IRC Logs for #crux Wednesday, 2018-02-14

pedjaxorg-1.20 and server-side glvnd, and I can finally test my theory00:06
pedjajaeger, any issues so far with your new toy :) ?00:09
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joacimso far i've been doing good about my spending00:26
joacimonly bought one ssd, ordered a kvm switch, bought two mice when im using one of my old ones, bought two mouse pads (because the first one i bought was too big)00:27
joacimnow i want an thinkpad x200 for libreboot/coreboot, and x56 controller is on sale (want for elite dangerous)00:28
joacima second apu2 would be nice too00:33
jaegerpedja: so far it's great... the only odd quirk I've seen so far is that the touchpad doesn't work at first in X, have to suspend/resume once to fix it... but as this is the first laptop I've ever owned that suspends and resumes in linux without any tweaking or kernel command line options, etc., that's not hard00:33
jaegerI haven't done any research yet, that might be an easy thing to fix with a libinput option  or something00:35
joacimsounds decent enough. running crux?00:36
jaegerNaturally :D00:36
jaegerwireless works great, suspend and resume work great so far. Haven't set up the bbswitch/optimus stuff yet but the intel uhd620 works fine too00:38
jaegerHaving an i5 with 4C/8T is kinda cool00:38
jaegerjoacim: E:D is a fun one :)00:39
joacimyeah. i havent done much in it tho00:43
joacimjust playing with a 360 controller when i do play00:44
jaegerNor have I but I've enjoyed the little time I've spent in it so far00:44
jaegerI use a logitech joystick that I've had forever00:44
jaegerextreme 3d pro00:44
joacimseen a few people play tha game with some very old gameport sticks00:47
jaegerI used to use a microsoft sidewinder 3d pro for a long time, that was a really solid joystick00:52
jaegerThe logitech one is a decent replacement00:52
joacimis there a reason why UID_MIN is set to 100 in our default login.defs?01:13
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jaegerPresumably it's been that way since Per01:30
joacimseems like an odd thing to do, since most distributions default to 500 or 100001:36
jaegerI'd start at 1000, myself, but haven't run into problems with it01:37
joacimi dont mind tho. dont think i'll have more than 100 system users any time soon =)01:37
joacimi usually change mine to 500, since thats what i was used to with gentoo01:38
joacimand people wonder why i dont like how most stuff end up being hosted in one single basket like github or sf01:46
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countmegabaronHey girls/guys. Making crux usable requires users to list daemons they wish to use in rc.conf. I'm using an old ThinkPad x230. Is there a way to list daemons for possible use?09:24
frinnstls /etc/rc.d will show you whats available from your installed packages09:26
countmegabaronIt seems as though the order in which they're listed makes a difference as well. How do i learn the appropriate order?09:26
frinnstthe order you put them is is the order they startup in09:26
countmegabaronExcellent! Thank you frinnst!09:26
frinnstso you would want to have your network online before you start nfs etc09:26
countmegabaronI see09:30
countmegabaronThank you09:30
countmegabaronBig help09:30
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frinnst :)11:32
joacimtoo deep for me11:39
cruxbot[core.git/3.4]: ports: update for CRUX 3.414:04
cruxbot[core.git/3.4]: filesystem: update to 3.414:06
pedjajaeger, how's the battery so far? iirc, that was still one of the areas Linux lags behind on laptops.14:08
pedjabut it looks like a fine Linux machine, congrats :)14:09
pedjaUI on fruit weighting machine kind of sucks, so I kind of broke the one in the supermarket14:11
pedjait froze, beeping, gibberish on the display. the solution? turning it off and on. duh.14:13
pedjaseems simple enough. put the fruit on the scale, type in the code, and then try to guess which of the 50 keys with weird glyphs on them prints the damn label14:20
pedjapro tip: the most worn out14:21
joacimbattery on mine is all over the place. sometimes 10 hours, sometimes 4 hours14:33
joacimfirefox is a huge drain14:33
joacimdont know what to choose. new mini itx system (that intel 6 core thingy for games), or a microserver for backups14:46
pedjaa.k.a the choice between the 'boring' and the fun stuff14:51
AnselmoACTION has a very fun mini tix computer14:52
pedjajoacim, you're not interested in new AMD APUs for a itx system?14:55
joacimno not really14:55
joacimi dont need that =)14:55
pedjaare there any decent AM4 itx boards, anyway?14:56
joacimasrock and asus have some14:56
joacimi think most major manufacturers have one these days14:57
pedjaah, yes, Anandtech reviewed Asrock one, I think14:57
joacimmeh i could just get a microserver, and upgrade for games when i need to14:57
joacimim not held back by my cpu yet14:57
joacimnot enough for me to care anyways14:57
joacima microserver is fun as well14:57
pedjawhich CPU :) ?14:58
pedjayou got a bunch of machines there, iirc14:58
joacimi5 469014:58
joacimbut an old computer can be a fine server too14:59
pedjathat CPU is 4 years old, not exactly the ancient tech :)15:02
joacimapparently there hasnt been much improvement in ipc15:02
pedjathat's a non-k variant?15:03
joacimbut i think i have the most to gain from simply replacing the graphics card15:03
joacimyeah. i could get a 4790k15:03
joacimthats almost a GHz higher i think15:04
joacimbut those are still expensive15:04
pedja500Mhz difference,8080715:06
joacimi over estimated how much higher the plain 4790 was clocked15:06
pedja4c/8t and a bit bigger cache could make a difference for some workloads, I guess15:08
joacimfor that there is the 5775c15:08
joacim128MB L3 cache i think15:09
joacimclocked a little lower tho, but it performs well in some tasks15:09
joacimor so im told. never used it myself =)15:09
joacimi could simply ask for my money back =)15:10
joacimand be sensible15:10
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pedja6Mb CPU cache, 128Mb dRAM for IGPU, if I am reading the specs correctly (5775c)15:17
pedjaIntel's CPU lineup is sometimes hard to navigate15:19
joacimbetter than amd at organizing those stats at least15:20
pedjathey turned the concept of market segmentation into the art form15:20
joacimeasier to find info about a cpu when i quickly need to slap information about max supported memory or something like that15:21
joacimhappened a few times when someone was wrong near me15:21
pedjathere is this
joacimi like how you must buy the already expensive processor if you want to overclock =)15:22
joacimi remember when i bought a cpu for overclocking, i bought the cheaper one15:23
joacimwould sting less if i broke it, and i'd get more performance for the money15:23
pedjawhen Ryzen came out, there was a lot of 'can't o/c to 5Ghz? fail' comments, which is just plain stupid, imho15:29
joacimi never really cared about overclocking, so for me, most of them seems to fall into the same performance bracket15:29
pedjaI have no sympathy for people that break their shit trying to o/c hw to gain some e-penis points :)15:31
pedjathe recent 'OMG! AMD APU can o/c to 4.5Ghz, guys!' is just hilarious15:38
pedjaGN video debunking that is nice15:40
pedjatl;dw is that Windows timekeeping breaks after waking up from sleep, so the time it keeps is ~7 sec slower than in reality15:42
pedjaso it skews the benchmark results15:43
pedjathe main news is that Windows 10 is so heavy these days it warps timespace like a black hole15:45
jaegerpedja: haven't tested battery life yet15:53
joacimI miss soulver15:56
joacimis there a gtk/qt based calculator like it?15:57
pedjaI use this
pedjajaeger, what's the battery life with Windows, according to the reviews? something like 6-8h?15:58
pedjaI wonder how effective something like TLP really is. it's dependent on the model and hardware, I guess16:02
jaegerone review said 7h22m16:04
joacimgalculator isnt quite the same. but its paper mode is ok enough16:07
cruxbot[core.git/3.3]: pkgutils: updated to 5.40.716:21
cruxbot[core.git/3.4]: Merge branch '3.3' into 3.416:21
cruxbot[core.git/3.4]: pkgutils: updated to 5.40.716:21
cruxbot[core.git/3.4]: cpio: added patch for CVE-2017-7516. Closes FS#157316:21
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marakuanyone getting a footprint mismatch with cyrus-sasl? i'm missing /usr/lib/sasl2/libgs2*16:56
marakuthis is building in a clean chroot, it builds fine on my normal system though16:57
j_vmaraku: yes, i get that too, in clean container... i think there is already a FS# for it, but i will check now16:59
marakuyup, i forgot to look on the bugtracker. thanks j_v17:00
j_vi commented on that one, because there is an interesting circular dependency going on between cyrus-sasl and krb517:01
j_vyep, no problem17:02
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john_cephalopodaHow are you managing your chroots?18:22
marakui use LVM, so i have a crux install with only core packages on it. then when i want to test i snapshot/clone it and chroot into that18:33
marakui have a script with does most of it, which includes mounting ccache, building in a tmpfs, and other things18:35
john_cephalopodaThanks, I'll try that out.18:35
marakucareful if you use the script though, it assumes a lot of things that are specific to my setup, like separate LV's for srcfiles and built pkg's and naming schemes18:36
john_cephalopodaHmm, it would be cool to have LVM as a default thing.18:36
marakui think it's good that users setup their own thing. i've learned that not using LVM makes resizing partitions a pain later on... learning through mistakes works pretty well :)18:38
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chinarulezzz_Is someone tried to display a colored diff by rejmerge  utility?18:48
pedjapartitioning is PITA.18:48
chinarulezzz_The first thing that came to mind is something like this:18:50
chinarulezzz_rejmerge_diff() {18:50
chinarulezzz_  colordiff -pruN $1 $2 > $318:50
chinarulezzz_but this doesnt work.18:51
SitriMost utilities that colorize output will strip the color codes from their output when it goes to a file.18:52
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chinarulezzz_It's not very dzen-way, but I stopped at this solution:19:57
chinarulezzz_if suddenly someone comes in handy :)19:57
chinarulezzz_I only replaced «cat "$TMPFILE" | more» with «colordiff -pruN "$1" "$2" | more» in diff_menu function.19:59
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deep42thoughtHi, I'm struggling to get my serial port working under crux.20:01
deep42thoughtDo I need "setserial" binary? And if so, where can I find it?20:01
joacimi dont think i needed that when i used my serial adapter20:01
joacimi had the driver and used screen to connect20:02
deep42thoughtok, so I probably misconfigured my kernel20:02
deep42thoughtI have (now) /dev/ttyS[0-3]20:02
deep42thoughtbut I get "cat: write error: Input/output error" when trying to cat something into it20:02
joacimi dont know how current systems implement serial. if its through some chip like the ones from ftdi, or some native solution20:03
deep42thoughtit's a pci card20:03
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pedjaserial. haven't used that since the glorious modem days21:24
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pedjaI still have this beauty in the box somewhere
joacimsomethings causing my tr4 system to be horribly slow with crux21:37
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joacimguessing it has something to do with the kernel config21:37
pedja'horribly slow' as in 'it takes longer than 36 seconds to compile the kernel' :) ?21:43
joacimas in takes several minutes just to get to the init script stage21:44
darfowhat has changed? New kernel version? Is this first time to use CRUX on it?21:47
joacimfirst time21:47
darfocat /proc/cpuinfo and check all the good stuff is turned on in the kernel config?21:49
pedjajoacim, from grub menu to login?21:49
joacima lot of things is horribly slow too. like ports -u21:50
darfostupid question: is all your RAM coming online?21:50
pedjafsck, my potatoputer is faster than that :)21:50
darfospinning metal or SSD?21:52
joacimeven opening a man page takes ages21:52
joacimnvme ssd21:52
joacimseems like most of the slowness is from dealing with the filesystem21:52
darfoi would take a close read of the dmesg after booting and see if everything related to the disk is correct21:53
darfodoes nvme show the transfer rate in dmesg?21:53
darfolike SATA?21:54
joacimnothing seems wrong21:55
darfoi see on duckduckgo there are problems with tr and memory config causing slow disk access21:57
darfoACTION out of wild*ass guesses21:59
pedjamaybe try something like ?22:00
pedjakernel source has something similar too22:01
joacimits not margin of error slow. it is like something is terribly wrong22:04
pedjawhat did you use on that machine before Crux?22:06
pedjaany issues like that with it?22:09
joacimnah it was fine22:09
joacimquick and responsive22:09
pedjaso, you wiped that, installed Crux, and now is slow af :) well, that's an interesting mystery22:12
darfodoes hdparm work with nvme drives?22:13
joacimis that the one with basic benchmarking stuff?22:14
pedjathere is nvme-cli in ports22:15
darfoyes. I see on that hdparm does work on nvme22:15
darfobut don't know what figures you should see22:16
joacimi gave up for now anyways22:17
pedjaisn't frinnst using nvme ? maybe he has some ideas22:21
pedjabut it's Valentine's day, so he is probably out, drinking and sinning22:24
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joacimi remember it was fine on my am4 system22:33
joacimand it was fine when i booted the same drive on this tr4 system22:33
joacimits just me lacking in talent22:33
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frinnstmy nvme port is broken on my mb22:40
frinnstevery other poweroff it doesnt detect the disk22:40
frinnstbut when its detected its quick as fuck22:41
frinnstmust be a kernel thing22:42
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jaegerI've not had any problems with nvme performance in crux on multiple systems, for what that's worth23:11
jaegerSo I'd guess maybe a kernel config issue23:11
jaegerI would have guessed it needed a BIOS update maybe but not if it worked fine in another dist23:11
joacim137 noto fonts.23:12
joacimbeen thinking about making a fonts repo for a more complete fonts selection23:12
joacimfind a lot of missing characters on some websites.23:13
joacimyeah my guess is this is a kernel issue too. it works just fine with different distributions, and it worked just fine with crux before23:14
jaegertry using the fedora kernel config?23:35
jaegerI remember doing that to get vfio passthrough working and finally finding out that CONFIG_PCI_MMCONFIG was the only thing my crux kernel was missing :P23:36
joacimi could try that23:39
joacimi dont really mind using fedora either. its pretty ok, outside of some of the crashy packages, and gnome323:53
joacimtheir mate packages are decent enough23:54

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