IRC Logs for #crux Thursday, 2014-11-27

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Workstermhe, did you learn anything from this? or is there something your trying to use this for?00:15
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xeirrrmorning from GMT+800:17
nbinoxeirrr: hi from GMT00:21
korihello from GMT -300:24
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Worksteralmost noon form +10GMT + DST00:44
Worksterfrom*00:44
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diverseI heard gtalk and facebook are going to switch from using XMPP to their own proprietary protocols06:21
diverseI'm getting more interested in using Tox now06:21
tvaalenSeparate protocols or are they cooperating?06:42
diverseseparate06:42
tvaalenWhat a bunch of dumbasses.06:43
diverseindeed they are06:43
tvaalen"Ooh, we're so good. We're never evil."06:44
diverseYou should see that "Google, don't be evil" video with darth vadar at the end06:44
diverseold, but still relevant today06:45
tvaalenYeah, that's how it always goes with big companies that are still hip and trusted.06:46
tvaalenAlways turn into assholes.06:46
tvaalenThey're almost making Microsoft look good these days.06:47
tvaalenGoogle, Facebook, Apple, etc.06:47
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diversetvaalen: well this is encouraging me to stop using gtalk and move to an open protocol like tox06:52
tvaalenYeah, been looking at tox as well.06:54
tvaalenQuestion is if your average user ever will though. That's the big problem.06:54
diversewell, it won't be hard to persuade anyone to create an account06:55
diverseat least people that I know and met in RL06:55
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diversetvaalen: just tell them you don't trust the other IMs and tell them the benefits of tox and persuade them to create one07:29
nbino_I'm leting google adiction by steps07:30
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diversenbino_: what?07:32
nbino_diverse: bad english :P07:44
diversenbino_: care to rephrase?07:48
nbino_slowly avoiding google services, at the moment only using email...07:50
diverseI see07:50
nbino_if a package like glibc is updated, then is a new "crux release" ?07:51
diverseso "I'm avoiding google's intervention, step by step"?07:51
Romstermore new users?07:51
nbino_yes Romster07:52
nbino_:)07:52
Romstercool07:52
diverseRomster: nbino has been here for a week now?07:52
Romsterdepends if it's a security fix we just bump it07:52
diverse2 weeks I think07:52
Romsterif it's a new branch that will be changed on the next crux iso release07:52
nbino_configuring this so litle take me 2 weeks :)07:52
Romsterdepends how many things you install and how you want it.07:53
diverseRomster: tvaalen was an old crux user but came back07:53
Romsterbeen busy so i haven't noticed everyone.07:54
Romstermhe, everything almost is i'll get to it.07:54
nbino_Romster: I'm tryng to have the minimum packages installed,07:54
Romsterah nice07:54
Romsterstay clear of the ones i maintain then most have a few dependencies.07:54
Romsterfew being a understatement.07:55
Romsternot sure how much english you know07:55
nbino_how I find you in pkginfo -i | grep Romster ?07:55
Romsterthat wont work.07:56
Romsterpkginfo -i only lists package and version installed on your system07:57
nbino_humm, then I need prt-get info on each package07:57
Romsterhttp://portdb.zero-io.net/search and search for "romster"07:58
Romsterhmm that doesn't give a total though it's around 300 or so.07:59
Romsterthey work just i have a lot of dependencies for video audio codecs mostly.07:59
diverseRomster: btw, if you want to clean out some ports, you can get rid of the linphone ones, I don't use them07:59
Romsteri odn't use linphone i was just trying that out ages ago actually.08:00
nbino_Romster: :D wow08:01
diverseI think tox will be better, so I'm going to try that as a skype replacement08:01
diverseand gtalk replacement08:02
Romsterso i read gtalk moving away08:02
Romsterhalf the reason for my new romster.me domain was to start migrating my emails to that away from gmail.com08:03
diverseyeah they are abandoning XMPP08:03
Romsterthen later host my own mail server08:03
Romsternot at home but on a host in a docker container.08:03
diverseI have a view gmail accounts I need to delete as well that I don't use08:04
diverse*few08:04
Romstermore like make inaccessable while google still use them for data.08:04
diverseyeah I know08:04
diverseone account I never used, one account I migrated from08:05
diversethey won't get much of anything from the former08:05
Romsteri got mostly mailing lists on mine08:05
diversethat email discussion yesterday got me thinking about using fastmail08:06
Romsteri read that too.08:06
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Romsterdunno if anyone is better than another.08:07
Romsteruh oh nbino must of rebooted.08:07
diverseor lost internet connection temporarily08:08
Romsteror that08:08
diversesometimes my ISP randomly kills my internet connection, usually after midnight on random days, and I hate having to count my timeouts up to 150 seconds or so08:09
diverseand then comes back on after 3 minutes08:10
diverseso annoying08:10
diverseit happens once or twice, weekly08:11
Romsteryeah 2 nights ago it was out for 3 hours and 40 minutes.08:12
Romsterwas not happy.08:12
diverseouch08:13
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diversenbino: welcome back08:13
Romsterwb nbino08:13
nbino:)08:14
Romsterbtw if you ever need the channel log http://irclogs.shortcircuit.net.au/%23crux/latest.log.html08:14
diversewe were talking about how much is sucks to have a ping timeout08:14
diverseand internet loss08:15
Romsteryeah08:15
Romsterdidn't miss much08:15
nbinothanks, will look,08:15
nbinoI'm poluting the chat ?08:15
diverseno08:15
nbinoI dont even notice I lost the connection08:16
diversethe worst offend is that pal_bth dude08:16
diverse*offender08:16
Romsterwell my work connection the other day was also bad08:17
Romsterglad that's fixed.08:17
diversewell the problem with that other person was that he doesn't respond at all, just idles here and lets it happen over and over and over again08:18
Romsterprobably was afk08:18
diverseyeah I guess I can't blame him for that08:19
nbinoI read that this can be ISP,08:19
Romsteri'm certain the 3 hours 40 mins and it came back on at midnight was my isp doing maintenance or something... it would be nice if they informed me.08:20
diverseRomster: your ISP would be thinking that most people would be asleep and not using the internet, whoever they never heard of night owls or MMO players08:21
diverses/whoever/however/08:21
nbino:D08:21
Romsteryeah08:22
Romstertired i need coffee08:30
nbinohumm, I just discover gitweb,08:31
nbinotoday, gitdeamon and gitweb day :)08:32
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Romstercommit bomb09:19
cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.1]: harfbuzz-32: 0.9.34 -> 0.9.3609:19
cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.1]: kmod-32: 18 -> 1909:19
cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.1]: libffi-32: 3.2 -> 3.2.109:19
cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.1]: libpng-32: 1.6.14 -> 1.6.1509:19
cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.1]: mesa3d-32: 10.3.3 -> 10.3.409:19
cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.1]: sqlite3-32: 3.8.7.1 -> 3.8.7.209:19
Romsterprologic, could you include kmod and httpup in your crux base image?09:20
Romsterports -u doens't complain that httpup is missing and i was wondering wtf why it wont clone my ports tree.09:21
Romsterand prt-get sysup breaks without kmod09:21
Romsterprologic, also your site says with contrib enabled it lies :D09:22
diverseheh09:22
diverseI need to get back into my code porting09:23
Romsterusing docker instead of chroots now.09:26
Romsterbut being lazy and using romster/pkg-clean still.09:26
Romstera readable pkg-utils would be awesome diverse hows the tar bit going?09:30
prologicRomster, how does sysup break without kmod?09:41
Romstereudev does not update and it's a pain doing prt-get depinst kmod ; prt-get sysup each time09:42
Romsteri'll make my own image if it's a pain to fix that. i will eventually anyways for other uses.09:47
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: libva: update footprint for egl09:59
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: upower: contrib -> opt09:59
diverseRomster: slowly but steady10:00
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.1]: upower: contrib -> opt10:01
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.1]: libbluray: 0.2.3 -> 0.6.2 new dependency freetype10:07
diversethe code in pkgutil::pkg_install() requires that I manually iterate the archive iterator through a loop instead of using the for expression, in order for me to directly affect the iterator.10:16
diverseI still have no way to chdir for a file in an archive, though10:17
Romsterah10:18
Romsterbut why is that necessary?10:19
diversehttp://crux.nu/gitweb/?p=tools/pkgutils.git;a=blob;f=pkgutil.cc;h=1bbb83d518fd7e49f0c3655ca76d5e18b3e6121f;hb=HEAD#l43010:19
Romsterdiverse, that looks like that changes the relative path to a absolute path?10:24
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Romsterah the permissions and stuff it goes though.10:26
diversenope, like the method says, it changes the entry's (the file of the archive) pathname to the specified string.10:26
Romsterand pkgadd.conf rejmerge stuff.10:27
diverses/method/function/10:27
Romsterisn't that --root= or / if --root is not specified.10:28
Romsterthen it does the checks on what it should do further down with that path10:28
diversethat's what pkgutil.root is for10:29
Romsteri really don't read this code well...10:29
diversethe specified --root= value goes to the root data member of type pkgutil. Yeah it's coded in a obfuscated way, it took me a while to figure it out10:30
Romsterplease make it less brainhurt in rust10:30
Romsteri'm surprised this is even rock solid, no bugs.10:31
diverseWell, I'm doing it in a way that makes sense. Also I'm not doing each functionality as a seperate util, but as a different command of "pkg"10:32
diverseWhat the author is doing in pkgutils is use the polymorphism of type pkgutil, and have it figure it out which command to compile from it10:33
Romsterah10:33
diverseother than that, it's total C++ magic10:34
Romsterit probably is the best of C++ but i can't read it too well. a elitist of C++ typed it.10:35
diverseI guess auto_ptr<T> is the magic that makes it compile all the utils10:35
RomsterAd hoc polymorphism and parametric polymorphism10:37
diversewell actually it's whatever the constructor of "util" uses10:37
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.1]: ffmpeg: 2.4.2 -> 2.4.3 removed redundant dependency libvdpau10:42
diversealso I seperated all the db_* methods in a "Db" object in Rust, although with the rootpath field, because that's what it needs.10:42
Romsterah10:43
diverseI'm also trying to make all the rest of the methods in pkgutil part of a trait called PkgUtil, which can be used to distribute to the other objects10:43
Romsteri would prefer that way db class.10:43
diverseit was hard figuring out how to make default methods in this trait without having to use rely any data fields of Self10:44
diverseand from looking at the code, some of those methods required the "root" field from, so I just added an extra parameter for the Db object, so I can use db.rootpath10:45
diverseit all works out nicely10:45
Romsterah that makes sense.10:45
Romstercan always refactor the code later on if need be anyways10:46
Romstermakes sense but seems silly in a db class.10:46
diversewell I think it's better for all the database stuff to be in an object of it's own10:46
Romsterone ting that really bugs me is the placement of logging is in prt-get when it should be in pkgmk10:47
diversethat way all the methods from say PkgAdd or PkgRemove object can reference the same Db object10:47
Romsterwell makes sense that way10:49
diversewell it's more expressive that way, instead of just having to call the db_* methods as just plain functions in a sub-object10:50
diverseand is more OOP10:51
diversewhich means more modularity10:52
diverseso it may seem silly to you, but it's a concept you're not familiar with10:53
diversewhich is why I recommend taking some intro to compsci courses11:03
Romstermhe, i bumped romster/texinfo11:07
diverseplus now that I think about I can't store data members in traits, because they are traits, so it makes it harder to organized data11:08
Romsteri know OOP11:08
Romstermakes sense from a progrmaing point of view but from a thinking point of view a root path in a db class...11:08
Romsterprogramming*11:09
Romsteranyways having it in the db class simplifies the code11:09
diversehmm11:11
Romsterthinking point of view it belings at a higher level than db class.11:13
Romsters/belings/belongs11:13
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diversewell yes, the problem is, the major of "pkgutil.root"'s usage is in db_* methods11:14
diverse*majority11:15
diverseoh I see, each pkg object besides pkgutil, uses the command line to parse for --root and stores it in an o_root var11:17
diverseand whatever is passed to o_root, is passed to db_open() and is store in the root data member11:19
diversehmm, I need to think about this11:20
Romsteri'm not much of a programmer and this is nit picking and opinions. but i think11:21
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Romsterthat the root var could be added onto a data structure of the database contents then that struct passed to the functions to work on it then db.commit to write that struct back to the database?11:22
Romsteretc?11:22
Romsterbut i'm not up on all the data structures of using objects.11:23
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mhe_late answer, Workster, just wanted the safest way to test gcc-4.9.2 and glibc-2.20 with current ports11:31
mhe_and of course a pure64 toolchain11:31
mhe_fixed texinfo 5.2 too11:31
prologicRomster, how does sysup not work without kmod?11:31
Romstereudev fails to recompile on sysup11:38
Romsterprologic, means i have to manually install kmod before i do sysup11:38
diversehmm for the looks of it, pkgadd, pkgrm, pkginfo types, don't have data methods, they just hold methods. The reason for those are objects is so it can work with that C++ util magic that is constructed at main.cc11:41
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diverse*data members12:02
diverseI'm tired12:02
diverseprologic: I think I might as well just use modules for that?12:03
diverseperhaps having a Db object wouldn't hurt though12:05
Romsterdunno your coding it.12:11
diverseI think I'm getting a better idea now, but it doesn't hurt to ask advice on design12:12
diverseI think I will leave Db as it is and have PkgAdd::run() pick up the root value at runtime and store that in Db while it runs12:14
diverseDb has to be an object because it holds data12:16
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mhe_has anyone made a list yet with unneeded ports in core?12:34
Romsterdiverse, that makes more sense to me already12:35
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Romstermhe_, no but prologic has pretty much done that in docker for crux alrhough i'd like kmod and httpup added in.12:36
mhe_nice, there was a link for that a few days ago I guess :)12:37
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Romsterthere is mhe12:37
Romstereh it's easy to convert multilib to pure in crux. and use pkgmk and pkgadd -r to install ports in a new prefix and do it all in Pkgfiles without even needing LFS12:39
Romsterid be more keen on clang and a musel12:39
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diverseRomster: for the PkgUtil trait, I think of replacing the Db parameter with Path instead for the rootpath.12:45
mhe_on my crux-3.1 I rebuild gcc with --disable-multilib and rebuild glibc12:46
diversethe methods it defines12:47
Romsterand pkgrm glibc-32 after12:48
Romsteryou don't gain much doing that12:49
mhe_well, to add httpup and kmod, just remove them from the pkgrm line: https://github.com/therealprologic/docker-crux/blob/master/build/cleanup.sh12:52
mhe_when I was comparing lfs and crux, there were some differences I noticed between "needed" software12:53
Romstermind pointing it out... well i know LFS is more gnu centric.12:55
Romsteri did see some differences myself.12:56
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mhe_lfs has intltool, expat, xml-parser and some I probably miss13:00
mhe_and texinfo13:01
diversemhe_: all which is available in ports?13:05
diversebut anyway, it seems like you are more happier using lfs?13:05
xeirrrlfs has no package manager, very hard to maintain packages13:07
xeirrrbb13:09
xeirrrs/bb/bbl13:09
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mhe_yes in /opt13:11
mhe_correct, that is why I wanted to add the pkgutils and use most of crux bootscripts, that will need to be studied further13:12
diverseso basically you own crux variant. You could probably look into other init systems13:13
diverse*your13:13
xeirrrWelcome to runit, Its small and fast :)13:14
diversethere is also s6 and fastinit too13:14
diverseboth supervised as well13:14
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mhe_indeed, runit could be a candidate, as well as openrc13:16
Romsteri used to run runit13:16
mhe_but I will keep sysvinit and a combination of lfs bootscripts and crux's13:16
diversemhe_: openrc just runs on top of sysvinit13:16
diverseRomster: what do you use now?13:19
mhe_yes and when did you last use openrc, I am interested in running it13:19
mhe_runit :) lol13:20
diversemhe_: basically what I recall reading from their wiki about it13:20
mhe_http://crux.nu/Main/Handbook3-1-Configuration and http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/lfs/view/development/chapter07/usage.html13:21
diverseperhaps about half a year ago13:21
mhe_is what I am going through13:21
diverseI'm talking about OpenRC here13:21
mhe_ah :), I use that on my manjaro (archlinux based)13:21
mhe_but without editing any of it13:22
diversejust an fyi, if you were interested in replacing sysvinit completely13:22
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mhe_I will try it if I get everything set up as I want13:25
diversesure13:25
diversehttp://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/OpenRC13:25
mhe_I already found out more then I hoped13:25
diversehmm, maybe openrc could work on top of other init systems? That would be neat.13:26
diverseblueness: ping13:30
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mhe_just found out my evening class has been canceled, that way I can continue with lfs/crux13:35
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xeirrrneed to sleep now, g'night13:42
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bluenessdiverse, pong13:47
mhe_I am off as well, work to do :(13:50
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_root_anyone know any alarm clock avaliable out-there? for linux or even BSD?15:14
_root_what package gives me gstreamer15:48
joacimgst-*15:54
_root_joacim gstreamer itself15:55
joacimprt-get search gstreamer15:56
_root_nothing came back15:56
joacimdid you disable opt or something? gstreamer is in opt15:56
_root_joacim what exactly gstreamer does? plays video files?16:01
joacimdon't know. never really looked at it. I guess it decodes video and audio16:02
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diverseblueness: just curious, does openrc work with other init systems besides the default sysvinit?19:27
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RooseveltAnyone care to share why this keeps failing http://pastebin.com/bZX7NWgv19:42
jaegerWhat's the error message?19:42
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diverseRoosevelt: because qt5 is a mess right now, I had a hard time trying to build qterminal with it a while back.19:50
Roosevelterror build of polkit#qt fail19:50
diversethat's the error? Wow... not too helpful19:51
Roosevelt=======> ERROR: Md5sum mismatch found:19:51
RooseveltNEW       bee71b71c12797e6fc498540a06c829b  polkit-qt-1-0.112.0.tar.bz219:51
Roosevelt=======> ERROR: Building '/usr/ports/myports/polkit-qt/polkit-qt#-0.112.0-1.pkg.tar.gz' failed.19:51
jaegerthat's not the error, that's the result of pkgmk trying19:51
jaegerthe actual error is somewhere in the log above19:51
Roosevelthow can I make it more verbose19:52
diversehe just pasted his problem, he needs to update his footprint19:52
diverseI mean md5sum19:52
jaegeryeah, sorry, was typing before that paste. pkgmk -um will update the md5sum19:52
diversejaeger: btw, have a happy Thanksgiving19:53
jaegeryou too, thanks19:54
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Rooseveltwhen I get done how can I share my port on crux ports?19:57
mhepkgmk -um to upate md5sum and pkgmk -uf for footprint19:58
diverseRoosevelt: you mean have it viewable on the portdb?19:59
Rooseveltdiverse, yes.20:00
diversethere was an email you need to send, but I forgot the address, but I recall hearing the person is not available to receive requests, so I would just ask jaeger20:01
jaegeryou'll need to set up a repo somewhere using httpup or rsync20:01
RooseveltOr git?20:01
jaegerhttp://crux.nu/Wiki/SettingUpAnHttpupRepo20:01
jaegerno official git driver for ports20:02
jaegerno reason you can't put your ports in git, of course... you just need to share them with httpup or rsync20:02
Roosevelthttpup URL local the URL is what20:03
Rooseveltwhat URL I mean is used sorry.20:04
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jaegerdepends on where you host your ports. you need some web space or a github account or something similar where you can host web pages20:08
Roosevelthttpup https://github.com/whatevername/whatevername.git for example20:11
jaegerthe portdb and ports don't understand git URLs20:11
teK_< ChrisJohnRiley> One small step for man… one giant leap for a midget! #FACT #Science20:15
diverseoh I just got it, rofl20:16
diverseteK_: that's terrible ;)20:16
teK_don't shot the messenger20:17
teK_:=20:17
Rooseveltraw github can be used to host the files20:17
jaegeryes20:17
diverseteK_: I'm not shooting you, I'm just saying it's so bad, it's funny20:18
jaegerhttps://github.com/mhoush/crux-i686 <-- here's an example one20:18
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diverseteK_: you brought out the evil in me ;)20:22
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diverseteK_: I wasn't trying to discourage you... :<20:25
teK_:-)20:26
diverseI need more laughter20:28
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diverseteK_: from looking up the word laugh, it had its roots in German, "lachen"20:36
teK_sounds reasonable20:36
prologicRomster, yeah I don't understand though. Why would one need kmod in order for a sysup to work? What port is failing to update?20:44
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diversegonna get some sleep, ttyl everyone21:18
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: git: 2.1.3 -> 2.2.021:28
kori^ neat™21:37
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RooseveltHey is qt5-base seprate from the qt5 port?22:29
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Worksterprologic, again for the third time it brakes rebuilding eudev on a prt-get sysup....23:43
Worksterprologic, setup new docker container, ports -u ; prt-get sysup... eudev fails due to missing kmod.23:44
Worksterwhat part of that is hard to understand.23:44
Worksteri'll just make my own fork of the image and edit it myself.23:44
prologicWorkster, I'm not saying I won't put it in :)23:52
prologicjust trying to *understand*23:52
prologicAlso out of curiosity; why are you building eudev anyway?23:52
prologicIt's not that useful in a container afaik :)23:52
prologicIn anycase, I'll add kmod to the image soon :)23:53
Worksterit just saves a prt-get depinst kmod before sysup23:54
Worksteralso i found out the hard way that httpup was removed too23:55
Epsylon3default nameserver should be set to 8.8.8.823:55
Roosevelthey guys qt5 in ports has qt5 base included?23:55
Epsylon3but not sure i use official version ;)23:55
prologicSo you want httpup in the image too?23:55
Worksteri added romster.httpup and nothing happend when i did ports -u23:55
Epsylon3(CruEx)23:55
Worksterthen i went huh then tried to use httpup directly on a single ports, command not found. either httpup needs to exist or ports command needs to warn that httpup is missing when it sees a foo.httpup file.23:56
Worksteri'll look into editing ports command and submit a feature request.23:56
Worksterpatch for a warn if *.httpup file exists and no httpup command23:57
Epsylon3i discover crux also...23:57
Epsylon3made this mistake top23:57
Epsylon3too*23:57
Epsylon3created REPO in different folders ;)23:57
prologicWorkster, happy to include kmod and httpup23:57
Epsylon3"ports -u" should be explained on start :p23:57
prologicwas merely just removing cruft from the image to save on space since most of what a typical hw system needs a container doesn23:58
prologicdoesn't*23:58
Worksterthats fine just them two are useful.23:58
Worksterand does not add much to the image.23:59
Epsylon3usb keys are big now :)23:59
Worksterprologic, and i suggested a bunch to be removed that you took out. pretty much just fine tuning it now.23:59
Epsylon3begin to be hard to find small ones (4GB and less)23:59

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