IRC Logs for #crux Thursday, 2019-05-02

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pedjaapparently, intels mkl library is specifically designed to suck on non-intel cpus11:03
pedjachecks for 'genuineIntel' :)11:03
TimB_you have to love intel11:05
pedjaI am curious what will Keller come up with, tbh11:09
TimB_Keller who? I am not too deep into that topic11:11
pedjaJim Keller. worked for Apple, AMD, co-author of x86-64, etc. quite a CV :)11:13
pedjadesigned Zen arch, amongst other things11:15
TimB_oh, right. I heard of him :)11:21
TimB_it's a very intresting situation right now11:21
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pedjafun fact: nvidia has 61% markup11:25
TimB_markup?11:27
pedjacost to make + markup = consumer price11:28
TimB_right, nice. good for them and everybody that's paying that I guess :P My old gtx770 was getting funky when having two screens connected. real weird shit occured when I plugged in the third one. sometimes it worked, sometimes it didn't. I read that it's the same for Quaddro Cards, so yeah, I'm out of there.11:30
pedjawaiting for navi :) ?11:30
TimB_I am so happy with that RX580, I'd rather buy a second one for sli instead of going back to nvidia11:31
pedjasli isn't really a thing these days, afaik11:31
TimB_currently I am trying to save up for new ryzen generation11:31
pedjaq3 2019, apparently11:32
TimB_I know :) I wouldn't buy a second one anyway, but _if_ I would need more GPU power I would rather consider that than nvidia right now11:32
pedjait depends. if I had the money for upgrade, I'd get amd cpu and nvidia gpu11:34
pedjanot because I like nvidia, but because of cuda11:34
pedjait's annoying, but that's the way things are atm11:35
TimB_right, cuda is another thing11:36
TimB_I am glad I don't have such deps for my usecase. I would love the extra power/features while gaming, but oh well.. AMD has it's own perks I believe. The windows driver package is pretty good11:41
Romsteralancio, get-pip.py i stopped uses awhile ago. are you sure you are on crux 3.4 and updated?11:47
Romsterprt-get fsearch get-pip.py11:47
Romsterno results11:47
RomsterCRUX version 3.411:47
pedjaTimB_, I am not really interested in gaming :) things I *am* interested in tend to use cuda, so.11:52
TimB_hehe :)11:53
pedja1060ti or second-hand 1080ti would be so nice to have :)11:56
pedjas/1060ti/1660ti/11:58
pedjaACTION takes a break from vacuuming the house 12:04
TimB_ACTION just got a coffee12:09
TimB_I still need to finish that ck4up.conf ~.~ how else can somebody maintain that mess12:09
TimB_pedja: if you need a break from vacuuming this sounds like a mansion :D12:10
pedjaTimB_, heh, not really. the vacuum cleaner starts to act up after a while, so I have to vacuum a little, let it cool off, vacuum again, and so on :)12:26
pedjathe cat demands my attention, too12:27
pedjashe is checking out my work atm, and I think she is not impressed :)12:29
TimB_well, that's something you have to obey12:29
TimB_lol12:29
z3braoi there12:49
TimB_hello12:51
TimB_pfew, ck4up for the perl modules is finished. fun task indeed12:53
z3braquick question: https://crux.nu/bugs/index.php?tasks=all&project=1&due=30&status=12:55
z3brais it all that's needed to be done before 3.5 is released?12:56
TimB_I don't think so z3bra12:56
TimB_it's unlikely that pkgconf replaces pkg-config now and pam is already integrated in 3.5 core. there is an rc0 available if you want to test it12:57
z3brawhat does it mean then?12:57
z3bra3.5 will get out soon? :D12:58
TimB_well, not sure how long it will be tested, but so far it seems to run smoothly for the majority12:58
z3branice12:58
z3braah, just found https://crux.nu/Wiki/TODO3513:00
Romsterpedja, needs an indrustial vacuum cleaner and duct the pvc pipe around the house so the vacuum can be outside on a 44 gallon drum13:01
pedjaheh13:01
Romsterthen ou just plug the hose in to the closest outlet, lifting the cover open starts the vacuum and only the one with the cover open and hose in would be working, the rest just vacuum shut on a rubber seal covered door13:02
Romsteralso saves sneezing fits. i hate vacuuming, the smell and warm air the vacuum cleaners blow out the back of them13:03
TimB_https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gxOg9XbBRE <- I need this13:03
Romsteruntil they take over the world13:05
TimB_I accept our robotic overlords13:06
ryuoi have to wonder what automation means for the economy in the end. eliminating a source of buyers for your products in the name of production efficiency could very well destroy the reason why they even produced anything.13:08
ryuoall i know is our economic model wasn't built for a market where the majority of laborers are not also buyers in the other markets.13:09
ryuoi guess they think the robots will buy their crap?13:11
ryuo\o/13:11
TimB_we will see I guess :) there is too much going on to tell what's going to happen13:17
pedjawhen robots evolve enough to be able to teach other robots, without humans in the loop, it's either singularity or we are fucked as a species13:20
pedjabut general AI is still far off, so no need for panic. yet13:21
ryuoJust another 50 years, eh?13:22
ryuoAlways n + 50.13:22
pedjapretty much :)13:22
pedjaI suspect global warming will kick our ass way before Skynet13:27
ryuoHm. New theory. Skynet is behind global warming. =p13:29
pedjawell, that's another way to get rid of pesky humans :)13:30
pedjaI am just not sure it's quick enough for its taste13:32
pedjait did launch ALL THE NUKES the moment it became sentient13:33
pedjawell, few microseconds after, but still13:33
pedjafor a bit more optimistic version of the future, I recommend Daemon/Freedom books13:36
TimB_new texlive sources are out14:05
TimB_ERROR: Building '/home/pkgmk/packages/texlive#20190410-3.pkg.tar.gz' failed. <- surprise D:14:15
jaegerpedja: I don't think the 1660s are good buys from what reviewers have said14:15
pedjajaeger, GN weren't impressed with 1650s and non-ti 1660, iirc. not sure about 1660ti, tbh14:21
jaegerI think what I remember seeing was that if you overclock the 1660ti it's reasonable, but if not, might as well just buy a 107014:26
jaegerIt's certainly possible that I'm misremembering, though14:27
jaegeror a 206014:27
pedjait's interesting that, afaict, 1070 and 2060 are pretty close in price, with 1660ti being considerably cheaper then both14:41
pedjalower tdp, too14:42
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pedjaat de.pcpartpicker, didn't check U.S prices :)14:50
pedjajaeger, I probably asked this before. are you using air, aio or custom loop on your 2950x?15:07
joacimair as far as i remember15:07
joacim140mm one from noctua15:08
pedjasomeone in blender channel asked about people's experience with tr and liquid cooling15:09
joacimthought about getting a liqtech, but the sales on those ended15:09
joacimand i dont want to get one when i know they can get pretty cheap on sale =)15:10
joacimi dont really trust these AIO coolers much tho. i feel safer with a nice old air cooler15:11
pedjadon't think I saw air vs aio vs custom loop tests for tr 2000 series15:11
joacimthe noctua nh-u12s works great for me and my 1950x15:11
joacimcan hear it spin up once in a while, but nothing too serious15:11
pedjanice. how hot it gets under full load?15:11
pedjaamd recommends u14s15:13
joacimi set mine to go to 100% at 65C or so15:15
joacimlet me just run a torture test =)15:15
pedjacustom fan curve thingie?15:16
joacimyeah15:17
joacimdefault curve is pretty useless on my board15:17
joacimdoesnt really match with the recommended max temp from amd15:17
jaegerpedja: yeah, using air... the NH-U14S TR4-SP315:18
jaegerI think an AIO would be fine for it if you get the right one... but seems most of them are asetek rebrands (at least in the US) with surface designed for most of the smaller chips15:19
joacimthere are tr4 specific AIOs in the liqtech series15:20
jaegerIn the end I suspect that the difference isn't huge, but something to keep in mind15:20
joacimhttps://i.imgur.com/Kz1n3nm.png15:20
joacimit seems to settle around 60ish15:21
joacimwith my curves15:21
pedjajaeger, that was one of the issues individual asking about tr and liquid cooling was concerned about15:21
joacimgot two fans on my u12s, mostly because i think it looks nice15:21
joacimdont know if i actually need two fans15:21
joacimmakes it all look a bit more balanced15:21
joacimCPU Fan 1:             1634 RPM  (min =    0 RPM)15:22
joacimthese fans go up to 2000 RPM15:22
pedjadamn, -273.1C :)15:22
joacimyou wish you had a radeon now?15:23
pedjaradeon vii? yes please :)15:24
joacimseems to settle just below 64C, ambient is probably around 20C15:24
joacimwouldnt mind a radeon vii15:25
joacimbut, for now the most demanding games i want to play run fine at 60 FPS15:25
joacimas long as i dont max out textures15:25
pedjaradeon vii is wasted on games :)15:26
joacimthats what i would waste it on =)15:26
joacimi honestly dont have any workloads for graphics cards outside of games15:27
pedjadon't dabble in gpu compute?15:27
joacimnah15:28
jaegerMy 2950x gets up to about 53C under load with the U14S15:28
joacimwhen mining becomes a thing maybe15:28
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pedjajaeger, how loud is that thing under full load?15:30
jaegercan't hear it over ambient noise in my house15:31
pedjanice15:31
pedjaunless you live across the airport :)15:31
joacimnext to the train yard afaik15:32
jaegernah :) It's generally fairly quiet here15:32
pedjanoctua really has some nice toys15:33
joacimdo i get a u14s...15:33
jaegerThat's the main reason I like 140mm fans15:33
jaegerVery quiet15:33
joacimwant one now15:33
joacimif iti s quieter than mine, and runs cooler too15:33
joacimor maybe the 2950x is easier to cool?15:34
pedjabigger fans, no need to spin that much to move air15:34
jaegerThis case isn't even amazing for airflow15:35
joacimsame with mine. gamer review sites tend to give it low scores for temps15:36
joacimbut none of them swap out the fans, or fill up the empty fan mounts15:36
pedjareviews look at 'as shipped'15:36
jaegerI have 2x 140mm in and 1x 140mm out but the front of the case is restrictive15:37
joacimhttps://www.bequiet.com/en/case/152115:38
jaegerIf I get really bored one day I could switch it from the Evolv ATX TG to a Fractal Design Define S I have around15:38
jaegerjoacim: I've heard/read that one is very good15:38
joacimif sites like gamers nexus is to be believed, it isnt =)15:38
jaegerdoh15:39
joacimi'm happy with it. restrictive front, but has room for 4x 140mm fans15:39
joacim3x i mean15:39
jaegerNo personal experience with it15:39
joacim+ it has 2 undocumented fan mounts on the floor, that no reviewer ever mentioned15:39
ryuo"Those weren't fan mounts. They're cup holders."15:40
ryuo<.<15:40
pedjawell, it's either quiet or airflow, can't do both good15:40
joacimseen so many reviewers do builds in this case, and forget to attach the feet15:40
joacimi filled up the front with 140mm fans, moved the original bundled fans to the floor15:41
joacimthose fans really do push a lot of air15:41
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jaegerAnyway, I'm not unhappy about a 30C idle and 53C load range15:44
joacimcant complain about that =)15:44
jaegerthat's with only one fan on the heatsink15:45
jaegerI don't think adding another one would make a significant difference in this case15:45
pedjamy friends colleague did a full cfd analysis for fan airflow in his rig, for fun15:45
pedjathat's maybe taking the whole enthusiast thing a bit too far, methinks15:47
jaeger:)15:47
joacimhe could do that to mine if he wants =)15:48
joacimto see if i could reduce the number of fans15:48
ryuojoacim: i'm not a fan of the idea.15:48
ryuo<.<15:48
jaeger...15:48
jaegerthis pun blows15:48
jaegerACTION ducks15:49
ryuoi knew it. jaeger was a quack this whole time. ;)15:50
ryuo<.<15:51
jaeger:D15:51
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TimB_anybody here uses ck4up for something hosted on gitlab? http://dpaste.com/2QN90DA this always generates a diff for me19:24
axno TimB_ sorry i dont use it.... p.s.good evening all19:25
TimB_ax: good evening, no problem :) I got everything else for my libreoffice repo sorted out as well, so if those are the only buggers not playing nice with ck4up I'm ok19:26
axi'm play with pkgsrc of netbsd ... for binary . although I have already tried and tested native pkg on 3 machines and it works very well19:28
axhttps://aicsx.github.io/crux-pkg/ ... but it makes me think that nobody puts them up ... maybe the single car is more widespread and the track is not necessary for anyone19:31
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TimB_do you want to collect build packages?19:36
axlike a processor, it makes no sense to recompile everything the same way with my settings on -0219:39
axno, I just want to find a very fast and very effective system for not recompiling all over again when for one reason or another the FS goes to that country19:40
TimB_mh, so what do you mean by "nobody puts them up"?20:04
ryuoax: that's already been invented. it's called using binary packages. :)20:08
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axryuo  i know ... but the question was not about invention but why it does not become a standard along with the rest.20:40
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pedjaACTION just woke up from what was supposed to be a short nap22:58
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