IRC Logs for #crux Sunday, 2018-06-17

*** hil has quit IRC01:20
*** tilman_ has joined #crux01:33
*** xcko has joined #crux01:57
darfoLooks like Perens is still out half the cost of speaking his mind.02:09
*** darfo has quit IRC02:20
*** darfo has joined #crux02:26
*** abenz has joined #crux02:34
*** abenz has quit IRC02:39
*** _________mavric6 has quit IRC02:44
*** _________mavric6 has joined #crux02:45
*** darfo has quit IRC02:52
*** darfo has joined #crux02:53
*** ohmegaohm has quit IRC05:49
*** abenz has joined #crux05:51
*** ohmegaohm has joined #crux05:57
*** abenz has quit IRC06:11
*** BurnZeZ has joined #crux06:51
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.4]: openjdk8: update to 8u171-b11 release07:47
*** jue has joined #crux08:47
*** jue has quit IRC08:47
*** jue has joined #crux08:47
*** abenz has joined #crux09:15
*** de11 has joined #crux09:27
*** abenz has quit IRC09:45
*** abenz has joined #crux09:46
*** john_cephalopoda has joined #crux09:46
*** frinnst has quit IRC09:50
*** abenz has quit IRC09:54
cruxbot[opt.git/3.4]: flash-player-plugin: ->
*** de11 has quit IRC10:03
*** abenz has joined #crux10:06
cruxbot[opt.git/3.4]: qt5: 5.10.1 -> 5.11.010:07
*** de11 has joined #crux10:10
*** de11 has quit IRC10:17
*** abenz has quit IRC10:24
*** smolboye has quit IRC10:35
*** fun has quit IRC10:35
*** fun has joined #crux10:38
*** de11 has joined #crux10:41
*** kod4-kyun has joined #crux10:49
*** kod4 has quit IRC10:52
*** fun has quit IRC10:55
*** onodera has joined #crux11:04
*** fun has joined #crux11:08
cruxbot[opt.git/3.4]: wine: 3.7 -> 3.1011:09
*** frinnst has joined #crux11:10
*** fun has quit IRC11:15
*** fun has joined #crux11:16
*** jue has quit IRC11:24
*** frinnst_ has joined #crux11:31
*** frinnst has quit IRC11:31
*** fun has quit IRC12:28
*** SiFuh_ has quit IRC12:37
*** fun has joined #crux13:56
ryuoHeard a new alias for Apple: CrApple.14:01
joacimoh their new macbooks will be covered in chrome?14:02
ryuojoacim: yea, after being baked in Apple's feces.14:03
joacimi like fapple personally14:04
ryuolol. that's good too.14:04
ryuobut they really aren't da shit, they are the shit.14:04
joacimi hope they make decent hardware again. i like their software, but their current macbooks, mac mini, and mac pro leaves too much to be desired14:06
joacim3000 USD for an ivy bridge 6 core workstation with 16GB RAM is a bit much14:07
ryuojoacim: that's not the worst of it.14:07
ryuojoacim: have you heard of Louis Rossman?14:07
joacimeveryone has by now14:08
ryuoAh. He recently did a video outlining Apple's hardware crap from a different angle, specifically Macbooks.14:08
joacimand he isnt really showing that much of shit that breaks on their own14:08
joacimcompared to people doing stupid shit to their stuff14:09
joacimofc there are failures like iphones shutting down on when it is kinda chilly outside14:09
ryuoi see.14:10
joacimbut apple isnt the only brand that does this. it is bullshit to focus on only apple14:10
joacimwhere i worked, asus was absolutely horrible. they had several bad batches of some of their laptops14:10
ryuohe doesn't talk much about iPhones... except what people have called "bendgate"...14:11
joacimwas a big sale on one model. i think most of them got returned shortly after since they would bluescreen all the time14:11
ryuojoacim: isn't there one major difference though? Apple charges much higher prices... people should expect more.14:11
joacimthe service centres for asus here are easy enough to deal with tho14:12
joacimsony is total bullshit. so much work and effort for something that should be simple14:12
joacimi wouldnt say pricing their stuff the same as competitors is charging much higher prices14:12
joacimapple isnt in the market of making cheap shitty hp laptops that bend and creaks as you pick them up14:13
ryuojoacim: ok... i guess i'm thinking macbooks then.14:13
joacimtheyre more like zenbooks and stuff like that14:13
joacimapple is expensive simply due to trying to sell a 2012 workstation for 3000 dollars still. that kind of shit is bullshit14:13
joacimgo with lenovo or dell and you get newer hardware for the same money14:14
ryuoso, what's your beef with HP? I heard horror stories about Dell too.14:14
joacimor go on ebay and pick up a used 6 core sandy bridge or ivy bridge workstation for 3000 dollars14:14
ryuoAnd, less often, Lenovo.14:14
joacimi dont have beef with hp14:14
joacimthey just make cheap shitty laptops. so does asus and dell14:14
joacimi just picked hp in that one example14:15
ryuoThey also make more expensive ones... are those shit too?14:15
joacimapple isnt in that market, so dell, asus, and hp gets to slug it out between eachother14:15
joacimofc not14:15
joacimthe nicer zenbooks and such are nice, but they have QC issues14:15
ryuowell, it sounded like you're suggesting that's all they do.14:15
joacimhp has issues with their charger. the plug gets damaged. but a new charger is cheap enough so isnt that big of a deal14:16
ryuoI bought a decent HP ProBook recently.14:16
joacimwhen people say apple is overpriced, they tend to compare to cheap shitty laptops that happens to have an i714:16
joacimthey never compare them to something like one of the nicer zenbooks, asus pro, latitude, xps, elitebook14:17
ryuoI'm not a fan of most modern laptops. They seeem obsessed with thinness.14:17
ryuoat the cost of features.14:17
joacimonce you choose something with a nice display and an ssd, you end up with similar prices anyways14:17
ryuoWith the falling cost of SSDs... that'll probably get cheaper.14:18
joacimim happy if it has a nice display and wifi =)14:18
ryuoMy ProBook is pretty nice, I feel.14:18
ryuoDurable enough for my uses.14:18
joacimi hear a lot of good t hings about thinkpads and the x220. nobody seems to mention that the plastic strip on top of the lid almost always breaks off in the corner14:19
ryuojoacim: i think these days i'm pretty much stuck with business or gaming laptops if I want what used to come standard on regular laptops.14:20
joacimdoesnt prevent the laptop from functioning tho14:20
ryuoStuff like ethernet ports.14:20
joacimi dont care about that. wifi is all a laptop needs for communication i think14:20
joacimmaybe displayport in some shape or form14:21
joacimbut i never use that tbh14:21
ryuoRight... because wifi is *so* reliable. :P14:21
joacimit is14:21
joacimtrust someone elses wifi as much as i trust someone elses ethernet cables14:21
ryuomy experience with routers begs to differ... i've always had slow speed.14:22
ryuonot to mention latency tends to be worse.14:22
joacimmy airport extreme works well :314:22
ryuowhat band?14:23
ryuoOr standard even.14:23
joacimit sucks that there is no decent config interface for it tho14:23
joacimapple has this lame utility14:23
ryuoI currently use a linksys wrt1200ac...14:23
joacima bunch of digits and n, their newer one supports ac14:23
joacimmine supports both 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz14:24
joacimit is from 2008 i think14:24
ryuoi currently use 'g' band because i could never get 'n' or 'ac' modes to give me anything good.14:24
joacimthe wifi on my laptop has slow speeds due to a driver bug (thanks intel)14:24
joacimand the bios of my laptop has a whitelist, so i cant simply replace the card with a different one14:25
ryuolike, i got like 15-25 megabits over wifi...14:25
ryuoi could never figure out how you can possibly improve it.14:25
joacimi get pretty good speeds from my old mac mini. i dont use that anymore tho14:25
ryuoethernet... just works.14:25
ryuoI get 900+ megabits without much effort.14:26
ryuojoacim: do you have any ideas?14:26
joacima lot of this stuff is made to suck simply due to crap software14:26
ryuoi mean, how's your wifi performance?14:26
joacimlike trackpads. they can be good, but their drivers and software often makes them feel so bad14:27
ryuohow much is your realistic bandwidth over wifi?14:27
joacimmy wifi performance is shit due to crap drivers =)14:27
joacima bit over 100 Mbps i think14:27
ryuodoes anything of yours do well?14:27
joacimyeah the mac mini14:27
ryuoThat's better than anything I've ever gotten.14:27
joacimand visitors have had good performance too with their windows laptops14:27
ryuoIs your area full of other APs?14:28
joacimyeah there is a lot of them14:28
joacimi dont live in a metropolis tho14:28
ryuoSo... what am I doing wrong then?14:28
ryuoI live in a suburbs with like a dozen other APs in range.14:28
ryuoi've never gotten more than ~30 megabits over wireless.14:28
ryuoi've resorted to gigabit ethernet because it's far more consistent.14:29
ryuoonly been using wifi for devices where it doesn't matter.14:29
ryuoIs my AP of choice a terrible one?14:29
ryuoIs there like a guide to optimizing wireless, when it's terrible even at close proximity?14:30
ryuoLike less than a meter?14:30
joacimlinux? try windows =)14:30
joacimbut yeah. wired is a lot easier to get up and running14:30
joacimwith decent speeds14:31
ryuoi've been wanting to revisit wireless, but not buying new HW.14:31
joacimi dont know too much about access points tbh. i've gone through a few crap ones14:31
joacimthe asus ones we used at work were fine tho. but i'd avoid the cheap 10-40 dollar ones14:31
ryuojoacim: my currently one oriignally cost $150 but i got it on special for $100.14:31
ryuoit was designed with openwrt in mind.14:32
joacimpretty much anything above 100 dollars should work fine14:32
ryuoIs my firmware holding me back?14:32
joacimespecially for just a few users14:32
ryuojoacim: yea... i need to figure this out.14:32
joacimmight be. i know the driver bugs that makes my laptops wifi slow, is only there when i use linux14:32
ryuoyea... i've gotten terrible performance over wifi... and i primarily run linux.14:33
ryuoMy ProBook comes with 802.11ac hardwae.14:34
joacimi have this atheros card that i hear is good, but i cant use it :(14:34
ryuoWhy? BIOS whitelist?14:34
ryuoNo drivers?14:34
joacimbios whitelist14:34
joacimthe drivers are free, no firmware blobs14:34
ryuoI see.14:34
ryuoWell, only option is to use a hacked BIOS then... Or...14:35
ryuosomething else.14:35
ryuoi once found a hacked BIOS for an old hp business laptop.. nc843014:35
joacimthen i get to choose between something from 2012, or one patched for spectre and meltdown from 2018 =)14:35
ryuojust to allow me to use a new card.14:35
ryuojoacim: heh. right now AMD is looking like the better choice for new stuff.14:36
joacimi heard you can diddle the card so it looks like a whitelisted card to the bios14:36
joacimmight try that14:36
ryuojoacim: anyway, i need to get going.14:36
joacimcya =)14:36
jaegerWireless can be good if you use decent APs, yeah. It just seems like most consumer ones are terrible14:55
*** de11 has quit IRC15:05
*** de11 has joined #crux16:10
frinnstubiquitis are pretty nice. cheap as consumer but more business/enterprise-light16:12
jaegerYeah, that's what I use and would recommend16:14
jaegerI have 2 UAC-AP-LITEs16:14
jaegerer, UAP-AC-LITE16:15
frinnstw t f16:17
frinnstthats fucking free for a 10g *router*16:17
joacimbuy two =)16:17
frinnstsry aus16:28
*** de11 has quit IRC16:30
frinnstthis is going to be me in during the next 3 weeks:
*** tsaop has joined #crux16:34
tsaopI cannot build qt5 in a docker container16:35
tsaopit fails after building qmake with: Could not find qmake spec ''.16:35
tsaopthe same process works fine if I manually build on the host system16:35
tsaopany clues?16:35
jaegerI don't know of a fix currently16:35
frinnsthmm. someone else mentioned something similar iirc16:35
*** jue has joined #crux17:04
*** jue has quit IRC17:04
*** jue has joined #crux17:04
tsaopI tried delving into the build system but I couldn't make much of it17:10
*** de11 has joined #crux17:14
tsaopfound it17:32
tsaop [1/2]17:32
tsaop [2/2]17:35
tsaopTL;DR: run docker with --security-opt seccomp:unconfined or wait for the statx call to be whitelisted17:36
tsaopwhich means docker has to be updated to the most recent version17:37
jaegerIt's on my list for review17:39
tsaopNo problem, I'll wait for 18.05.0 to land17:40
tsaopon CRUX17:40
*** tsaop has quit IRC18:09
*** de11 has quit IRC18:21
*** fun has quit IRC18:41
*** fun has joined #crux19:03
*** jue has quit IRC20:18
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.4]: docker: updated to version 18.05.0-ce20:21
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.4]: runc: updated to version 4fc53a820:21
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.4]: containerd: updated to version 773c48920:21
frinnst"runc" *tihi* /sweden20:21
darfojaeger: did you try qt5 on docker?20:25
joacimi maintain my own runc version20:25
frinnstwell you are from norway so thats obvious20:25
jaegerNo, I didn't yet. I don't use qt5 for anything20:32
darfook, I'll give it a try.21:07
*** [EaX] has joined #crux21:35
*** xor29ah has quit IRC21:38
darfojaeger: qt5 on docker got past the point where it was failing to bootstrap a working qmake binary21:42
darfoit will be some time before qt5 completes the build21:42
jaegersounds like progress21:47
john_cephalopodaqt5 on my system compiles fine.21:48
darfoit does on all mine too, just didn't under docker21:49
*** smolboye has joined #crux21:57
*** smolboye has quit IRC22:10
darfojaeger: qt5 build completed successfully under docker 18.05.0-ce \o/23:34
darforomster: ^^^ something you can take off your to-do list for qt523:37
jaegergood deal, thanks for testing23:38
darfonp. thanks for updating docker so fast after tsaop found that Qt bug report.23:39
darfonow I can let my kvm gather dust again and enjoy the speed of containers for my integration testing23:39
jaegerNo problem. It had been on my lsit for a little while and I had some time today23:40
*** john_cephalopoda has quit IRC23:48

Generated by 2.14.0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at!