IRC Logs for #crux Tuesday, 2018-07-03

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jaegerLike I said, not appropriate for 100% of the uses here but handy for some, such as removing a package from the package database and writing it back out to disk in sorted order00:35
jaegersearching is nice and quick, too00:35
jaegerOn the other side of the coin, not worth the effort to just display a list of all the installed packages, for example00:35
jaegerYou could certainly sort an array during or after its creation but the BST also does that for you00:39
jaeger6 of one, half a dozen of the other :)00:42
jaegerat least qsort(3) is already available, don't have to write anything for that00:42
jaegerOne place where the BST kinda falls down is that the package database is sorted on disk, so when you read it in you get a very one-sided and tall BST00:45
jaegerI originally started with a hash map but ended up switching to BST because it's somewhat simpler.00:48
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ryuojaeger: did you use the POSIX BST functions?01:40
ryuojaeger: tsearch, etc.01:40
jaegerno, didn't know about them01:47
ryuoOh. Ok.01:54
jaegermaybe I'm weird but I also enjoy the mental exercises of implementing the data structure and managing my memory allocations, etc.01:55
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frinnstyes you are weird :-)03:16
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SiFuhWelcome to the Royal Thai Navy Seal school of cave spelunking.08:38
SiFuhhaha08:38
SiFuhBig news in Asia about 12 kids and coach lost for 9 days, found by 2 British divers in a flooded cave, all alive. Search involved 7 countries including Myanmar! very impressive08:40
SiFuh7 countries as in people from 7 countries, not searching 7 countries08:40
joacimall the people from 7 countries?08:47
SiFuhno ;-)08:49
SiFuhThe Thai Navy is considering training the kids after they eat how to scuba dive08:49
SiFuhhttps://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2018/jul/02/thailand-cave-rescue-divers-search-for-missing-football-team-live08:50
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pedjafrinnst, have you seen 'btrfs balance' do this https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1063638 ?10:47
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pedjaI don't see any recommendations on btrfs-balance man page on how often to run it. the warning that it's I/O intensive is there, thou :)10:51
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pedjaheh. any bets on how long from Cake merging upstream to CPE vendors using it? https://www.bufferbloat.net/projects/codel/wiki/Cake/11:52
SiFuhI bet before 202011:54
john_cephalopodaI wonder how long it will take until Cake will be an integral part of systemd.11:56
pedjawhen systemd devours kernel. so, any day now :)11:58
pedjaI am looking forward to a video of 'The tragedy of systemd' talk from BSDCan 2018.12:00
pedjait will be interesting to hear BSD perspective on it.12:01
pedjafrom what I gathered from talk notes, the main issue with it is not so much technical, but the rather abrasive attitude of the systemd developers.12:05
pedjathat drastic of a change required more...diplomatic? approach12:06
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SiFuhfsck systemd12:16
SiFuhi hate it so much12:16
SiFuhi like void's runit12:16
SiFuhbut i like Gentoo's openrc12:16
SiFuhand slackwares init12:16
SiFuhbut the systemd is very shit and if linux adopts it  then I am going to cry12:17
SiFuhand I don't understand why somethign so premature made it in the linux world12:18
pedja'if Linux adopts it'?12:19
pedjatbh, I didn't have any issues with it on several distributions I used that ship it.12:22
pedjaso far, anyway :)12:23
SiFuhalthough linux itself is premature12:23
joacimsystemd is just annoying to deal with to me12:24
joacimit feels bigger than it needs to be, and i think services are annoying to manage with systemd12:24
joacimtoo much typing12:24
joacimtoo much head scratching12:24
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pedjaidk, whatever I had to do with it (on openSUSE) took a couple of minutes to find in the docs. granted, all of that was simple stuff12:27
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joacimeasier and simpler to edit a file and rerun a script i think12:28
pedjatab completion ftw :)12:33
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frinnstpedja: no13:07
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jaegerthat ship has sailed, systemd is here to stay13:30
cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.4]: mesa3d-32: 18.0.5 -> 18.1.313:41
cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.4]: gdbm-32: 1.14.1 -> 1.1613:41
SiFuh:-( quick let's go back to BSD13:51
SiFuhDevuan introduces a version where you can choose Openrc or SysVinit13:52
SiFuhunfortunately your system is piled full of dormant systemd crap13:52
joacimidk. ill use systems without while i can13:58
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SiFuhHaha Gentoo 5 second boot. All I need now is the theme for Jurassic park playing when it boots :-P14:12
joacimentire theme in 5 seconds14:15
SiFuhi was thinking about the climax only14:18
SiFuhbut thanks for ruining it for me ;-)14:18
pedjafrinnst, OK. that bug report is an interesting read, looks like the behaviour is hard to reproduce reliably.14:25
pedjajaeger, I wonder if its eventual replacement will generate so much heated discussions :)14:26
SiFuhneeds the Jurassic park theme song when discussing14:26
pedjastep 0: don't let Lennart anywhere near it14:27
pedjaSiFuh, T-Rex roar14:27
SiFuhyeah and when you delete/uninstall systemd then you hear the theme song for Jurassic park14:28
SiFuhhahaha that would be awsome!14:28
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frinnstholy shit. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1877514/reference is crazy14:29
SiFuhvelociraptors?14:29
joacimi imagine a replacement for systemd will be even worse14:29
joacimi hear what openindiana has is nice. but illumos/solaris folks say a lot of nice things about their systems in general14:29
SiFuhrunit is best14:30
jaegerpedja: I'd say that would depend greatly on the attitudes of those developing/pushing it14:31
jaegeras with systemd14:31
pedjaagreed14:31
pedjajoacim, aren't they using Solaris smf? which was one of the inspirations for systemd, allegedly14:32
joacimthink so14:32
SiFuhand xml is a disease to coding14:34
SiFuhi bet if AI takes over they will be cursed with xml14:34
joacimfirst thing an actual AI would complain about is binary logs and xml config files14:37
SiFuhand install javascript and systemd ?14:37
SiFuh:-P14:38
SiFuhfrinnst: Vietnam War is crazy?14:38
frinnstcrazy good, horrible etc14:39
frinnst(the documentary that is)14:39
SiFuhim getting it as we speak because I am thinking of moving to Vietnam14:40
joacimshould be ok14:40
joacimi heard the war is over14:40
SiFuhhahahaha14:40
SiFuhthat's was funny14:40
cruxbot[opt.git/3.4]: qt5: fix missing cmake files. Fixes FS#163215:10
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.4]: qt4: updated source URL, fixed tabbing20:26
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elderKHey guys, is there any way to see which packages have had new dependencies added or perhaps depnames changed?23:18
elderKMako for instance has been renamed python-mako23:18
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jaegerelderK: probably the timeline would be an easy place to see stuff like that23:21
jaegerhttps://crux.nu/Main/Timeline23:21
elderKCan I make a suggestion? In the future, it would be nice if we had someone say "Renamed whatever -> whatever"23:22
elderKEasier to pattern match :D23:23
jaegerThat should be part of the commit message, in theory23:23
elderK:P Just ->23:23
jaegerwell, that's just lazy, heh23:23
elderKI figure I'll hit build issues later anyway if they're needed23:24
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jaegerLooking through the git log for opt there are quite a few commits in the past that say something like "renamed to blah"23:28
frinnstyeah and notifies were sent out to the ML, no?23:32
frinnsthttps://lists.crux.nu/pipermail/crux/2018-July/thread.html23:32
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