IRC Logs for #crux Thursday, 2018-04-19

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maraku hey pedja, do you have any tips for running vulkan on crux? i'm trying to compile the PS3 emulator rpcs3 but i get a lot of 'undefined references' on the `ld` stage02:53
marakuspecifically just vulkan references like "undefined reference to `vkCreateInstance'"02:54
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ryuohow many web developers does it take to change a lightbulb?04:32
ryuoonly one, but they'll somehow manage to trip the circuit breaker in the process.04:32
brian|lfslol04:58
brian|lfs did it turn the webserver off04:58
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tilmani think it's a joke :-)05:02
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brian|lfsya I do also05:38
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ryuotilman: yes, it is. lol08:21
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pedjamaraku, you need vulkan-sdk. rpcs3 ships with it as a git submodule, afaict.09:38
pedjaI'll try to push to contrib my vulkan-sdk port son-ish (needs a bit of cleanup)09:39
pedjawrt to getting vulkan to work on Crux, nothing much needs to be done. mesa ships with drivers, and adding nvidia one is trivial.09:41
pedjaa bit of the hack is needed for vulkaninfo, thou. currently it breaks when it detects mesa-32 libraries, but that should be fixed upstream in a near future09:44
pedjaexporting explicit search paths in env variable fixes it for now09:47
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frinnstPublic updates for Oracle Java SE 8 released after January 2019 will not be available for business, commercial or production use without a commercial license.10:15
frinnstwtf10:15
frinnstthey really dont want you to use java, do they?10:15
ryu0frinnst: at this rate maybe Java will be the next Sun product to get forked.10:15
frinnstwell you have openjre/jdk and no such license restriction applies to them but still10:21
Romsteropenjdk is working for me so i don't even use jdk anymore.10:23
ryu0AHA10:29
ryu0I found Romster!10:29
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dbrookeI didn't know we'd lost him 8-)11:00
pedjafrinnst, no money in peasants, hence the push to OpenJDK :)11:02
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john_cephalopodaPeople should just use python instead of Java.11:08
ryu0s/python/perl/11:09
john_cephalopodaOr C.11:09
pedjapeople should just use whatever works for them11:10
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ryu0too many programmers can't keep the snake in their pants. :P11:10
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john_cephalopodapedja: I don't think that I even got java installed. There are not many programs using it.11:16
john_cephalopodaAt least not many that I use.11:16
john_cephalopodaSo when I stumble upon one I usually decide against installing it because I'll have to install a giant JDK.11:17
john_cephalopodaAnd JRE.11:17
pedjajdk contains jre, last I checked11:18
pedjabuilding Java apps is an interesting experience. I pray to Eris that it doesn't break, since I have no idea where to start debugging it if it doesn't11:21
pedjamono and lisp are similar in that regard11:22
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pedjamono is still broken on Crux :)11:25
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pedjaor any distribution with ncurses-6.x, for that matter11:27
pedjafrinnst, rust will be shipped only in 3.4, right?11:30
pedjalibrsvg depends on it these days. yay, progress?11:32
pedjait's 19th. where are ryzen+ reviews?11:34
ryu0pedja: that time of the month, huh?11:36
pedjaryu0, what?11:36
ryu0:P11:36
ryu0pedja: sorry, bad joke.11:36
ryu0what's so special about today anyway?11:36
pedjaRyzen+ launch11:37
ryu0Ok?11:37
pedjayou are looking for AMD laptops, right?11:37
ryu0I'm still waiting on Ryzen mobile to roll out more.11:37
ryu0Isn't ryzen+ something else?11:38
pedjahave you seen new Lenovo Thinkpads?11:38
ryu0pedja: rumors, but nothing offiical.11:38
ryu0E475.11:38
ryu0etc.11:38
pedjahttps://www.anandtech.com/show/12655/lenovo-lists-thinkpad-e485e585-amds-ryzen-mobile-land-in-business-pcs11:38
pedjagigabit NICs :)11:40
ryu0Oh, those.11:40
ryu0They're not available yet.11:40
ryu0they came up in searches.11:40
ryu0pedja: the only product i've seen with gigabit in an actual product you can order is Acer Aspire 3 so far.11:41
pedjawho knew that Acer, of all people, is on the 'cutting edge'11:42
ryu0it showed up in the last week.11:42
ryu0https://www.acer.com/ac/en/US/content/model/NX.GY9AA.00311:42
pedjano word on pricing on that Thinkpads yet?11:43
ryu0None.11:43
ryu0But it'll probably be like the previous one11:43
ryu0E475.11:43
ryu0if Acer's machines weren't so hard to service i might take theirs seriously.11:44
ryu0"cutting edge". lol11:44
ryu0640 x 480 webcam11:44
ryu0anyone ever bought system76?11:45
ryu0they supposedly ship their laptops with intel ME "disabled" now.11:45
ryu0perhaps neutered is a better word.11:46
ryu0pedja: not a fan of the E485 though. it'll probably use a non-removable battery like its predecessor.11:47
ryu0we'll probably have to wait for raven ridge pro processors to have some real choice.11:47
pedjaOEMs seem to be a bit..hesitant?...to make AMD based laptops, imho11:55
ryu0pedja: HP is the only one offering them in any meaningful way.11:55
ryu0Elitebooks typically have AMD's full feature set for business.11:56
ryu0DASH, etc.11:56
ryu0Probooks too often times.11:56
ryu0so i figure, once Elitebooks offer AMD Ryzen we'll start to have some serious stuff.11:57
ryu0but, they often only use Pro processors so that's why they haven't been pushed out yet.11:57
ryu0EliteDesk already uses the Desktop versions.11:58
ryu0https://store.hp.com/us/en/pdp/hp-elitedesk-705-g3-microtower-pc11:59
pedjaAPUs, on surface, look ideal for 'business class' laptops. what am I missing?11:59
ryu0pedja: well, AMD ryzen's Pro version isn't out yet.11:59
ryu0that's probably the reason for the delay.11:59
ryu0for mobile that is.11:59
ryu0the only product i'd expect to see HP release is Probooks, which don't always use them.12:00
ryu0before then12:00
ryu0Dell doesn't do AMD business, at all.12:00
ryu0example of a probook that could be one of the first updated: https://store.hp.com/us/en/pdp/hp-probook-455-g5-notebook-pc-p-3pp98ut-aba-112:01
pedjaI had no idea about APU Pro, I thought that was only for 'proper' CPUs :)12:02
ryu0pedja: they exist, bud.12:02
pedjayeah, that would explain it12:02
ryu0it's also probably why thinkpads are delayed.12:03
ryu0yet Ideapad already has it.12:03
ryu0right now, the most well balanced AMD Ryzen laptop comes from Dell.12:03
joacimhow are the amd thinkpads compared to the T and X serieS?12:04
ryu0Dell inspiron.12:04
ryu0No idea.12:04
ryu0But12:04
ryu0I do have an X120E that uses an ancient AMD APU.12:04
ryu0it's still running.12:04
ryu07 years later.12:04
ryu0i'm not sure what i'll do though honestly.12:05
ryu0i'm wanting a new laptop soon, but none of the offerings are compelling right now.12:06
ryu0AMD ryzen, i don't need pro stuff but chances are i can't find a good one w/o it.12:06
ryu0considering it's not as used as intel is.12:06
pedjamaybe Xiaomi makes one12:08
ryu0i think i'd have found one if they did.12:09
ryu0yep, nothing.12:10
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ryu0Ok, who murdered jue?12:10
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ryu0cool. i found a how-to video on pranking people with youtube links.12:15
ryu0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ12:15
john_cephalopoda[ytdl_hook] ERROR: dQw4w9WgXcQ: YouTube said: The uploader has not made this video available in your country.12:41
john_cephalopodaGreat prank :D12:41
ryu0john_cephalopoda: lol. it was a rickroll video.12:43
john_cephalopodaGEMA saved me again.12:44
ryu0Gema?12:44
john_cephalopodaI already guessed that it would be a rickroll.12:44
ryu0lol12:44
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john_cephalopodaGEMA is the organisation that is managing music rights in Germany. They had a big fight with youtube and won lawsuits against youtube several times.12:44
ryu0lmao12:44
john_cephalopodaBasically they wanted 3 videos removed and youtube overreacted, deleting all GEMA-licensed videos. Then they displayed a message "Because of GEMA this video isn't available". GEMA sued because it was not their responsibility that youtube deleted all those videos and they won. Youtube changed that message and GEMA sued again and won.12:45
john_cephalopodaAfter some time youtube and GEMA found a way to do it in a proper way.12:46
john_cephalopodaBut some videos are still not available.12:46
ryu0So, the germany RIAA.12:47
ryu0john_cephalopoda: we really need a new video prank.12:49
ryu0rickrolling is too predictable.12:49
john_cephalopodaNobody expects the Spanish inquisition?12:49
john_cephalopodaRickrolling is 10 years old.12:50
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.3]: mysql: update to 5.6.4013:30
cruxbot[xorg.git/3.3]: libinput: upate to 1.10.513:31
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cruxbot[contrib.git/3.3]: acpid: updated to 2.0.2918:43
cruxbot[opt.git/3.3]: gtk3: updated to 3.22.3018:52
cruxbot[opt.git/3.3]: cmake: updated to 3.11.118:52
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TimB_jaeger: hey, are you still using mate?20:31
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jaegerIndeed. Will be updating to 1.20 probably after the crux 3.4 release20:54
TimB_okay great, thats why I'm asking, I have done most of the work already, you could take a look if you like (I still have to create a repo for it though)21:02
TimB_I still have to clean up the working dir, but I thought I might share it after it's done to make things easier. :)21:06
jaegersure, feel free and I'll take a look21:08
TimB_cool, I think I'll have it done this weekend, I'll send you the link then21:09
jaegerok21:10
TimB_beginner question: I fork a repo, make my changes, and later on could make a pull request?21:24
pedjahttps://youtu.be/W7oeROkyPgs21:40
marakusounds good pedja, let me know if you need any help packaging/testing anything. i'm running intel only (laptop)21:47
maraku^for the vulkan stuff, not the youtube link :)21:47
pedjaheh. testing it would be nice, since I only use it on Nvidia21:48
pedjawhere it works OOTB, pretty much21:49
pedjaport is a bit messy, since it's using git to get specific git commits of some of the dependencies21:50
pedjaI have several WIP ports that decouple them somewhat, similarly to docker port, but I have yet to find a hosting space for rolled tarballs21:53
pedjaupstream is splitting up a repo into separate projects soon[tm], so that could help21:54
marakudo you have repo/hosted space where your temporary ports are?21:56
pedjaI have on bitbucket, but I haven't pushed vulkan ports to it yet. slipped my mind, tbh :)21:57
pedjaI've been wrestling with Blender for some time now, so the other stuff is on hold for now.21:59
marakuah, no worries then. i just wanted to play with the vulkan ports a bit22:00
pedjaI'll ping you when I push it there (over the weekend, probably), if you want to play with it?22:00
marakuthat sounds good, thanks22:01
pedjanp. btw, do you have wine on that machine?22:04
marakuyup22:07
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marakuthinking of testing wine's vulkan backend?22:07
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pedjaah, I've heard about it. that would be cool to test :)22:23
pedjano, I am getting rare random segfaults with vulkaninfo and mesa3d-32 Vulkan libs, so it would be nice to see if it's an issue only on my system22:25
pedjait's annoyingly random22:25
marakuhmm, i'll definitley try it out22:26
marakuany specific app you run through wine that segfaults? or just generally22:26
pedjaI only use Meshmixer with Wine, it works fine-ish. vulkaninfo (think glxinfo, but for Vulkan), shipped with vulkan-sdk has issues sometimes.22:29
marakuok22:30
pedjawrt to wine's vulkan backend, any suggestions on what to test it with?22:32
pedjait's for dx11 apps, right?22:33
marakui think the backend is just passing windows vulkan calls to vulkan calls on linux (or something like that)22:49
marakuso only vulkan windows applications will work22:49
marakuthere's dxvk, which is for dx11 (probably what you're talking about), but i don't think that's matured as much yet22:51
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marakualso dxvk is a dll that converts DX11 calls to vulkan and the vulkan calls get interpreted by wine. at least that's what i understand22:55
pedjaah, yes, dxvk is what I meant22:56
pedjayou are right, wine backend is Vulkan->Vulkan wrapper.23:00
jaegerTimB_: yeah, that generally works23:00
pedjaI guess no one opened that yt link I posted a while back? congratulations, you avoided being (sort of) rick-rolled23:04
jaegerThere was no context accompanying it so of course I didn't :)23:06
pedjawell, if I wrote 'Westworld Season 2 Primer', someone might actually fall for it :)23:07
pedja'Singing Traveler047'. looks like Christopher Nolan is a fan23:10
pedjahe has a great taste in TV if he is :)23:10
pedjalooks like a cool dude, he was in "Do you trust this computer?" documentary I watched recently23:13
pedjas/Christopher/Jonathan/23:15

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