IRC Logs for #crux Monday, 2015-01-19

rmullports repo00:04
rmullI was using prtsweep and prtwash and noticed that they didn't know how to cope with some of the stuff00:05
rmullNo big deal00:07
rmulljust fyi00:07
rmullman, hosts.deny gets me every time during fresh installs00:44
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teK_it was removed from ssh01:29
Romster camping gear anyone?01:54
diversewe have our own brand of camping gear now01:57
rmullBring on the lawsuits!02:13
diverseWorkster: uncommented rm command, be sure to rebase when you get home02:20
Worksterin like 4 hours or so02:23
diversehopefully it will "just work"02:23
Worksterin the meantime do setup docker02:28
diverseI got a lot of cleanup to do02:31
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korihave you guys ever thought about splitting repos by category, like gentoo does?02:52
diversethink of it this way, if they did, would it be practical for you to have to manage 10 to 20 different prtdirs just for the official stuff?02:58
diverseheck would it be practical for the maintainers to keep track of?02:59
rmullWhat's the advantage/02:59
diversermull: to make it easier to search what kind of packages we might want02:59
diversebut either way I'm sure the thought has been brought multiple times already03:00
diverseand the cons probably outweight the pros in this case03:01
koriconsidering CRUX is more than a decade old, I think "have you guys ever thought of..." type of questions may be kinda dumb, whoops03:01
diversekeep in mind, crux works differently too03:03
diverseit's more open than centralized03:04
koriI guess if you had to categorize everything it'd take more manpower03:04
rmullWhat does it mean to search for the packages we want?03:05
rmullI ran gentoo for years and honestly I never discovered any packages because of they way they were classified03:06
rmullI'm not sure that's a solid advantage03:06
korirmull: think of it this way, if all fonts were in a font dir, you'd just have to search for the font name03:06
korithat's an example03:06
koribut now that I think about it, there's no real ADVANTAGE03:06
rmullYeah, I suppose that's true. At the moment 'font' appears in the port name so it would do the same thing, but maybe less clunky to have it in a separate dir03:06
koriit'd just make things neater03:07
korirmull: meh, I hate "xorg-font-" being in the name of ports03:07
koriI just named them like, ttf-font03:07
koribdf-font, pcf-font03:07
rmullWell, in the mean time, instead of dirs, someone could maintain a database of tags, since tags are the New Way and hierarchical dirs are Deprecated03:08
rmulland people could tag their packages, then search for tags and show the matching packages03:08
rmullbut I guess it could work03:08
rmullbut why bother03:08
korimake a huge dir with all the ports03:08
koriand link them to other dirs03:08
korithe MODERN way of doing things03:08
koriln -s /usr/ports/ttf-font /usr/ports/fonts/ttf-font03:09
rmulloh, I was thinking we could get sqlite involved03:09
rmulland then connect the tag cloud to the desktop notifier with dbus03:09
rmulland query it through a browser using a RESTful API03:10
koridon't forget to create a service so you can see all the ports in a very nice web interface with scrolling animations03:10
Worksterprt-get dsearch03:10
rmulltrue enough03:11
Worksterand manual looking03:11
diverselabels could probably go inside the Pkgfiles for parsing, although the amount of operations to file traverse just to categorize seems unsightly and then again it requires people to be complacent anyway due to our distributed nature03:16
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diverseso yeah, I agree rmull, there really isn't a whole lot to it03:17
diversefor our benefit03:17
rmullHTML indexes would load faster... :P03:17
diversewhy not just use the portdb then?03:18
rmullThat's what I mean. Loading some of the portdb is a browser take a while to render.03:18
rmull(relatively speaking)03:18
diverseWorkster: that new portdb site you showed me could have a "category" feature?03:20
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diversealthough the online database would have to be tracked and maintain with the user embedded information by whoever owns that sites... so yeah...03:27
diversermull: the more I think about it, the more I want to give up03:28
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rmullI got this when trying to update core/kmod from a vanilla 3.1 iso: gcc: error: unrecognized command line option '-fdiagnostics-color=auto'04:02
diverseoh I think that's one of the new flag options in GCC 4.904:03
diversebasically compiler output with "colors, colors everywhere"04:04
rmullBut our core port should patch it out, no?04:04
diverseunless you want to break the tool chain?04:04
diversewell, I dunno.04:05
diverseupgrading to 4.9 would be a big mistake though, because of ABI changes.04:05
diversermull: oh do you mean, sed'ing out the flag?04:08
rmullsed -i '/fdiagnostics-color/d' configure04:08
diversesounds good04:08
diversemore than one way to solve a problem :)04:09
rmullKinda surprised that it made it in, though... if someone had actually tried to build it, it wouldn't have gotten pushed I would think04:13
rmulloh well04:13
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Worksterdiverse, only if everyone agreed to # Groups:05:03
Worksterheader to parse05:03
diverseI see, so like a prt-get gsearch <group>?05:03
Worksterhand not thought that far. but portdb could parse it and category it05:04
Worksterbut it depends on the maintainer to get it right05:04
Worksterkmod-32 had that gcc flag option only with distcc/ccache i patched it and then got told off because it works without distcc/ccache just fine... i did test on a few machines but all had the exact same setup...05:06
Worksterso lesson learned05:06
Workster2 iphones repaired i need to go do the 3rd one... all screen replacements.05:07
diverseI'm going to undo a few commits on my project because I think I did mess up by not using Pkg anymore, I was revisiting why I did things the way I did before05:10
diverseso I don't think the rm command is ready yet05:11
diverseand I do need have the ability to decompress because I'm extracting PkgInfo for the package05:12
diverseokay, I only need to undo 205:16
diverseoh sweet I can remove 405:29
diverseall cleaned up05:29
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diverseRomster: I squashed a lot of commits05:59
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diversekori: how is the neovim project coming along?06:31
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frinnstawesome, systemd has container tech integrated!09:28
frinnstsystemd - emacs on pid009:28
prologicfrinnst, you have got to be kidding me?10:16
prologichow many more "things" do they want to shove into systemd?10:16
prologicI know! Let's put wayland in it too10:17
prologicwhile we're at it; why not shove the kernel in for good measure too :)10:17
frinnstit is kinda silly, yeah10:19
frinnstwhenever i read systemd news its hard to tell if the article is written by a giant troll or not10:19
prologicit's really bad to put all your eggs into one basket10:23
prologicso to speak10:23
prologicI morally object to systemd :)10:23
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frinnst disk space threshold: 3010.6% used (-6.7GB free)10:24
frinnstlooks legit10:24
prologicbtw anyone know what those SSD(s) are claled that plugin directly into the SATA cable?10:27
prologicthey're tiny - meant as boot drives10:27
frinnstno clue10:28
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prologicme neither forgotten10:54
prologiccame across one and thought it was a good idea10:54
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Romstersystemd is the kernel... didn't you know?11:07
Romsteruse 2 sata sockets.11:08
Romsteron the mobo11:09
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asieokay, crux is on my server, working surprisingly well11:12
asiewaiting to compile mariadb 10.0 now11:13
Romsterthat will take some time.11:15
asiebut i'm in class so i'll just set it up and let it go11:15
asiephp is done11:15
asiei'm also taking my time to clean up /var/www11:15
asieas it accumulated a lot of dust for 3 years11:16
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Romstersooo systemd has docker support.11:16
Romsteris that what it looks like prologic11:17
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openfbtdfrinnst, now that is just silly.11:50
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frinnstThe highest CVSS Base Score of vulnerabilities affecting Oracle Java SE is 10.013:15
frinnstThis Critical Patch Update contains 19 new security fixes for Oracle Java SE.  14 of these vulnerabilities may be remotely exploitable without authentication, i.e., may be exploited over a network without the need for a username and password.13:15
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jaegerprologic: most current SSDs plug into SATA cables13:59
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frinnstsounded to me like he wanted something tiny that was powered via sata too14:01
jaegeryou mean power and data via the same connector?14:02
frinnstthat was the impression I got, but i hadnt had my coffee yet14:03
jaegerI don't think that exists, though maybe I'm wrong. Even the laptop style connectors have two sets of wiring14:03
frinnstor msata14:04
jaegerM2 is a different beast14:04
jaegermsata and m2 both plug into different physical connectors rather than a standard SATA cable14:05
frinnstyeah indeed14:05
jaegerand may also be electrically incompatible depending on the motherboard (sata or pci-e)14:05
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joacimm.2 ssds have no extra power cables15:06
joacimthey just plug straight into the motherboard15:07
joacimseems like everyone else mentioned m.2 as well15:08
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rmullI have an idea that I'd like some feedback on15:51
rmullI have a fileserver with 16 HDDs (two sets of RAID5, LVM concatenated)15:52
rmullI don't like having to power up the fileserver every time I want to access data. Spinning up all the drives takes a lot of power, makes noise, etc15:52
frinnstand is unhealthy for drives15:52
rmullWhat if instead of RAID5 I switched to RAID4 (block stripe, single disk parity)15:53
frinnst16 disks and raid5? please dont15:53
rmull8 disks raid515:53
frinnsti'd still do 8 disks raid6 x215:53
frinnstraid5 is silly15:53
rmullyou're silly15:53
rmullanyway - these are media disks. Basically write once, multiple read15:54
joacimfrinnst is silly15:54
joacimand i'd use raid615:54
rmullwait, my idea is dumb I think15:55
joacimmore like idiot15:55
teK_puff puff RAID10! puff puff15:55
joacimI'll probably get raid5 myself, and then grow to raid6 once i've transfered the data from my single 3TB drive15:56
frinnstmy raid5 array of wd green 2tb disks have been running since 2011 without any issues15:56
joacimno idea what I§d use for backups15:56
joacimI have nowhere to store backup drives15:56
frinnstim just holding my breath and await the day everything is gone15:56
rmullMy arrays are made with 8x500G and 8x1T15:56
joacimand it all seems a bit inconvenient15:56
rmullI want to change it up though15:57
rmullBasically I want to take a drive off a stack on hte bookshelf, plug it in, watch my movie15:57
rmulland have a way to recover it if it fails15:57
rmullIs that possible?15:57
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jaegersure, if you keep backups15:58
rmullI don't want to have a dupe of every HDD though15:58
jaegerget one of those usb->sata docks, plug that into your media box or whatever15:58
jaegerbackup the data, not the drives, I guess15:59
rmullIf there was a "RAID" that didn't stripe, and had a dedicated parity disk - I could write the data to one disk at a time, and keep the parity disk attached15:59
rmulland if a drive fails, I would have to connect all the drives in order to recover using the parity15:59
rmullbut AFAIK there is nothing like that16:00
rmullbecause it's kind of stupid16:00
jaegerI'm not aware of anything like that16:00
jaegerit's a bit odd, heh16:00
rmullThe alternative (if someone wants to join the adventure) is to make mirrors of the disks and send them to friends16:00
rmulland if someone fails a drive, they order a new one to a participants house, who mirrors it from their copy and sends it along16:01
rmullmeanwhile everyone can enjoy the contents of the disk16:01
rmullIdk. I'm sick of this gigantic clunky server.16:02
rmullI'd rather just have a shelf with a stack of drives on it, and plug in only what I need16:03
joacimIf my upload was better, I could use some server for my important data16:03
joacima server at some hosting company i mean16:03
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jaegerthere's always a trade... if you do the mirroring thing it'll likely work fine, just has a lot of delay for ordering new drives, mirroring, and shipping or driving them around16:11
jaegerif you keep a server and storage array you have less downtime or shipping time but more noise, power usage, etc.16:11
jaegerwhat about a compromise? a smaller physical machine with larger capacity drives16:12
rmullYeah, that's the most well-balanced solution at the moment, though I'd need all new equipment16:23
rmullI bought this one when 500G, then 1T, drives were the most cost effective price-per-gig16:23
jaegerI currently have a mix of 2TB and 4TB drives in my NAS, buying 4TB when the 2TB ones fail16:25
rmullSounds as if you plan for them to fail - do you get many failures?16:25
rmullI haven't had a single one, knock on wood16:25
joacimI've had one drive with bad sectors16:26
joacimit wasn't an important drive either =)16:27
rmullthat's good16:27
joacimI've lost more files to bad file systems than bad drives16:27
rmullwhich fs?16:27
joacimI think I used reiserfs and xfs back then, I don't remember which one lost files16:27
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dxlr8rdunno if anybody can help me. but I experiment with a python library called pyftpdlib. well, for different reasons I want to run it as non-root/admin, and it is suppose to work. I got it to work in Debian (python 2.7 and pyftpdlib 1.4.0, same in Crux), but it doesn't work in Crux19:22
dxlr8rstating "OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied"19:22
dxlr8rany help would be awesome :)19:23
rmulldxlr8r: Is this trying to open port 21 for an ftp server?19:24
rmullports < 1024 require root privs19:24
b1n0I was thinking that but I was in doubt,19:25
dxlr8rno, 212119:25
rmulloh, hm19:25
dxlr8rbut this error happens on the import19:25
dxlr8rI haven't even initsialized it19:25
rmullcould you run it in strace to see what it's trying to access?19:25
rmullseems relevant19:25
dxlr8ryeah, that worked :)19:26
dxlr8rvery nice library, should be in crux. made my own pkgfile19:27
dxlr8ris that fix by chmodding /dev/shm secure?19:30
dxlr8rI have no other users to my system bt myself19:30
rmullI think the entry in fstab is what you want19:32
rmullYou could try a remount with those mount options19:32
dxlr8ryeah, I have fixed it in fstab. but it would lead to the same thing19:32
dxlr8rthat is what I am wondering, giving it w for all, is that smart?19:33
rmullI think it's supposed to work like /tmp19:34
rmullso... it's probably fine, especially if you're the only user19:34
rmullnot certain though19:34
dxlr8rwell, it's on my lan. but it would be nice to know anyway19:34
dxlr8rbut debian stable has it as default19:34
dxlr8rso I guess it's ok19:34
b1n0there is a way to build linux-fusion (kernel module necessary for directfb) without root previlege ?19:37
rmullSure, you can build it, but probably won't be able to load it19:38
rmullwithout a reboot19:39
b1n0yes, can you help me ;)19:39
b1n0I think is better than messe with the system before pkgadd19:40
rmullThere's nothing preventing you from downloading and building kernel sources as non-root19:40
rmullWhat's the problem?19:41
b1n0I'm using Pkgfile from cruxab, I updated some things acording to manual of new version,19:44
b1n0and it trys no build where system kernel sources are, but that belongs to other user,19:44
prologicjaeger, no there are apparently these little tiny ones :)19:47
prologicjaeger, i.e: < 2.5" :)19:47
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jaegerprologic: 1.8" ones, perhaps?20:18
jaegeras far as I know those still use standard sata power and data connectors20:19
prologicyeah of course20:21
prologicbut they're tiny :)20:21
prologicI think the one I saw was even smaller than this20:22
prologicand only 32GB or so20:22
prologiccan't seem to find it20:23
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koriso, I updated nvidia and now i get "no such device" when trying to insmod20:30
koriapparently my card is legacy now, cool20:32
koriwhat do I do :<20:32
koriwell, I'm in a tty20:33
rmullDo you have the built package from before?20:34
korirmull: can you do me a favor? can you look in the commit logs and see what the previous version was20:34
koribefore the version bump20:34
rmullDoes nvidia-sl port work for you? It's slightly older20:34
rmullokay, hold on20:35
rmullPrevious revision was 340.6520:36
korialright, thanks20:36
rmullYou should be able to check out the git and build it, right?20:36
koriI just manually edited version=20:36
kori┐('~'; )┌20:36
rmullThere are a few other Pkgfile changes20:36
korioh well20:37
korilet's see what happens with this20:37
jaegerwhich card is it?20:37
korijaeger: nvidia 9500gt20:37
rmullkori: ";a=blob_plain;f=nvidia/Pkgfile;h=c529c3d6f7ad3135f5b77624ad9aecaf12cfb61e;hb=9cad5826402151408d5e25805cd1bcd4d755d812"20:37
koriit's only supported by 340.xx now20:37
rmullLink to previous Pkgfile20:37
korieh I'd have to type that in manually20:38
koriI must be a bother right now, lol20:38
korithanks rmull20:39
koriI knew my card was going to be considered legacy but I didn't know this was going to happen so soon20:39
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rmullquit living in the past20:42
koriI need a new card, yeah20:43
koribut I can't really get a new one just yet20:43
rmullNo reason to get a new one if your old one keeps working20:43
korieh, I'd like a new card20:43
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leo-unglaubgood evening20:44
rmullhello leo-unglaub20:45
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rmullAnybody here use blender?21:11
jaegerI've used it once or twice, not regularly21:12
rmullI'm attempting to use it as a CAD program21:12
rmullwondering if anyone had tips for me21:13
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jaegerAh, bit more advanced than my usage, sorry21:17
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rmullI designed a bed platform with correct measurements and everything, but it's all rectangles so it wasn't too bad21:22
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jaegernice. gotta start somewhere21:24
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rmullThey say it's not a CAD program but maybe it's good enough21:29
rmullWorks even with one eye closed21:32
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lmarieHi all,  looks like I had same experience as kori.  Had to download the 340.65 for my legacy card.  It doesn't seem that old! : )21:56
lmariegeforce 8500 gt21:57
lmarieGoing to give nvidia a try to see how hard or easy it is to switch to it.  ; |21:58
lmariefrom nouveau21:58
lmarieTake care!  Heading home.21:58
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korihrmm I gotta talk to xeirrr22:07
diverseif I do recall from an article I read, the new nvidia drivers had plan to remove support for gtx 400 and below22:08
diverseso if there is any planning to get a new card, get the gt/gtx 500 series or above22:12
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frinnstguys, buy amd/ati.. seriously22:14
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JSchilli1hello, for some reason i can't get sound from my xonar dg card. i've installed mod_oxygen as a module, loaded it with modprobe, and it doesn't output anything22:15
korifrinnst: but the proprietary nvidia drivers are great22:15
diversefrinnst: perhaps an ati, although why buy an amd, if intel already works fine?22:15
jaegerI've been burned enough times by ATI drivers in the past to avoid them for a long time22:15
JSchilli1previously (before upgrading to the latest kernel) i'd had it builtin to the kernel and i still didnt get any output from applications but i could hear the mic through the speakers if i unmuted the 'analog input monitor'22:15
frinnstwtf diverse? amd owns ati since way back22:16
jaegerJSchilli1: can you see it in /proc/asound/cards and alsamixer, etc.?22:16
joacimi had a radeon 9600. worked great =)22:16
JSchilli1it shows up in alsamixer, and there is a 'DG' symlink in /proc/asound22:16
diversefrinnst: ah sorry, I thought you also meant switching to amd cpus as well22:18
JSchilli1/proc/asound/card2 (i have nvidia, onboard, and xonar) shows the files id, oss_mixer, and oxygen, and dirs pcm0c, pcm0p, pcm1c, and pcm1p22:18
joacimthat's not what he said, diverse22:18
jaegerJSchilli1: is it muted in alsamixer? can you play directly to it with aplay or something similar?22:19
JSchilli1it is not muted, what should i type to test aplay?22:20
jaegerfirst see if it's listed with aplay -l and aplay -L22:20
diverseit's a contextual misunderstanding, don't worry about it.22:20
JSchilli1jaeger: it is listed in both22:20
jaegerif it is, try using one of the PCMs in the second list to play a wav file to it. aplay -D <pcm name> /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Front_Center.wav22:21
rmullcat /dev/urandom > /dev/dsp22:22
z3braI'm fixing my ports atm, and prtverify complains that /usr/share/locale shoudln't be used22:22
z3brawhat should I use instead .22:23
z3bra/usr/locale ?22:23
z3bra/usr/lib/locale ?22:23
rmullz3bra: localedef22:23
rmullI think, according to the handbook22:23
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JSchilli1jaeger: i tried using "Headphone" where you wrote <pcm name>, that didn't work, what's a good guess on what i should use?22:24
z3braOh, didn't see the path was specified in localedef --help22:24
jaegerJSchilli1: what are the PCM names reported by aplay -L ?22:24
JSchilli1default, sysdefault, front, surround21, surround40, surround41, surround50, surround51, surround71, and iec958. are those it?22:26
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jaegerJSchilli1: try default and front, maybe22:28
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JSchilli1ALSA lib pcm_dmix.c:1022:(snd_pcm_dmix_open) unable to open slave22:29
JSchilli1aplay: main:722: audio open error: No such file or directory22:29
JSchilli1for default22:29
JSchilli1aplay: main:722: audio open error: No such file or directory22:29
JSchilli1for front22:29
WorksterJSchilli1, groups22:29
jaegerare you in the audio group?22:30
Worksterif not in audio group add yourself22:30
Worksterlog out and back in22:30
JSchilli1i'd added myself before, let me check again22:30
rmulllogging out and back in is necessary22:30
JSchilli1i'm in audio22:30
JSchilli1i've logged out/restarted multiple times since i added myself22:31
jaegerdi you have a .asoundrc in your home dir?22:31
rmull"no such file or directory" probably means something other then permission denied22:31
JSchilli1i've since deleted it22:31
Worksterand /etc/asound.conf ?22:31
JSchilli1doesn't exist22:31
Worksterok should work only 1 sound card? does /dev/snd/ exist22:31
JSchilli1yes, it exists22:32
Worksteralsa support in kernel?22:32
JSchilli1alsamixer lists three sound cards, HDA ATI SB, HDA NVidia, and Xonar DG, in order22:32
Worksterand right sound card22:32
rmullgunzip -c /proc/config.gz | curl -F 'sprunge=<-' http://sprunge.us22:32
JSchilli1i got the kernel from, i checked when configuring it for alsa and it was enabled22:33
jaegerI wonder if making the xonar dg the default and first loaded would matter22:33
prologicWorkster: ta but that's not the one i saw22:33
prologicI'll ask my colleage who showed me this and paste the link :)22:33
prologichopefully he's in today22:33
Worksterrmull, doesn't zcat work just as well22:33
Worksterprologic, what were you after stat ?22:34
Workstersata? msata?22:34
prologicwhen I saw it it seems so tiny that it basically just hung off the sata cables22:35
JSchilli1if i change the default sound card, does that require a reboot?22:35
prologicnot really22:36
prologicalmost nothing requires a reboot22:36
prologicexcept for a new kernel22:36
prologicor new inbuilt kernel features22:36
prologicCRUX != Windows22:36
JSchilli1does it need to be reloaded?22:36
rmullWorkster: Yes - I checked the contents of gunzip and zcat in /bin, and they're just script wrappers to gzip -d, with zcat adding -c22:36
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prologicassuming your sound card driver is a module22:36
prologicrmmod, insmod, modprobe etc22:36
JSchilli1it's been loaded with modprobe22:38
jaegerJSchilli1: you could try removing all sound modules and just loading the one for the xonar dg22:39
JSchilli1lsmod only shows oxygen-related modules22:40
jaegerwhat's in /proc/asound/modules?22:41
JSchilli1there is no modules directory22:41
jaegershould be a file listing the loaded alsa modules22:42
JSchilli1ah okay, it doesn't exist however22:42
jaegeris snd-oxygen actually loaded?22:43
JSchilli1lsmod shows it22:44
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jaegersorry, I'm out of ideas22:49
JSchilli1alright thanks for trying22:50
jaegergood luck22:50
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Workstermultiple sound cards you need to set a default23:00
Worksterin /etc/asound.conf or be sure to set the correct sound card to load first23:01
jaegerAnyone in here familiar with qlogic 2500 series FC HBAs in linux?23:04
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