IRC Logs for #crux Sunday, 2016-07-31

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joacimyou can benchmark with quake 300:21
frinnstgod.. starting messing with my fonts yesterday. I'll never get it looking good again00:36
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Romsterbrian|lfs> we need to make a bot that updates packages also lol <- i'm working towards semi-automating that task02:20
Romstersaptech, glxgears i just use to make sure i have nvidia working on opengl witht he gl-select tool. sometimes i need to rebuild mesa3d and nvidia and gl-select again then restart xorg to get opengl acceleration to work. so glxgears is a quick easy lazy test. but it's numbers mean nothing for a beanchmark.02:22
cipppRomster: , idea02:22
Romsteri have version sort and docker all i need to do now is marry the two up and presto02:23
cipppi dont know if can work with crux because of different package names02:23
cipppbut ..02:23
Romsterwho made this?02:24
cipppthat man :)02:24
cipppnot me02:24
Romsterah that's for alpine linux02:25
cipppit is for a custom crux02:25
cipppi used it as help to build main coz this one is not multilib02:25
cipppit is lfs + crux02:25
Romsterlooks like it just monitors python modules02:25
cipppi dont know, then is useless02:26
Romsterbut it grabs the files off a gentoo mirror02:27
cipppanyway, gentoo page for packages can be goof for monitor02:27
cipppi write slow ...:)02:27
Romster i need to regenerate those but that's my version sorting02:28
Romsteri started writing a database for it and didn't get too far02:29
Romsterso i've started that again02:29
Romsteri'll likely end up with some API that a CLI tool can query it02:31
cipppi build something like him but with multilib and i use crux ports for sysup02:32
cipppi want more but ...02:32
Romsterso what does that custom crux provide that the main does not?02:33
cipppgcc6, and no .la files02:33
Romsteryou do realise crux 3.3 will be gcc602:34
cipppand build all from scratch with Pkgfiles02:34
cipppis not big deal but was fun02:34
Romsterand i have talked about slaying .la files in the past, but it's never gone any further than that.02:34
cipppi use finit vs sysv02:34
Romsterbeen meaning to try that, i used to use runit on crux02:35
Romsterrunit is rather messy with little documentation though.02:35
cipppfinit is fast02:35
Romsterwell at least when i tried it.02:35
cipppbut i think i dont understand all well :)02:36
Romsteri've packaged finit that's as far as i got02:36
Romsterwhat's the url to this modified crux?02:36
cipppi dont have02:36
cipppmaybe i will do02:37
Romstersurely you would put your Pkgfiles and any details somewhere on like github02:37
Romsteri'd be interested in your init files for finit02:38
cipppi can paste it02:38
Romsterno rush02:39
cipppRomster: ^02:39
cipppbut how i said not all are ok, i dont understand how tty parrt work02:40
Romsterhah you got my Pkgfile and modded it :)02:40
cipppsure, im lazy :)02:40
cipppafter tty /dev/tty1 i need to use service :1 [2345] /sbin/agetty ... to work02:41
cipppis not ok02:41
cipppoh, i did and a patch to not use start_udev02:43
cipppbut i dont did a diff for final and now i think is a mess02:43
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cipppRomster: i did and a custom pkgmk, work but is not finised , because im lazy and of finit03:00
cipppsave second file as the_silver_searcher-0.32.0-1.spec and run ./pkgmk the_silver_searcher-0.32.0-1.spec03:00
Romsterso you've added macros03:04
cipppand remove build{03:04
cipppand get version and release from file name03:04
Romsterwhat's the purpose of that?03:04
cippplook clean and nice for me :)03:05
Romsterwhat if someone needs to bump the release due to a patch?03:05
cipppmv file-0.32-1.spec file-0.32-2.spec03:06
cipppor cp or so03:06
Romsteroh so like gentoo .ebuilds03:06
Romsterfor file version and release03:06
cipppand macros are nice03:06
cipppi dont know gentoo03:06
Romsteryou are basicly allowing multiple versions of source build scripts.03:07
cipppand read macros and bash commands03:07
Romsterthe only thing your missing is slot for each different version, some use slot 0 and slot 1 for new and second new verison of library for like compatability than ffmpeg and ffmpeg-compat03:08
Romsterbut that adds even more complexity03:08
Romstercrux is built on kiss03:08
cipppi will do more after i have a propper init03:08
cipppi hope will do a release fo finit 3 soon03:09
cippphe did a lot of work in github03:09
Romsteri've thought of macros and can only come t the conclusion it adds far too much complexty and hides code for easy fast Pkgfile creating for novices that never have read the macros.03:09
Romsteryou can do what you like but that's not the crux way.03:09
Romsteri wouldn't mind git support in pkgmk though03:10
cippp%configure vs ./configure --prefix=usr --sysconfdir=/etc --libdir=/usr/lib --libexecdir=...03:10
cipppRomster: i know it is not, but how i said, it is fun03:10
cipppcrux is nice03:11
Romsteri've been doing something else however.03:13
Romsterpre-processing Pkgfiles03:14
Romsterand the Makefile03:15
Romsternot the final form was just an idea i was trying.03:15
cipppi will have something like "#ifeq NLS 1" in pkgmk.conf and macros or autosplit for lang,dev and so03:17
cipppi hope, coz i start then move to other things ...03:17
Romstermy idea is to spit out clean Pkgfiles that end users can edit. or regenerate them with other flags03:18
Romsterto suit there systems03:18
Romsterend result s Pkgfiles that are not bloated or look messy or unable to read how it works.03:19
Romsterediting pkgmk might be an idea too for this, but i haven't contemplated that03:20
cipppmy idea is minimum lines on pkgfile03:20
Romsteranother touch i'd like to add is .meta4 support ifdef03:20
cipppbut is true, hide code03:20
Romsterhiding code gets messy fast03:20
Romsterand complexity03:21
Romstergo and pull up a ebuild file and tell me how it works.03:21
Romsternow look at a Pkgfile and do the same03:21
Romsterwhich is easier to understand and write one in a matter of minutes?03:21
cipppmost of pkfiles will be: link,description, source, %build03:22
cipppebuild it is complex03:22
cippprpm spec it is better03:22
Romsterprobably the majority will be. but there will end up being a few special cases03:22
Romsteragreed rpm is better even possibly deb03:22
Romsterbut deb patches everything and the Makefile03:23
cipppRomster: here i will use pure bash lines03:23
cipppi dont want epatch,emv,ecp ...03:23
Romsterwell if you are going this path i'd really would lover to see pre/post-install/remove done in the one spec file.03:24
Romstermajority fo it is regenerate caches for fonts or desktop files or adding user/groups03:24
Romsterfonts could be macros for regenerating the cache03:25
cipppi will ping you after half year or more :)03:25
Romsterif that can be tightened up i still fear someone might in a 3rd party repo make a malicious script03:26
Romsteralso using fakeroot as required to build in for pkgmk is a nice addition03:26
marakucould you guys try this out, it's a script that gets build times (for building and built packages)03:27
marakuit's kind of like genlop for gentoo (at least that was what I was trying to go for)03:27
marakuoh and read the header of the file because it needs some options enabled in prt-get.conf03:27
Romsteri was thinking of some SBU for crux Pkgfiles to give people an idea on build times.03:27
cipppmaraku: i want to read but perl lost me:), im not a coder03:29
marakusorry if it's bad code, it's my first perl script03:30
marakuIt was originally a shell script, but that got too complex03:30
Romsteri can sort of get the jist of it03:30
cipppi have no idea if is bad or not, how i said, i can do small things only coz google help me:)03:31
Romsterset a start time and when compiled set a end time find the difference03:31
marakuyeah, pretty much03:31
Romsteri would make a patch for pkgmk for that.03:31
Romsteradd a couple of new functions to set time and display time03:32
marakuRomster: do you mean that pkgmk would get a log?03:32
Romsterand save the times into files, and then use some script to find the mean average from those03:32
Romstercorrect maraku03:32
marakuyeah, one problem with using prt-get's logs is that the times aren't accurate03:33
Romsteryou could do something like /var/log/pkg/buildtime/$name-$version-$release03:33
marakufor example, a prt-get update -uf would just update the footprint, but prt-get still writes the times like it's building03:33
marakuand if you use pkgmk, no logs get written03:34
Romsterbut if you hooked the functions to the build() function only03:34
Romsterto the start and end of the build process03:34
marakuhmm, and then on a <C-c> it could nuke that log03:35
Romsterthough it wont count the archiving time03:35
Romsterif it didn't complete it can clean it up yes03:35
Romsterjust an idea i just came up with.03:35
marakuah, but what if I rebuild the same package multiple times(like with diff. compile options)?03:35
marakushould pkgmk save the previous times?03:35
Romsterthen you would make the code to overwrite the excising file with the start and end times in it.03:36
marakuyeah that sounds good03:36
Romsterthat is entearly up toyou, you could read a number and save the last x build logs if you so desired03:36
Romsterone thing though is ccache and distcc and maybe other things will skew the results badly.03:37
marakuit could do a $name-$version-$release.2 and so on like with syslogs03:37
Romsterand some make uses -j103:37
marakuI think the -j1 is fine, because it's package specific03:38
Romsterjust remember to have code to clean up at some point else that directory will grow to epic size03:38
marakuhmmm, I was thinking to just save the times03:38
Romsterkeep x number of logs03:38
Romsterof time03:38
marakudon't save the logs themselves (like the compilation output)03:38
marakubecause that's what prt-get does now03:38
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Romsteronly be a few bytes each file03:38
marakuyeah much better03:39
marakuespecially for those big ones like chromium and firefox03:39
Romsterthough i thinkthe minium will be 4096 bytes on disk regardless. unless the filesystem packs it in a specal inode03:39
Romsterhow long have you been using crux maraku ?03:40
marakutrue, but I think there could be an option somewhere to turn logging off/on, for those people with limited hard disk space03:40
marakuwtmp begins Wed Jun  8 21:43:47 2016. arch and funtoo user before this03:40
Romsteradd an option to pkgmk.conf for it.03:40
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Romsterah i haven't been that active i irc and seems we got some new users here03:41
Romstermsot of them because no systemd03:41
marakuexactly why I'm here :)03:41
Romstersome because of the simplestic bsd like layout03:41
Romsterbut it comes at a cost of no hand holding but some prefer that03:42
marakuyeah, I really do like the bsd layout.03:42
Romsterless getting in the way = more for the admin to take care of, and flexibility03:42
Romsteri use it for a firewall/server, a bunch of headless nodes and a desktop03:43
marakufor me it's just my laptop and server(it's actually just a laptop sitting in my living room)03:43
Romster and i build packages in docker, i was using chroots but this is more elegant03:44
Romsterlaptops can too but some take awhile to build packages.03:44
marakuis that for testing Pkgfile's and such?03:44
Romsterwhich is why i supply binary packages of some large things
Romstercorrect i test Pkgfiles and the dependency tree03:45
marakuI have a quad-core i7 in mine! It really does help. My core2(dual-core) server takes a long time(getting better with ccache)03:45
Romsterto make sure nothing is missing in the depends on line03:45
Romsteri share ccache with my system and docker containers03:46
marakudo you have that on a cron or something like that? like semi-continuous testing for the tree?03:46
marakuah that's smart. otherwise it would take ages to test stuff03:47
Romsterthough the march is different so i am really storing 2 copies in ccache for my system maybe more when i build a new tool chain for something03:47
Romsteri don't yet, but i am working on that03:47
Romsteri already have a version sorting tool to report that i need to get completed, and cron a job for building in docker.03:48
marakulooks like you're quite the busy person Romster :)03:48
Romsterthen the majority can be semi-automated03:48
Romsteryeah i jsut do bits in my spare time.03:48
Romsterover a number of years03:48
Romsterguess i got nothing better todo lol03:48
Romsterfeel free to keep working on perl though maraku it's a nice language despite some people saying otherwise.03:49
Romsterit's jsut anyone can write messy code in perl or neat code.03:49
Romsterthe majority i guess write messy and that is what people often see so they think perl is a horrible language03:50
Romsternot true03:50
Romsterplus perl is in core while say python is in opt so not installed by default. comes in handy for some tasks with minimal dependencies.03:51
marakuyeah I really like it. It's got that c like structure but there's no 'real' compiling03:52
cipppi have a laptop with  i3 4030u, compiling it is ok , ram usage it is not03:55
cipppfreaking browsers03:55
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marakuoh right, speaking of ccache, I don't think that will skew the times. Because new packages will also build faster, so the average time will semi-represent the new compile time03:55
marakuchromium took 182 hours  and 10953 minutes  to build, uhh my script is broken :(03:57
Romsterhell event he kernel only took a day and a half on a very old computer03:58
marakuyeah, but chromium's a completely different beast03:58
Romsterinded it takes hours even for me03:58
marakuit took like a whole day on my server!03:59
cipppmaraku: you can get chromium from kwort packages03:59
marakuwhat's your computer like Romster? It sounds powerful03:59
marakucippp: I based mine off the arch PKGBUILD, so I can have flash(for dumb websites) and widevine(for netflix)04:00
marakualthough I mainly use surfraw + elinks because I dislike gui's04:01
cipppmaraku: from what i remember flash work, widevine i dont know, i dont use it04:01
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cipppi use firefox coz need less ram than chromium,opera,vivaldi. i have all time a lot of tabs:(04:04
Romstermines just a phenon II 965 black edition04:04
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marakuhehe, chromium actually took 43 hours to build! or it's just my script messing up again... ;)04:07
cipppi dont build firefox, i use bin from mozilla04:09
cipppmaybe i should try to see if is a difference04:09
marakuoh nvm, it took 5 hours. I guess parsing prt-get logs isn't the best. I think I shall try making that patch for pkgmk Romster04:10
jaeger43 hours... man04:11
jaegerwhat kind of hardware is that?04:11
marakujaeger: it actually took 5 hours. my script just couldn't parse the logs correctly04:13
jaegerAh, ok, I see that now, heh04:16
Romsteror you could make a script to makecommand on prt-get.conf in the advanced section04:19
Romstermakecommand nice -n10 pkgmk04:19
Romsteri do that to mine04:20
Romsterstill builds fast unless i am hogging the system04:20
Romsteri'm going afk for awhile04:29
marakuRomster: but then pkgmk wouldn't log anything, right?04:50
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brian|lfshello all06:10
brian|lfsBrian to the rescue whats going on06:10
abenzhi brian|lfs07:06
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frinnstI have "renice -n 19 $$" in my pkgmk.conf12:28
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saptechfrinnst, what does that do for pkgmk.conf?13:52
saptechhello all, does the "who & w" commands work for you?13:59
saptechmine doesn't show any info13:59
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frinnstsaptech: man renice :)15:23
frinnstpkgmk.conf is just a file sourced by pkgmk15:23
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darfosaptech: is /proc mounted?19:58
darfodoes /var/run/utmp exist?20:04
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brian|lfsalready getting sick of updating my skype alpha port every few days lol21:03
onoderapretty cool stuff21:17
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cruxbot[contrib.git/3.2]: keychain: 2.8.1 -> 2.8.321:39
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saptechdarfo, /proc is mounted and /var/run/utmp exits. Thanks22:32
frinnstyou might not be logged in in the traditional sense22:35
saptechdarfo, a couple of guys in the linux channel said theirs were, rw--rw etc. mine -rw-r--r-- 1 root 664 1536 Jul 29 15:35 /var/run/utmp22:35
frinnstI dont get any output from w or who when I login via slim22:35
frinnstslim is pretty broken but i still love it :)22:35
saptechfrinnst, I have been using lxdm to login22:35
saptechbefore installing it, I guess I didn't notice w22:36
frinnstif you just login without a manager and run startx im sure you'll see yourself22:36
brian|lfsnot sure what the person is talking about on the mailing list my kvm and keyboard and mouse work fine with the CRUX iso22:43
saptechit's not that big of a deal, but I thought it should just work. It seems like using other distros with DM it worked22:43
frinnstim not sure what causes it - I've noticed it but not looked into it.22:49
joacimbrian|lfs: different kvm devices might fuck up in different ways maybe22:54
jaegerI suspect he's also talking about when he ran into the recovery shell mode... I'll have to test that, some hid drivers might indeed not be loaded at that point22:55
jaegerIt's mostly focused on getting storage working22:55
jaegerUnder most cicrumstances you never see that state22:55
brian|lfsmakes since jaeger23:23
brian|lfsI've heard about KVM's being flakey23:23
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brian|lfsthat was annoying I had no spell check installed just realzied it lol23:26

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