home :)10:20
BitPuffinjust wanted to give you a heads up10:20
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teK__ugh, new privilege escalation hitting  2.6.31 - 3.15rcX11:11
teK__oh boy :-)11:11
frinnstits not "new"11:17
frinnstthey attempted to patch it a week or so ago11:17
frinnstthe tty thing?11:17
frinnstsorry, pty11:17
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Romsterso why isn't that in yet or it is?11:29
Romsteror is that patch to hacky?11:29
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prologicprivilege escalation for?11:43
Romstertty i guess11:59
nwehey guys I question.. I trying to use kSar, and wondering if I need jre or jdk ?12:02
nwefor it..12:03
z3brajre to run it12:03
z3brajre = Runtime Environnement12:03
z3brajdk = Development Kit12:03
nwez3bra: thanks12:03
teK__I refred to the PoC frinnst. No need to be small-minded12:05
prologiceither or will work just fine12:09
frinnstI AM LARGE12:17
teK__possibly. But funny? Probably not.12:18
Romsterunless you need to built jar files you don't need jdk12:19
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nogagplzI needed to built jar files once12:20
Romsterstop cashing in my my bad choice of words.12:20
teK__iirc, jre does not include source code for standard libraries so you cannot debug using these, either.12:20
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Romsterprobably not. and some parts of jdk/jre are binary only as well.12:21
Romstercertain modules.12:21
teK__if you say so12:21
Romstersome parts are binary and no source is provided :/ like openjdk implement the open source parts but then removed the property parts.12:27
Romsterbut is of little concern since not much even uses the property parts in linux afaik.12:27
prologicRomster, they're callsed classes :)12:28
prologicJava has packages and classes :)12:28
Romsterblah -_-12:28
Romsteryou know what i mean.12:28
prologicshitty horribleness of a language :)12:28
Romsteri'm not a programmer.12:28
Romsteryeah will not learn it.12:28
prologicI had to create .jar and .javac files once upon a time12:29
prologicJava stack traces are super lovely12:29
Romsterso ugly.12:30
jaegerHe was young and needet the money!12:30
Romsterwish i had a better mental capacity to remember everything though.12:31
prologicjaeger, nah it was for Uni12:32
prologicif only I were paid to do it :)12:32
prologicto this day I just ignore Java job adverts12:32
prologicalmost in disgust :)12:32
prologicthe extra money you'd pay in tax (higher salary but not because of tax) and added stress is not worth it :)12:33
Romsterspyda is working better with tighter whitelists, i would love to be able to set PATTERN= as a environment variable or a file though.12:33
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prologicpull request :)12:34
prologicgo rip off kdb's config code which supports both -foo/--foo (long/short) cli options as well as FOO env var counterparts and a --config= (INI-style config file)12:35
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Romsteroh that's an idea thanks12:37
Romsterthat's a interseting metric prologic between income, code stress to debug/program vs the cost of seeing a doctor due to stress.12:38
Romsteror time off work.12:38
Romsterwhich is also cost.12:38
prologicbasic oligarchy economy of most of the modern world :)12:39
prologicthe most you earn, the more tax you pay12:40
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prologicunless you just happen to be one of the ones in the oligarchy and hide your millions/billions and get away without paying tax :)12:40
Romsteruntil they freeze your assets12:40
renovaatiohi, my startx session sudenly refusesto start, without any message printed, and nothing in /var/log12:40
renovaatioany hints?12:41
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Romsterrenovaatio, is sysklogd running?12:41
RomsterSYSLOG=sysklogd in /etc/rc.conf12:41
renovaatiolemme check12:41
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renovaatioRomster: yes12:42
Romsterpgrep syslogd12:42
prologichmm did not know this, but apparently you can mount --bind over the top of an existing file :)12:42
Romsterand you should have a Xorg.log in /var/log/ as well.12:42
renovaatioRomster: pid 18812:43
renovaatiothere is a Xorg.log in $var$log12:43
Romsteri thought that only worked on directories prologic12:43
prologicalso startx on a tty (console) should print "something"12:43
Romsterand what's in it wgetpaste it perhaps?12:43
prologicthe fact it prints nothing at all is worrying12:43
Romsterdid it work before? do you have a /etc/X11/xorg.conf file?12:44
renovaatioit worked yesterday12:44
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frinnstsome lockfile still around, perhaps?12:44
renovaatioit wirked after my last update last week, and after it as well12:44
Romsterand you did a sysup?12:44
renovaatioRomster: I dont have anything /etc/X11/xorg*12:45
Romsterprt-get update -fr $(revdep)12:45
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Romsteras root12:45
frinnstslim usually leaves a lockfile when i manage to crash the box, fucking stuff up the next boot12:45
prologicyou should (normally) not need an /etc/X11/xorg.conf12:45
prologicmodern Xorg shoudld normally figure out most things12:45
renovaatiofrinnst: i use startx12:45
Romsterrevdep is in prt-utils if oyu don't have that prt-get depinst prt-utils12:45
frinnstyou should have /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/12:45
Romsterit'll rebuild anything broken during a update.12:45
jaegerrenovaatio: anything if you capture both stdout and stderr to a log file? startx > wtf.log 2>&112:45
prologicstart &> log12:46
prologicyou *should* get something!12:46
Romsternot everyone needs a xorg.conf12:46
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RomsterX is pretty smart now.12:46
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renovaatioRomster: prt-get sysup -if --log --ignore=gcc,glibc12:46
prologicooer why ignore the toolchain? :)12:46
Romsterrenovaatio, check with revdep ^^12:47
Romsterwill take some time.12:47
prologiceven with a broken library you'll get an error about some library not available it's trying to laod12:47
Romsterand another note if oyu rebuild xorg-server be sure to rebuild input and video modules after.12:47
prologicare you sure /usr/bin/startx isn't just a file containing "#!/bin/bash\nexit 0" :)12:48
Romsterno log no error that is really weird.12:48
prologiconly way you'd get "nothing" :)12:48
Romsteror you made an alias12:48
Romsterto the same effect12:48
nogagplzor whatever has startx isn't installed12:48
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prologic$ wc -l $(which startx)12:49
prologic292 /usr/bin/startx12:49
prologic$ codepad < $(which startx)12:49
renovaatiostartx &> fuck_log12:49
renovaatioit worked that time12:49
renovaatiomakes no sense12:49
jaegerall you had to do is curse at it12:49
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prologicmakes no sense to us either :)12:49
Romsterwelcome to computers where no sense is made12:49
prologicmost Linux/UNIX systems I've ever worked with just dont' go "bellow up" like this12:49
prologicunless you have some really weird/bad hw failure :)12:49
prologicor it's r00ted12:49
Romsterbelly up12:49
prologicor you've encountered a really nice bug :)12:50
prologicsorry yes belly* :)12:50
Romsterit's probably PEBKAC12:50
prologicand yeah I don't agree with your statement "Romster> welcome to computers where no sense is made"12:50
Romsteri do it all the time.12:50
prologicthere is always a reaonable explaiantion :)12:50
Romsterwell most times...12:50
prologicit just is a trade off of how long you want to spend finding out :)12:51
Romsteri get some customers.12:51
prologicreboot is not the right solution :)12:51
Romsterunless it's windows12:51
renovaatiowellllll thanks guys12:51
prologicyeah well isn't that where the knee-jerk reaction came from? :)12:51
renovaatioyou are always hekpful12:51
prologicthank you?12:51
prologicwe did nothing :)12:51
prologicjust typical problem solving12:51
renovaatioyou were available and friendly12:52
prologicthis channel is logged12:52
prologicjust google for crux <insert your favourite problem here>12:52
prologicin the next day or two you'll be able to search for: "crux startx fuck you"12:52
prologichow sad12:52
Romstercrux i need coffee12:53
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prologicwe should have a talking crux mascot desktop assistant :)12:54
prologicthat responds to voice commands and behaves like Siri12:55
z3brawhat about a living clipper ?12:55
prologicnah that's M$'s idea of a desktop assistant :)12:56
prologickinda lame :)12:56
Romsterthere was that eyes thing that used to follow the mouse.12:56
prologicI said crux mascot :)12:57
prologicisn't that our little blue coloured penguin that sits on his ass? :)12:57
z3brait is12:57
Romsterour drunk penguin12:57
z3bra(i guess)12:57
z3brahe needs a bottle in his hands12:58
Romsterbtw did anyone makea  SVG of that mascot on the site?12:58
prologicI think it's been around for a while13:00
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frinnstor mascot looks fucked up :)13:02
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prologicwow :)13:03
prologicwho's behind this?13:03
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z3branot crux13:05
Romsteri saw that ages ago prologic13:05
Romsterthe due that made the mascot13:06
frinnstholy shit he's ugly13:07
nogagplzlol those eyes13:08
Romsteroh for gods sake....13:10
Romsterany one dare challenge me at table tennis <<13:11
Romsteris that your site frinnst ?13:11
prologicI dare :)13:12 ? yeah13:12
frinnstits the bottom one13:12
Romsterone of tese days need to photograph my trophies.13:12
Romsteris that were your server sits?13:13
Romsteri bet.13:13
nogagplzromster that is a very stylish part I must say13:14
Romsterhehe thanks13:14
frinnstyeeep server + backup server13:14
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Romsterhope it has ventilation13:15
Romsterdon't think i'd want a noisy server near the sofa though13:15
frinnstthose pics were taken just as i installed it. i've removed the back part - it got a little hot13:15
Romsteri was wondering that.13:16
frinnstand they are not noisy at all even with 5 disks in each13:16
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frinnsthp microservers just have one 120mm fan, cooling disks and cpu13:17
Romsterid install a fan that turns on at a certain temperature and have some thermo siphoning path13:17
frinnstAdapter: PCI adapter13:17
frinnsttemp1:        +42.5�C  (high = +70.0�C) (crit = +100.0�C, hyst = +95.0�C)13:17
Romsterok so no screaming fans13:17
frinnstthey are dirt cheap as well13:18
frinnstmodel name: AMD Turion(tm) II Neo N54L Dual-Core Processor13:20
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Romstergood enough for a server.14:02
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saptechhello all14:08
saptechI've since got my network up and running and now using Crux14:10
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jaegersaptech: good deal :)14:28
saptechthanks. I ended up reinstalling, the first install, I didn't do the modules correctly14:29
saptechand I made sure everything I needed for my device was included in the kernel14:29
saptechthanks to you, jaeger and others, who helped me get on the right trail14:30
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jaegerglad to help14:34
saptechhow often should you do the prt-get sysup?14:36
frinnstprt-get sysup by itself wont do much. you need to "ports -u" first14:37
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frinnstports -u could be run daily14:38
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saptechdag, freaking chatzilla14:39
frinnst16:38 <frinnst> ports -u could be run daily14:45
cruxbot[core.git/3.0]: perl: Updated Locale-Maketext URL14:46
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saptechis it okay to install two or more programs at the same time?15:16
jaegersure, if you have the CPU/RAM for it. You'll see a failure if both install processes try to update the package database at the same time but you can just re-add the one that failed15:19
teK__pkgadd acquires a lock on the DB before installing/upgrading packages so I suppose: yes15:19
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saptechok, thanks15:32
teK__but it fails immediately if it cannot get it. pussy :P15:34
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joacimwhich ssh clients for android do we like in this channel?15:56
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saptechI've heard ConnectBot is a good one. I've never used it but will once I get Crux setup completly15:59
saptechI need to access my home computer from work15:59
saptechconnectbot should be in the play store15:59
joacimand that is one tiny font16:03
saptechthe font?16:05
saptechconnectbot font16:06
saptechI don't do much surfing type of things on my phone, screen too small. I do have a 8 inch tablet16:06
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jaegerjoacim: I use one called JuiceSSH or something like that. it's ok. I haven't really shopped around16:24
joacimjuicessh seems to work well16:33
shatI use Juice on droid as well, Prompt for iOS16:46
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saptechI installed pcmanfm file manager, but no icon for folders/files17:05
saptechI tried searching for a few but no packages found. any suggestions?17:06
frinnstprt-get search icon17:08
frinnstnot sure what icons pcmanfm uses though17:08
frinnstbut i'd bet its just a gtk/gnome icon theme17:09
saptechsome docs I'm reading was using gnome-icon-themes and oxygen17:11
saptechas examples17:12
saptechprt-get search show these, hicolor-icon-themep5-text-iconvxorg-xf86-video-siliconmotion17:13
saptechhicolor-icon-theme, p5-text-iconv, xorg-xf86-video-siliconmotion17:14
saptechthe docs say hicolor won't work and look like the p5-text is text and xorg is video17:15
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cruxbot[contrib.git/3.0]: grub2-efi: initial import19:11
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j_vI'm working on a LinuxFromScratch install. I'd like to use pkgutils, prt-get, and maybe even ports to manage my system. Is there any objections to this usage? I ask because I would likely publish my port collection and system build files on github or some similar site.22:12
frinnstof course not, have fun22:15
j_vvery cool.22:16
frinnstif you make improvements, feel free to post it to our mailinglist22:16
j_vThat is reasonable.22:17
j_vI'm following an currently developing lfs hint for installing runit as both init and service manager. I've only got the rudimentary system up and running, but the dev's doing the work are make excellent progress.22:24
epitamizorhey how do i make the initrd?22:31
saptech prt-get search abiword[Config error: can't access /usr/ports/compat-32]No matching packages found. Does this mean there is no 64 bit version for Abiword?22:47
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pidsley j_v : I have CRUX ports working on an LFS system. It's not difficult.22:52
epitamizornm i got it running22:55
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j_vpidsley: that's great! I've been reading the docs and manuals for pkgutils and prt-get. It looks pretty straight forward. I'll be installing them after dinner and working on the configs toight and tommorow. Good to hear you can get ports working easily enough.23:05
pidsley:) good luck23:16
j_vThanks... I maintain some sbo slackbuilds, so it's a bit more compilcated than that. But much less complicated than the hairy mess of dpkg and apt.23:18
pidsleythe only problem I had was with thing I had already installed as part of the LFS build.23:21
pidsleyYou have to convince the ports system that those are already installed23:21
j_vYeah, I thought about that issue. I'm wondering how hard it will be to setup the lfs build to actually run from pkgmk Pkgfile's.23:22
pidsleyI started with LFS, and then did most of what they call BLFS with ports (xorg, etc)23:23
pidsleybut if you started earlier it might be easier. I just wanted to see if I could do it23:24
j_vVery cool that you did. The three linux's that I like are slack, crux, and lfs... though I've had the least exposure to crux.23:25
pidsleycrux is probably my favorite distro. I am having some problems with a new install on a test machine23:26
pidsleythat I will probably ask about here shortly. but I have had it running for almost a year on another machine23:27
pidsleyslack always puts me off because i don't know how to do a minimal install23:27
j_vminimal is though with slack, but I just leave out the DE's and that drops a lot of the cruft for me. I run a bare X session, so I don't need much. I will probably install a crux system to a box I'm intending to rework... maybe later this month.23:29
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pidsleyi know other people who love slackware, but i've just never been one of them. perhaps i should try it again23:32
jaegersaptech: if prt-get can't find it then it's not available in the repos that you already have on your system. you can also search
j_vI'm not trying to push slack... it has advantages, but I don't think it's any better than crux.23:34
pidsleyi know -- i like to try other distros, and i have tried slack, it just doesn't make me as happy as some others23:35
jaegerI'm completely out of touch with slack, last version I used was slackware '9623:35
pidsley@jaeger ; do you use anything other than crux?23:36
jaegermy personal stuff is all crux. at work I also use ubuntu and some centos23:36
jaegerIn the past, though, I've used most of the popular dists23:36
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pidsleyi have too many installs, on too many machines ;)23:37
pidsley@jaeger, I mentioned a problem i was having with a new crux install -- I can't build glibc-32. i don't have the exact error message23:37
pidsleybut i will have it in a few minutes23:38
pidsleymy old install updates fine, it's just this new install that fails23:38
jaegerpidsley: you can't build a lot of things if glibc-32 isn't already installed23:38
jaegerdid you not install glibc-32 from the ISO/CD?23:38
saptechjaeger thanks again23:39
jaegerIt's an integral part of the toolchain which is why it's the only *-32 port in core23:39
jaegersaptech: np23:39
pidsleyI did a regular install, installed the core packages, and then once it was installed I tried to update, and the update fails23:39
pidsleythe system runs, it just won't update23:39
jaegerah, that's odd. well, pastebin the error if you can23:39
saptechI've been running Mageia 4 and Salix OS23:40
pidsleywill do. it's trying to build now, i expect it will fail and i will post the error23:40
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pidsleysaptech : do you like salix ?23:49
saptechyes its pretty solid23:50
saptechSlackware made easy23:51
saptechit uses slapt-get for pkg manager23:51
pidsley;) did you install the core, or basic, or full install ?23:51
saptecha full xfce version23:51
pidsleyreally made easy then23:52
saptechat the time I was in a hurry to install something from a hard drive crash23:52
pidsleyi should try it on one of my test machines23:53
saptechgo for it. it's slack compatible23:53
pidsleyi have very limited experience with slackware23:53
pidsleyjust about everything else, but slack always puts me off for some reason23:54
pidsleywhat are they using for init now ?23:55

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