IRC Logs for #crux Tuesday, 2017-02-28

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john_cephalopodaA better wiki documentation for Crux would be cool.00:11
john_cephalopodaI think, I'll sit down and make a list of articles that would be nice to have in the next weeks, and start to write a few already.00:11
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pedjabase-16 monokai ftw00:32
pedjasolarized is so overrated.00:33
pedjahttps://chriskempson.github.io/base16/00:35
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john_cephalopodapedja: I like the way solarized looks.00:38
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just_funIs PKGMK_SOURCE_DIR="/usr/ports/src/$name" used by anyone? Problems?01:39
druid_droidjust_fun: humm01:49
druid_droidme not, but that solves the problem of bad names like v4.201:49
just_funthinking that it will create empty dirs for sourceless ports01:50
just_funbut that can be fixed with oneline patch01:50
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just_funit doesn't work02:05
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Worksterhttps://hardware.slashdot.org/story/17/02/27/1411210/intel-reacts-to-amd-ryzen-apparently-cutting-prices-on-core-i7-and-i5-processors and it begins04:47
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abenzthey are at it again04:47
abenzhttp://wccftech.com/intel-playing-dirty-undercut-amd-ryzen/?utm_source=wccftech&utm_medium=related04:47
abenz"call us before you write" was reported by a few sites04:48
abenzthe price drop though, say they drop price on 6900k to 500, the customers who bought the part within last few months would feel robbed!04:49
abenzthey'd voice it I'm sure04:49
Worksterintel seriously...04:51
joacim6900k is in a different class tho04:57
joacimi think04:57
joacimlooking at its pci-e lanes and such04:57
abenzit was smoked by the 1700X05:00
abenz1800x has a clear advantage05:00
abenzthe silly part is not thats its faster, but also half the price05:00
brian|lfsanyone pre-order the new AMD chip05:19
abenznot me05:19
abenzbulldozer still ok for my needs05:19
brian|lfssame here I'm all Intel always have problems with AMD05:19
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Worksteri only had problems with the AMD graphics, every GPU i tried was to new for the driver.05:33
Worksterhttps://bugs.chromium.org/p/project-zero/issues/detail?id=101105:45
WorksterMicrosoft Edge and IE: Type confusion in HandleColumnBreakOnColumnSpanningElement05:45
Worksterfail05:45
otwieraczz3bra: Yes, it's detected at compile time - but without opus, your package is missing files listed in footprint – so either provide footprint from system without opus, or add opus as a dependency.06:28
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frinnstpro tip: dont throw up in the shower06:50
korifrinnst: are you alright06:59
frinnst:>07:00
frinnstyeah just purging my lungs07:00
koriyer lungs?07:01
koridoesn't sound healthy07:01
frinnstbrain thought it would be a good idea to purge everything07:01
korimight have been then07:01
frinnststupid manflu07:03
brian|lfshuh I'm brian07:11
korihuh i'm kori07:12
brian|lfsoh he wrote brain07:14
brian|lfsok makes more sense now07:14
frinnst:>07:21
frinnst"an unnamed file was not found."07:22
frinnstinformative error message07:22
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brian|lfswell he has a static IP lol07:26
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timcowchiphttps://bitbucket.org/timcowchip/timcow/src/a92f1124282427134da5fc18e19ce3a06655533b/lumina-desktop/Pkgfile?at=master&fileviewer=file-view-default09:18
timcowchiphas .md5sum now09:21
frinnstyou should include the version in the tarball, or upgrades will be troublesome09:23
timcowchipok09:25
cruxbot[opt.git/3.3]: sysstat: updated to 11.4.309:25
cruxbot[xorg.git/3.3]: xorg-sessreg: updated to 1.1.109:29
chinarulezzzHi. Here is virtualbox-bin port, if someone needs: https://github.com/chinarulezzz/crux/tree/master/ports/virtualbox-bin09:41
timcowchiphttps://bitbucket.org/timcowchip/timcow/src/6a0b2ef226750e327399cc6893437d81402ae140/lumina-desktop/Pkgfile?at=master&fileviewer=file-view-default09:42
cruxbot[opt.git/3.3]: xfsprogs: updated to 4.10.009:42
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timcowchipgn :)10:04
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frinnsthttps://www.inet.se/kundvagn/visa/10227579/ryzen10:08
frinnst...must..resist..impulse...purchase10:08
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frinnstfailed :10:14
frinnst(10:14
abenzfrinnst: failed?10:16
abenzas in bought it?10:16
abenzRomster / Workster are you still on your phenom ?10:17
frinnstyes10:17
pedjafrinnst, congrats on the purchase :)10:18
abenzseems you went all out with the components, why did you pick 1700x instead of 1800x ?10:18
frinnstbit more expensive for not much gain afaik10:19
abenzyup10:19
abenzat what point does running non-ECC ram become unwise? 64GB? 128?10:20
frinnstits already unwise imho but there seems to be no ecc solutions for ryzen yet10:20
frinnstand depends on the workload I guess10:20
abenzI wonder if ryzen supports ECC memory.. googled it and it seems AMD always dodges that question10:21
abenzbulldozer supports it..10:23
ryu0ACTION bulldozes AMD.10:23
ryu0<_<10:23
pedjathere is a rumor their server chips will support ECC10:23
frinnstyeah or they would be server chips10:24
frinnstso, anybody want to buy a i7 2600k with 16gb ram? :-)10:25
abenzpedja: hah. yup, without ECC it wouldn't be server grade10:26
pedjamarket segmentation ftw, abenz :)10:28
abenz32 core naples CPU, 64 threads10:31
abenzI wonder at what TDP that'd chip run10:31
pedjawhat's the AMD equivalent of VT-d?10:32
abenzAMD-V10:32
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pedjathanks :)10:34
abenznow I hope AMD gets some cash and resumes work on K1210:36
abenzso we finally have ARM on the desktop10:36
abenzand that would be the day, when crux-arm will see more traffic than #crux ;)10:37
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pedjaI don't see AMD-V here http://www.cpu-world.com/Compare/668/AMD_Ryzen_7_1700X_vs_AMD_Ryzen_7_1800X.html10:38
abenzhttp://cdn.wccftech.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/Ryzen-7-1700X-CPUZ-Benchmark.png10:39
abenzsee CPU-Z instructions list10:39
pedjaI'll wait until frinnst pastes output of 'cat /proc/cpuinfo' :)10:47
frinnstits there10:48
frinnstpromise :>10:48
pedjayou do know we expect a lot of pictures of your new rig, right?10:49
abenzand 4K unboxing vids of cos10:50
pedjaunboxing would be 30 sec video of him tearing up the packages to get to the new toys as soon as possible :)10:53
pedjaI'd watch that.On a loop.Forever.10:54
frinnstI wonder when the panic and buyers remorse will arrive10:54
frinnstcouple of days probably10:54
pedjayou can always blame it on manflu and medications :)10:55
abenzACTION makes meme of frinnst 10:56
abenzhttps://cdn.meme.am/cache/instances/folder537/500x/75871537.jpg10:57
abenzI'd be interested to find out time of10:58
frinnst:-)10:59
abenzprt-get -fr 'prt-get listinst'11:00
abenz;)11:00
abenzwith -j16 of course11:00
pedjaFF or Qt5 build.11:00
pedjaspeaking of FF, they bought Pocket :)11:01
abenzsearching for ryzen hype on youtube yields funny results11:01
abenzhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcwJ6l33Zwo11:02
frinnstyeah wtf mozilla11:02
frinnstwho the fuck uses pocket?11:02
pedja20 million users, across several platforms11:03
ryu0ACTION watches as the lone guy at the back of the room raises his hand.11:03
pedjame too, since it was Read It Later11:03
pedjabookmark on the phone, read on 23'monitor.neat.11:04
abenzisnt that what sync'd bookmarks do?11:04
frinnstI use sync for my phone and pad, thats it11:04
abenzyea11:05
frinnstwould never consider syncing my desktop/work desktop with my phone or whatnot11:05
pedjaSync works just with FF, right?11:05
frinnstthink so11:05
pedjathis works with whatever you use (reddit or twitter clients)11:06
pedjait made 12 hour shifts a bit more bearable :)11:07
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otwieraczz3bra: thanks for updating! unfortunately, bad news: configure: WARNING: disabling AV support No package 'vpx' found11:29
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otwieraczz3bra: +libvpx11:29
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druid_droidI allways have amd cpu's, this is my second intel was a offer... I love amd + atheros, it seems every intel I get come with a shity wifi tarded blob12:11
druid_droidI'm making a copy of freetype and fontconfig and using arch as a reference, it seems they have patched,12:13
abenz_only fully open wifi chips that are usable today are ath9k based12:13
abenz_those are wireless N12:13
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abenz_wifi AC and later (including atheros, or as they are known now QCA) all come with huge firmware12:14
abenz_ie closed blobs12:14
abenz_the "open source" driver is basically an API for that firmware12:14
druid_droidhumm, really what happen ?12:14
druid_droidso to have a nice wifi I need obsulete/old usb/card ?12:15
abenz_customer demand, they made ath9k because at the time loads of laptops had atheros wifi. And there was pressure from linux community.. so they responded by opensourcing the driver12:15
abenz_depends on what you consider as nice12:15
abenz_for many wireless N is more than adequate12:15
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abenz_if thats the case then any ath9k card will do fine12:16
druid_droidsorry, I was making confusion, so ath9k don't have blobs ?12:16
abenz_no12:16
abenz_ath9k (wireless N) is fully open, ath10k (wireless AC) has firmware12:16
druid_droidNICE :) next hardware I will choose that models12:17
john_cephalopodaI got an ath9k for my desktop, but some crappy Intel with firmware blob for my laptop.12:17
john_cephalopodaIt takes about 1 minute until the firmware is loaded after boot.12:17
druid_droidjohn_cephalopoda: at the moment I have firmware "in the kernel" or I wold have problems with grsecurity12:18
druid_droidbecouse when I boot the way is configured modprobe can't read /lib/modules even as a root12:18
druid_droidI'm testing kernel the way is configured, I don't have gradm / pax enable yet,12:19
pedjaare WIFI firmware blobs mostly used so user can't crank up the power or?12:19
druid_droidbut it seems I will need two kernels, one for building other use12:19
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druid_droidpedja: european legislation / portuguese legislation show intelectual defeciences12:20
druid_droidmoral issues and so on,12:20
druid_droidif I have some millions I can have all kinds of radios pointed at you, I can even put a tower over your building12:20
druid_droidbut if you are a ordinary slave you will not be able to buy unlocked (AP/PREMISCUOUS MODE) chips,12:21
druid_droidretarded as fuck, fat rats, think all the world is EU/EUA corps controlled,12:21
druid_droidopening a window to other players, that I can't wait to see in the market,12:22
pedjathe trouble is most of the users are fucking clueless.'my wifi doesn't work?CRANK IT UP!'yeah, more power will fix it.12:23
druid_droidpedja: we can buy microwake for 40 euros, not sure the quality of shielding, but you cant play with 100mw ?12:24
druid_droid*microwave12:24
pedjayou can, if you pay for the privilege of using licenced spectrum :)12:26
pedjaclueless idiots misusing unlicenced spectrum is why we can't have nice things.12:28
john_cephalopodaWhy can't you surf on a microwave? Because it is too small.12:29
pedjanice :)12:29
cruxbot[xorg.git/3.3]: xorg-libx11: update to 1.6.512:29
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pedjaFCC might, after killing net neutrality, kill those pesky WiFi requirements, too.12:31
john_cephalopodaI know some guy who lived in the approach path of an airport. His wifi turned off quite often, until he found out that some old, russian machine that landed once per week had a 2.4GHz approach radar, and apparently routers switch off automatically to not disturb such a signal :D12:31
pedja'can I fly a drone near the airport?Of course you can, 'merica is free at last!'12:32
ryu0'Sure, just don't let the FAA know!'12:33
john_cephalopodaOn some airports in Europe, hawks and eagles are used to hunt drones down.12:33
pedjaSerbian version of FAA has some pretty strict rules wrt drones.12:34
pedja(think DJI Phantom and similar, not those tiny quads)12:36
pedjagovernment is touchy on that subject after that drone scandal on the football match :)12:38
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john_cephalopodaPoliticians here (Germany) discuss about introducing stricter rules on drones, e.g. a drone flying license for big drones.12:41
pedjafun fact: when the military showed their drones to the public for the first time, they were all painted pink :)12:41
john_cephalopoda:D12:41
pedjajohn_cephalopoda, something similar here.the fines are pretty drastic, iirc.12:42
john_cephalopodaYeah, if air traffic is disturbed, one will get high fines.12:43
john_cephalopodaBut it's nearly impossible to identify where the drone came from.12:44
john_cephalopodaAfter a collision, the operator just has to land the drone, pack it into the trunk and drive away quickly. Until the pilot has landed and reported the drone, the drone operator is long gone.12:44
john_cephalopoda*After a near-collision12:45
pedjaunauthorised drone flight, even far from the airports/flight paths = jail time+fine12:45
pedjaunless you are a politicians sibling, kid, or friend, then you'll be fine12:47
pedjaif you are rich and know the right people, you can do whatever the fuck you want, pretty much.12:48
john_cephalopodaI'm not 100% sure, but I think that you can fly drones pretty much anywhere.12:49
john_cephalopodaExcept for airports.12:50
pedjalast time I checked local laws, no you can't :)12:50
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joacimfrinnst: more or less the same cpu and motherboard that i'm thinking about12:54
joacimbut i'm hesitant since asus hasn't published the manual yet12:55
john_cephalopodapedja: This is the situation in Germany.12:56
abenz_I'm curious about the Pro variants12:57
abenz_eg Ryzen 7 Pro 180012:57
pedjajohn_cephalopoda, if you are curious http://cad.gov.rs/en/strana/20171/unmanned-aircraft12:57
pedjaabenz_, there is a theory floating the interwebz that they have ECC support.12:58
abenz_I suspected so12:59
abenz_that'd be great12:59
abenz_in fact, I could do with a motherboard that doesn't have "GAMING" in its name12:59
abenz_its getting ridiculous12:59
pedjanot for frinnst it wouldn't, he already bought non-Pro variant, iirc :)13:00
abenz_all those gaming "heatsinks" are in fact entrapping heat. They have no fins, just huge blocks of metal over the mosfets and power delivery13:00
abenz_nothing more annoying than aesthetics (if you call it that) getting in way of performance13:00
pedjaI don't get the obsession with LED's13:01
john_cephalopodapedja: They are blinky!13:01
john_cephalopodaLinux drivers for some nvidia GPUs now support blinking the LEDs :D13:01
druid_droidXD13:02
pedjathat's easier than getting framebuffer to work, I guess.13:02
john_cephalopodaAlso some AMD card is supported now.13:02
john_cephalopodaI'm quite happy with the nouveau driver. It's slower than nvidia proprietary, and when it doesn't work, I go to #nouveau and ask nice and get a patch instantly ;)13:03
pedjawhatever happened to subtle?everything is SHINY! these days.13:04
joacimpedja: it has pro in the name =)13:04
john_cephalopodaYou can also set the LEDs to "glow subtle" in the driver ;)13:05
pedjathen again, I am not the kind of user that they target, I guess.13:05
pedja'glow subtle'?like Dr.Manhattan?13:05
pedjaor whatever his name is13:05
joacimi guess it isn't enough that cases replaced the muted green/amber activity leds with eyescorching blue ones13:06
joacimmotherboards and graphics cards have to scorch your eyes too13:07
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pedjafew years back, I bought a replacement fan.Imagine my surprise when I saw that it glows bright blue :)13:07
pedjadid it say that it does on the box?fuck no.13:08
abenz_then?13:09
abenz_returned it?13:09
joacimi try to avoid anything with leds or styled for gamers13:09
pedjano, ripped the LED out.13:09
joacimbut at the same time, i have this desire to buy a sunbeam case and get a load of translucent LED fans13:09
pedjathat would give 'shiny' a whole new dimension13:10
pedjaI get why they do it, gamers as a group have the most disposable income/upgrade regularly13:12
pedjame?most of this computer is almost 10 years old.13:12
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pedjahardware choice is pretty limited here.you can get cheap(ish) stuff, or the expensive stuff.almost nothing in between.13:17
joacimyeah. on the intel side, it's mostly the workstation boards and the cheaper boards that looks nice13:18
joacimwithout the gamer bling13:18
pedjado I drool when I browse de.pcpartpicker.com?of course I do.13:18
joacimyou'll always have gigabyte and msi that makes everything military grade tho13:19
pedjaI always bought gigabyte boards.so far, so good.13:20
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otwieraczWehre should I report problem with /opt/openal port?13:49
pedjahttps://crux.nu/bugs/13:50
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otwieraczhttps://crux.nu/bugs/index.php?do=details&task_id=138614:01
john_cephalopodaotwieracz: NEW things in footprints can be ignored in most cases. Often it means, that you have some optional dependency installed, that is then automatically compiled in and might create additional files.14:04
john_cephalopodaotwieracz: In this case, the optional dependency "qt5" is present, which results in the configuration dialog being built.14:06
john_cephalopodaotwieracz: You can uncomment the line # PKGMK_IGNORE_NEW="yes" in /etc/pkgmk.conf to ignore NEW lines in footprints in general.14:06
otwieraczthank you.14:09
john_cephalopodanp :)14:11
otwieraczBTW14:14
otwieraczWhat's the rationale after not creating more-contrib-contrib?14:14
otwieraczeg. open-to-all?14:14
otwieraczWith warranty even more void?14:14
john_cephalopodaThere is the 6c37 repo, which is not official, but open to everybody.14:15
otwieraczRight now I am contributing to my own repository and I have to fetch from other's repositories.14:15
otwieraczfetch dependenceis*14:15
john_cephalopodahttps://github.com/6c37/crux-ports14:16
otwieraczThis is even the only external repository I am subscribing.14:16
john_cephalopodaAnybody can file a pull request to 6c37.14:17
otwieraczThat's good to know.14:18
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druid_droidI also have 6c37 :)17:22
koriI'm glad 6c37 is as high quality as it is today17:25
korionodera did some good work, same for all the other contributors17:25
druid_droid:) I have to read about new signature feature, I have a small collection, I'm learning by doing ...17:26
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druid_droidtoday I'm in slow mode, ... surfing, I have been at asus.com to see the boards, I read here about new amd processors17:27
druid_droidI saw there a military grade board, I also read above gigabyte/msi also have, dreaming about a tower :P17:28
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druid_droidjust dreaming about pkginfo -i | xargs prt-get update -fr and all that fun in such a system...17:29
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just_funif you don't filter with grep -v '(firefox|gcc|llvm)' you will have a nightmare17:31
druid_droidyesterday I put my laptop outside, I could not listen more the fan's17:31
druid_droidafter glibc was build and make check I let it come inside again...17:32
druid_droiddo glibc pass all tests in a pristine crux instalation ?17:32
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otwieraczz3bra: utox is now using cmake18:08
otwieraczz3bra: and toxcore is now maintained here: https://github.com/TokTok/c-toxcore/tree/master/toxcore18:08
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joacimis it a bad idea to combine 4TB drives from different manufacturers when using a raid 10 array controlled by btrfs?19:13
joacimthis would be 4TB drives. two ironwolf and two wd red19:13
joacimalready have the two from WD19:14
joacimthe specs from WD are rather fuzzy19:16
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pedjasome cynic would say that 'controlled by btrfs' is the worrying part of that question.19:42
joacimgnu plus linux plus btrfs then19:43
joacimbetter? =)19:43
pedjas/btrfs/zfs :)19:44
joacimi dont want to fiddle too much19:44
joacimand i have this thing called backups =)19:44
pedjawhat are these 'backups' you talk of?19:45
joacimi do want to setup a second machine dedicated to backups, that one will probably run omnios or something else that supports zfs19:45
joacimcopy of all the data on a second set of unmounted drives19:46
pedjaFreeNAS or vanilla FreeBSD would be my choice.19:50
timcowchipis sepen or viper maintainer for the portdb?19:57
timcowchipI see viper is retired20:19
timcowchipso I'm guessing sepen is20:20
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.3]: qemu: 2.7.0 -> 2.8.021:58
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z3braotwieracz, I use toxcore for ratox primarily22:20
z3brawhich is still based on the "official" toxcore from irungentoo22:20
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pedja[OT] Ambassador of Sweden in .rs speaks pretty impressive Serbian.Hell, he speaks it better than significant portion of the population[/OT]22:51
pedjacuriously enough, much better than our wannabe king.22:53
pedjano wonder there was a large crowd at 'Study in Sweden' event.22:54
pedjaI think I closed that off-topic tag a bit prematurely...22:56
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john_cephalopodapedja: Well, apparently you learn an impressive amount of Serbian when you study in Sweden ;D22:58
pedjaheh23:07
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