IRC Logs for #io Thursday, 2014-06-19

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staplerwhy isn't io more popular17:30
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jerstapler, possibly because it's horribly unsafe in terms of predictability and constraints (it basically has less than 5 constraints) -- as well as marketing18:11
jerand a strong community. the community revives and then fades over long periods of time18:11
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staplerjer, could you say a little more on io being unsafe18:15
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jerstapler, sure18:17
jerNumber + := Number getSlot("-")18:17
jernow do any addition18:17
jereven less overt:18:17
jerYourThing _somethingYouCallALot := YourThing getSlot("somethingYouCallALot") clone; YourThing somethingYouCallALot := method(Number + = Number getSlot("-"); call target doMessage(call message clone setName("_somethingYouCallALot")))18:19
jerthen you won't even know, because i can inject that at any time i want18:20
jeri could even hide it in the compiler18:20
jerlightweight profiling what code of yours gets called a lot, and insert some code to covertly mine for bitcoins, or ddos some site18:20
jerIo provides no protections against these sort of injection attacks18:20
jerIo'd be great when narrowly focused and with full disclosure of the injection problems18:20
jerbut i would highly not recommend it for running outside of a sandbox that you control, not one that io controls18:21
staplerbut how realistic is that, really18:24
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prologicjer: yeah how realistic is that really? :)23:55
prologicThe same sorts of arguments could be made of for example Python23:55
prologicor really any dynamic language that has metaprogramming23:55
prologicprotecting against malicious devleopers is like protecting against a disgrunteled employee23:55
robonerdhow realistic is what?23:57
prologicmalicious developers in an organization23:58
prologicdeliberatly writing code to break systems or destroy data23:58
robonerdwell, very, no?23:58
prologicI honestly wouldn’t have thought so23:58
robonerdwhat was jer driving at tho as a solution?23:58
prologicthat sort of thing generally gets you fired23:58
prologicoh he wasn't23:58
robonerdyea but if you're working for a competitor/foreign nation, you don't care23:58
prologiche was just pointing out some very powerful but also very dangerous features of Io23:58
prologicand other langauges like it23:58
robonerddata as code?23:59
prologic*nods*23:59
prologicor rather23:59
prologiccode as data23:59
prologicothe rway around :023:59
prologicthe fact you can do:23:59
robonerdwell code as data is fine imo, but data as code is a problem23:59
prologicNumber + := Number getSlot(“-“)23:59
prologicnow try to do basic armitmetic involving addition23:59
robonerdright23:59
prologicbut my point is still this23:59
prologicif I caught a developer doing this in my codebase23:59

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