IRC Logs for #crux Wednesday, 2016-06-01

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mhehi guys06:08
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mheI found an old crux i686 livecd I installed and try to upgrade to the 3.2 i686 unofficial one06:09
abenzhi mhe06:10
abenzif you just installed then why not grab a fresh copy and do a clean install ?06:10
abenzbetter than installing then upgrading no?06:10
mheso far I managed to upgrade the toolchain using an adapted glibc Pkgfile from 3.2 i686 and installed the crux 3.1 toolchain except for the glibc package06:11
mhewell, of course a fresh install is safer but I like a challenge and like to know how updating could work06:11
mheit seems I needed to update flex as well to be able to compile anything with the 3.1 toolchain and a custom glibc06:12
mhecareful updating glibc because headers can get outdated on current system, so I changed the Pkgfile to enable-kernel=3.2 and used kernel-header-3.12 instead of 4.1 for glibc06:13
mhenow in the progress of upgrading the toolchain by compiling it myself this time and after that the base :)06:13
mheor core as it is called in crux06:14
tilmanthe term toolchain usually refers to libc/binutils/compiler06:17
mhepackages to be safe I took: binutils, glibc, tzdata, libgmp, libmpfr, libmpc, gcc, libtool and zlib06:18
tilman"safe" how?06:18
mheto make sure the binatries I take from a newer version my system is, will be compliant06:19
mheto keep a usable system :)06:19
tilmani see06:19
tilmani think you can remove libtool from that list06:19
mheprobably but can't harm06:20
tilmannot sure if gcc/binutils link to zlib06:20
mheI had no idea for (f)lex to need an update06:20
mhethe cruxex livecd toolchain was glibc-2.16, binutils 2.20 (I guess), gcc-4.7.206:21
mheI directly used the Pkgfile from i686 3.2 crux with 3.12 kernel headers and enable-kernel=3.206:22
mhethen the toolchain from crux 3.1 excluding glibc and now I am rebuiling the toolchain to a 3.2 one06:23
tilmansounds good06:23
mheI wonder what packages are added to 3.2 core compared to a 2.8 core06:24
tilmanthough you could _first_ update your kernel to 4.1 or greater06:24
tilmanso you don't have to tinker with the libc minimum kernel version thing06:24
mhemy kernel is 3.606:26
mheI would like to keep it 3.10 3.16 or 3.18, best 3.16 as it is longest supported but 3.10 suffices06:26
abenzACTION is curious why not 4.x ?06:27
mheI use the slackware huge config btw06:27
mhemy newest pc is like 3y old06:27
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mender27Howdy everyone ;).07:10
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Romsteri'm still on kernel 3.18.34 on crux 3.208:27
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frinnstholy debian versions, batman!08:30
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Romsterkinda want to hold off until nvidia and other crap catches up08:33
Romsterand it's tested more08:33
mender27Oh, Romster! Hi there!08:38
mender27I was meaning to ask you something in regards to the CRUX docs and hosting .isos.08:39
mender27I am getting more and more comfortable with CRUX and I was thinking why not contribute to the documentation. Is there an 'official' way to do this?08:39
frinnstthe only official doc is the handbook and install guides08:40
frinnstbut feel free to add to the wiki - it sure could use it08:40
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mender27Great. I wanted to share some intel on kernel configs and getting the system to work properly. I also noticed there is some sort of strange occurence with dhcpcd and upgrades with updated .isos.08:42
frinnstthe version of dhcpcd that comes on the iso? or the current version?08:43
mender27After an upgrade using the liveCD I could no longer connect to the Internet via LAN, because dhcpcd would fail to solicit a lease from the router. Connecting to a different network would solve the problem.08:43
frinnstI've never had much luck with dhcpcd. all sorts of strange issues. dhclient ftw08:44
frinnstbut regarding the live-iso - you should probably tell the maintainer that the dhcpcd version in use is a bit wierd08:45
mender27Yes, the problem was the updated .iso. I probably should, I agree. The outdated release .iso is fine.08:45
Romster has a i686 iso08:46
Romsterhi mender2708:46
mender27I was using the x86_64 iso08:47
mender27Not sure what could the problem with dhcpcd there be.08:49
mender27After soliciting a lease from a different router and again from the first one, things went back to normal and I had no further problems.08:50
Romsterthere is a recent patch for some issue in dhcpcd08:50
Romsterthe other issue was the fact dhcpcd used to call wpa_suppclient but does not now. so using /etc/rc.d/wlan is advisable. for wifi.08:51
mender27Also, another matter, what would you guys think of a simple CLI or ncurses menu for selecting optional depends and features within the Pkgfile?08:51
mender27Ah, I forgot that there was already a script for wlan. I wanted to write one myself :P.08:51
frinnsteew, no :)08:51
frinnstinteractive package installs are eew08:52
mender27I see, fine then :).08:52
frinnsthehe just my opinion though08:52
mender27I think it's OK. It's just that the way FreeBSD does it is nice and some ports would really profit from those features.08:53
mender27For instance, mplayer has a great GUI with optional skills, though its not in the default config08:53
mender27optional skins*08:53
Romstermender27, crux is kiss but if you want to toy with a program you write yourself go for it.08:54
Romsterusually other changes to Pkgfiles you copy it and edit to your needs.08:54
mender27Cool enough. I sort of like USE flags, though the way Gentoo does it is often an overkill.08:55
frinnstbest thing i've ever seen08:55
mender27wow, those turtle abs...08:56
Romsterhaving said that i got a side project using contrib/gpp to ifdef some things and write out a Pkgfile08:56
Romsterprt-get info gpp08:57
mender27ah, ok, got it.08:58
Romsteras a example08:58
Romsternot the crux way just me experimenting08:59
mender27So basically a config on top of the Pkgfile?08:59
Romsteryeah that writes out the Pkgfile due to some options08:59
Romsteror maybe loosely called use flags09:00
mender27I was thinking of something similar, though in Python and with an ncurses menu09:00
Romsterthis way the Pkgfile that's spit out can also be hand edited09:00
Romsterif need be09:00
mender27Mhm, mhm ;)09:00
Romsterbut i wonder if it's best to modify pkgmk in some way or some other way.09:01
mender27It might get complex and messy :(09:02
mender27it would be an additional parameter for prepending09:02
mender27for instance09:02
mender27'pkgmk -d -i --params="--enable-gui --disable-nls"'09:03
Romsterthis is why everyone says to just copy and edit the Pkgfile to suit your needs09:05
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mender27Yeah, much easier :D09:05
Romsterthat would /never/ get in crux and it would make the resulting Pkgfile still messy.09:06
mender27Soon I'll propose USE flags, you'll see xD.09:06
Romsterbut i have my reasons to try pre-processing09:06
Romsterthere is gentoo for that09:06
frinnstif you want use-flags you have gentoo for that09:06
mender27I guess codecs are one thing.09:06
Romsteri just use opus for a example09:06
Romsterit gets built twice for 64bit and 32bit09:07
mender27frinnst: nah, I don't want USE flags. That's why I came to CRUX. USE flags get messy quickly09:07
Romstercontrib/opus compat-32/opus-3209:07
mender27that's actually useful :).09:07
Romsterexactly mender2709:07
mender27I think the main problem with USE flags is that they're too interdependent09:07
Romsterso i started on a pre processing to reduce duplicate version bumping, but i haven't got that far with it yet09:07
mender27I see09:08
Romsteralso my version sorting to bump the versions automaticly and use docker to build them09:08
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mender27I'll think more of how FreeBSD does things and whether it's actually useful. That would be Python + sh most likely.09:08
Romsteri havne't had much time or motivation todo much more on that09:08
mender27Because FreeBSD doesn't keep track of package changes globally.09:09
mender27As in, does not enforce them per a global USE config09:09
mender27There is no 'Whoops, you did something wrong we didn't anticipate. Let me mask it for you!'09:10
mender27I guess per package overlays with features might be useful. Something along the lines :).09:11
mhehi romster, tnx!09:18
Romsterhi mhe09:19
mender27Hello mhe ;)09:20
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mender27Did you guys know that Source Mage Linux is still alive?10:39
mender27I'm just going through their News page. Almost monthly updates ;D.10:40
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.2]: qt5: various bug fixes11:24
Romstermender27, i did11:29
mender27Any redeeming qualities?11:34
Romsteri know of it, but i have never tried it.11:35
mender27I know of it and was meaning to try it, but also never did :P.11:36
mender27I was sort of wondering, though. Nowadays, what would be the best about compiling from source code?11:37
Romsterknowing what patches are applied and easily editing the build.11:50
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mender27Probably also knowing that if the program builds, it's going to work, right? :)11:54
mender27The only real problem I have are the 'big guys' like Firefox, Chromium, Libre Office, Java, etc.11:55
cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.2]: xorg-libxfixes-32: 5.0.1 -> 5.0.212:17
Romsterthose i provide built packages for so do a few others here.12:39
Romsterbut most have hardware for building those.12:40
mender27Probably, yeah.12:41
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mhemanaged to build gcc-5.3.0 on my custom crux 2.8/3.1 i68613:13
mhenow last step: rebuilding glibc13:13
mender27Nice, congrats :).13:14
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mender27I was just reading an interesting research on init systems: Slightly stale, but still mostly valid.13:14
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mheI wonder how much crux rc scripts changed from 2.8 to 3.2 and if the udev to eudev change matters anywhere13:16
mheis dash really needed for anything on crux 3.213:17
mender27Was it pulled as a dependency of anything?13:20
frinnstt-minus 1:40 till vacation starts13:21
frinnstim soooooooooo productive right now13:21
mender27haha, good for you frinnst. I am also very productive today. I just read about init systems and now I'm digging into a review with Lennart Poettering. So job-related...13:22
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joacimACTION gets no vacation13:42
joacimACTION have to work in place of a coworker while he has his vacation13:42
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mender27I found this today: Does what he says make any sense? I'm starting to get really confused on the systemd agenda :/.15:31
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SaveTheRobotsthere's a systemd agenda? :o16:04
SaveTheRobotsto replace every man, woman and child on earth with a systemd daemon?16:04
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.2]: [notify] nginx: updated to version 1.11.116:28
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tsaopit seems qt5 still won't build17:50
tsaopneeds this patch:
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mender27Romster:  I cannot sync with your repo via httpup - unexpected end of line symbol18:28
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mender27Hello again :).20:24
rmullmender27: hi20:26
mender27I just read an interview with Lennart Poettering today :P.20:28
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.2]: pinentry-gtk2: 0.9.5 -> 0.9.720:30
cruxbot[opt.git/3.2]: pinentry-qt4: 0.9.5 -> 0.9.720:30
cruxbot[opt.git/3.2]: pinentry: account for qt4/5; patches by jue20:30
cruxbot[opt.git/3.2]: qemu-agent: fix comment in the rc script20:34
mender27I'm confused, though it seems he doesn't understand the UNIX ways at all, yet claims he does based on false assumptions :9.20:36
mender27Alright, time to go to sleep. G'night! :)20:45
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mheupgrading a crux-2.8 i686 to 3.2 core i686 with a few minor changes still boots up to a full desktop :)20:54
mheI kept udev, dhcpcd, yasm instead of nasm, no dash and symlink /bin/sh to bash, usbutils-007, custom glibc and a working desktop :)20:56
mheudev was to keep grub from working, my older version was linked to older lib, usbutils-008 need udev 196 or up so these can be updated when I upgrade/rebuild grub first :)20:57
teK_you did single steps from 2.8 to 3.2, right?20:58
mheI upgraded glibc to slighty modified 2.22 (3.12 headers and enable-kernel=3.2)21:00
mhethen used binaries for toolchain from crux-3.1 i686 excluding glibc21:01
mhethen upgraded toolchain by compiling to 3.2 toolchain and rebuild entire core21:02
teK_I have this 3.0 box here..21:03
mhei686 or 64bit?21:03
mheI had a cruxex i686 2.8 lxde livecd around21:04
mheso I thought let me try to upgrade the thing21:04
mheI used this;a=blob;f=ChangeLog;h=662dda5686253571cdbf88619e48df365e0a7492;hb=6ea5c28a2855e756a74df8784c4e1d6dc3637a3421:04
mheto tell what packages are added/removed/changed in core21:05
mhefor a 3.0 box I would try to edit your rsync files and make them point to 3.2 instead of 3.0 for core.rsync21:06
teK_the system has almost no packages installed and a sperated partition with important stuff so I might end up saving the kernel config and reinstalling 3.2 from scratch...21:06
mheupdate ports21:06
teK_fun fact: I have that already for other reasons ;)21:06
mhecheck glibc Pkgfile for headers21:06
teK_glibc should be central/vital, yeah21:07
mheI would take at least --enable-kernel=3.4 \21:07
mheedit the glibc Pkgfile headers from 4.1 to 3.1221:08
mhesame for glibc-3221:08
teK_installation is so quick, I realy should safe prt-get listinst and redo that thing21:09
mheyou could use binaries from crux 3.1 except glibc (tzdata, binutils, mpc, mpfr, gmp, gcc, libtool and zlib)21:09
teK_yes and have a look at the setup script (which accounts for special tasks during upgrade)21:10
mheyeah true, but it is more fun and more dangerous :)21:10
teK_but. forget one thing nd the server goes D-A-O-W-N21:10
mheyeah, prolly bad idea then :)21:10
teK_yes but I dont have time for this and especially not for that bix21:10
teK_it's amongst other things one of our distfile mirrors :-)21:10
mhebummer, would be nice to see if others succeed with the same steps21:11
mheow, do not touch it then :)21:11
mheupdating xorg and desktop will be harder, although it is quite a minimal desktop with lxle21:13
mhelxde :P21:13
mhesomething I will try tomorrow (with binaries as well)21:13
teK_good luck21:13
mheis there another way to check all installed ports except prt-get listinst21:14
teK_pkginfo -i21:14
mhesome grep magic from /var/lib/pkg/db for the *#* lines21:14
teK_with versions21:14
mhelol, tnx21:15
mhehaha, been out of crux for a while, was using LFS with only pkgutils as a package manager21:15
teK_egrep -v '(/|^$|-[0-9]*$)' /var/lib/pkg/db21:16
mhebut keeping it up-to-date is crazy so I am happy to go back to crux with some extra tools to sync21:16
teK_but might skip some crazy named ports ;)21:16
mhewoohoo :)21:16
teK_I did LFS like 10 years ago21:17
mhe312 packages installed, hmmm21:18
teK_the regex is pooched, claims 1001 packages vs 500 (pkginf)21:18
mhebest for me to start with paperwork and admin to get a grip on things before I start21:20
mheLFS is great but it has gotten too much of a hassle to update the thing and kepping it secure21:20
onoderahi, what that comment to rebuild all revdep stuff in the correct order21:30
teK_are you actually having issues with the rebuild order?21:32
mheI used the lfs 7.6 build order and then for the extra packages alphabetical :)21:33
teK_no I meant for revdep21:33
teK_i.e. onodera21:34
onoderawell, I don't know, not yet :)21:35
onoderaI just switched from openssl to libressl again so there are quite a lot of packages that need rebuilding though21:35
onoderaprt-get update -f (revdep) seems to work fine :)21:39
onodera *prt-get update -fr (revdep)21:40
teK_it doesnt do ordering21:40
teK_which should not matter :-)21:40
onoderaalright, I must admit I'm not an expert how dynamic linkin works ;)21:42
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