IRC Logs for #crux Wednesday, 2019-09-25

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cruxbot[contrib.git/3.5]: nginx: updated to version 1.17.404:01
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lealapshello, I made a lightworks port, could someone please take a look if it makes any sense? :D
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SiFuhYay!! Time to dance.. finally got UEFI + Syslinux to work in CRUX11:10
TimB_SiFuh: where is the live stream located? :P11:13
SiFuhtoo late   i heard a beert11:16
SiFuhbeer* call my name11:16
TimB_SiFuh: i don't get it. should't that make it even better?11:25
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cruxbot[contrib.git/3.5]: ipset: 7.2 -> 7.311:39
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.5]: ant: 1.10.6 -> 1.10.711:39
TimB_ noice11:41
TimB_i can imagine this could work out fine (bike, drivetrain related)11:42
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SiFuhi can imagine dust and grime11:46
SiFuhadd two disks in the rear and seal it all up11:48
TimB_i am not sure if this is prone to clogging up that bad? it looks sturdy and open enough to 'self clean' fairly well11:49
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SiFuhi'd like to see this on a motorbike11:51
SiFuhi was sick and tired of adjusting my chain every few thousand km11:51
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TimB_yeah it's tedious12:00
TimB_i prefer single speed also for the less wear&tear12:00
cruxbot[opt.git/3.5]: jdk: update to
cruxbot[opt.git/3.5]: python-mysql: update to 1.4.412:29
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frinnstyeah I saw that. looks cool12:47
pedja_hpminimy nephew is pretty impressed with his 1tb intel 660p upgrade :)12:57
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pedja_hpminifrom spinning rust to nvme is a pretty big step up, I would imagine13:01
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frinnstssd to nvme isnt really that big of a deal for normal usage13:07
frinnstyeah the figures are impressive but day to day? meh13:07
frinnstmy samsung qvo is slow as fuck though. its more like a regular hd13:08
pedja_hpmini970 evo was his first choice, but the price diff between 512gb evo and 1tb intel was small13:15
pedja_hpminiso he went for the bigger one :)13:16
pedja_hpminiwindows is a space hog, anyway13:16
frinnstwe got some old hardware from a customer the other day. A bunch of skylake cpus, motherboards and a evo 960 2tb. all brand new13:17
pedja_hpmininew old hardware? hth does that work :) ?13:17
frinnstthey didnt have any need for it. they used the hardware to construct appliances and they have changed it up a bit13:18
frinnstor so i'm told. either that or my coworker is a thief :D13:18
pedja_hpminiI guess giving it away is cheaper then e-wasting it13:20
frinnstim surprised nobody at the company wanted it13:23
jaegersome companies (like mine) have a policy that employees cannot have or buy their old hardware13:41
frinnstyeah I suppose that could create some problems13:42
frinnst"we don't need this brand new cluster - I'll take it home"13:43
jaegerMaybe so, yeah... but it is a bummer for things that they're genuinely decommissioning13:43
jaegerI've gotten some very good deals on surplus computers from previous jobs13:43
pedja_hpminiACTION is curious about rolling release Centos thingie13:52
pedja_hpminia.k.a Centos Stream13:52
SiFuhso anyone using Virtualbox in CRUX ?14:47
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SiFuhcuriously, if I am not lvm will it be a problem if I just comment it out in  /etc/rc and /etc/rc.shutdown ?15:35
TimB_SiFuh: i am sure i did that, but can't check right now15:41
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jaegerSiFuh: I use virtualbox regularly. I use the binary from the site, though, not a port16:20
jaegerIn the past that was a requirement to have USB support. I have no idea if that's still true, I've been using it that way for years16:20
SiFuhjaeger: Cool what kernel version and what virtualbox version?16:20
jaegerI tend to stick with LTS kernels and use whatever the latest virtualbox release is at the time. I know virtualbox 5.2 and LTS kernels generally plays nicely together. 6.0 has been out long enough that it's probably fine, too. I can check specific versions on a system if you like16:22
SiFuhI was trying  Virtualbox 6.0.12 on ..... OH! Linux 5.3.1 haha I didn't think I was using 5.3.1 on this machine16:24
jaegerLooks like I'm currently using 6.0.12 on 4.19.69 on one system16:26
SiFuhyeah i am compiling 4.19.48 now  from the cd 3.516:28
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SiFuhjaeger: did you install it as a port ?16:42
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SiFuhjaeger: thanks, it worked..17:11
SiFuhnow I need a footprint for it17:11
jaegerNo, I mentioned above that I use the binary from the site17:12 site specifically17:12
SiFuhjaeger: i know, i was asking if you installed the binary as a package/port  so you can keep track of where it stuck stuff17:13
SiFuhsays it is installing to  /opt/  and yet it is also in /sbin17:14
SiFuhOk, well I want to keep track of all those links it put in the system17:15
pedja_hpminiit used to be a virtualbox-bin port, iirc17:16
pedja_hpminirepackaging upstream binaries17:16
jaegerThere was a port in the past but I think it was sepen's so long unmaintained17:17
jaegerdoesn't seem to exist anymore17:17
jaegerHe wasn't using the binary package if I recall, though, which was why it had no USB support17:17
SiFuhhang on  let me check my archives  I remember having sepen's ports laying around17:17
pedja_hpminiI used to have one, before I switched to libvirt/qemu17:18
SiFuhseems to not be here, must have left it back in Austalia17:19
SiFuhpedja_hpmini: that?17:23
pedja_hpminijaeger, aren't usb pass-through and rdp support part of the vbox extension pack?17:23
pedja_hpminiSiFuh, I think so, yes17:24
pedja_hpminiit's been a while :)17:24
SiFuhyeah I see   I can probably work with that17:24
jaegerpedja_hpmini: they are17:25
jaegerthe OSE version could not make use of the extpacks back in the day17:25
pedja_hpminiSiFuh, there is virtualbox-bin in arch aur thingie, you could use that as reference17:27
pedja_hpminifor 6.0.1217:28
pedja_hpminijaeger, ah. well, that sucked :)17:29
pedja_hpminiiirc, even with binary version, extpack was fiddly to install/update17:30
pedja_hpminivmware ws, vbox, and then I stumbled on libvirt, and never looked back17:32
SiFuhpedja_hpmini: yeah I have it installed on the artix system17:33
pedja_hpminiwth is artix? :)17:33
SiFuhartix is based on on arch but with your choice of openrc or runit17:33
pedja_hpminitbh, systemd hasn't annoyed me yet on this Leap netbook17:34
pedja_hpminibut it's early days still, so17:35
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SiFuhpedja_hpmini: Understood and yes similar when I was running Debian in Kyrgyzstan. But it was just not practical for me17:37
pedja_hpminihad no idea there was an uprising in arch community so they forked it to artix, tbh :)17:41
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pedja_hpminiI know of only Devuan as the more known distribution systemd-less spinoff17:43
SiFuhVoid Linux17:44
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SiFuhantix has no systemd   but MX Linux which is from antiX has it there for compatabiity like Devuan has17:46
jaegerpedja_hpmini: these days it's as simple as 'sudo VBoxManage extpack install /path/to/extpackfile'17:46
SiFuhjaeger: love that. Found that out last week when I got tired of not having USB 2 or 3 support in vbox17:47
jaegerCan probably even do it from the UI with an askpass type thing installed but I haven't tested that17:47
pedja_hpminijaeger, I remember a few versions were very confused that opt is a symlink :)17:48
SiFuhchinarulezzz: I have tried pretty much most of those. Only a select few worthy of a real desktop ;-)17:51
SiFuhsome are even extinct17:51
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SiFuhI even went through that list of linux distros image on wiki
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chinarulezzzSiFuh: long live slackware :)17:52
SiFuhchinarulezzz: most definately17:53
pedja_hpmini0oracle snooping ips that d/l extpack, and then trying to bill companies for 'enterprise use' was fun17:54
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chinarulezzzI think the best no-systemd distros are gentoo/funtoo/slackware/devuan/alpine/void/openwall/slitaz. And of course crux/nutyx/lfs. Very various, many purposes. Desktop and server, embedded, etc. So, no worries of systemd.17:58
SiFuhpedja_hpmini0: thanks for the info about the virtualbox-bin   little bit of tweaking and mostly deleting the port is working17:58
pedja_hpmini0heh. someone reviewed Crux on distrowatch with 'kde5 doesn't work, mediocre distro'18:04
pedja_hpmini0and still gave it a 10/1018:04
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joacimsounds like a nice review =)18:05
pedja_hpmini0'lfs without the documentation' is an interesting one18:06
pedja_hpmini0"CRUX is a lightweight Linux distribution [...] targeted at experienced Linux users"18:11
pedja_hpmini0maybe people think they are more experienced then they actually are, so hit the wall?18:11
kvikdefinitely not me, i swear i never even saw a wall!18:14
joacimare you implying some of us are trespassing?18:16
SiFuhpedja_hpmini0: says youa re the maintainer of the virtualbox-bin  :-P18:17
joacimbreaking in, crossing through the wall18:17
pedja_hpmini0SiFuh, a long time ago :)18:17
joacimi might be implying some of us are just posing as capable =)18:18
Anselmoperhaps the fun is in becomming as experienced as you think you are ~18:18
joacim*not me i swear*18:18
pedja_hpmini0fake it 'till you make it :)18:18
Anselmothats what I did :P18:18
joacimi think crux is easier to work on than windows :(18:19
joacima lot of the issues i find on windows systems are just brainfuck18:19
Anselmoat this point, same for me18:19
Anselmobut thats because I havent used windows in ages18:19
pedja_hpmini0neighbours windows machine is cranky, so I went to take a look18:22
pedja_hpmini0boot crux, run memtest, the usual18:22
pedja_hpmini0the look on his face when he saw memtest was priceless18:23
pedja_hpmini0"what the hell is *that*"?18:23
pedja_hpmini0kids these days18:23
pedja_hpmini0and he is a damn enginner18:24
pedja_hpmini0Autocad and Solidworks all day long, and knows fuck all about the machine they run on18:26
pedja_hpmini0idk, maybe that's the way it's supposed to be, looking at computer as a tool18:32
Anselmomeh, it seems some degree of specialization is needed18:33
Anselmoall the same . . .18:33
jaegerpedja_hpmini0: why would opt be a symlink?18:35
pedja_hpmini0jaeger, sorry, I meant "/opt"18:35
jaegersame question18:36
jaegerIs that a suse thing?18:36
jaegerAlso, I know nothing, I just use CRUX because I look smarter that way18:36
pedja_hpmini0jaeger, it was on my Crux system. root partition too small18:37
jaegermemtest86+ even has a UEFI version now18:37
jaegerOh, ok18:37
jaegerI just didn't think of that, I don't think I've ever moved /opt to another disk or partition... just /home or maybe /var18:38
joacimi'll have to move /usr/ports to /home soon on my laptop. unless i grow /18:39
pedja_hpmini0well, i didn't really think it through when I installed Crux, so I had to hack around my stupid decisions :)18:39
jaegerAt least you always have the option to do so18:39
pedja_hpmini0always learned the most when I have to do something like that, tbh18:40
joacimgot your new hdd yet?18:41
pedja_hpmini0not yet, unfortunately18:42
TimB_jaeger: about making it look smart, i thought using a terminal always makes the impression of being a badass :P18:42
TimB_in university, business class, when i have irssi open, they ask me if this is the darknet :D18:43
pedja_hpmini0you should try hollywood sometime, if you want to impress someone :)18:43
jaegershow them, maybe they will melt18:43
TimB_pedja_hpmini0: just use that stupid matrix effect script to freak people out :P18:43
SiFuhdarknet   wtf18:44
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TimB_SiFuh: yeah, i know :D18:45
TimB_jaeger: what am i supposed to do on that site lol18:45
TimB_aaah lol18:45
TimB_this is gold XD18:46
TimB_i'll keep that in mind lol18:46
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pedja_hpmini0there is a docker image too, iirc :)18:46
jaegerhah, nice18:47
TimB_pedja_hpmini0: i do have a window in tmux open with some logs i watch and htop18:47
TimB_does that count? :D18:47
jaegerNeed the movieOS stuff from swordfish18:47
SiFuhhey that's like me trying to get virtualbox port working  haha18:49
jaegerI used to own one of those SGI monitors... it was kinda a pain in the ass to get X to like it sometimes18:49
TimB_SiFuh: so you are dancing once again?18:50
pedja_hpmini0Swordfish/Hackers on one end, Sneakers/Mr.Robot on the other18:52
SiFuhcleopatra and sherlock in a movie together ;-)18:53
pedja_hpmini0Without a Clue, one of the best Sherlock movies ever, imho :)18:55
joacimben kingsley?18:56
pedja_hpmini0Michael Caine and Ben Kingsley, what a par18:56
joacimi remember him. known for playing in one of those uwe boll movies, right? =)18:56
pedja_hpmini0Kingsley? yeah :)18:56
joacimi have yet to see one that surpasses this18:57
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pedja_hpmini0I am surprised Uwe Boll isn't in the credits for syfy's Pandora19:16
pedja_hpmini0lifeless, humorless, badly written/acted/directed POS of the tv show19:17
TimB_poor uwe19:18
joacimit is syfy. if it was good, they'd cancel it19:18
joacimhow's the outpost?19:19
pedja_hpmini0can't remember, tbh :)19:19
pedja_hpmini0Legolas and that unibrow chick from Besson's Valerian movie tv show would be much19:27
pedja_hpmini0more interesting with different leads19:27
pedja_hpmini0looks gorgeous, world building is amazing, apparently, but hard pass19:28
pedja_hpmini0nothing against Legolas19:29
pedja_hpmini0but she can't act to save her life19:29
joacimthe movie that some singer was in?19:30
pedja_hpmini0of 'umbrella, 'brella, 'brella' fame19:32
pedja_hpmini0she was in that 'girl power' Ocean's heist movie too19:33
pedja_hpmini0waste of couple of good actresses that was19:34
pedja_hpmini0Galadriela was awesome, but in it for a maybe 10 minutes19:35
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.5]: arc-theme: updated to version 2019091719:35
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chinarulezzzWould anyone like to see ports synchronization (ports -u) in prt-get utility?20:57
chinarulezzzsorry for molestation, devs)20:57
chinarulezzzand why ports script for that?20:58
chinarulezzzon the one hand we have pkgutils, on other prt-get. Why else?21:00
chinarulezzzIt turns out that prt-get does not have such a basic thing as port synchronization. And we use a separate port script just for this.21:03
chinarulezzzs/port script/'ports' script/21:03
pedja_hpmini0because those things are separate in Crux21:04
pedja_hpmini0just as they are separate in BSD ports, afaik, which was the inspiration21:04
pedja_hpmini0do one thing, and do it well. The Unix[tm] way :)21:06
joacimalso is a little annoying how some other package managers will randomly refresh the package database when you try to install stuff21:07
pedja_hpmini0'autorefresh off', iirc21:07
joacimbut they dont have to do that to provide db updates through the main utility21:07
chinarulezzzThe 'ports' script doesnt do just one thing. It has such things as (-l list ports), (-d  list version differences) that prt-get already has.21:08
chinarulezzzAlong with the Unix principle, don't we cross the Occam's razor?21:08
pedja_hpmini0'simplest explanation is most likely the proper one'?21:10
pedja_hpmini0I am curious, what's the use-case for adding ports functionality to prt-get?21:11
pedja_hpmini0because other package managers do it?21:12
chinarulezzzjoacim: adding synchronization to prt-get will not make it intrusive and untimely. It will be the same as with 'ports' script: you make sync -- you work with latest ports. Else, you work with your current.21:12
chinarulezzz"Entities should not be multiplied without necessity." -- referring to ports utility.21:14
chinarulezzzFirst, we will remove one unnecessary entity. prt-get already has the 'ports' functionality (except sync).21:16
pedja_hpmini0I guess you already have a patch ready for developer review?21:16
joacimshouldnt have to show a patch to have an idea21:18
joacimi wouldnt mind if prt-get could do this, but i dont mind that it dont also21:18
chinarulezzzSecond, we can distribute ports as source collection that may differ for various purposes. The crux-user can choose 'ports via rsync', 'ports via git', etc. It's comfortable. The developer may like to use git for updates & commit to git:// direct from ports.21:18
chinarulezzzI could not write in the best way, but I can take into account all the comments.21:20
pedja_hpmini0well, good luck :)21:20
joacimi wonder how quick an rpi4 is compared to some older systems21:21
joacimi see people are hosting terraria and minecraft servers with decent luck on those21:21
joacimthe one i ordered has more ram than my c2d system had21:22
crash_it should be a lot faster newer arm cpu and more ram should help a lot i think21:22
pedja_hpmini0was there some usb issue with rpi4?21:23
joacimi think that might have been fixed21:23
crash_i'm still using a rpi1 for screen + irssi :)21:24
joacimseems there is a history of usb issues with those21:24
joacimthe poe hat also had issues with higher power usb devices21:24
pedja_hpmini0rpi4 is 64bit?21:24
joacimthink so21:24
joacimreplacing my rpi3, since my rpi3 doesn't have the connector for poe hats21:25
joacimi could've just bought a much cheaper rpi3b+ tho. instead of getting an rpi4 =)21:25
crash_yep rpi3b+ and rpi4 are 64bit21:25
joacimyes power over ethernet =)21:26
pedja_hpmini0did the rpi foundation push all the drivers upstream, or is raspbian still using a custom kernel?21:27
stenurrpi4 i will buy too. with 4gb. Maybe taking a holiday learning some arm asm programming, predicates and such. Thumb set. Always loved the concept.21:28
pedja_hpmini0SBC's are interesting21:29
pedja_hpmini0never played with one :)21:29
pedja_hpmini0but interesting nonetheless21:29
crash_is crux-arm still active?21:30
stenur3.5 was released some time ago.21:30
pedja_hpmini0I think so, yes21:30
crash_nice maybe i should try that out21:30
stenurIs anyone using non-root prt-get aka pkgmk runs?  I have in prt-get.conf "makecommand umask 0002; sudo -u guest fakeroot pkgmk"21:32
stenurand in pkgmk.conf eg "PKGMK_WORK_DIR="`d=/usr/obj/ports/\`basename $PWD\`; if [ -d $d ]; then :; else sudo -u guest mkdir -p -m 2775 $d 1>&2; fi;echo $d`"21:32
stenurand i get ERROR: object '' from LD_PRELOAD cannot be preloaded (cannot open shared object file): ignored.21:32
stenurERROR: object '' from LD_PRELOAD cannot be preloaded (cannot open shared object file): ignored.21:33
stenurERROR: object '' from LD_PRELOAD cannot be preloaded (cannot open shared object file): ignored.21:33
stenur(sorry) for quite some time now.  Not from the start, but for at least a month or more.  Not that it matters, does no harm, but i don't understand the problem actually.21:33
joacimfor programming, i think i would enjoy some of the smaller SBCs more21:33
joacimrpis are nice for running irc on tho =)21:34
stenurDunno sbc.21:35
stenurBut saw a great multiple months spanning ARM commit marathon on NetBSD a couple of years ago.21:36
stenurForgot the name (too lazy to look).  He did optimized string operations among others, and did iteration by iteration.21:37
crash_i have a rpi2 as well that is running pi-hole21:37
stenurUntil it rocked. Retired persons can do good stuff.21:37
crash_when we are talking abou rpi, :)21:40
stenurMatt Thomas is his name.21:41
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xckoprtsweep in prt-utils could be updated to keep .signature files23:01
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