IRC Logs for #crux Wednesday, 2015-11-18

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cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: wine: 1.7.54 -> 1.7.5500:47
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cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.1]: gdk-pixbuf-32: 2.32.1 -> 2.32.201:40
cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.1]: glib-32: 2.46.0 -> 2.46.201:40
cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.1]: libpng-32: 1.6.18 -> 1.6.1901:40
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frinnsthttp://arstechnica.com/science/2015/11/coffee-drinking-linked-to-lower-mortality-risk-again/ <- that probably makes me immortal10:25
Romsterbrewing coffee right now10:36
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Ghost_r00thello crux people. ;)11:00
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Ghost_r00tin a normal desktop do we need cache and/or general file system local cache?11:03
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RomsterGhost_r00t, for what program?11:24
Ghost_r00tRomster: I am asking the same. I want to enable that in the kernel OR not.11:29
Romsterwhich option exactly?11:30
Romstereep the lighening is getting closer.11:31
Romsterhttp://www.blitzortung.org/Webpages/index.php?lang=en A community collaborative real-time lightning location network11:46
Ghost_r00tfile system > cache > general file system local caching manager11:50
Ghost_r00tCONFIG_FSCACHE11:51
frinnstno11:51
Romsternever used it11:51
Romsterwhat is this some other bcache?11:51
Romsterhttp://cateee.net/lkddb/web-lkddb/FSCACHE.html11:52
Romstera generic filesystem caching manager that can be used by various network and other filesystems to cache data locally.11:52
Romsterso unless you use nfs or samba or something, you don't need it.11:53
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Ghost_r00twhat do they have over FSCACHE? (samba nfs ...)12:15
Ghost_r00twhat does floating point do in modern CPUS?12:16
rmullGhost_r00t: It does a lot of things. Can you rephrase your question?12:20
Ghost_r00trmull: would you like me to paste the exact text that I have problem with?12:22
rmullsure12:22
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Ghost_r00tThe pipeline units in vector computers are not integrated floating point uints but attached vector units to a CPU that itself has a floating point unit12:24
Ghost_r00twhat is the floating point units job?12:25
rmullthe FPU performs computation of IEEE754 floating point numbers, whereas the rest of the CPU's arithmetic logic unit can only compute things that are whole integers12:26
rmullIn processors without an ALU, floating point math can still be done, but it's a lot slower12:28
rmull*without a FPU12:28
rmullAs far as your problem sentence - it's a little weird. Do you have a link for context?12:29
rmullWikipedia explains vector computing reasonably well: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vector_processor12:32
rmullYour sentence seems like it was written by a non-native english speaker or something12:32
Ghost_r00tit is better now.12:38
Ghost_r00tbut what difference does it make that these FPU units have register or direct-to-memory arch?12:39
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rmullI would suppose those terms are describing how the CPU exchanges data with the FPU. In x86 for example there are dedicated floating point registers that can be maniuplated with a specific set of assembly instructions. Registers are the lowest-level fastest "working" memory of a CPU - in order to perform any computation the CPU typically has to load data from elsewhere into its registers, do the math there, and load the data back to cache/ram.12:45
rmull"Direct-to-memory" isn't a term I'm familiar with12:45
rmullPossibly an external memory-mapped bus?12:45
rmullThat doesn't seem likely though12:45
Romsteryour talking about DMA12:50
Romsterdirect memory access12:50
Romsterwhere different devices can talk directly to memory and not hog bandwidth on the cpu12:51
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rmullDMA still hogs bandwidth, though, because the data still goes on the bus. It just cuts down on interrupt overhead.13:02
rmullexternal DMA might not go on the bus, but that's probably not what's being used in the case of a FPU since it's used for moving data between two external memory-mapped locations13:03
rmullgotta run13:05
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frinnstpro tip: dont install a syslog config that forwards everything to the syslog server - on the syslog server13:17
frinnstloops are fun13:18
Romsterlol13:18
frinnstEvent: 'threshold of high load exceeded: current value 12.32' <- on lo :D13:21
shaggy814This may be a stupid question but I am trying to write a pkgfile for a package that uses capital letters in the url and package name. Is there any reason to not name the package with caps as well?13:23
frinnstwe try to use non-caps for package names/ports13:26
frinnstI dont think anything uses caps13:26
shaggy814hmm ok, do you happen to know how to strip case of the downloaded package in the pkgfile?13:27
shaggy814maybe rename?13:28
frinnstdont strip anything. just dont use caps in name=13:28
frinnstcheck contrib/virtualbox for example13:29
shaggy814ok I will take a look there, thanks :D13:29
shaggy814I cant believe how easy that was. Thanks for the help13:34
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rmullI haven't noticed anyone ever complaining too much about hardcoded URL elements13:45
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Romsterjust try not to hard code the version if you can help it.14:01
Romsterthat's the only bit that is annoying if it is.14:01
Romsteraka boost doesn't hardcode it.14:02
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shaggy814Are there any repos that use git? or is that frowned upon?14:10
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frinnstshaggy814: its not as efficient as, say, rsync14:13
frinnstbut easier to set up these days14:13
frinnstbut there seems nobody has bothered to document it on the wiki14:15
rmullshaggy814: You can use all the crux repos via git if you want14:15
frinnst(but please dont)14:15
rmullfrinnst: Why not?14:15
frinnstbecause it will download *everything*14:15
frinnst--depth=1 or whatever in the port would be useful14:16
rmullMy /usr/ports/core is 17M14:16
rmull(via git). How big is it without git?14:16
rmullcontrib -> 65M14:17
frinnst3.4mb14:17
frinnstcontrib is 19mb14:17
rmullSo if the difference is just a few MB, is it really that bad?14:18
rmullIn terms of server CPU, maybe?14:18
frinnstyeah its pretty cpu-expensive. but as long as not everybody uses git it should be fine14:19
rmullIs git more CPU-expensive than rsync?14:19
frinnstyes, a lot more14:19
frinnston the client side too14:19
rmullgit is definitely a lot faster to sync14:19
frinnstreally?14:20
rmullYes14:20
rmullThis suggests that there is significantly less CPU time for git as well https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-1009562.html?sid=3d159da91be130023387c24a22cacc1714:20
frinnsthm, maybe its something with our git version then, or something14:21
rmullTo clarify, by "sync" I meant a ports -u on a mostly-up-to-date ports tree14:21
rmullOh - you've taken measurements?14:21
rmullI have not, but maybe it's worth doing14:22
frinnstnot in a scientific way or anything. just counted 1001, 1002 etc :)14:22
frinnstUpdating collection core14:23
frinnstFinished successfully14:23
frinnstreal0m0.861s14:23
frinnstthats with rsync14:23
rmull0.459 with git14:23
rmull(was already up to date)14:23
frinnstyeah, same here14:23
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rmullsys time was 0.035s14:25
frinnstsys0m0.011s here14:25
rmullRsync wins there14:26
rmullAny idea how the server side could be measured?14:26
rmulloh, and user: 0.026s14:26
frinnstuser0m0.045s14:27
frinnsti'll look at it when I get home, dont have ssh access from work14:28
frinnst(unless I forget)14:28
rmullokay14:31
rmullLooks like CPU time is pretty equivalent at least14:31
rmullon the client14:31
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frinnstRomster: do you play minecraft?14:35
frinnstI know you use docker so this might be something for you!: https://github.com/docker/dockercraft14:35
Romsternah i haven't frinnst14:36
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Romsteri've seen that for docker though already.14:37
Romstermight be a game i might get, been watching it on twitch.14:37
frinnsthttps://github.com/docker/dockercraft/issues/3 not without issues :)14:38
RomsterJust don't clean up after yourself for a month or two.14:39
Romsterlol14:39
Romsteri mightnto hit that issue with my thin-provisioning snapshots in lvm214:40
Romsterso i don't have a overhead in docker doing the work for me, instead it's moved to dm-mapper in the kernel14:41
Romsterfunny comment though14:45
john_cephalopodacontrib youtube-dl is outdated. Latest version is 2015.11.15 - see http://rg3.github.io/youtube-dl/download.html14:55
Romsteri'll fix it after i wake up14:55
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frinnstthis reminded me of my customers: http://i.imgur.com/PepgwJs.gifv14:57
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: [notify] poppler: update to 0.38.017:04
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: poppler-glib: update to 0.38.017:04
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: poppler-qt4: update to 0.38.017:04
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: nano: update to 2.4.317:10
Ghost_r00trmull: about thoses issue -"your last 3 lines answering my question"- do you have any text or website in mind for further reading. I have to cement my base so to speak.17:30
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rmullGhost_r00t: Hmm, not sure about a single source, but you could try an online computer architecture course: https://www.coursera.org/course/comparch17:41
rmullNot sure how much time you want to put into it if you just have a few specific questionts17:42
Ghost_r00trmull: all in;17:43
rmullI have a computer engineering degree fwiw17:43
rmullmost of my practical experience is with embedded stuff though17:43
Ghost_r00trmull: anything that would help is appreciated. even keyword for search. pdf chm IDN even TXT17:44
rmullI would start by looking for resources on computer architecture/organization, and drill down depending on which aspects interest you17:45
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Ghost_r00trmull: any starting point for that? any specific web sites besides that one?18:37
rmullwikipedia...18:48
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rmullThis is kind of neat - old (1948) computer that only had 8 instructions consisting of subtraction, negation, and jumping. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchester_Small-Scale_Experimental_Machine18:54
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cruxbot[core.git/3.1]: btrfs-progs: updated to 4.3.119:06
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cruxbot[core.git/3.1]: wget: update to 1.1719:39
cruxbot[core.git/3.1]: kmod: update to 2219:39
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: git: footprint update for perl 5.2219:42
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: imagemagick: footprint update for perl 5.2219:42
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: irssi: footprint update for perl 5.2219:42
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: p5-xml-parser: footprint update for perl 5.2219:42
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: mysql: disable tcp_wrappers19:42
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rmullSo many updates!19:44
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tierd982exciting times!19:57
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Ghost_r00trmull: yes but it is the second chapter of the book I am reading and it is directly related to pipelining vector processor superclusters20:04
juethe last messages from cruxbot for opt/3.1 are wrong, the mails as well, sorry for that20:06
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Wildefyrer is there any way to make prt-get update stop if it fails on upgrading one of the packages given to it?20:30
jueprt-get grpinst20:39
Wildefyrthanks20:39
juesorry, that only works for fresh installs and not for updates20:45
rmullp5-xml-parser footprint is all wacky20:52
shaggy814is there a way to generate footprints for packages?20:58
Wildefyryeah just had to update it myself20:58
Wildefyrshaggy814, -uf20:58
shaggy814prt-get -uf?20:59
Wildefyrprt-get <option> -uf20:59
Wildefyrso normally update21:00
shaggy814is there a way to do it without installing the package? I want to include a footprint in my repo but I dont necessarily want to install everything haha21:00
Wildefyroh21:00
Wildefyrpkgmk -uf21:00
shaggy814ahhhh thanks man21:01
Wildefyryou still have to make the package21:01
shaggy814thats what im looking for21:01
shaggy814i dont mind building it21:01
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frinnstopt is currently a bit messed up at the moment21:42
frinnstfor 3.1.. we are working on it :)21:42
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casucciHello everyone! New Crux user with two questions: how to generate /etc/ssl/certs/ca-certificates.crt? and Why can't I connect wifi with wpa_supplicant/dhcpcd on boot?21:50
casucciMore info: I have openssl and ca-certificates installed and up to date. I can connect manually by using ip link set wlp3s0 up, wpa_supplicant -B -i wlp3s0 -c /etc/wifi.conf, dhcpcd wlp3s0. When put these commands in /etc/rc.d/net they fail.21:57
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: wine: 1.7.54 -> 1.7.5523:16
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: [notify] poppler: update to 0.38.023:16
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: poppler-glib: update to 0.38.023:16
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: poppler-qt4: update to 0.38.023:16
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: nano: update to 2.4.323:16
cruxbot[opt.git/3.1]: gtk3: updated to 3.18.523:16
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casucciHello Everyone!23:35
Wildefyrhullo23:43

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