IRC Logs for #crux Wednesday, 2019-05-08

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ninjafor me, libinput scrolling stopped working. now I have made some changes to the config and I can only scroll from edges00:20
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Romsterninja, i noticed gtk3 apps don't scroll unless you set export GDK_CORE_DEVICE_EVENTS=108:28
pedjais libinput that broken these days? good that I switched back evdev a while back08:45
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ninjaRomster: it was working on edge for scrolling10:31
ninjabefore the update, it was working for two fingers scrolling10:31
Romsteroh you talking about gestures10:42
Romsterninja, wacom or synaptics10:44
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pedjaanother day, another cisco cve
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ninjaRomster: nah, I'm not about talking gestures.11:39
TimB_two finger scrolling = gesture iirc11:41
TimB_over here, mate-* does that11:41
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Romsterthat's what i thought too 2 fingers is a gesture on the trackpad12:13
Romsteri just pushed contrib/firefox 66.0.512:15
frinnstwhat's new?12:34
frinnstFurther improvements to re-enable web extensions which had been disabled for users with a master password set (Bug 1549249).12:35
frinnsti'll fix it after work12:36
Romstermore fixes for there stuffups12:37
Romsterto me it doesn't look any different between 66.0.4 to 66.0.512:37
pedjathat's a good thing[tm]12:42
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pedjasome epic moments in GoT S8e0320:24
pedja(I skipped the first 2)20:24
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dlcusaDoes anyone here agree with Doc Searls?
stenurhowtos died once IBM spend several billion, just stumbled over that last week.  Was about 2004, no?21:26
stenurAnd am happy here on CRUX: ghostscript, cups and gutenprint almost self-contained, almost no dependencies.21:27
dlcusaIBM Made noteworthy investments in the GNU/Linux market back then, for sure.21:27
john_cephalopodaHmm, the "Some specifics" list doesn't mirror completely what I see.21:28
stenurI use nothing of that.  netflix, signal, github.. no.21:29
john_cephalopoda* Slack and Google Hangouts is pretty uncommon in open-source projects. IRC is very common and the next big thing, discord, is not even mentioned.21:29
dlcusaRMS' idiosyncracies have really been hurting what he has championed for decades.21:30
stenurakamai rules the SSL and DNS world, but OpenSSL about to be switched to Apache license.21:30
stenurAnd i use letsencrypt myself.21:30
stenurWould like to see that for S/MIME too, but ... no.21:30
stenur"Just pick up a fight."21:31
dlcusaWell, one does have to pick their fights--everyone is resource-constrained.21:32
john_cephalopodadlcusa: I don't know... what RMS says makes a lot of sense. I don't think that what he personally does has much influence, and what he built up (FSF, GPL) is definitely helping.21:32
dlcusajohn_cephalopoda, I have seen many discredit the need for freedom due to his behavior.21:34
joacimthink i agree with the message of the article21:34
joacimi havent read the whole thing yet21:34
dlcusaThe thing is one one can do this alone.  If we lose our critical mass, it will fall apart.21:35
dlcusaWe all depend on each other.21:35
dlcusas/one one/no one/21:36
joacimif nobody dares to say no, nothing will improve21:36
john_cephalopodaI don't really understand the criticism of github and sourceforge there. They allow you to make free repositories. They are helping the masses to get access to open-source hosting.21:37
dlcusaHow many systemd-style projects can free software persevere through?21:38
john_cephalopodaYeah, their JS might be proprietary, but they are using git and svn. You can migrate those with two commands.21:38
joacimsourceforge did bundle crapware with installers, didnt they?21:39
dlcusaYes, I understand systemd is technically free software, but it damages the whole universe of free software.21:39
stenurSourceforge cut project owners from accessing ML subscriber lists.21:39
joacimand the problem with github it has become a single point of failure21:39
joacimso much is on that site, so if it goes down, you lose a lot of content21:39
john_cephalopodajoacim: Yeah, at some point they went bad. But the article doesn't critisize that. It only talks about proprietary server-side sw and JS.21:39
john_cephalopodajoacim: So what VCS isn't a SPOF?21:40
joacimi can understand that point. one should promote an entire free set of tools and services21:41
joacimnot just gratis21:41
john_cephalopodajoacim: When you self-host, your server is the SPOF.21:41
joacimdoesnt have to self host21:41
joacimbut you dont have to support mega sites either21:41
joacimand your self hosted site wouldnt be the single point of failure for thousands of projects either21:42
john_cephalopodaThe good thing about github is, that it gives anybody the possibility to put out their open-source software. Of course free backends and JS would be a nice touch, but it doesn't change the fact that github is very benificial to the OSS community.21:42
stenurYou need to access it through a web browser.  These beasts are gigantic.21:43
stenurThey limit directory listings for me; maybe not for registered users, i do not know.21:44
john_cephalopodajoacim: I kinda have more trust into github than into millions of self-hosted thingies.21:45
john_cephalopodaIt is way more likely that a project disappears because a self-hosted site isn't paid or something than because github fails.21:45
john_cephalopodaEven when github fails, there are usually local copies of it flying around or backed up somewhere. Migrating to a new server should be trivial.21:46
stenurIt has its time at the moment for sure.  I have the impression people moving to gitlab in recent times.21:48
dlcusaI have to disengage for several hours, but will catch up when I return.21:49
joacimsadly, many of those moving to gitlab are kneejerk-reactionist pol-bullshitters tho21:49
john_cephalopodaYeah, people got very emotional because github was bought by Windows.21:49
john_cephalopodaSeveral projects said things along the lines of "Github is fine right now. If it goes bad, migrating will be easy.".21:50
john_cephalopodaMigrating a project is a lot of work. And doing so without no real reason is a waste of time.21:50
stenurI hate it you know. People moved around, MLs are given up, ML archives get lost.  No idea of how to keep up with changes.21:51
stenurmsmtp last example, stumbled upon that after long time of seeing no messages. ML given up; recalled that announcement then though, but...21:52
stenurPatchwork everywhere. Partial changelogs laying around, rest now via commit messages. Whatever.21:54
stenurMost people just do that for fun, and that left some day. But amazing what foss create[sd]!21:55
stenurStuff is use moves on. mksh, vim, cwm, st, compilers, ..21:55
stenurLinux, FreeBSD. Now irssi. curl, tmux. bash, dash. All moves on, more or less. All free.21:57
john_cephalopodaWelp those are failures of project management.21:57
stenurWell. I now even use firefox. And found out how to increase the font size of the GUI!!!21:58
stenurYou know how?21:58
joacimthunderbird need a plugin for that21:59
joacimand everything looks wonky as hell once you use it21:59
john_cephalopodaWrite something better or make a pull request. It's OSS.22:01
stenurYou go to .mozilla/firefox/STRANGEDIR; you create a directory "chrome" within; with file userChrome.css: * {font-size:15px;} #urlbar{font-size:15px;}22:02
stenurjoacim: looks ok, only font bigger.  But it was an Odysee to find out.22:03
stenurThat is very esoteric, not for "normal" human beings anyway.22:04
stenurjohn_cephalopoda: this is like "That is democracy!  Everybody can bring in his/her opinions, and in the end a broad consent comes out". More or less. But i never tried in real life (CSS file from April 20th).22:13
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