IRC Logs for #crux Tuesday, 2019-02-19

john_cephalopodaI need it for firefox.00:00
ryuoAbdullah: Future C? Lies. It's not future C until it has just as many security flaws. D:00:07
john_cephalopodaForth is the future.00:08
ryuoForth was in a race. It came in fourth.00:08
Abdullahjohn_cephalopoda: I use chrome. firefox is slower than it ;-)00:08
john_cephalopodaAbdullah: When did you last use firefox?00:08
john_cephalopodaryuo: It _always_ comes fourth, since 1970. Gotta respect that. :รพ00:09
AbdullahI think a few weeks ago when I installed crux and didn't have chrome00:09
Abdullahwhat's first one then ryuo ?00:09
ryuoAbdullah: C or Java these days. =p00:09
john_cephalopodaAbdullah: Firefox is pretty fast. Also it compiles _way_ faster than chromium, even if you add the build time for rust.00:10
AbdullahWe don't have to compile chrome btw ;-)00:11
Abdullahso again it is faster ;-)00:11
Abdullah have chrome here00:12
john_cephalopodaYou should use chromium instead. Chrome is a bunch of spyware.00:14
Abdullahwhy not tor ;-)00:16
john_cephalopodaI am in fact using Tor Browser for my daily surfing needs.00:18
john_cephalopodaI still use regular firefox when there is some really interesting web demo that won't run with all the blocked stuff in Tor Browser.00:19
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jaegerAbdullah: portdb names need to be a single word, what would you prefer yours be called when it's listed on the portdb?03:53
jaegerAbdullah: also, I recommend running 'prtverify' on all your ports, it shows some best practice/style stuff03:55
jaegerAbdullah: also also, I get 403 forbidden errors trying to sync your ports tree03:56
jaegerspecifically in the google-chrome-dev port03:56
jaegerAbdullah: for now I've added it as 'ak' but wanted to make sure04:14
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deep42thoughtHi, I have trouble compiling rust - anyone else seing this: "... consider adding `cargo-features = ["edition"]` to the manifest ..."?06:48
deep42thoughtalso it warns about being run via sudo (which it is)06:48
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deep42thoughtif I su to the respective user instead of sudo, it does not complain about sudo anymore, but still fails similarily07:15
deep42thoughtthis is the log when running via su instead of sudo07:20
frinnstdeep42thought: what do you use rust for? firefox source?08:10
deep42thoughtunfortunately I need to compile it, because I'm using a patch for it08:10
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frinnsti'm sooo sorry08:11
deep42thoughtyeah, I'm seriously considering abandoning years of thunderbird usage08:11
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deep42thoughtand switching to a simpler mailer like alpine ...08:11
frinnstwhat does the patch do? anything interesting?08:11
deep42thoughtstamps outgoing emails with hashcash08:12
deep42thoughtbecause I was tired of the bad implementation via plugins08:12
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.4]: squid: update to 4.611:39
cruxbot[xorg.git/3.4]: mesa3d: update to 18.3.411:40
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Abdullahjaeger: Thanks ak is okay12:10
AbdullahThere is mutt deep42thought12:11
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Abdullahit was set 0644, now set to 0755 jaeger12:15
Abdullah has some ports like libnotify which is updated to latest version. Please update this page12:46
frinnstits still unmaintained13:03
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pedjaafaict, 0.7.7 is still the latest libnotify version13:07
Abdullahfrinnst: I'd love to adopt it. and yeah its the latest version pedja13:13
pedjainteresting video on level1techs about vdi.13:13
pedjafrinnst, iirc, you experimented with nvidia enterprise stuff? did it go anywhere?13:16
pedjaI know you are a big fan of Nvidia :)13:16
pedjanext release of pavucontrol drops gtk2 support.13:23
ryuocheck it out:
ryuoit's so overpriced it's not even funny.13:39
ryuo$90 for a laptop that old in that condition?13:40
ryuoAre you people nuts? I can buy similar ones for half that.13:40
ryuoheh. i offered half what they're asking and they auto-declined it.13:41
ryuoeh, not my problem.13:41
ryuoi thought i might be able to salvage a cheap CPU upgrade from it.13:41
ryuobut the unit isn't even guaranteed to work, so fsck it.13:41
ryuoACTION is looking for i7-3612MQ or i7-3632MQ processor for a decent price.13:43
frinnstoh joy14:02
frinnstexpire_logs_days        = 1014:02
frinnstmax_binlog_size         = 100M14:02
frinnstdoesnt really limit anything when you import a +50gb db14:02
jaegerAbdullah: ok14:57
Abdullahso when a package complains about a missing shared lib. while file exists there too17:11
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Abdullahlike I compiled neovim and it complains now that isn't there but it exists as /usr/local/lib/
jaegertry with LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/local/lib perhaps17:17
Abdullahjaeger: it should be compile option right?17:26
Abdullahwondering arch linux has 8.1.0877 and we have 8.1.0878 ;-)17:30
jaegerFor CRUX packages we don't use /usr/local at all17:51
jaegerThat's left for things you install outside of the package management tools17:51
AbdullahI installed msgpack-c from git repo18:02
AbdullahThere in ports db we had a port for it, but it was not working so I tried to install it how it is mentioned in github18:03
john_cephalopodaAbdullah: Replace ./configure with "./configure --prefix=/usr" in your msgpack-c package.18:05
Abdullahnow when I do, LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/local/lib nvim, nvim is started but when I do it without it, it complains about missing lib18:05
Abdullahokay john_cephalopoda18:05
Abdullahthere is no configure18:07
Abdullahthat's why I modified this Port and went with how it was mentioned in github repo18:08
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AbdullahI have to learn C ;-)18:53
Abdullahmake it now and updated the Pkgfile too at
ryuoAbdullah: welcome to a world of misery and woe. excuse me, i meant to say, welcome to the world of C.18:58
Abdullahryuo: ;-) how long it may take me to learn it btw18:59
ryuoAbdullah: a long ass time if you expect to do anything with it.19:00
ryuoi've been using it for 10 years.19:00
ryuoit's not an easy language to use.19:00
Abdullahhmm, is learning linux difficult than it?19:00
ryuoeh, i learned Linux at the same time.19:00
ryuoprobably easier.19:01
AbdullahI had no computer knowledge in school, I'm a high school dropped guy and never saw computers in school. I had no teachers, learned linux in less than one year19:01
ryuoyou don't need C to learn Linux. shell is generally more useful for that.19:01
Abdullahlinux was my first OS I ever used in life. now it looks easy to me.19:02
AbdullahI think if I learn something enough to make something in C, it will get interest and then I'll learn fast.19:02
AbdullahI'm 18 hours online just tinkering my machine19:03
ryuowell, go for it i guess, but C is not a nice language.19:04
ryuoyou'll likely saw your fingers off in the process, metaphorically speaking.19:04
jaegerI'm weird and I enjoy programming in C for the mental exercise... but I don't do it often19:04
ryuojaeger: heh. i'm part of a libc research project.19:04
jaegerthat sounds less fun19:05
ryuoAbdullah: lots of pitfalls, but be my guest if you want to try it.19:07
AbdullahI'm newb. You people have experience. Suggest me what is benificial for me19:07
ryuodon't go for C without a damn good reason. it requires a lot of hassle, even for pros, to get stuff done.19:07
Abdullahso what should I learn19:07
ryuothat's highly dependent on your goals.19:08
AbdullahI wanna make some money from my computer knowledge19:08
Abdullahso keeping that in mind, suggest me something19:08
ryuohow old are you?19:09
AbdullahI have lost many years19:09
ryuothere's a number of industries.19:09
ryuogames? i don't suggest it. highly specialized and the companies reportedly treat you like trash.19:09
AbdullahI left high school in 2006.19:10
AbdullahI don't like games ;-)19:10
Abdullahwe didn't have electricity in our areas since 201419:10
ryuoweb development? it's got a bad rep in the IT field, but it's still a common line of work.19:11
Abdullahgot a computer by chance and started using it a year ago.19:11
ryuoa lot of web developers end up causing trouble due to their own incompetence.19:11
AbdullahI'm not good in that. I think I can be system administrator19:12
ryuojust ask frinnst or jaeger. ;p19:12
AbdullahThey will give their comments after we end talking ;-)19:12
Abdullahthey are seniors, hear more and talk less ;-)19:13
ryuowell, good luck with IT?19:13
joacimim starting to wonder if some of them might be competent19:13
joacimbut they seem incompetent due to what their boss tells them to do19:13
ryuojoacim: .. some of the stuff i've heard couldn't be explained by bad orders.19:13
ryuojoacim: web developers screwing up their own DNS records.19:13
AbdullahI own a site and I just started it from a template.19:13
Abdullah that's all I know about web development19:14
joacim"migrate that dns, ignore the zone file we're getting new shit!"19:14
frinnststop giving me PTSD19:15
ryuoAbdullah: web development is a bit of an odd field. it needs competent programmers but it also needs competent artistic folks.19:15
frinnsta handful of times our clients have given out their dns to web monkeys19:15
frinnstand a handful of times the webmonkeys have moved their dns', breaking email and other "fucking business critical shit"19:16
ryuofrinnst: i saw a job posting on indeed recently that expected their web developers to manage the DNS.19:16
Abdullahryuo: you know in my country web development has some industry but linux has about to none19:16
ryuoAbdullah: I see. Perhaps that would be a better place to start? you can use system admin crap to facilitate it.19:16
ryuoPHP is a commonly used solution for web backend stuff.19:16
AbdullahI think its easier to learn too19:17
ryuoit doesn't even require apache. php-fpm can be used with any web server supporting FastCGI.19:21
joacimshould learn some ready made solutions too i think19:22
ryuoAbdullah: so, if web is your thing, you'll need to learn a crapton of languages.19:39
ryuoAbdullah: first, HTML, CSS, JavaScript. then whatever you use for the backend. this could be PHP or JavaScript even.19:39
Abdullahryuo: I would like to learn something else like system engineering19:39
ryuowell, it's your life.19:39
ryuowhat is system engineering anyway?19:40
Abdullahryuo: yeah because I have learnt at least something in it19:40
Abdullahsystem administration19:40
john_cephalopodaAbdullah: Why do you embed google ads in your website?19:48
AbdullahI wanted to earn some money from it but still adsense account isn't approved. and I'm lazy enough to remove code19:49
john_cephalopodaGoogle is awful.19:50
john_cephalopodaAds are awful.19:52
Abdullah;-) I have no ads yet20:05
john_cephalopodaBut you embed script by google, which means that google probably gets to see every visitor of your website.20:06
Abdullahis it not good for some reason? tell me and I'll remove it20:07
john_cephalopodaEh, whatever.20:14
jaegerryuo: is a realloc less efficient than a free -> malloc or the same?20:15
ryuojaeger: it should be about the same, but that's dependent on the implementation.20:15
jaegerI guess realloc does keep the data20:15
ryuojaeger: it's better to not need to use realloc in the first place.20:16
ryuothe only performance penalty i ever heard of was overusing them.20:16
ryuoincidently realloc includes an implicit free.20:18
ryuoof the old memory.20:18
ryuoand... you can switch realloc to a mode that's effectively the same as malloc if the provided pointer is null.20:19
ryuosome of the weird behaviors of realloc.20:19
ryuonot sure why you'd use that mode honestly.20:19
jaegerseems odd. In this case I want to keep the contents of the original memory20:20
ryuook... that's something realloc already does.20:20
ryuoto get the same effect with malloc, you'd need to allocate a new buffer, memcpy it over to it, and free the old pointer.20:20
ryuoincidently C++ has no form of realloc with the new operator.20:21
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timcowchipso dconf-editor needs vala >= 0.4020:37
timcowchipand vala >= 0.40 needs graphviz20:38
timcowchipand graphviz is no longer available at$name/stable/SOURCES/$name-$version.tar.gz20:40
timcowchipbut it is available at https://$$name/stable/SOURCES/$name.tar.gz20:40
timcowchipso I made ports for graphviz, vala-0.42.5 and dconf-editor20:41
timcowchipsimilarly vala-panel needs gtk3 compiled with wayland-backends enabled20:51
timcowchipso I made a port for gtk3 and vala-panel20:51
Abdullah youtube-dl giving error20:52
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timcowchipit looks like it compiled and failed to install, did you try " -f"?20:55
timcowchipor "update -fr" instead of depinst?20:56
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AbdullahI created a new port for it, it belonged to 2018. and installed it successfully.21:02
AbdullahHow can I move it to contrib?21:04
AbdullahI think I once visited the page ;-)21:05
joacimapply to join contrib, then you access to add shit to it21:06
timcowchipisn't there an extensive vetting process to join contrib?21:07
joacimAbdullah: is pkgadd / pkgmk -i ran as root?21:07
Abdullahyeah I ran as root I think. I have them as alias and I use aliases21:07
timcowchipto prevent "shit" from being added to it?21:08
Abdullahleave it joacim I have now port and that is working.21:08
Abdullahtimcowchip: sorry I coudln't get you21:08
timcowchipAbdullah: do you have a git repo?21:08
Abdullahyeah timcowchip I have many21:09
joacimlooks like you run things with fakeroot, which is fine. makes sense that the install stage fails if it has no access to install stuff to system21:09
joacimthen again idk21:09
timcowchipyou can add your own repo to /etc/ports/Abdullah.git21:09
joacimtimcowchip: i dont mind good shit in contrib, but bad shit is better off in user repos i think21:10
Abdullahyeah I have added one.21:10
timcowchipjoacim: that's where I put bad shit21:11
Abdullahoh so he was talking about me that I should add shit to contrib lol21:11
AbdullahI'm not a native english speaker and I have only read english for 4 years.21:12
Abdullahso pardon me if something goes wrong ;-)21:12
joacimyour english seems fine to me21:13
joacimwhat's your native language(s)?21:15
joacimi wouldnt mind applying for contrib, but i dont know what i'd maintain or add21:17
joacimmost of what i use is already in core/opt21:18
pedjabunch of quake mods, perhaps :) ?21:18
joacimi dont want to maintain video games in contrib21:18
joacimwouldnt mind helping with a video game repo tho.21:19
joacimlike emulators21:19
pedjawhy not?21:19
joacimidk. i think with enough games, they can work well in their own repo21:19
joacimyou get a lot of ports just from maintaining id tech stuff.21:19
joacim(vk)quake(spasm), yquake2, ioquake3, bhewm3, heretic2, warsow, xonotic21:21
pedjaif I weren't a lazy bastard, I'd add a few font ports to contrib. Source family, for example21:21
joacimthen the map editors21:21
joacimand maybe some ports that add launch scripts for common map packs and mods21:21
joacimfonts i also think would work in a big fonts repo21:21
joacimkeep the few main ones in opt/xorg21:21
joacimthen another repo for people that want fonts like the noto family21:21
joacimnoto alone would be a lot of different packages21:22
pedjaidk, contrib should be a mix of different stuff, imho, games included21:22
pedjabut most people use Steam these days, so21:23
joacimoh yeah jumpnbump too, and dfort21:23
timcowchipcontrib should be like is for Slackware21:23
joacimis that like an aur?21:23
pedjadifference being having actually maintained ports in contrib vs aur :)21:24
joacimtbh, the system we have no reminds me a bit of copr on fedora.21:24
joacimrandom collection of small reposoitories by users21:24
joacimthat may or may not be well maintained21:24
pedjait's a best effort, after all21:25
pedjaworks for me[tm] kind of thing21:25
joacimonly thing in my own repo i would like to add to contrib would be obmenu, since it would compliment openbox and obconf21:26
joacimthe rest is just games and small less important tools21:27
joacimnetatalk isn't much of a requirement anymore21:27
joacimi think smb and samba took over in most kinds of networks21:27
joacimtransmission-remote-cli maybe, but that is unmaintained, and its replacements are less impressive21:28
joacimtremc is missing some features that transmission-remote-cli has21:28
pedjacan't remember the last time I used a bt client21:28
pedjato d/l linux isos :)21:29
timcowchipno SBO requires approval for package submissions unlike AUR21:29
pedjaso like FreeBSD ports, I guess21:31
pedjapkgsrc is similar in that regard, iirc21:32
joacimi use bt a bit21:33
pedjatoo lazy to set up port forwarding every time I need to reset my router/the power goes off21:35
pedjahardly anything is worth the effort these days21:36
pedjacool. I had no idea virt-builder can use Windows images to install VM's21:39
joacimis that like an auto install?21:40
pedjaif it works like for Linux distributions, they are pre-built images. just pull and install, iirc21:41
Abdullahjoacim: Pashto21:42
pedjajoacim, if you are curious
joacimseems worthwhile to learn how to make ones own templates21:44
joacimcant believe i havent heard about pashto before :(21:45
joacimheard a lot about the countries it is spoken in tho21:45
Abdullahjoacim: people say it is difficult ;-)21:47
AbdullahIts spoken in Pakistan, Afghanistan mostly. While pashtoons live around all over the world21:48
Abdullahwe say in our language, Pashto isn't just a language, its way of living.21:49
joacimi have enough with norwegian, and maybe sami21:49
Abdullahpeople say we are lost ten tribes ;-)21:50
joacimthose uralic languages are supposedly hard to learn too. tho sami has far fewer grammatical cases than finnish and hungarian21:51
AbdullahAs I told earlier I dont have enough knowledge how you people learn languages but ...21:52
AbdullahI learned English just by using internet21:52
Abdullahand learnt local languages by living with them21:53
joacimi started learning in school. think i was about 8 or 9 years old21:53
joacimbut i think i learnt most of what i know from reading and writing in my own time21:54
joacimsome overlap between norwegian and english too, so it isn't a tricky language to pick up21:55
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Abdullahyeah but I sent you some other thing ;-)22:05
joacimoh the apple22:05
Abdullahyeah ;-)22:06
AbdullahYou know even I'm on dwm, my screen will be just like this22:08
Abdullahjoacim: you said you love terminals, am I right?22:09
Abdullahdid you install termite on crux?22:10
joacimnot sure if did. maybe it was someone else22:10
joacimi mostly just use urxvt and whichever term comes with the desktop environment i use22:10
AbdullahI'm gonna compile it.22:10
AbdullahI love urxvt. the scrot you saw was also urxvt22:11
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joacimhey =)22:40
marwellousI have a question22:40
marwellousUnder what license CRUX is realesed?22:40
marwellousGPL or another?22:40
marwellousIs there anybody?22:42
joacimyes. i dont know22:42
joacimports seems licensed under GPLv322:43
joacimcan check them all here22:43
marwellousI visited the site and saw the principels that this distro has but didn't find anything freedom related, so I assumed that it's not freedom friendly, am I right?22:45
joacimnot to such a degree that mp3 and h264 are disabled for mpv and other applications22:46
TimB_it's a regime. I am kept against my will22:46
joacimsupreme leader knows best22:46
TimB_it's true, who am I to have a opinion22:47
TimB_marwellous: what concerns do you have?22:47
TimB_sorry I was joking, but it sounds so harsh you come to the conclusion it's not freedom friendly.. imo, it's very much supporting my freedom22:48
marwellousOK, got it22:49
TimB_about the terminal discussion earlier: I just switched from urxvt to st, and I think I like it22:49
marwellousAlso, how much does this distro weight?22:50
marwellousAt first installation, ofc.22:50
TimB_mh, not sure. I don't have an untouched image flying around22:51
marwellousDon't be sorry, Tim, it's ok. I just didn't get the joke; now I do.22:51
joacimi think suckless is a bit too basic for my tastes22:52
TimB_joacim: paired it with tmux and I really don't seem to miss much22:52
TimB_I really just got bummed out because some fonts didn't render properly with urxvt, but they work with st out of the box22:53
TimB_applied alpha plus solaris patches, all set22:54
TimB_marwellous: no worries. you want to try it out?22:54
pedjasolaris patches?22:55
marwellousYeah, I really do since pretty much all of Linux distro nowadays have systemd preinstalled...22:55
marwellousI don't like it much.22:55
pedjatechnical or philosophical reasons? or both :) ?22:56
TimB_pedja: uhm, I think I might be too sleepy already. solarized color scheme ;)22:56
pedjaTimB_, ah :) got me confused for a moment22:57
pedjabase16 monokai ftw22:57
AbdullahTimB_: which fonts22:59
Abdullahmarwellous: I have full functional system with less than 350 packages23:00
TimB_Abdullah: some font awesome glyphs, really just bummed me out editing configs that use them (i3bar and stuff)23:00
TimB_but well, yeah, I like the slim approach st has over urxvt23:01
TimB_marwellous: try it!23:01
AbdullahTimB_: I'm compiling termite but no success23:01
TimB_took a look at termite too, but the build process looks a bit too nasty, I didn't want to do all of that :D so I didn't try it23:02
AbdullahTimB_: I had some fonts earlier in my ~/.local/share/fonts and I was able to see icons in urxvt23:02
TimB_Abdullah: it were just some of them, most worked23:03
AbdullahTimB_: those are I think font awesome 5 glyphs23:03
pedjamarwellous, if you decide to try Crux, I'd suggest to use jaeger's updated iso, it will save you some work23:03
TimB_Abdullah: most likely then23:03
AbdullahTimB_: they don't work in bar too23:04
TimB_they worked in the bar23:04
AbdullahI was tired after 3 hours today23:04
TimB_but not in vim, then again, they worked when displayed through gvim D:23:04
Abdullahbut they didn't work for me . only some icons23:04
TimB_now they work everywhere, which is great23:04
marwellousCan I find it on the site, pedja?23:05
TimB_marwellous: https://crux.ninja23:05
pedjahe is one of the Crux developers, so no worries there :)23:05
marwellousOk, thanks.23:05
Abdullahsomeone help us please in compiling termite ;-)23:05
TimB_I'm fine with st ;)23:06
Abdullahno clickable urls ?23:06
Abdullahdid you patch it?23:06
pedjatermite? iron dust and magnezim strip is all it takes, iirc23:06
TimB_might hurt the hardware though23:07
marwellousOk, I try it. Any other concerns that I should be aware of? Docs aside.23:07
Abdullahpedja: there is good arch pkgbuild but I don't know how to use thier variables23:07
pedjait goes thru the engine block like hot knife thru butter, so yeah, TimB_ :)23:07
TimB_marwellous: know how to compile a kernel that works on your hardware23:07
TimB_Abdullah: patch st you mean? I just a fork from somebody, because he went through the work of making both patches (alpha + solarized) compatible with each other23:09
AbdullahI have used his fork in past23:10
TimB_also includes the patch to configure st through Xressources23:10
marwellousI think I'll contribute to this community. Seems comfortable and I've never done this before. I'll do my best, though.23:10
Abdullahbtw he himself ended up using urxvt ;-)23:10
TimB_I've used urxvt for the past years now23:11
TimB_can't remember23:11
pedjamarwellous, there is a Handbook on to get you started23:11
TimB_since 2010 at least23:11
Abdullahcheck his voidrice now23:11
Abdullahmarwellous: you're welcome23:11
AbdullahI think terminator can print images to screen like urxvt?23:12
marwellousOk, bye and have a good night.23:12
AbdullahGood night marwellous23:12
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dlcusaWell, I am really impressed with the 3.4-update!  The 4.14.88 kernel's r8169 module handles on onboard and PCI/e NICs without needing to install an external r8168 instead.23:59

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