IRC Logs for #crux Tuesday, 2016-03-01

rmullWhen I watch movies (mpv) using speakers I find I am constantly adjusting the volume up during dialog and down during explosions and loud scenes. Is there some method by which I can restrict the volume of the peaks in a media file? Is what I want called "peak normalization?" Or is this replaygain?00:52
ryu0rmull: does your player support dynamic range compression?01:01
ryu0https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_range_compression01:02
ryu0"Dynamic range compression (DRC) or simply compression is an electronic effect unit that reduces the volume of loud sounds or amplifies quiet sounds by narrowing or "compressing" an audio signal's dynamic range."01:02
rmullYes, looks like mph has an --af=drc option01:02
rmullI will experiment with that, thank you ryu001:02
ryu0the effect is for consistent volume levels, iirc.01:03
jaegerIf noctua comes back, tonight's updated ISO build has a new kernel with NVME support01:07
jaegerthough it'll take a few hours to build the whole thing, of course :)01:07
rmullryu0: Looks like it's a pretty noticeable boost in the quiet dialog sections relative to the loud scenes - exactly what I was looking for. Thanks again01:08
brian|lfswhat kernl version jaeger?01:09
brian|lfs4.4 maybe?01:09
jaeger4.1.1801:09
brian|lfsyuck01:09
brian|lfswas really  hopeing01:09
jaegerThe ISO always uses the longterm kernels for compatibility01:09
ryu0jaeger: does it ship with latest gcc 5.x?01:09
brian|lfs4.4 my network card woudl work01:09
jaegerryu0: whatever's in ports when the build happens01:09
ryu0k01:09
jaegerbrian|lfs: I've got a note on my list to maybe put multiple kernels on the ISO in the future01:10
ryu0jaeger: does crux support an offical initrd system? i saw no mention of it anywhere.01:10
brian|lfsthanks for now I would use another live disc and the pre compiled package-utils01:10
brian|lfsjust haven't got to it yet had jury duity all day kind of tired01:11
ryu0brian|lfs: http://dilbert.com/strip/1990-10-2301:13
ryu0heh01:13
brian|lfslol01:14
brian|lfsI ended up not being on the jury after they debated back and forth01:15
brian|lfsthe attorneys01:15
brian|lfsso back to work tomorrow01:15
ryu0yea, they don't want smart people.01:15
jaegerryu0: aside from the initramfs the ISO uses, not really. You're welcome to use whatever you like, dracut, mkinitrd, custom stuff01:17
brian|lfshow about mkinitcpio01:21
ryu0well given that initrds are cpio archives, compressed or not...01:21
ryu0probably would work.01:22
ryu0initrds are required for some types of root partitions.01:22
brian|lfsyup like LVM and LUKS01:22
ryu0certain mdadm setups will work without it, as the kernel has some capacity for autoassembling them.01:23
brian|lfsusing raid over here on my home folder01:23
brian|lfsdid make an /etc/mdadm.conf also01:23
ryu0fyi, it is possible to boot from an encrypted root without a separate boot partition.01:24
ryu0grub2 does support it, but you have to enable it.01:24
brian|lfsinteresting didn't think that was possible01:24
ryu0yea, it's an undocumented feature of grub2.01:24
brian|lfsdoes grub2 ask for the password for the key then01:24
ryu0yes.01:24
ryu0you'll end up giving it twice. once for grub and again for the kernel's initrd.01:25
brian|lfsI guess thats if someone is crazy paranoid01:25
ryu0i use btrfs on top of luks01:26
ryu0so i can get some filesystem compression too01:26
brian|lfsI'll have to try BTFS at somepoint01:27
ryu0you may not want to use its RAID modes though.01:27
ryu0some people have said it doesn't handle the disappearance of devices gracefully.01:28
ryu0for single disk, this is a moot point, but for multiple disk it is a concern.01:28
ryu0zfs is probably better in many respects.01:28
jaegerzfs on linux is very solid these days01:31
brian|lfsabout to go to subway be back in a bit01:32
jaegerI used to run my NAS from a FreeBSD or OpenIndiana/OpenSolaris VM but it's been linux for a long time now01:33
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brian|lfshey stupid question how do I force my crux system to run post and pre install scrips on all my installed ports04:24
jaegercheck prt-get.conf04:24
brian|lfsok for new packages thats fine but what about everything alreadyed installed04:25
jaegerah, sorry, didn't realize that's what you meant.04:25
jaegeryou'll have to script a bit, probably04:25
brian|lfsouch04:25
brian|lfsor reinstall what I see is broken04:25
brian|lfsI see glibic for now04:25
jaegerfor P in $(prt-get listinst); do [ -e $(prt-get path ${P})/pre-install ] && echo ${P}; done04:27
jaegersomething like that but use your imagination with the echo bit04:27
brian|lfsthanks jaeger just a couple of packages04:33
brian|lfsseems to be non for pre just post04:33
Worksterhmm i've never used prt-get path before04:33
Worksterpre is pretty rare04:33
brian|lfsis there a way to force the pre or post install scrips with recompiling04:33
brian|lfswithout I mean04:34
Worksterusually just ser/group setups like tor cups etc04:34
jaegersure, use that command and alter it to run instead of echo04:34
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brian|lfsyuck clsoed the tab04:36
brian|lfsis that correct ser/group setups04:37
brian|lfswell glibc being nasty telinit: /dev/initctl: No such file or directory04:39
brian|lfs-- Packages updated04:39
brian|lfsglibc [post: failed]04:39
brian|lfsother ones updated04:39
brian|lfsand /dev/initctl exists04:39
Worksterser/user*04:40
Worksteri get that glibc failed post-install from a docker image since i don't have all the /dev/ nodes for it04:41
Worksterit's harmless unless it's on a desktop and not docker?04:41
brian|lfsfixed glibc just did touch on /dev/initctl and it worked now04:41
Worksterthat'll be gone on next reboot04:41
brian|lfsits probably what you just said me being chrooted in04:41
brian|lfsnot all my nodes using a lvie disc04:42
Worksteryeah04:42
brian|lfshmm trying again still no locales on my system04:44
Worksterhandbook has a command for that04:45
brian|lfsyou talking about localedef -i sv_SE -f ISO-8859-1 sv_SE04:46
Worksterhttps://crux.nu/Main/Handbook3-2#ntoc5204:47
Worksteryes04:47
Worksterand setting LANG= in /etc/profile04:47
Worksterelse it'll default to C04:48
Workster"locale" in the terminal will display what it's set too04:48
brian|lfsbut either way I have no /usr/share/locale folder04:50
brian|lfshave tempted just to copy it off my other curx box04:51
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brian|lfsstrange need a reboot can't compile a kernel right now just get core dump05:12
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frinnsthttps://github.com/fulldecent/system-bus-radio wtf07:37
brian|lfshmm going to sleep must need a reboot just get segfaults if i try to do anyt hing with a kernel07:41
brian|lfssegfault core dump07:42
brian|lfsor corrupt07:42
frinnstbad hardware?08:12
cruxbot[core.git/3.2]: openssh: update to 7.2p109:00
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vyprhey yall10:20
vyprso um, i need help with xorg10:21
vyprit's being a bit of a potato with everything10:21
vypranyone willing to go on this wild ride with me?10:21
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vyprActually, nevermind10:22
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cruxbot[core.git/3.2]: [notify] openssl: security update to 1.0.2g15:36
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.2]: webfs: fix build with dash, move man-pages16:01
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onoderaHi, I just thought about something. it would be nice if pkgmk supports git and svn and stuff, but implementing those is kind of a sliptper slope.16:28
onoderaso I thought about using drivers, like ports has, this way uses can implement git or hg or whatever besides the default wget16:29
joacimrevdep  0.13s user 0.24s system 98% cpu 0.379 total16:33
joacimi dont like it16:33
joacimi have no reason to leave my desk and get more food and drink16:34
joacimold revdep was good for that16:34
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jaegerfor i in $(seq 1 1000); do revdep; done16:37
jaeger:D16:37
onoderarevdep && sleep infinity16:39
joacimhp servers are real slow for rebooting, right?16:40
joacimcould get one of those and do a daily manual reboot16:40
cruxbot[opt.git/3.2]: stunnel: update to 5.3116:47
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frinnstgen8 and gen9 are slow as fuck17:23
frinnststupidly show debian & centos mirrors17:26
frinnstsync damn you, sync!17:26
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tsaopcrap18:15
tsaopIt seems I need to rebuild qt5 after applying the openssl update18:16
tsaopit'll take almost 2 hours18:16
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Wildefyrhave fun!18:23
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john_cephalopodaYaaay, qt!18:50
tsaopAlso python18:50
tsaopcurrently compining blink. Yay!18:51
john_cephalopodaThough I got no application that actually uses qt5 :þ18:51
tsaopI got the entire KF5 stack18:51
frinnstsweet; ipv6 + netflix = huuuge library18:52
frinnstswedish netflix is such a fucking ripoff18:52
john_cephalopodaI got some KF5 stuff.18:53
rmullfrinnst: Can you elaborate? Are you saying that accessing netflix over ipv6 gets you access to more titles?18:53
frinnstyeah no geolocation crap18:53
frinnsttunnelbroker.net18:54
frinnstmy android devices seems to default to ipv4 and firefox on linux wont play any titles18:54
frinnstbut still you can see what you are missing when you're not in the US18:55
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frinnstgot allocated a /48; using 2 /64 subnets for my lan and wifi :)18:58
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frinnst1208925819614629174706176 ip addresses ought to be enough for now19:00
joacimfor the next couple of years at least19:01
joacimfrinnst: a friend was having issues with netflix this weekend19:01
joacimhe couldntn get access to much content with his usual vpn methods19:01
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frinnsti am veeery reluctant to use some random vpn for netflix19:02
joacimhe used vyprvpn i think19:03
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try_cruxhi19:18
frinnsthey19:18
try_cruxi am "trying" crux, but is there a more easy way to install it without to build a new kernel?19:19
tsaopblink 9450/1051719:19
tsaopalmost19:19
try_cruxhow?19:20
tsaoptry_crux: download kernel image19:20
jaegertry_crux: you can use the kernel and initramfs image from the installation media if you like, though it may not have all the device drivers you need in it19:20
frinnstthere is also a live-cd19:22
frinnstbut 3rd party19:22
frinnsthttp://cruxex.exton.net/19:23
tsaopor, you can simply use the .config file from crux iso19:23
tsaopor any other distro with a more beefy kernel19:23
tsaopbut compilation times will vary accordingly19:23
try_cruxi am using the iso, image and a 8GB disk under vbox, made fdisk /dev/sda with pri 7GB, ext 1GB and logical 1 GB for swap. formated sda1 (ext4) and sda5 swap. mounted to /mnt19:24
try_cruxbut install guid tells me, i have to build a new kernel ...19:24
try_cruxwhy?19:25
jaegerbecause crux doesn't package kernels and the one that the ISO uses is meant for installation, not for covering all hardware needs and use cases19:25
try_cruxwhy it is not possible, to use, copy the working kernel from the iso to the new system?19:26
jaeger13:20 <@jaeger> try_crux: you can use the kernel and initramfs image from the installation media if you like,19:26
jaeger                though it may not have all the device drivers you need in it19:27
try_cruxi just need a simple working linux, kiss, if i like an can build my own kernel. but, the install istrucktions on the page are not kiss-like ...19:28
try_cruxshould i abort to build the new kernel?19:29
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try_cruxsorry, i am from debian/ubuntu but i'd like to try crux. the installer/setup is not so easy to understand. i thought "setup" will insatll all needed things ...19:32
tsaopit indeed installs all needed things19:33
tsaopexcept the kernel19:33
try_cruxexpect means it needs a kernel, right?19:34
frinnstit extracts the kernel source to /mnt/usr/src/19:34
try_cruxsure19:34
frinnstyou need to run "make menuconfig; make && make modules_install install" in that dir after you have chrooted to the installation19:35
tsaopand hope all the needed modules for the emulated hardware are there19:36
jaegercrux assumes you have experience with kernel compilation and figuring out the necessary drivers for your hardware19:36
frinnstif you have "common" hardware (virtualbox, vmware or standard ahci hardware) just "make modules_install install" ought go be enough19:36
tilmanremember viktor? he's credited in the DROWN paper19:36
try_cruxwhy menuconfig? i do not want to change anything, just to use the running kernel. there is a .config in the sources ...19:36
frinnstjust remember to configure your bootloader before you reboot :-)19:37
frinnsttry_crux: well in case you wanted to change something19:37
try_cruxdo i need a bootloader?19:37
tsaopwell, yes19:37
try_cruxfor what?19:37
tilmanto load the kernel and boot the system19:37
try_cruxhmm, thats new19:38
tsaopi don't know if virtualbox supports enough efi to boot using efi_stub19:38
frinnstnot really, everything uses a bootloader19:38
tsaoptry_crux: how do you boot your debian machine?19:38
try_cruxsure, debian is using a bootloader, but embedded systems do not19:39
frinnstcrux is for x86_64 hardware19:39
try_cruxnot arm?19:39
tilmantry_crux: what is uboot?19:39
frinnstthere is a arm-project, sure19:39
jaegerthere's an arm port, check http://crux-arm.nu and #crux-arm19:40
try_cruxi'll try crux first on an x86 before i'll use it on arm, but for what is a bootloader needed in linux? normally it is not nessesary, isn't it?19:41
jaegerIt's nearly always necessary19:41
tilmanare you old enough to know what a BIOS is?19:41
tilmanyour BIOS doesn't directly execute the linux kernel19:42
jaegerI only say 'nearly' because efistub is sorta not quite a bootloader19:42
jaegerIn pretty much every other scenario you need a bootloader. grub, lilo, syslinux, etc.19:43
try_cruxhmm, i thought a bootloader is only needed if i am using different kernels? as am im marking a device to "boot" it is only nessesary to put the kernel and initrd to /boot and make a ln -s for that to / i am wrong?19:46
frinnstyes you are wrong19:46
jaegerYou need a bootloader for that, too.19:46
jaegerAt least on non-embedded hardware19:47
tsaopunless you use efi19:47
jaegerspecifically efistub; efi without efistub still uses a bootloader19:47
tsaopquit19:48
tsaopdamned numpad19:49
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tsaopat last, qt5 finished compiling19:50
try_cruxi do not understand that, for exp, i am using embedded systems, the u-boot is patched to boot from usb. on the usb-device is no bootloader, just /boot and it is working?19:50
jaegeryou know u-boot is a bootloader, right?19:50
jaegeralso, embedded systems are very specific, the bootloaders are often tied to the hardware19:50
frinnsthttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Booting#BOOT-LOADER19:51
jaegeryou said you were using virtualbox, yes? Forget embedded, then, you need a bootloader.19:51
try_cruxi am confused ... u-boot just need an address where to boot from, right?19:54
jaegerAre you installing on embedded or x86_64?19:54
try_cruxwill try both19:55
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jaegerWell, for x86_64 you'll need to pick a bootloader. I don't think u-boot is an option on x86 hardware, though maybe I'm wrong. On embedded, it depends on which embedded machine you're using. If it's a u-boot one, then set it up however that's supposed to work19:56
try_cruxhmm, after i built the kernel i get an error by "make modules install" ... "fatal: open /dev/ is a directory " ...  :(20:10
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jaegernote that "make modules install" is NOT the same thing as "make modules_install" and that "make install" triggers lilo to run - that error looks like what happens when lilo is run without being configured first20:12
try_cruxhttps://crux.nu/Main/Handbook3-2#ntoc920:13
try_cruxmake modules_install20:13
tsaopyes, that's the correct command20:13
try_cruxmake "modules_install" is not working ... and i tried make "modules install" but i get an error20:16
tsaopdid you chroot correctly?20:16
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try_cruxi think so ...20:16
tsaopmounted /dev, /proc, and /sys?20:17
jaegerIf you'll read my last comment I explained why you're seeing that error. With that said, what error/probelm did you get with "make modules_install" ?20:18
try_cruxyes, i think so, how to figure out in the chroot now?20:18
jaegers/probelm/problem/20:18
try_cruxtarget 'install' failed20:19
jaegerACTION sighs20:20
try_cruxerror 220:20
jaegerDid you read my comment about "make modules_install" vs "make modules install" ?20:20
jaegerDo you see the difference between the two commands?20:20
try_cruxyes, "make modules_install" is not working20:21
jaegeryou shouldn't be getting "target 'install' failed" from modules_install. modules_install is the target20:21
jaegerWhat is the *exact* command you are typing that produces the error?20:21
try_cruxdamnit, misstyped it ... sorry, error-40, my mistake20:24
try_cruxok, now i am "hanging" here " $ cp arch/x86/boot/bzImage /boot/vmlinuz $ cp System.map /boot", what is the last step after these commands?20:29
tsaopnot needed, AFAIK20:29
try_cruxjust reboot, init 6?20:30
tsaopset a root password first20:30
tsaopif you haven't already done so20:30
try_cruxdone20:30
tsaopcheck fstab20:30
try_cruxdone20:30
jaegerdid you configure your bootloader?20:30
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try_cruxno?20:30
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Wildefyrwhat bootloader are you using?20:33
try_cruxnone, i exited chroot and l"sof /mnt" shows me command not found, why?20:36
try_cruxnone, i exited chroot and "lsof /mnt" shows me command not found, why?20:37
frinnstbecause lsof isnt installed on the iso20:39
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Wildefyrwell I think you're going to need to use a bootloader (i.e. LILO or grub) to be able to load the kernel20:41
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frinnst:D20:42
tsaopuhm20:43
Guest85585as i sayed , to install crux is not "kiss", i thought it is more easy ...20:43
frinnstbootloader is for the weak!20:43
john_cephalopodaOh COME ON! Updated openSSL and now everything is broken.20:43
tsaopjohn_cephalopoda: rebuild python20:43
tsaoprebuild qt5 *gasp*20:43
john_cephalopodatsaop: Yeah, I found the python thing out myself.20:43
Wildefyrfrinnst, oh really? :>20:43
tilmanGuest85585: the _system_ is simple20:43
frinnsthow so john_cephalopoda ?20:43
tilmanGuest85585: personally i find the setup process simple, too20:44
john_cephalopodafrinnst: A lot of things have to be rebuilt after the update.20:44
frinnstshouldnt break anything20:44
frinnstunless you use ssl220:44
john_cephalopodaIt broke youtube-dl and python. And apparently qt5.20:44
tsaopit's all well now20:44
tsaopshould one rebuild all of the libraries that link libssl.so just in case?20:45
frinnstno, just restart crap that has libssl.so loaded20:45
Guest85585tilman, in vbox it is "normally" easy to install a *.iso, also "oracle72.iso" but with crux i have a problem :(20:46
john_cephalopodaOh, wait, youtube-dl is a python thing. Although it is integrated into mpv via Lua... lol20:46
tsaopyep20:46
joacimKISS and simple does not imply easy20:47
Guest85585joacim, where is the different between easy and simple?20:48
frinnstwell, open a dictionary and you can probably find the answer20:49
john_cephalopodaKISS only means that it is simple to design :þ20:49
john_cephalopodaAnd to maintain20:49
frinnsthttp://dictionary.reference.com/browse/simple20:49
frinnsthttp://dictionary.reference.com/browse/easy20:49
Guest85585simple comes from simplicissimus, right?20:50
tilmanand easy comes from grease20:50
tilmanif you put enough grease, everything becomes easy20:50
tilmanor was it greasy?20:50
tsaoptilman: can't really argue with that20:51
frinnsttilman: it originates from geese20:52
frinnstthose birds are sluts20:52
joacimsimple is about design,and easy is about effort20:52
joacimI think20:52
john_cephalopodahttps://bpaste.net/show/452f046a5090 <- Huh, did I miss something in python that needs to be updated?20:53
frinnstseems you havent rebuilt python?20:54
joacimrebuilding pythong fixed the youtube-dl issues for me20:54
frinnstImportError: /usr/lib/python2.7/lib-dynload/_ssl.so: undefined symbol: SSLv2_method20:54
Guest85585do you really want to stay in a "nerd situation" or try to make Linux public?20:55
tilmanmost of us couldn't care less20:55
frinnstandroid baby20:55
tilmanbut thanks for the laugh20:55
Guest85585why?20:55
joacimi just want crux for what it is20:55
joacimeach distro have their own goals20:56
tilmanwe use this system because _we_ like it and it works for us (mostly)20:56
john_cephalopodafrinnst: Weird, I'll rebuild again, maybe it had some build error and I didn't see it.20:56
Guest85585is crux  distro?20:56
joacimim sure there are some out there that arent as dorky20:56
Guest85585is crux  a distro?20:56
frinnstcrux is paper20:56
frinnstand grass20:56
john_cephalopodaYes, crux is a distro.20:56
Wildefyra distro's goal should not always be to try and get as many users as possible20:56
joacimfrinnst: 42020:56
Guest85585if crux is a distro, how to get an "upgrade"?20:57
frinnstdownload fedora20:57
john_cephalopodaGuest85585: Download the latest crux .iso.20:58
frinnstfedora is very wow20:58
john_cephalopodaGuest85585: They are released every once in a while.20:58
Guest85585frinnst, i use them all20:58
john_cephalopodaGuest85585: I won't call it a "nerd situation", Linux is very widespread.20:58
john_cephalopodaAlso making crux a mainstream binary distro would kinda go completely against the goals of a source-based distro.20:59
tilmanpitillo: been trying to build crux-arm with musl for a beaglebone black for a couple of days. juuuust hit the point where i'm very annoyed about the joys of cross-compiling :x20:59
tilmanalso, can fucking libtool die already?21:00
tsaopcompile it directly on the target hardware like the openbsd folks21:00
john_cephalopodafrinnst: Ah, now youtube-dl works. I probably pressed ^c or something.21:00
tilmantsaop: i'm bootstrapping the system21:00
Guest85585sorry, but i "try" to switch all my friends from win* and android to switch them to linux, but it is not an easy way. same ist that they use gpg for e-mail ...21:01
tilmanand i don't want to do that from the target system..21:01
tsaopGuest85585: that's wrong21:01
john_cephalopodaGuest85585: Android is Linux.21:01
joacimi just let my friends and family use whatever it is they want to use21:01
tsaopyou should let people use what they feel the most accustomed on21:01
Guest85585john_cephalopoda, where did you found, that ANDROID is LINUX?21:02
tsaopthere's also the thing that if they accept to switch to linux and there's a problem, they'll pester you to no end21:02
john_cephalopodaGuest85585: Android uses the Linux Kernel. Android is just a proprietary distro.21:02
tsaopwhile also reminding you that "that thing used to work on windows"21:02
joacimit is their computers and their feelings and preferences. if they want chromeos, windows, os x, netbsd or whatever, it should be their own choice and nobody should push them in any way21:02
Guest85585john_cephalopoda, ANDROID is BASED on an linux kernel.,not more21:03
john_cephalopodaGuest85585: CRUX is BASED on a linux kernel, not more.21:03
john_cephalopodaI am always happy when more people find out that Linux is the better choice for them. But when they like gaming or need programs that simply don't run on Linux, they should stay with what works better for them. I don't want to be a preacher who hammers Linux into everybody's head, that would be just stupid.21:03
Guest85585on crux, you can do passwd21:04
joacimwonder how easy it would be to switch to a different kernel21:04
john_cephalopodaGuest85585: When you root your android, you can do passwd, too.21:04
Guest85585no!21:04
joacimyou're not exactly forced to use linux21:04
Guest85585sudo bash, passwd is not working!21:04
john_cephalopodaThe only thing that keeps you from running all the unix commands on your android is the proprietary software that runs on top of the kernel.21:05
tilmanthis is kinda entertaining21:05
john_cephalopodabash, passwd and sudo are NOT Linux.21:05
tilmanwhat about lynx?21:05
tilmanis LYNX LINUX?21:05
tilman:[21:05
joacimhurd/crux21:05
john_cephalopodaYes, of course. But that's an other thing.21:05
john_cephalopodajoacim: Lol, strapping CRUX userland to a kernel that is behind Linux, although having a very big headstart? :D21:06
john_cephalopodaThe question that is probably bigger than "is LYNX LINUX?" is probably "is GNU NOT UNIX?".21:07
Guest85585sudo su - passwd is also not working on android ... linuxdeploy is offering that, but this is a chroot for android21:07
john_cephalopodasudo su is also not aviable on archlinux.21:07
joacimjoacim is not in the sudoers file.  This incident will be reported.21:08
joacimhope i don't lose my computer privileges21:08
tsaop*swat blasts the door*21:08
john_cephalopodajoacim: OOOOOOOHHH... That can end BAD.21:08
john_cephalopodajoacim: http://xkcd.com/838/21:08
john_cephalopoda21:09
joacimsame as last year then. didn't get any gifts from santa then either21:09
Guest85585android is not linux, android is a derivate, check ".config" for the kernel .... you'll see "ANDROID" in the kernel-config21:09
john_cephalopodaGuest85585: Android is a very crappy, locked-up Linux distribution. You could lock up any distro in the same way, with easy methods.21:09
john_cephalopodaBy the way, when you chroot, you only change your userland, not your kernel.21:10
Guest85585back to the roots, the installation guide about crux and its "iso" for exp. 3.2 is not so easy as it should be. the iso is booting and the option CRUX should "normally" install all necessary things, including the kernel and bootloader, or not?21:17
tsaopkernel must be compiled21:18
Guest85585why?21:18
tsaopbootloader must be installed and then configured (installed in MBR or ESP)21:18
frinnstGuest85585: may I suggest you try another distribution that does what you want instead?21:19
frinnstcrux does what I want (and many others too). But obviously not what you want it to do21:20
frinnstgood thing about free software - you have lots of choice!21:20
Guest85585frinnst, what are the target users from crux?21:20
Guest85585developers?21:21
frinnstwe are not looking for market shares21:21
frinnstcrux is for curious people that are control freaks21:21
Guest85585what are you lokking for?21:21
frinnstnothing21:21
Guest85585looking21:21
frinnstwhy should we be looking for anything?21:21
joacimi just liked the Pkgfiles tbh. simple and easy to maintain21:21
Guest85585yust for fun?21:21
joacimno fancy "magic"21:22
frinnstyeah, pretty much21:22
Guest85585hmmm ...21:22
frinnstwe like to use it, whats wrong with that?21:22
joacimalso, closer to upstream than many other distros21:22
frinnstif you (or anybody else) doesnt like it, feel free to chose another distribuion21:22
tsaopalso, everything is where it should be21:22
tsaopno useless layers21:22
frinnsthttp://distrowatch.com/ <- lots to chose from21:23
Guest85585distros is not what i am searching for, mainly basics ...21:23
tsaopedit text file -> system behaves like i think it should according to the change21:23
frinnstWITHOUT BASICS - NO FUN21:24
frinnst(sorry, flashback)21:24
Guest85585i like the concept "kiss" for linux, but it is hard to find "distros" for that ...21:25
frinnsthttps://www.obra.se/crux-tB.png21:27
Guest85585frinnst, what do you mean with "BASICS", we need to have a LPIC-1 -or LPIC-2-Certification?21:27
joacimthat's my second year of highschool i think. 200121:29
joacimI'm still lacking in basics21:29
Guest85585joacim, are you using a mobile device with linux?21:32
tsaopis Ubuntu Phone ubuntu/linux?21:33
joacimthinkpad w500 and lg nexus 521:34
Guest85585no21:34
joacimw500 isnt exactly portable21:34
Guest85585ubuntu touch is using android21:34
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Guest85585since now (past motorola A780) there is no linux-based mobile phone!21:37
joacimok21:37
tired890Guest85585, there is21:39
tired890www.jolla.com21:40
Guest85585jolla is dead :(21:41
Guest85585no sponsers21:42
tsaopfak21:42
tired890its not dead21:43
tired890they had a rough patch21:43
tired890but are now back.. struggling still but the company lives21:43
Guest85585did jolla get a new sponsor? - i do not think so ...21:44
tired890not a new one, their existing sponsor is back in action, there was some misunderstanding or smt. You can read about it in the blog21:45
Guest85585where?21:45
tired890anyways they have a deal with an indian company named intex some hopefully things will work out21:45
tired890https://blog.jolla.com/21:45
tired890direct link: https://blog.jolla.com/jolla-back-business/21:46
Guest85585jolla is still closed source, and they have big problems with thir tablet ...21:46
tired890its based on mer, which is open. Only the UI is closed21:46
tired890a user has full control over the phone and thats what matters21:47
tired890in that sense, similar to the nokia n90021:47
Guest85585mer is open, but not the blobs21:47
tired890thats beyond jolla's control.. blobs are enforced by the SoC21:47
tired890blame qualcomm21:48
Guest85585tired890, did you read about the problem with thir tablets?  they can't deliver ... now they have a problem with payback ...21:50
Guest85585as i said, jolla is dead :(21:51
tired890yes I have. its unfortunate. Its a small dinghy among oil tankers. I still admire their persistence. I have a jolla and am happy with it21:52
Guest85585tired890, are you able to run snort on it?21:54
tired890haven't tried that21:55
Guest85585why?21:55
tired890I'm not that paranoid?21:55
Guest85585do you trust jolla?21:55
joacimI like windows 721:56
tired890in what sense? I certainly feel better with them than with google/apple21:56
joacimhide important update, it shows up as optional update21:56
joacimhave to hide it again21:56
Guest85585tired890, isn't jolla supporting android? if yes, ist it running in a chroot?21:57
Guest85585tired890, isn't jolla supporting android? if yes, istn' it running in a chroot?21:58
tired890they provide android compatibility through a framework called alien dalvik21:58
tired890I don't have it installed21:58
tired890ie I run native sailfish OS apps only21:59
john_cephalopodaI'm not sure if TOH is a good idea.21:59
tired890so I have no idea about the "android compatibility" features nor am I interested in them21:59
tired890TOH is good in theory, failed in practise21:59
john_cephalopodaIt is really expensive.22:00
john_cephalopodaSmartphones are quite annoying.22:01
Guest85585the problem in ubuntu-touch is, it is a ubuntu working in a android chroot, same as android (root-mode) working with linuxdeploy. you can as dist as you what unter linuxdeploy ... also kali!22:01
tired890no idea about that.. last I heard its horrid22:02
Guest85585tired890, do you own a rooted android device?22:03
tired890no22:03
Guest85585so do you own an android device?22:04
john_cephalopodaOne thing that really sucks about smartphones is, that you can't run native linux applications on them.22:04
tired890nokia 3310 > nokia 6600 > motorolla razer > nokia 7210 > Nokia N9 > Jolla22:05
tired8900 andriod lol22:05
Guest85585john_cephalopoda, you can !!!22:05
Guest85585also libre office22:05
john_cephalopodaYeah, but you either have to install a chroot on top of a proprietary userland or you have to use ubuntu.22:05
tired890john_cephalopoda, all this discussion is about a native linux phone (with terminal and assorted tools): jolla22:05
john_cephalopodaOh, cool.22:06
Guest85585check linuxdeploy for android22:06
Guest85585xfce and libre office is working fine under ubuntu 15.10 on an android device22:08
Guest85585the problem is, why android can emulate linux???22:08
Guest85585normally linux should emulate android22:09
john_cephalopodaA thing that I'd love to see on Linux would be a call application that can use an LTE usb module to make phone calls.22:09
tsaophow to tap into baseband stuff?22:09
Guest85585use a rpi 3 :)22:09
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john_cephalopodayeah, rpi3 + LCD + battery pack + LTE USB module = smartphone22:10
Guest85585yepp :)22:10
tired890free phone john cepha style!22:10
tired890its JOOOHN22:10
Guest85585but amazon still not offering rpi 3 ...22:11
john_cephalopoda*doo doodoo dooooo*22:11
john_cephalopodayou can use any ARM board.22:11
Guest85585therefore i asked before, is crux available for x86 and arm, if yes, how to install on embedded systems ...22:13
Guest85585k, have to leave, bye all22:17
tsaopbye22:17
john_cephalopodaThe problem is, that there is no proper UI for touch devices and no call application that can actually use the GSM/UMTS/LTE call protocols, so you can make calls without using data from your plan.22:21
john_cephalopodaPorting anything to an other architecture is tedious work - but not extremely difficult. As long as the drivers are present.22:22
john_cephalopodaAHRG! Why doesn't gajim connect securely any more?22:22
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Worksterthere is a i686 overlay and iso for crux22:33
Worksteri don't remember the status of arm or ppc22:33
dbrookearm is apparently up to date though I've not tried it yet22:36
dbrookethere appear to be crux packages for some python packages but what's the advantage of that compared with using pip? is it just to be able to get dependencies of other crux packages installed automatically?22:39
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john_cephalopodaHmmm...22:48
john_cephalopodagajim wants pyopenssl, which doesn't seem to work...22:48
john_cephalopodahttps://bpaste.net/show/afbc8a45731022:50
Wildefyrdbrooke, pip kinda sucks22:51
WildefyrI have certs break on me half the time too22:51
john_cephalopodaAlso, can anybody confirm that the package "cryptography" doesn't build?22:53
dbrookeWildefyr: I've not really used pip, but I was just wondering what to do for python things which don't seem to be available as crux packages22:59
john_cephalopodaUnfortunately just doing pip install in a pkgbuild won't work.23:02
dbrookeI was really thinking of scripts that I wasn't intending to package but that might use python packages which aren't already in crux23:10
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