IRC Logs for #crux Thursday, 2014-07-17

Workstercrux 3.1 is out for those that don't know yet.00:02
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kruecongrats on the release :)00:06
Worksterto the entire dev team00:11
diverseWorkster: yeah I saw frinnst change the topic and that's when I found out00:18
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prologicyes congrats guys :)01:57
prologicwell done :)01:57
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darfo3.1 cheers for the Crux team03:35
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nrxtxnice work06:13
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timcowchipis the only diff between RC3 and 3.1 is linux-3.12.24 instead of 3.12.22?07:00
timcowchiplooks like I'm rebuilding another kernel07:06
frinnstyou should get your kernels from instead07:08
frinnstthe kernel shipped on the iso is quickly outdated07:08
timcowchipok thanks frinnst07:11
timcowchipand thanks for the new release :)07:12
Worksterand the glibc patch07:17
Worksterwhich sysup will also do anyways07:17
Worksterthose that use compat-32 will have todo some manual port removal and insertions07:18
Worksterbut i dunno how many use those.07:18
frinnstprtorphan ftw07:19
frinnstI have lots of 32bit stuff installed on my workbox. libjpeg-32 was the only orphaned port07:19
Workstermostly around mesa3d-32 and a few xorg-*-32 ports07:20
frinnstand its not like its suddenly gonna stop working07:20
Worksteroh and webkit is split into webkit-gtk2 and webkit-gtk3 now07:20
Worksterlibpng should be named libpain07:21
Worksterrequires /everything/ to be rebuilt07:21
Worksterdid you read about mozjpeg07:21
frinnstno but looking now. libjpeg-turbo fork?07:22
Worksterkinda it's more towards more compression07:22
Worksterthey recomend to keep using libjpeg-turbo for decompression07:23
Worksterbbs home time07:23
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frinnstyeah it seems to aim to replace the encoders people use07:25
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mapemaHello. Do you know where is the source code for CRUX's udevd?09:02
frinnstcrux 3.1 uses eudev09:06
frinnstyou can check the core/eudev/Pkgfile what happens when you build the port09:06
frinnstthe url to the tarball is included there09:06
frinnst3.0 used an older udev version. Same thing there: check the Pkgfile09:07
frinnstand this is how eudev is built:
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Romsterif anyone wants serious download speeds without using a torrent ^ recommends aria2 or any other metalink enabled download manager10:10
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Romsteror even down them all in firefox10:49
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thetornainbowcan i upgrade to 3.1 without the .iso? when i tried with the .iso it noted 227 errors and gave message (use -u to upgrade), but i thought that's what the upgrade option in the installer is for?12:24
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Romsterwhy would you do it without the iso?12:29
Romster227 errors how?12:30
Romsterdid you even down arrow and select upgrade then enter?12:30
thetornainbowyep. i went through them individually.12:32
thetornainbowor do you mean the very first step of the installer?12:32
Romstershouldn't need too.12:32
Romsteronce you mount root and type setup12:32
Romsteryou select the second option not the first one.12:32
Romsterto upgrade and it just works.12:33
thetornainbowi did it twice to make sure i had selected upgrade12:33
Romsteri've upgraded 5 machines here with no issues. and 1 was a fresh 3.1 install.12:33
Romsterroot is read write ?12:34
thetornainbowit is. i'm able to chroot in from .iso and make changes.12:34
thetornainbowperhaps i was just making some small mistake. i'm not at home at the moment, but i thought i'd ask just in case i was missing something.12:36
thetornainbowi'll try it later, but thanks for the input!12:36
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Romsteryou might be chrooting setup-chroot before setup? when that's done after.12:43
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thetornainbowi've just been following the install guide. so setup. when i get errors regarding updgrades abort installation. then setup-chroot.12:46
Romsterjust select core only to upgrade?12:47
Romsterthere is ways to manually do an upgrade but it's not exactly for the faint of heart.12:47
Romsterand i can't see why it would fail.12:48
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Romstertake a screen shot with a camera? double check your commands.12:48
Romstersure you have the correct disk and partition for crux root12:49
Romsterabout all i can sagest i'd help you more but your not in front of the pc atm.12:49
thetornainbowyeah i'll try to only upgrade core. i definitely have correct disk and part though.12:50
Romsterif you can get core done setup-chroot and then go rebuild your kernel and get it to boot.12:50
Romsterand rejmerge and the usual for ports update and rebuilding12:51
Romsterrather strange.12:51
thetornainbowit had already detected the 3.14 kernel i had built for 3.012:51
Romsteryou can keep the kernel although it wouldn't hurt to make clean make again and install the rebuilt kernel to the newer tool chain.12:51
thetornainbowthat's true.12:52
Romsteri always do that for good measure.12:52
Romsterjust measn you wont have X until you rejmerge and ports -u ; pet-get update -fr `revdep` ; prt-get sysup12:53
Romsterlast two steps might need a few runs.12:53
thetornainbowpet-get? :)12:53
Romsterprt-get sorry...12:53
thetornainbowhaha, didn't know that was in prt-get....12:54
Romsteralias pet-get=p'rt-get' :P kidding my typo12:54
thetornainbowi have pg as prt-get12:54
Romster`revdep` is the same as $(revdep) it's a subshell12:54
thetornainbowright. would i need to prt-get cache as well before sysup?12:55
Romsterand revdep is in prt-utils12:55
Romsternah not unless you do prt-get cache then use prt-cache12:55
Romsteras a quicker way todo stuff. as prt-get takes time to re-read dependencies etc.12:56
Romsteri used to use prt-cache but i got lazy lately12:56
Romsterjust means on ports -u you also need todo prt-get cache before you can trust prt-cache12:57
Romsterthat's if you use prt-cache12:57
thetornainbowokay for some reason i thought prt-get cache was similar to pacman's cache or apt-cache and was sourced when using prt-get commands12:59
Romsterprt-get cachel updates the cache of ports that prt-cache then uses. than to keep reading Pkgfiles every single time.13:00
Romsterits sourced when you use prt-cache the rest of the options are as far as i know compatible with prt-get and prt-cache the later being cached.13:01
thetornainbowi was not aware of that distinction. nifty. i thought i just didn't notice the effects of caching13:02
Romsterthat could be the case. if you use prt-get as the kernel keeps buffers in the extra memory and wont empty that unless it needs that extra ram.13:06
Romsterso prt-get after the first run is quicker due to disk cacheing in ram13:07
Romsterbut it's not guaranteed to stay in ram while prt-cache should have consistent results in speed.13:08
Romsteron fast hardware though you barely see the difference.13:08
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thetornainbowbut if you feeeeeel like there's a difference, that makes all the difference right?13:09
Romsterpretty much it depends on the hardware what files speed of disks amount of ram... pretty much what oyu do if it flushes the disk cache out or not. or how often you use a command and if it's perceived as slow to you or not.13:13
Romsterits like optimizing if it feels faster smoother etc...13:14
jaegerIf the errors are a result of a user mistake that's one thing but if they're a legitimate problem in the install we'd like to know about it to fix13:14
thetornainbowsure. i'll try it again this evening.13:14
thetornainbowand i kept getting the strange sense that my computer was becoming sentient when i booted the 3.1 .iso13:15
Romstersure hope it's not a bug in the iso. but i haven't tested it since rc213:15
thetornainbowi'm so glad you put that right after me13:15
Romsterno problem.13:16
Romsterwould like to see the results though.13:16
thetornainbowwill do.13:16
Romsterand if any more issues if it was a pebkac13:16
Romsteror a serious bug13:16
Romsterargh why are gnome libs such a pain.13:25
mapemathanks for the answer, bye13:33
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bluenessfrinnst if there are any problems with eudev, just ping me13:33
Romsteroh hey blueness gentoo dev :)13:36
bluenessRomster, greetz!13:37
Romsterfrugalware and gentoo lurkers hehe.13:37
Romsternever ran gentoo but i often look though ebuilds for patches and configure options etc.13:38
Romsteri worry one day even eudev wont run on the kernel?13:38
Romsteror that gentoo will be happy with systemd and eudev gets dropped.13:39
Romstercan't really forsee the future though of what will happen.13:39
Romsteri'm happy with eudev13:40
jaegerkdbus coming up may be a turning point for udev/eudev, not sure13:40
Romsterand that13:43
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frinnstblueness: cheers. I guess we are one of the earlier adopters of eudev? :)14:26
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bluenessfrinnst, we started it for lots of different reasons, but my primary reason is because i do embedded system stuff in gentoo, so i create all the uclibc images in <gentoo_mirror>/experimental/<arch>/uclibc15:01
bluenessas well as /musl15:01
bluenessso even though systemd-udev was building as a standalone, it was a problem, so i continued maintaining it15:01
bluenesswith the recent noice about dropping netling and moving to kdbus via sd_* calls in udev, this would make a stand alone udev impossible15:02
bluenessthis is even more reason now for the fork15:02
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jaegerblueness: how will it jive with the upcoming dbus fuckery?15:02
bluenessits being used in, eg., buildroot15:02
bluenessjaeger, it won't, so i'm going to have to cull out that code15:03
bluenesswrite an entire separate implementation15:03
bluenessi don't think netlink is going away anytime soon, but i did email the big Kahuna (aka Linus) whether he would preserve the components in the kernel needed to keep the current eudev or systemd-udev going15:04
bluenesshe didn't answer :(15:04
bluenessthe choice15:04
bluenessif i tease out the kdbus code from systemd and make for a separate implementation, then its a lot of work, but i will be able to track systemd-kernel lock-in-step development15:05
bluenessor if i continue maintaining the current, then its less work but i run the risk of being deprecated15:05
jaegerI'm guessing those components will not be preserved15:07
jaegerLinus doesn't seem to have any interest in reigning that stuff in15:07
bluenessi'll have to look at what else is still using netlink15:07
bluenessthis might be the time to learn kdbus stuff15:08
teK__Linus always has had a big priority on not breaking already existing user-land interfaces etc.15:08
teK__at least he stated that numerous times15:08
bluenesshmm ... just read up on kdbus ... looks promising15:20
bluenesswe'll have to decide when we see what comes down the pipe15:21
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jaegerIt would be nice if we could continue to use eudev, it works rather well. I'm just hoping that it doesn't get pushed out completely15:31
tilmannew x server w/ glamor integration15:36
jaegerIs it glamorous? :)15:36
tilmanprobably not, it's graphics stuff after all15:36
joacimfake boobs and all15:36
tilmanmissign link to in the announcement blurb on ;]15:44
frinnstoh you picky bastard15:45
tilmannot picky15:45
tilmangood stuff in there15:45
tilmanalmost exciting15:45
tilman /etc/rc.d/lo seems like heresy though15:46
frinnstHAPPY NOW?! :D15:46
frinnstoh surprise, ze germans are ganging up on me re. rc.d/lo15:47
tilmandidn't know it was brought up before15:53
joacimOpen wide, the germans are coming.15:57
diverseoh cool, we got one of the gentoo devs lurking here15:59
jaeger <-- sophos' marketing is great :D16:02
bluenessjaeger, any deprecation of netlink would be years in the making16:04
bluenessits not like it would catch us by surprise16:04
jaegerI'm sure it would take a while, yeah16:10
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joacimI'm glad I don't have to do admin work for friends for free anymore16:39
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frinnstX.Org X Server 1.16.021:33
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mechaniputerI just updated from 3.0 to 3.1. Everything is working fine for me so far, but Is anybody else seeing "udevd[1148]: specified group 'input' unknown"22:57
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jaegermechaniputer: rejmerge your /etc/group file23:47
jaegeror just add the new input group, gid 22 by default I think23:47
mechaniputerjaeger, thanks!23:59

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