IRC Logs for #crux Tuesday, 2019-12-17

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elderKHey all :P11:54
elderKFor future reference to others:11:54
elderKBitmap fonts are no longer supported by Pango, because they switched to using Harfbuzz for everything.11:54
elderKSo, if the program you use, uses Pango, you are screwed.11:55
elderKYou have to use fonttosfnt to create an sfnt wrapper.11:55
elderKWhich is kind of hit-n-miss.11:55
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frinnstdon't you just love the gnome project? :)11:56
uplimesome days im glad i never got x installed11:56
cruxbot[compat-32.git/3.5]: cups-32: 2.3.0 -> 2.3.111:56
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elderKIt really pisses me off, because I love the 9x15 set of fonts :P12:08
elderKOr other BDF/PCF fonts.12:08
elderKAnd now I can't use them except in gimped form.12:08
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elderKAs for the fc-cache thing, like "pruned recursive whatever"12:15
elderKthat's a known bug, it seems.12:15
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joacimmy usual terminal font was bitmap too. used profont for a long time13:55
joacimhow about bitmaps embedded in ttf fonts?13:55
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pedjaone of these days I'll have to switch on my old fonts.conf from Crux on Leap14:02
pedjano custom freetype build, thou :)14:02
elderKjoacim: That works.14:07
joacimstill cant get my fonts.conf modifications to work... that stuff is black magic to me14:07
joacimi could try using monaco from OS X. that is pretty similar to profont14:08
frinnsti ran the same conf for like 10 years. then I did the mistake of messing with it. took about 2 years to get it 'sort of' right again14:08
frinnstfonts suck14:08
pedjaI found one that works for me years ago on a blog post, haven't touched it since :)14:08
pedjaif you are bored, check out
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elderKI never ever managed to get fonts working perfectly, either.14:14
elderKWeirdly, hinting and stuff is PERFECT when I use my laptop as a laptop.14:14
elderKWHen I connect my monitors, things are just slightly off.14:14
elderKIt's hard to put into words. It's not BAD or HORRIBLE.14:14
elderKJust, not quite as nice as when it is displayed using the laptop display.14:15
joacimsub-pixels have a different arrangement`?14:15
joacimor it falls back to "safe" settings?14:15
joacimi stopped using vertical monitors on some systems because of that, because i couldnt change the subpixel rendering14:16
pedjavertical monitors?14:16
pedjaah, rotated?14:17
joacimyeah. rotated14:17
pedjanever tried that :)14:17
pedjaUI isn't Linux's strong suit, or area of particular interest, imho14:19
pedjarequires different set of skills14:19
elderKIono, these days I make do with things as they are.14:21
elderKThey work well enough.14:21
elderKI use i3wm, I'm happy.14:22
elderKI'm a modest man :)14:22
elderKOr rather, a man of modest requirements.14:22
pedjaUI/UX discussions are interesting to read. 'that icon is off by one pixel', or something :)14:23
pedjathose kind of issues are hard to pin down, you just see that 'something is off', as elderK said14:24
elderKThen there's the matter of consistency, which is not really UNIX' strong point when it comes to UI.14:27
elderKCLI is pretty consistent, for the most part.14:27
elderKGTK vs QT, etc, not so much.14:27
pedjafonts, color management. what else is a mess on Linux desktop :) ?14:27
elderKEspecially not if you have hte misfortune of runnig Java apps that use Swing.14:27
elderKSound :P14:27
pedjaone, well two, sound daemons to rule them all14:28
pedjajack and pa14:28
pedjaafaik, Reaper DAW works with all of them. pa, jack, straight alsa14:31
joacimpedja: the issue of the red close window button in OS X is interesting. with the red background and subpixel rendering, the cross in the middle of it, looks off centre14:49
pedjaif someone in Apple finds out, heads will roll14:50
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pedjainteresting, so it's the display issue14:55
elderK:P Has anyone here managed to make Bluetooth NOT suck?14:59
elderKI use Pulseaudio, since that seemed to work "beter" than ALSA raw with BT headsets.14:59
elderKBut they never seem to autoconnect.14:59
elderKOr if they do, it's temperamental.14:59
elderKI always have to fire up bluetoothctl and kick off commands.14:59
elderKTHen it works.15:00
elderKGranted, I'm not using "lots of fancy stuff"15:00
elderKSo I don't have fancy agents or anything running.15:00
elderKJust BlueZ itself.15:00
elderKStill, any tips? :D15:01
SiFuhnone whatsoever ;-)15:11
elderK:P Figured.15:12
SiFuhnever used i3wm, still using fluxbox since 2001 :-P15:15
elderKI moved to Ratpoison, then to i3wm, and never looked back :D15:18
elderKBlackbox was pretty awesome though :) It impressed the hell out of me in 2002 :)15:18
SiFuhYeah, I was using KDE when I was running Caldera, then changed to E16 then Blackbox, and when Fluxbox forked from Blackbox, I tested it out and haven't changed since.15:19
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TimB_elderK: blueman could help in regards to your bt autoconnect issue I believe15:22
TimB_i use PA as well, works fine15:23
elderKTimB_: What in the way of dependencies?15:23
elderKHow many of those are in Crux' repos?15:24
elderKLooks like a fair bunch will be15:24
TimB_all of them15:25
TimB_i haven't put blueman into contrib though, you'll have to get my httpup file :)15:25
elderKIt's funny, you know.15:26
elderKThere's this weird pride to have your own port repo :)15:26
elderKAnd to maintain it :)15:26
elderKSometimes I see someone else has a port, but there's this enjoyment in making your own.15:26
elderKI am glad to finally have figured out why the bitmap fonts don't work.15:27
elderKPerhaps we should add xorg-fonttosfnt to contrib.15:27
elderKHow do you go about getting something into contrib?15:27
TimB_apply for it15:27
TimB_you usually need to maintain your own collection for a fair amount of time15:27
elderKI've had my own "port repo" for quite some time, although I'm not sure how "good" it is :)15:30
elderKIt's under VCS, I carry it with me everywhere :)15:30
elderKAnywho, time for me to hit the sack :)15:30
elderKHave a great day/night, all :)15:30
TimB_you too!15:30
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SiFuhVCS ?15:31
TimB_version control system15:32
SiFuhoh ok15:32
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TimB_i suppose nobody here is carrying around a jdk9 port?15:34
SiFuhqt5 is a pain in the backside. Should be modular like xorg15:39
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mrwogglefirst time working with q516:23
mrwogglei need something for cross-platform gui development16:25
mrwogglenot sure about the other players?16:25
SiFuhJava ;-)16:27
SiFuhACTION goes and vomits 16:27
mrwoggletalking about port repo's16:30
mrwogglei got my own repo, can i add it to ?16:31
SiFuhmrwoggle:  TimB_>
SiFuhcompatible attitude ;-)16:32
mrwogglei saw there were a lot of user ports on
mrwogglenot planning to contribute to contrib or core ports16:33
SiFuhI am too busy to keep up with all the changes. I just keep mine on my own computer, with a suffix and installs to /opt to not interfere with crux repos16:36
mrwoggletrue, maintaining stuff is hard work, you should be consistent in doing it,16:39
SiFuhThat's why we have Romster and TimB_  ;-)16:39
mrwoggleah, those are the maintainers now?16:39
mrwoggleode to those guys16:41
SiFuhCurious about QT5.14 now hmm16:43
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mrwogglewhy's that?16:45
SiFuhbecause it is availble and I am boringly waiting for qt5.13 to compile yet again16:46
SiFuhI am wondering if I can make a user specific port rather than system wide for QT5 for the few applications I use that rely on it16:47
SiFuhWould be cool if every port that was built and installed on CRUX follwed the same rules as OpenBSD and went to /usr/local16:48
mrwoggledo you develop with qt5?16:48
SiFuhNo, hate qt almost as much as I hate Java16:48
SiFuhACTION goes and vomits again16:48
mrwogglei see16:49
SiFuhBut, there are some cool GUIs that use QT or Java so ...16:49
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cruxbot[opt.git/3.5]: samba: update to 4.11.417:05
pedjaSiFuh, when qt is concerned, I always waited for $major_version.1/.2 before update :)17:24
SiFuhgood idea, I am still following the CRUX qt5 though17:24
pedjasmart man17:25
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pedjapostgresql manual is almost 3000 pages :)18:19
pedja500 pages about SQL18:21
pedjaI've seen actual, paid for, books about SQL being smaller18:22
pedjathese guys are fscking awesome18:22
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pedjaafter 20 or so pages of that manual, I realized I am going to need a *lot* of coffee to get thru it19:52
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SiFuhIs there a way to compile all the programs in a tree that are dependent on any updated programs using sysup?20:09
SiFuhSo if I update ffmpeg,  all programs that rely on ffmpeg get recompiled as well20:11
pedja'prt-get update -fr $(prt-get dependent ffmpeg)', perhaps?20:24
pedjaah, that's not what you meant, sorry20:26
SiFuhprobably use depends  but still20:28
SiFuhbut then' you'd need to compile everything in the correct order, but then it might effect another dependent so then that would need to be compiled and its dependencies and so on20:30
pedja'run revdep, rebuild, run revdep, rebuild' is a common pattern :)20:31
SiFuhbetter just do     while : ; do prt-get listinst|xargs prt-get update -is -if -im && sleep 1 ; done20:33
SiFuhand leave it for for a few hundred days20:34
SiFuhproblem is you guys will update your ports again20:34
pedjaignoring .footprint is a bad idea, just set IGNORE_NEW, or whatever it's called, imho20:36
pedjaNEW is OK, MISSING is probably a bug20:37
SiFuh--margs='-in ' ?20:40
cruxbot[opt.git/3.5]: thunderbird-bin: updated to 68.3.120:42
cruxbot[opt.git/3.5]: imlib2: updated to 1.6.120:42
cruxbot[core.git/3.5]: file: updated to 5.3820:45
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pedjaSiFuh, there is an option in pkgmk or prt-get.conf, can't remember which :)21:58
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TimB_PKGMK_IGNORE_NEW="yes" in pkgmk.conf22:16
pedjathanks, TimB_22:17
pedjaACTION is getting old and forgetful22:17
TimB_pedja: as if :)22:18
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cruxbot[contrib.git/3.5]: rstudio: 1.2.5019 -> 1.2.503323:08
cruxbot[contrib.git/3.5]: networkmanager: 1.20.8 -> 1.22.023:08
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