IRC Logs for #crux Saturday, 2019-05-04

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ryuofun morning.03:45
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tilmanyes, very fun07:12
tilmansuddenly firefox starts opening 50 tabs without ublock/noscript running. FUN.07:13
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frinnstfucking snow....08:48
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tilman"Update: We have rolled out a partial fix for this issue. We generated a new intermediate certificate with the same name/key but an updated validity window and pushed it out to users via Normandy (this should be most users). Users who have Normandy on should see their add-ons start working over the next few hours. We are continuing to work on packaging up the new certificate for users who have Normandy10:21
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pedja'add-on-mageddon'? that's just lazy10:49
joacimhow about add-on-gate10:50
pedjaadd-on-strophe, perhaps10:52
pedjaangry people threatening to switch to chrome. yeah, because google is more trustworthy somehow maybe10:53
pedjaad-blocker not able to block google & partners ads, allegedly, is OK, they are just 'protecting their business model'10:56
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john_cephalopodaGrr, latest poppler breaks inkscape :/12:00
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TimB_you might believe it's the goal of poppler devs to break as much as humanly possible with every release12:50
pedjawhat, again? with a minor update? haven't run revdep yet13:00
ryuoanyway, the only real workaround i found was to disable addon signing.13:05
pedjaTimB_, shouldn't you be fixing your bike now instead of wrestling with poppler breakage :) ?13:05
TimB_pedja: I stopped wrestling with poppler haha but I have some other stuff to do13:06
TimB_though I really should fix up that bike, maybe I have some time for that later today13:08
pedjaI feel left out, afaict all my ff add-ons work13:10
ryuopedja: you probably don't have addon signing enabled.13:12
ryuobut it makes you wonder. is mozilla this inept?13:12
ryuothey screwd up and the choice to shove addon signing down our throats is having consequences now.13:13
pedjamakes sense form security point13:17
frinnstgeez evey fucking website is impossible to use without adblockers13:18
frinnstdidnt even know youtube had ads13:18
pedja'shoving down out throats' is a bit dramatic13:18
pedjadamn, typo-day13:18
ryuopedja: well, perhaps so.13:18
frinnst504 Gateway Time-out13:18
ryuopedja: but they've forced a lot of changes that no one asked for.13:19
ryuopedja: over the years.13:19
ryuopedja: UI changes for who knows what flipping reason.13:19
joacimi like general ui. reminds me more of early firefox13:19
pedjaand no one is forced to keep using it if they don't agree with the changes, so13:20
joacimjust wish the config tool was better13:20
pedjaand bookmark manager13:20
ryuopedja: that's a good one. there's only so many browser engines left that can handle modern standards.13:20
ryuothe choices keep shrinking.13:21
TimB_ACTION is still using palemoon (chrome as a backup for great sites that won't work, which aren't that much)13:21
ryuoso you kind of are if you still want to use the "modern" web.13:21
TimB_devs act a little bit weird with their trademark crap but it has most of what I need and it feels like firefox13:22
joacimsame choice as before i think13:22
joacimexcept there are more webkit options now than before13:22
pedjachrome and firefox, that's it13:22
ryuoand webkit browsers, i guess.13:22
pedjaand various chrome-like ones13:22
joacimthere are many browsers available, but they need some effort put in them, which they can get with more interest from users (and developers)13:23
pedjaeven ms edge is switching their engine to chrome, afaik13:23
ryuothey are.13:23
pedjaand you can't say ms doesn't have the resources :)13:23
ryuoEdge stood on the edge and finally fell over. ;p13:23
joacimmaybe if edge was a good browser =)13:25
pedja'xpinstall.signatures.required' is set to true here13:27
pedjaanyone getting 2700x the gold edition :) ?13:29
pedjaengraved signature of Dr.Su on it13:31
joacimsounds expensive13:34
pedjagamers nexus have a video on it, still didn't watch it13:34
pedjaryuo, blender developers get the same critique (changes no one asked for, UI changes, breaking workflow) with 2.80 :)13:37
pedjathey had the chance to deal with technical debt, old code, and they took it, as anyone has to do at some point13:40
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pedjalooks legit17:28
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frinnstit is20:28
frinnstbut man what a fuckup20:29
pedjayeah :) it was fun to see how the web looks like with ads and other nuisances, thou20:30
pedjanot fun was that I disabled ff native tabs, so when tree style tabs broke, it got interesting20:32
pedjaafter a while, I just closed firefox and went back to my book :)20:34
pedjaand now my brain hurts. math is hard when you are stupid, I guess20:36
frinnstthats why i never bothered20:36
pedjayou don't look stupid, my friend :)20:38
frinnstthanks! my deception has worked!20:38
frinnsti get dumber by the year :)20:38
pedjahell, I started at a low point, how low can you go?20:39
john_cephalopodaEvery human kinda starts at a low point.20:48
frinnstwow my deception has REALLY worked it sounds like20:49
john_cephalopodafrinnst: Your name sounds Swedish, so everybody assumes that you are wealthy and clever.20:50
frinnsti'm very "medelklass"20:50
pedjamiddle class?20:51
pedjawhat's middle class in .se? white collar workers, that kind of thing?20:53
frinnstanyone with a job :)20:53
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pedjahere you would be upper middle class, as the most of people working in IT :)21:00
pedjaeverybody wants to be developer these days because of that. 'how hard can it be?'21:01
pedjaafaik, domestic companies have trouble keeping seniors, they often go to foreign companies for 2,3,5 times the pay21:04
john_cephalopodapedja: Snatched a job in the Embedded Systems field, already signed the contract and starting in December, after finishing my master thesis.21:09
john_cephalopodaThe company opens new branches all over the world because they need more devs.21:10
frinnstnice! congrats21:10
john_cephalopodaDid two internships there, now actually doing my master thesis there, too. And then I'll work there as embedded software dev.21:11
pedjaI've talked to some that packed up and went abroad. it's not just about the money, it's quality of life too, apparently21:12
pedjamy cousin is a structural engineer, worked here for peanuts, packed up, went to .de, never looked back21:18
JanCif Serbia wanted to get over some political issues, they could probably become EU members...?21:21
pedjaif there was an actual political will to do that and not just lip service, yes21:22
john_cephalopodaPolitics are shit _everywhere_.21:22
pedjawe are candidates for a while now :)21:23
pedjait's...complicated. lots of bad blood21:24
pedjaprime minister who had the drive and energy to do what has to be done so we can become a better society got killed21:27
john_cephalopodapedja: Well, you can at least never quit the EU. "Brexit", "Frexit", "Dexit"... but "Sexit" or "Serbxit" just doesn't sound good, so that's not an option. :D21:27
pedjawe know who pulled the trigger. we don't know who gave the order, officially21:28
joacimmy turn to get the unsupported addons now21:32
pedjaJanC, too high of a political price to deal with that, and he wants to get re-elected again and again21:32
pedjajoacim, there is a quick fix for that :)21:33
joacimye ye. i know i could use lynx =)21:36
pedjaor install hotfix directly :)21:37
pedjanew point version is maybe in the works too21:38
joacimthat legit looking link up above?21:39
frinnstits just a zip-file, feel free to inspect it21:39
pedjacan't be worse then 'curl | sudo bash'21:40
JanCpedja: and people who care leaving the country probably doesn't help either21:42
john_cephalopodapedja: Oh, yeah, those "Curl directly into a sudo'd bash, what could possibly go wrong" things are so annoying.21:44
pedjaJanC, funnily enough, that's one of the 'arguments' anti-eu people use. 'if we are in EU, everyone will leave' :)21:45
pedjathere is a lot of history and political games from all sides in effect here21:47
JanChuge numbers of people left Hungary (about 15% of the population), not many left Slovenia...21:49
pedjaexactly that.21:49
john_cephalopodaOh, wow, it now hit my browser.21:50
JanCand Slovenia & Hungary are both EU members; it's mostly about how people feel at home in their own country  :)21:51
pedjaif someone can live a decent, normal life in his own country, why would he leave?21:52
pedjaSlovenia was always ahead, even when we were the same country21:52
pedjaSFRJ, eons ago :)21:53
JanCand many Hungarians migrated to places like Slovakia, which never really was a "promised land"21:53
pedjafor Balkans, this parts anyway, Germany is the 'promised land' for generations21:54
pedjaAustria, Germany21:55
john_cephalopodaEw, Austria.21:55
pedjaCroatian and Hungarian passports were highly sought up items few years back21:58
pedjasomething like Irish passport in UK these days :)21:59
john_cephalopodaI honestly don't hear much from most EU states (living in Germany).22:03
john_cephalopodaFrance is always on the screen when there's something important, the UK is only making trouble with their stupid Brexit, Poland and Hungary are under observation because of their weird behavior. But else...22:04
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joacimfigured hungarians would go to estonia or finland for language reasons22:07
DaViruzi figured they would go to turkey for hunger reasons22:08
JanCjoacim: while their languages are formally related, they aren't to the point where they really understand each other AFAIK22:13
joacimthe idea would be that their languages are easier to learn22:18
joacimnot that they can understand eachother without formally learning eachothers language22:18
john_cephalopodaDaViruz: Or they stay in Hungary for Hungar reasons.22:20
pedjaiirc, there was a study showing that people faster learn a language that is completely different to their native one22:20
john_cephalopodaMakes sense. I learned French at school and later Spanish, it's impossible to not mix them up because they are so similar :รพ22:21
pedjait's harder if languages are similar in some fashion22:21
joacimspanish was considered the easy language when i went to school22:22
joacimwhile german was one of the harder ones22:22
pedjaa friend of mine learned spanish watching their soap operas when she broke the leg and couldn't leave the house22:23
pedjaidk, some say that French is a PITA to learn22:25
pedjaI am curious, how similar, if at all, are Scandinavian languages?22:27
pedjaor do you just speak English to each other when you meet somewhere :) ?22:29
joacimvery similar22:38
joacimi dont have much trouble with swedish or danish22:38
joacimbut i get the impression they have greater trouble with my dialect, except for the swedes and danes that have lived here for a while22:39
joacimfaroese kinda sounds like a more western west-norwegian dialect22:39
joacimi cant understand icelandic. i can guess at what they're trying to say, and land somewhat close tho22:40
joacimhad a positive impression of otter browser, until it crashed =)22:41
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john_cephalopoda :D23:21
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